Re:I have been reading

[Guest guest]

,

I read your post and found parts of it very disturbing. You are correct you need to weigh the pros and cons of your disease along with the treatment and long term outcome. Most of this we do not know because we can not see the future. There are other factors that determine how each of use choose to treat our disease. Some of those are race, age, sex, do we have health insurance and can we afford to pay medical bills, do we want children? do we just want to be able to get out of bed? Are we retired and in our 60s or 70s and just hope to live to see the grandchildren? Or even the severity of the disease. I could go on for pages...but i think you get the idea.

Weight gain is a problem. Tell that to person that has RA, heart disease and weights 300,400 or even 500 lbs. They are too heavy to exercise to loose weight and the drugs are not helping the situation. The steriods make them too high a risk for weight loss surgery or for any surgery, period. Now add to that if they have osteoporosis, diabetes, cataracts or heart disease induced by the steriods. Even worst their adrenal glands stopped working years ago and they are now steriod dependent.....they can NOT stop the steriods....well, unless you want to deal with side effects of sudden withdrawal and possibly even death.

I know of plenty of people not able to get out of bed on there own for various reasons not related to RA. You might find they have a different story to tell about how they choose to live their lives. Surprisingly its not a bad life!

Liver damage....well let me clue you in. We only have one liver and though depending on the severity of the damage it can regenerate lobes of itself...if damaged too severely, and without a liver transplant you are DEAD! I protect my liver at all costs. Not all doctors monitor the drugs as they should. Not all patients can afford expensive lab tests or are compliant with them. Then there are some drugs such as Arava that have a history and a major warning that they can cause acute liver failure without warning! On and let me add to that you can carry Hep C with NO symptoms until you are tested via a blood test...now mix that with some of the drugs and you have a deadly cocktail for liver failure.

You talk about TB...Maybe you should learn exactly what TB is and how it affects a healthy person inorder to understand the dangers of it to someone with auto-immune disease. TB infection rates in the US have been climbing in the past years at an alarming rate. It was thought it was a disease of the poor and the dirty. One that the poorest of immigrants bring with them into the US. How wrong that info is. The reason for the sharp rise in the rate is global travel. close living quarters and we no longer screen for TB like we did in the past. Public Schools use to require TB Screening annually...now its done in infancy and again once in the career of a child by the time they finish high school. You will find TB rates very high in prisons, nursing homes or long care facilities and mental health long term facilities.

Many people who work with the public are at high risk for TB exposure.

TB is caused by a bacterium. When it invades the body via airborne droplets as it is respiratory spread, you get an immune response to it. The body with the healthy immune system encapsulates the TB bacterium from spreading any further. Its usually in the lungs but can be found in the brain and other parts of the body. When that happens the acute stage is over and it can lay dormant for years. Waiting for a time when the immune system is down and it can escape its immune prison. Then BANG...you are already sick...and TB can run amok on your system because you immune system is already over taxed due to another illness.

Its the reason doctors screen for TB and will refuse to use certain DMARDS in patients that test positive or have a history of positive test. The drugs used to suppress immune response to RA can also cause TB infection to flair and run amok. Also if you are suppressed and are exposed to TB it can be more difficult to treat and control. Since the first line drugs used to treat TB also can cause rise in liver enzyme and liver problems in some people.

Side effects of meds...I wonder if you could take care of your son if you had the following side effects from meds: vomiting and diarrhea that was so bad you had to sleep on the bathroom floor because you were tired of cleaning feces off yourself, bed and floor cause you can not get to the bathroom in time.

Dehydration, severe fatigue and sores in your mouth, eyes, throat and genitals from meds.

Dizziness, headache from either the meds or the dehydration. esophagitis from the vomiting that was so bad you had blood coming back up from the acid in your stomach.

Spending you entire life either in bed or on the bathroom floor due to side effects of meds. Not able to do much productive.

I would take the disease any day than to take meds that make quality of life not even worth living.

Oh and not being able to button your clothing...they make buttoners for that and many other neat assistive devices as well as they make velcro.

Toni

I have been reading

Posted by: "mary backs" haveyarn2crochet@... haveyarn2crochet

Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 am (PST)

a lot lately about people worrying about the possible side effects of medications given for RA and I remembered something . If you actually weigh out the possibility of a side effect versus the almost guaranteed negatives of not treating your disease, it becomes obvious which way you should go. Worried about the possibility of weight gain? How about not being able to get out of bed on your own?Possibility of liver damage? Remember that your liver is capable of repairing itself with time in most cases and the is why your liver counts are monitored by the doctor. Wouldn't it be worse not to be able to button your own clothes?Possibility of TB? How about not being able to pick up your child or grandchild?The possible side effects are scary but the negative of not treating the disease is even worse. I have had to go off the meds for certain problems, and I have even forgotten to take them on occasion, but I promise you I am reminded soon enough. I have had to quit taking them when I had a problem, but I was always happy to go back on them. At this time I am worried about more about not being able to take care of my autistic son and not being able to play with the greatest grandchild in the world than I am about the possible side effects of my medication. It takes me more exercise to try to lose some weight, but at least with my medications I am able to exercise with out as much pain. With my medications, at least I can get up on my own and not have to call someone to help me get out of the bed, or even more embarrassing having to call someone in to help me finish using the toilet. My hands hurt, but I have learned to deal with the pain. My fingers are beginning to twist some, but that has slowed down due to the medications. I have to figure it would be a lot worse with out the medication. ( I have proof of it with a brother that doesn't take any of medication, he was diagnosed after I was and he is in considerably worse shape physically). I will take the possible side effects over the sure problems anyday.Check out AOL Money Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007.

[Guest guest]

I have been fighting RA for over 35 years. I have had episodes where I actually considered either amputating the offending limb, or splitting my skin open to relieve the pressure. I will gladly take the risks if it means I can have one minute without the pain. I have gained 50 pounds over time and I am still trying to figure out how to get rid of it. I have tried all the diets out there and even thought about stomach stapling even after I was told it was the medication.Almost all medications can cause liver damage, my cholesterol meds can do as much, if not more damage to my liver, but then again so can alcohol abuse. That isn't enough to make most people quit drinking. At least my liver functions are monitored closely and if the doctor sees dangerous levels, she changes my medications.As for the risk of TB, well I have been smoking 42 years and I am able to say that my lungs are clear of damage except for what has been

caused by pneumonia and chronic bronchitis which I have had since childhood. I have been exposed to TB before and it wasn't God's will that I contract it. I risk more lung damage daily by just breathing. I saw a young cousin die from lung cancer even though she had never smoked or been exposed to cigarette smoke her whole life.This year I have had to go to 2 funerals for family members, one, a niece who was killed in a car wreck while heading to Wal-Mart and the other my oldest sister. Honestly I would rather go the way my niece did because she wasn't aware that she was dying and wasn't forced to live with pain. You see my sister was in pain. I don't know how long she was aware of the pancreatic cancer that was taking her life. I do know that she preferred to live what she called a few quality weeks with her family than to have a surgery that might not give her any more time and would cause her more pain. She was on

so much pain medication that she admitted to not knowing which was was up, but she felt that was the only way she could spend what time she had left with her family, time she used to tell all of us that she loved us and would rather we remember her laughing than suffering. She said that if it was a choice between pain or being able to be pain free for even a minute that she would take that minute any time she could. I am not willing to give in to the pain and plan on continuing to fight this old body of mine and trying to find ways to do the things I love. I think personally that attitude plays a big part in how I am able to cope with what I have, and I make it a point to try to find something good to think about everyday. I try to spend as much time as I have pain free doing something enjoyable to me, whether it is reading a book or just sitting with my cat on my lap while wrapped in ice packs. I am sorry you feel that the risks aren't

worth it but to me they are.aclavern33@... wrote: , I read your post and found parts of it very disturbing. You are correct you need to weigh the pros and cons of your disease along with the treatment and long term outcome. Most of this we do not know because we can not see the future. There are other factors that determine how each of use choose to treat our disease. Some of those are race, age, sex, do we have

health insurance and can we afford to pay medical bills, do we want children? do we just want to be able to get out of bed? Are we retired and in our 60s or 70s and just hope to live to see the grandchildren? Or even the severity of the disease. I could go on for pages...but i think you get the idea. Weight gain is a problem. Tell that to person that has RA, heart disease and weights 300,400 or even 500 lbs. They are too heavy to exercise to loose weight and the drugs are not helping the situation. The steriods make them too high a risk for weight loss surgery or for any surgery, period. Now add to that if they have osteoporosis, diabetes, cataracts or heart disease induced by the steriods. Even worst their adrenal glands stopped working years ago and they are now steriod dependent.....they can NOT stop the steriods....well, unless you want to deal

with side effects of sudden withdrawal and possibly even death. I know of plenty of people not able to get out of bed on there own for various reasons not related to RA. You might find they have a different story to tell about how they choose to live their lives. Surprisingly its not a bad life! Liver damage....well let me clue you in. We only have one liver and though depending on the severity of the damage it can regenerate lobes of itself...if damaged too severely, and without a liver transplant you are DEAD! I protect my liver at all costs. Not all doctors monitor the drugs as they should. Not all patients can afford expensive lab tests or are compliant with them. Then there are some drugs such as Arava that have a history and a major warning that they can cause acute liver failure without warning! On and let me add to that you can carry Hep C with NO symptoms until you are tested via a blood test...now mix that with some of the drugs and you have a deadly cocktail for liver failure. You talk about TB...Maybe you should learn exactly what TB is and how it affects a healthy person inorder to understand the dangers of it to someone with auto-immune disease. TB infection rates in the US have been climbing in the past years at an alarming rate. It was thought it was a disease of the poor and the dirty. One that the poorest of immigrants bring with them into the US. How wrong that info is. The reason for the sharp rise in the rate is global travel. close living quarters and we no longer screen for TB like we did in the past. Public Schools use to require TB Screening annually...now its done in infancy and again once in the career of a child by the time they finish high

school. You will find TB rates very high in prisons, nursing homes or long care facilities and mental health long term facilities. Many people who work with the public are at high risk for TB exposure. TB is caused by a bacterium. When it invades the body via airborne droplets as it is respiratory spread, you get an immune response to it. The body with the healthy immune system encapsulates the TB bacterium from spreading any further. Its usually in the lungs but can be found in the brain and other parts of the body. When that happens the acute stage is over and it can lay dormant for years. Waiting for a time when the immune system is down and it can escape its immune prison. Then BANG...you are already sick...and TB can run amok on your system because you immune system is already over taxed due to another

illness. Its the reason doctors screen for TB and will refuse to use certain DMARDS in patients that test positive or have a history of positive test. The drugs used to suppress immune response to RA can also cause TB infection to flair and run amok. Also if you are suppressed and are exposed to TB it can be more difficult to treat and control. Since the first line drugs used to treat TB also can cause rise in liver enzyme and liver problems in some people. Side effects of meds...I wonder if you could take care of your son if you had the following side effects from meds: vomiting and diarrhea that was so bad you had to sleep on the bathroom floor because you were tired of cleaning feces off yourself, bed and floor cause you can not get to the bathroom in time.

Dehydration, severe fatigue and sores in your mouth, eyes, throat and genitals from meds. Dizziness, headache from either the meds or the dehydration. esophagitis from the vomiting that was so bad you had blood coming back up from the acid in your stomach. Spending you entire life either in bed or on the bathroom floor due to side effects of meds. Not able to do much productive. I would take the disease any day than to take meds that make quality of life not even worth living. Oh and not being able to button your clothing...they make buttoners for that and many other neat assistive devices as well as they make velcro.

Toni I have been reading Posted by: "mary backs" haveyarn2crochet haveyarn2crochet Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 am (PST) a lot lately about people worrying about the possible side effects of medications given for RA and I remembered something . If you actually weigh out the possibility of a side effect versus the almost guaranteed negatives of not treating your disease, it becomes obvious which way you should go. Worried about the possibility of weight gain? How about not being able to get out of bed on your own?Possibility of liver damage? Remember that your liver is capable of repairing itself with time in most cases and the is why your liver counts are monitored by the doctor. Wouldn't it be worse not to be able to button your own clothes?Possibility of TB? How about not being able to pick up your child or grandchild?The possible side effects are scary but the negative of not treating the disease is even worse. I have had to go off the meds for certain problems, and I have even forgotten to take them on occasion, but I

promise you I am reminded soon enough. I have had to quit taking them when I had a problem, but I was always happy to go back on them. At this time I am worried about more about not being able to take care of my autistic son and not being able to play with the greatest grandchild in the world than I am about the possible side effects of my medication. It takes me more exercise to try to lose some weight, but at least with my medications I am able to exercise with out as much pain. With my medications, at least I can get up on my own and not have to call someone to help me get out of the bed, or even more embarrassing having to call someone in to help me finish using the toilet. My hands hurt, but I have learned to deal with the pain. My fingers are beginning to twist some, but that has slowed down due to the medications. I have to figure it would be a lot worse with out the medication. ( I have proof of it with a brother that doesn't take any of

medication, he was diagnosed after I was and he is in considerably worse shape physically). I will take the possible side effects over the sure problems anyday.Check out AOL Money Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007.

Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make your homepage.

[Guest guest]

A major item is not only the severity of possible

problems but the likelihood of those problems. If we concentrate only on

the consequences of automobile accidents we would never go near an automobile

or place where automobiles travel. That’s an extreme example but it

is quite similar to the arguments Toni presents by dealing only with the worst

possible consequences. I do not deny that the consequences are possible

but most of them are as remote as an automobile accident. With proper

care the worst consequences of medications are foreseen by routine examinations

and tests so they can be avoided. Many other side effects of medications

are easily reversible when a treatment is stopped. With untreated or

undertreated RA the prognosis is life in pain and a wheel chair. Some people

are fortunate enough to have a mild case so it doesn’t progress that far

but if it does progress to joint damage there is no recovery. I prefer

the unlikely and probably reversible consequences rather than the likely and totally

irreversible consequences of untreated RA. God bless.

Harold

From: Rheumatoid Arthritis [mailto:Rheumatoid Arthritis ] On Behalf Of aclavern33@...

Sent: Tuesday, November 27, 2007

8:44 PM

Rheumatoid Arthritis

Subject:

[sPAM] Re:I have been reading

,

I read your post and

found parts of it very disturbing. You are correct you need to weigh the pros

and cons of your disease along with the treatment and long term

outcome. Most of this we do not know because we can not see the

future. There are other factors that determine how each of use

choose to treat our disease. Some of those are race, age, sex, do we have

health insurance and can we afford to pay medical bills, do we want children?

do we just want to be able to get out of bed? Are we retired and in our

60s or 70s and just hope to live to see the grandchildren? Or even the

severity of the disease. I could go on for pages...but i think you

get the idea.

Weight gain is a problem.

Tell that to person that has RA, heart disease and weights 300,400 or even 500

lbs. They are too heavy to exercise to loose weight and the drugs are not

helping the situation. The steriods make them too high a risk for weight

loss surgery or for any surgery, period. Now add to that if they

have osteoporosis, diabetes, cataracts or heart disease induced by the

steriods. Even worst their adrenal glands stopped working years ago and they

are now steriod dependent.....they can NOT stop the steriods....well,

unless you want to deal with side effects of sudden withdrawal and possibly

even death.

I know of plenty of

people not able to get out of bed on there own for various reasons not related

to RA. You might find they have a different story to tell about how they choose

to live their lives. Surprisingly its not a bad life!

Liver damage....well let

me clue you in. We only have one liver and though depending on the

severity of the damage it can regenerate lobes of itself...if damaged too

severely, and without a liver transplant you are DEAD! I protect my

liver at all costs. Not all doctors monitor the drugs as they should. Not all

patients can afford expensive lab tests or are compliant with them. Then

there are some drugs such as Arava that have a history and a major

warning that they can cause acute liver failure without warning! On

and let me add to that you can carry Hep C with NO symptoms until you are

tested via a blood test...now mix that with some of the drugs and you have a

deadly cocktail for liver failure.

You talk about TB...Maybe

you should learn exactly what TB is and how it affects a healthy person inorder

to understand the dangers of it to someone with auto-immune disease. TB

infection rates in the US

have been climbing in the past years at an alarming rate. It was thought it was

a disease of the poor and the dirty. One that the poorest of

immigrants bring with them into the US. How wrong that info is. The

reason for the sharp rise in the rate is global travel. close living quarters

and we no longer screen for TB like we did in the past. Public Schools use to

require TB Screening annually...now its done in infancy and again once in the

career of a child by the time they finish high school. You will find TB

rates very high in prisons, nursing homes or long care facilities and mental

health long term facilities.

Many people who work with

the public are at high risk for TB exposure.

TB is caused by a

bacterium. When it invades the body via airborne droplets as it is

respiratory spread, you get an immune response to it. The body with

the healthy immune system encapsulates the TB bacterium from spreading any

further. Its usually in the lungs but can be found in the brain and other parts

of the body. When that happens the acute stage is over and it can lay

dormant for years. Waiting for a time when the immune system is down and

it can escape its immune prison. Then BANG...you are already sick...and

TB can run amok on your system because you immune system is already over taxed

due to another illness.

Its the reason doctors

screen for TB and will refuse to use certain DMARDS in patients that test

positive or have a history of positive test. The drugs used to suppress immune

response to RA can also cause TB infection to flair and run amok.

Also if you are suppressed and are exposed to TB it can be more difficult to

treat and control. Since the first line drugs used to treat TB also can

cause rise in liver enzyme and liver problems in some people.

Side effects of meds...I

wonder if you could take care of your son if you had the following side effects

from meds: vomiting and diarrhea that was so bad you had to sleep on the

bathroom floor because you were tired of cleaning feces off yourself, bed and

floor cause you can not get to the bathroom in time.

Dehydration, severe

fatigue and sores in your mouth, eyes, throat and genitals from meds.

Dizziness, headache from

either the meds or the dehydration. esophagitis from the vomiting that

was so bad you had blood coming back up from the acid in your stomach.

Spending you entire life

either in bed or on the bathroom floor due to side effects of meds. Not able to

do much productive.

I would take the disease

any day than to take meds that make quality of life not even worth living.

Oh and not being able to

button your clothing...they make buttoners for that and many other neat

assistive devices as well as they make velcro.

Toni

I have been reading

Posted by: " mary backs " haveyarn2crochet

haveyarn2crochet

Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 am (PST)

a lot lately about people worrying about

the possible side effects of medications given for RA and I remembered

something . If you actually weigh out the possibility of a side effect versus

the almost guaranteed negatives of not treating your disease, it becomes

obvious which way you should go.

Worried about the possibility of weight gain? How about not being able to get

out of bed on your own?

Possibility of liver damage? Remember that your liver is capable of repairing

itself with time in most cases and the is why your liver counts are monitored

by the doctor. Wouldn't it be worse not to be able to button your own clothes?

Possibility of TB? How about not being able to pick up your child or

grandchild?

The possible side effects are scary but the negative of not treating the

disease is even worse. I have had to go off the meds for certain problems, and

I have even forgotten to take them on occasion, but I promise you I am reminded

soon enough. I have had to quit taking them when I had a problem, but I was

always happy to go back on them.

At this time I am worried about more about not being able to take care of my

autistic son and not being able to play with the greatest grandchild in the

world than I am about the possible side effects of my medication. It takes me

more exercise to try to lose some weight, but at least with my medications I am

able to exercise with out as much pain. With my medications, at least I can get

up on my own and not have to call someone to help me get out of the bed, or

even more embarrassing having to call someone in to help me finish using the

toilet. My hands hurt, but I have learned to deal with the pain. My fingers are

beginning to twist some, but that has slowed down due to the medications. I

have to figure it would be a lot worse with out the medication. ( I have proof

of it with a brother that doesn't take any of medication, he was diagnosed

after I was and he is in considerably worse shape physically). I will take the

possible side effects over the sure problems any

day.

Check out AOL Money Finance's list of the

hottest

products and top

money wasters of 2007.

[Guest guest]

hi i like what you had to say. cause that is me sometimes,but you have to over come. those who say things like about you or about what you write. like very disturbing. bet she don't have the pain like i or you have....i don't write alot cause no one seen to know the pain iam every day of my life....have a good day Bethmary backs <haveyarn2crochet@...> wrote: I have been fighting RA for over 35 years. I have had episodes where I actually considered either

amputating the offending limb, or splitting my skin open to relieve the pressure. I will gladly take the risks if it means I can have one minute without the pain. I have gained 50 pounds over time and I am still trying to figure out how to get rid of it. I have tried all the diets out there and even thought about stomach stapling even after I was told it was the medication.Almost all medications can cause liver damage, my cholesterol meds can do as much, if not more damage to my liver, but then again so can alcohol abuse. That isn't enough to make most people quit drinking. At least my liver functions are monitored closely and if the doctor sees dangerous levels, she changes my medications.As for the risk of TB, well I have been smoking 42 years and I am able to say that my lungs are clear of damage except for what has been caused by pneumonia and chronic bronchitis which I have had since childhood. I have been exposed

to TB before and it wasn't God's will that I contract it. I risk more lung damage daily by just breathing. I saw a young cousin die from lung cancer even though she had never smoked or been exposed to cigarette smoke her whole life.This year I have had to go to 2 funerals for family members, one, a niece who was killed in a car wreck while heading to Wal-Mart and the other my oldest sister. Honestly I would rather go the way my niece did because she wasn't aware that she was dying and wasn't forced to live with pain. You see my sister was in pain. I don't know how long she was aware of the pancreatic cancer that was taking her life. I do know that she preferred to live what she called a few quality weeks with her family than to have a surgery that might not give her any more time and would cause her more pain. She was on so much pain medication that she admitted to not knowing which was was up, but she felt that was the

only way she could spend what time she had left with her family, time she used to tell all of us that she loved us and would rather we remember her laughing than suffering. She said that if it was a choice between pain or being able to be pain free for even a minute that she would take that minute any time she could. I am not willing to give in to the pain and plan on continuing to fight this old body of mine and trying to find ways to do the things I love. I think personally that attitude plays a big part in how I am able to cope with what I have, and I make it a point to try to find something good to think about everyday. I try to spend as much time as I have pain free doing something enjoyable to me, whether it is reading a book or just sitting with my cat on my lap while wrapped in ice packs. I am sorry you feel that the risks aren't worth it but to me they are.aclavern33aol wrote: , I read your post and found parts of it very disturbing. You are correct you need to weigh the pros and cons of your disease along with the treatment and long term outcome. Most of this we do not know because we can not see the future. There are other factors that determine how each of use choose to treat our disease. Some of those are race, age, sex, do we have health insurance and can we afford to pay medical bills, do we want children? do we just want to be able to get out of bed? Are we retired and in our 60s or 70s and just hope to live to see the grandchildren? Or even the severity of the disease. I could go on for pages...but i think you get the idea. Weight gain is a problem. Tell that to person that has RA, heart disease and weights 300,400 or even 500 lbs. They are too heavy to exercise to loose weight and the drugs are not helping the situation. The steriods make them too high a risk for weight loss surgery or for any surgery, period. Now add to that if they have osteoporosis, diabetes, cataracts or heart disease induced by the steriods. Even worst their adrenal glands stopped working years ago and they are now steriod dependent.....they can NOT stop the steriods....well, unless you want to deal with side effects of sudden withdrawal and possibly even death. I know of plenty of people not able to get out of bed on there own for various reasons not related to RA. You might find they have a different story to tell about how they choose to live their lives. Surprisingly its not a bad life! Liver damage....well let me clue you in. We only have one liver and though depending on the severity of the damage it can regenerate lobes of itself...if damaged too severely, and without a liver transplant you are DEAD! I protect my liver at all costs. Not all doctors monitor the drugs as they should. Not all patients can afford expensive lab tests or are compliant with them. Then there are some drugs such as Arava that have a history and a major warning that they can cause acute liver failure without warning! On and let me add to that you can carry Hep C with NO symptoms until you are tested via a blood test...now mix that with some of the drugs and you have a deadly cocktail for liver failure. You talk about TB...Maybe you should learn exactly what TB is and how it affects a healthy person inorder to understand the

dangers of it to someone with auto-immune disease. TB infection rates in the US have been climbing in the past years at an alarming rate. It was thought it was a disease of the poor and the dirty. One that the poorest of immigrants bring with them into the US. How wrong that info is. The reason for the sharp rise in the rate is global travel. close living quarters and we no longer screen for TB like we did in the past. Public Schools use to require TB Screening annually...now its done in infancy and again once in the career of a child by the time they finish high school. You will find TB rates very high in prisons, nursing homes or long care facilities and mental health long term facilities. Many people who work with the public are at high risk for TB exposure. TB is caused by a bacterium. When it invades the body via airborne droplets as it is respiratory

spread, you get an immune response to it. The body with the healthy immune system encapsulates the TB bacterium from spreading any further. Its usually in the lungs but can be found in the brain and other parts of the body. When that happens the acute stage is over and it can lay dormant for years. Waiting for a time when the immune system is down and it can escape its immune prison. Then BANG...you are already sick...and TB can run amok on your system because you immune system is already over taxed due to another illness. Its the reason doctors screen for TB and will refuse to use certain DMARDS in patients that test positive or have a history of positive test. The drugs used to suppress immune response to RA can also cause TB infection to flair and run amok. Also if you are suppressed and are exposed to TB it can be more difficult to treat and control. Since the

first line drugs used to treat TB also can cause rise in liver enzyme and liver problems in some people. Side effects of meds...I wonder if you could take care of your son if you had the following side effects from meds: vomiting and diarrhea that was so bad you had to sleep on the bathroom floor because you were tired of cleaning feces off yourself, bed and floor cause you can not get to the bathroom in time. Dehydration, severe fatigue and sores in your mouth, eyes, throat and genitals from meds. Dizziness, headache from either the meds or the dehydration. esophagitis from the vomiting that was so bad you had blood coming back up from the acid in your stomach. Spending you entire life either in bed or on

the bathroom floor due to side effects of meds. Not able to do much productive. I would take the disease any day than to take meds that make quality of life not even worth living. Oh and not being able to button your clothing...they make buttoners for that and many other neat assistive devices as well as they make velcro. Toni I have been reading Posted by: "mary backs" haveyarn2crochet haveyarn2crochet Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 am (PST) a lot lately about people worrying about the possible side effects of medications given for RA and I remembered something . If you actually weigh out the possibility of a side effect versus the almost guaranteed negatives of not treating your disease, it becomes obvious which way you

should go. Worried about the possibility of weight gain? How about not being able to get out of bed on your own?Possibility of liver damage? Remember that your liver is capable of repairing itself with time in most cases and the is why your liver counts are monitored by the doctor. Wouldn't it be worse not to be able to button your own clothes?Possibility of TB? How about not being able to pick up your child or grandchild?The possible side effects are scary but the negative of not treating the disease is even worse. I have had to go off the meds for certain problems, and I have even forgotten to take them on occasion, but I promise you I am reminded soon enough. I have had to quit taking them when I had a problem, but I was always happy to go back on them. At this time I am worried about more about not being able to take care of my autistic son and not being able to play with the greatest grandchild in the world than I am about the

possible side effects of my medication. It takes me more exercise to try to lose some weight, but at least with my medications I am able to exercise with out as much pain. With my medications, at least I can get up on my own and not have to call someone to help me get out of the bed, or even more embarrassing having to call someone in to help me finish using the toilet. My hands hurt, but I have learned to deal with the pain. My fingers are beginning to twist some, but that has slowed down due to the medications. I have to figure it would be a lot worse with out the medication. ( I have proof of it with a brother that doesn't take any of medication, he was diagnosed after I was and he is in considerably worse shape physically). I will take the possible side effects over the sure problems anyday. Check out AOL Money Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007. Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make your homepage.

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Hi ,

I agree with Beth. I showed this to my husband and he thought that you had a wonderful attitude. I deal with family constantly telling me that I am over medicated and your post helped me to help my family understand more. I didn't send your mail to them, I just called them up and read it.

Thank you and God Bless,

Gloria in Okla. , I read your post and found parts of it very disturbing. You are correct you need to weigh the pros and cons of your disease along with the treatment and long term outcome. Most of this we do not know because we can not see the future. There are other factors that determine how each of use choose to treat our disease. Some of those are race, age, sex, do we have health insurance and can we afford to pay medical bills, do we want children? do we just want to be able to get out of bed? Are we retired and in our 60s or 70s and just hope to live to see the grandchildren? Or even the severity of the disease. I could go on for pages...but i think you get the idea. > > Weight gain is a problem. Tell that to person that has RA, heart disease and weights 300,400 or even 500 lbs. They are too heavy to exercise to loose weight and the drugs are not helping the situation. The steriods make them too high a risk for weight loss surgery or for any surgery, period. Now add to that if they have osteoporosis, diabetes, cataracts or heart disease induced by the steriods. Even worst their adrenal glands stopped working years ago and they are now steriod dependent.....they can NOT stop the steriods....well, unless you want to deal with side effects of sudden withdrawal and possibly even death.> > I know of plenty of people not able to get out of bed on there own for various reasons not related to RA. You might find they have a different story to tell about how they choose to live their lives. Surprisingly its not a bad life!> > Liver damage....well let me clue you in. We only have one liver and though depending on the severity of the damage it can regenerate lobes of itself...if damaged too severely, and without a liver transplant you are DEAD! I protect my liver at all costs. Not all doctors monitor the drugs as they should. Not all patients can afford expensive lab tests or are compliant with them. Then there are some drugs such as Arava that have a history and a major warning that they can cause acute liver failure without warning! On and let me add to that you can carry Hep C with NO symptoms until you are tested via a blood test...now mix that with some of the drugs and you have a deadly cocktail for liver failure.> > You talk about TB...Maybe you should learn exactly what TB is and how it affects a healthy person inorder to understand the dangers of it to someone with auto-immune disease. TB infection rates in the US have been climbing in the past years at an alarming rate. It was thought it was a disease of the poor and the dirty. One that the poorest of immigrants bring with them into the US. How wrong that info is. The reason for the sharp rise in the rate is global travel. close living quarters and we no longer screen for TB like we did in the past. Public Schools use to require TB Screening annually...now its done in infancy and again once in the career of a child by the time they finish high school. You will find TB rates very high in prisons, nursing homes or long care facilities and mental health long term facilities. > Many people who work with the public are at high risk for TB exposure. > > TB is caused by a bacterium. When it invades the body via airborne droplets as it is respiratory spread, you get an immune response to it. The body with the healthy immune system encapsulates the TB bacterium from spreading any further. Its usually in the lungs but can be found in the brain and other parts of the body. When that happens the acute stage is over and it can lay dormant for years. Waiting for a time when the immune system is down and it can escape its immune prison. Then BANG...you are already sick...and TB can run amok on your system because you immune system is already over taxed due to another illness.> > Its the reason doctors screen for TB and will refuse to use certain DMARDS in patients that test positive or have a history of positive test. The drugs used to suppress immune response to RA can also cause TB infection to flair and run amok. Also if you are suppressed and are exposed to TB it can be more difficult to treat and control. Since the first line drugs used to treat TB also can cause rise in liver enzyme and liver problems in some people. > > Side effects of meds...I wonder if you could take care of your son if you had the following side effects from meds: vomiting and diarrhea that was so bad you had to sleep on the bathroom floor because you were tired of cleaning feces off yourself, bed and floor cause you can not get to the bathroom in time.> > Dehydration, severe fatigue and sores in your mouth, eyes, throat and genitals from meds. > > Dizziness, headache from either the meds or the dehydration. esophagitis from the vomiting that was so bad you had blood coming back up from the acid in your stomach. > > Spending you entire life either in bed or on the bathroom floor due to side effects of meds. Not able to do much productive. > > I would take the disease any day than to take meds that make quality of life not even worth living. > > Oh and not being able to button your clothing...they make buttoners for that and many other neat assistive devices as well as they make velcro.> > Toni> I have been reading Posted by: "mary backs" haveyarn2crochet@... haveyarn2crochet Mon Nov 26, 2007 11:41 am (PST) a lot lately about people worrying about the possible side effects of medications given for RA and I remembered something . If you actually weigh out the possibility of a side effect versus the almost guaranteed negatives of not treating your disease, it becomes obvious which way you should go. > > Worried about the possibility of weight gain? How about not being able to get out of bed on your own?> > Possibility of liver damage? Remember that your liver is capable of repairing itself with time in most cases and the is why your liver counts are monitored by the doctor. Wouldn't it be worse not to be able to button your own clothes?> > Possibility of TB? How about not being able to pick up your child or grandchild?> > The possible side effects are scary but the negative of not treating the disease is even worse. I have had to go off the meds for certain problems, and I have even forgotten to take them on occasion, but I promise you I am reminded soon enough. I have had to quit taking them when I had a problem, but I was always happy to go back on them. > > At this time I am worried about more about not being able to take care of my autistic son and not being able to play with the greatest grandchild in the world than I am about the possible side effects of my medication. It takes me more exercise to try to lose some weight, but at least with my medications I am able to exercise with out as much pain. With my medications, at least I can get up on my own and not have to call someone to help me get out of the bed, or even more embarrassing having to call someone in to help me finish using the toilet. My hands hurt, but I have learned to deal with the pain. My fingers are beginning to twist some, but that has slowed down due to the medications. I have to figure it would be a lot worse with out the medication. ( I have proof of it with a brother that doesn't take any of medication, he was diagnosed after I was and he is in considerably worse shape physically). I will take the possible side effects over the sure problems any> day.> > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------> Check out AOL Money Finance's list of the hottest products and top money wasters of 2007.> > > > > ---------------------------------> Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make your homepage. > > > > > > > ---------------------------------> Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.>