vaccines

[Guest guest]

Thanks, -Anne. I will forward this question off. Sandy

ALL INFORMATION, DATA, AND MATERIAL CONTAINED, PRESENTED, OR PROVIDED

HERE IS FOR GENERAL INFORMATION PURPOSES ONLY AND IS NOT TO BE CONSTRUED

AS REFLECTING THE KNOWLEDGE OR OPINIONS OF THE PUBLISHER, AND IS NOT TO

BE CONSTRUED OR INTENDED AS PROVIDING MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE DECISION

WHETHER OR NOT TO VACCINATE IS AN IMPORTANT AND COMPLEX ISSUE

AND SHOULD BE MADE BY YOU, AND YOU ALONE, IN CONSULTATION WITH YOUR

HEALTH CARE PROVIDER.

Re: Fw: Vaccines

Dear Sandy,

My daughter is going for a trip to the States for one week this summer. The

information sheet (where she is staying) requires knowing the dates of her

last vaccination. Can she be denied leaving the country because her

vaccinations are not up to date?

Thanks Sandy.

-Anne

[Guest guest]

dear Teela,

I second what Judy had to say about pertussis. We lived in Germany for a while when Annie was two, and there are many people there who don't vaccinate their children now. It was not at all uncommon to see children being pushed around in strollers and wheelchairs because they were so worn out from coughing. I still think about a child I saw in a store who seemed to be dying. Someone expressed concern and the mother said, "No, just whooping cough." I've never seen a child suffer that much and it still haunts me. That's just my two cents worth. Why is Summer going to ear,nose and throat specialists and not getting treatment for her OCD?? I don't get it.

Hugs,

[Guest guest]

All my kids have had their vaccinations. I've read where some

parents are against, etc. (and, yes, part of me would worry my child

would be the 1 out of 100,000 or so that would react badly!)

My question - how do kids withOUT vaccinations go to school??? Here

in NC, kids can't begin school if their immunizations are not up to

date; can't go to childcares either.

> Good to have you back, Teela.

>

> About the vaccinations, though, I'm afraid you have been mislead

about the dangers. The old pertussis vaccines (the whole cell

preparations) did often cause fevers, etc, but the new acellular ones

are much more benign. The dangers of not being vaccinated are much

greater than purported side effects, internet " experts "

nonwithstanding. If you ever saw a kid with whooping cough, you

would definitely change your mind. And believe me, thanks to the

scare tactics by a vocal, poorly-informed group of anti-vaccine

alarmists, there are plenty of kids now getting whooping cough, not

to mention other preventable childhood diseases which are sometimes

fatal.

>

> I'm a medical microbiologist with no axe to grind--just want to

keep kids safe and healthy. If you want more information on this

from reputable medical scientists, let me know and I will get it

together for you.

>

> Judy in Baltimore

> Summer's update

>

>

> Hi everyone. sorry I have been away after just

> returning. Sheesh life is busy. I have been reading

> about vaccinations and I have decided that neither one

> of my girls will be getting any further vaccines with

> pertussis in it. I haven't come to any decisions

> reguarding the others so they are on hold for now.

> Summer went to her dr and I finally at the end of the

> appt got mad at him. It was after he spent all his

> time trying to tell me to put her into child care 5

> days a week and that I had separation anxiety. I lost

> it. I told him in no uncertain terms that I was sick

> and tired of getting no where, the run around etc. I

> told him that if he has someone who was going to help

> Summer learn to deal with her issues instead of

> babysit and play with her I wouldn't have a problem

> with her being away. I didn't feel she needed to spend

> more time away from home when what she needs is a

> mommy. He was shocked. Maybe we will see some progress

> now. She isn't on meds yet. I found my own ot in

> Kingston and we are in the process of setting up an

> appt. We are looking into funding as it is 100 for the

> initial 1 hour assessment and 80 for 50 minutes

> sessions. she is going to teach me brushing!!!!!

> YAY!!!!!! Summer is going on MOnday for a hearing

> assessment, and fri is her appt with the ear nose and

> throat specialist. We are going away for a week so I

> can finish my driving lessons. We will be back the

> following fri. take care and hugs teela

>

> _______________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

In most states, children without vaccinations can go to school if

parents sign a form that the lack of vaccines are for religious or

reasons or some version of " against personal principles. " However,

if there is any outbreak of a usually vaccinated illness by those who

are unvaccinated or by those children who are vaccinated, the

unvaccinated children are not allowed to go to school until the

illness is no longer communicable. Hope this answers your questions.

Stephany

[Guest guest]

I didn't vaccinate Ava when she was a baby, I waited until she was older, around

first grade, and then only selectively. In NC you just get a religious

exemption form from the health dept.and fill it out and turn it in to the

school. They don't ask what religion, it's pretty easy to do. If I had a baby

now I'd just vaccinate - OCD has made me get over my fear of medications,

non-organic food, chlorine or fluoride in the water supply etc. and join the

21st century. We love medical technology in our house now!

Dana in NC

[Guest guest]

Yikes Teela,

Given those reactions I wouldn't give them anymore either!

[Guest guest]

Did any of you guys with 15 yo's have trouble getting the DT 10 year

booster? 's was due in April, but because of a nationwide

shortage, it wasn't available here. The serum that drs had was saved

for treatment of injuries. Our school nurse kept sending harassing

letters...I called and left a message about the shortage. Her

response was " to try the county health clinics " . After 3 tries and

many miles on my car, I gave up. Anyone else have this problem?

Melinda S.

Dallas

> Wow, that WAS awful. My son also had bad reactions to the DPT

shots, but he's 15 yo now, so that was with the earlier version of

the vaccine. I believe you can get the shots separately now, without

the pertussis. Are you in Canada or the US? I know the US held onto

the whole cell vaccine a lot longer than they did in Europe--don't

know about Canada.

>

> I wonder how individuals who are pre-disposed to react so

vigorously to the pertussis shot would fare if infected with the

Bordetella pertussis infection naturally--maybe they would have a

more severe disease course also than the average person.

>

> Judy in Baltimore

> Re: Re: vaccines

>

>

> Thanks for the input and info. I would love more if

> anyone wants to send it to me. At this point neither

> one of my girls will recieve anymore petussis vaccines

> though. Summer had a fever of 105 for 5 days. nothing

> brought it down. that is not a minor reaction. She was

> vomiting and screaming endlessly. she couldn't sleep

> until she exhausted herself and then startled awake to

> start again. Jordanna who never sleeps. she goes on

> maybe an hour all day long went to sleep in the office

> after her shot and slept until 10:30 the next morning.

> this child is up twice at night without fail for

> feedings. she slept through the night. I had

> difficulty rousing her enough to feed her something

> before tucking her in. excessive sleepiness was a

> contraindication against giving a child more of the

> pertussis vaccine right up until 1988. No more of that

> one for my girls. I haven't decided about the others

> yet but that one for sure. teela

>

> _______________________________________________________

>

[Guest guest]

Is this the tetanus? I just got my booster a couple months ago

(May/June?) at our county health dept.

> > Wow, that WAS awful. My son also had bad reactions to the DPT

> shots, but he's 15 yo now, so that was with the earlier version of

> the vaccine. I believe you can get the shots separately now,

without

> the pertussis. Are you in Canada or the US? I know the US held

onto

> the whole cell vaccine a lot longer than they did in Europe--don't

> know about Canada.

> >

> > I wonder how individuals who are pre-disposed to react so

> vigorously to the pertussis shot would fare if infected with the

> Bordetella pertussis infection naturally--maybe they would have a

> more severe disease course also than the average person.

> >

> > Judy in Baltimore

> > Re: Re: vaccines

> >

> >

> > Thanks for the input and info. I would love more if

> > anyone wants to send it to me. At this point neither

> > one of my girls will recieve anymore petussis vaccines

> > though. Summer had a fever of 105 for 5 days. nothing

> > brought it down. that is not a minor reaction. She was

> > vomiting and screaming endlessly. she couldn't sleep

> > until she exhausted herself and then startled awake to

> > start again. Jordanna who never sleeps. she goes on

> > maybe an hour all day long went to sleep in the office

> > after her shot and slept until 10:30 the next morning.

> > this child is up twice at night without fail for

> > feedings. she slept through the night. I had

> > difficulty rousing her enough to feed her something

> > before tucking her in. excessive sleepiness was a

> > contraindication against giving a child more of the

> > pertussis vaccine right up until 1988. No more of that

> > one for my girls. I haven't decided about the others

> > yet but that one for sure. teela

> >

> > _______________________________________________________

> >

[Guest guest]

Yes there is a shortage of Tetenus. got a shot at

his pediatricians office before he went to Philmont. I had heard that

there was a shortage, but they said since this was a childs clinic

they had some.

Vivian

> > > Wow, that WAS awful. My son also had bad reactions to the DPT

> > shots, but he's 15 yo now, so that was with the earlier version

of

> > the vaccine. I believe you can get the shots separately now,

> without

> > the pertussis. Are you in Canada or the US? I know the US held

> onto

> > the whole cell vaccine a lot longer than they did in Europe--

don't

> > know about Canada.

> > >

> > > I wonder how individuals who are pre-disposed to react so

> > vigorously to the pertussis shot would fare if infected with the

> > Bordetella pertussis infection naturally--maybe they would have a

> > more severe disease course also than the average person.

> > >

> > > Judy in Baltimore

> > > Re: Re: vaccines

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for the input and info. I would love more if

> > > anyone wants to send it to me. At this point neither

> > > one of my girls will recieve anymore petussis vaccines

> > > though. Summer had a fever of 105 for 5 days. nothing

> > > brought it down. that is not a minor reaction. She was

> > > vomiting and screaming endlessly. she couldn't sleep

> > > until she exhausted herself and then startled awake to

> > > start again. Jordanna who never sleeps. she goes on

> > > maybe an hour all day long went to sleep in the office

> > > after her shot and slept until 10:30 the next morning.

> > > this child is up twice at night without fail for

> > > feedings. she slept through the night. I had

> > > difficulty rousing her enough to feed her something

> > > before tucking her in. excessive sleepiness was a

> > > contraindication against giving a child more of the

> > > pertussis vaccine right up until 1988. No more of that

> > > one for my girls. I haven't decided about the others

> > > yet but that one for sure. teela

> > >

> > > _______________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Yes, Diptheria/Tetanus. Wow, we were told there was a national

shortage. That was about the same time that I was still looking for

it here! I guess I will call our fam doc and see if they have it in

yet.

Thanks!

Melinda

> > > Wow, that WAS awful. My son also had bad reactions to the DPT

> > shots, but he's 15 yo now, so that was with the earlier version

of

> > the vaccine. I believe you can get the shots separately now,

> without

> > the pertussis. Are you in Canada or the US? I know the US held

> onto

> > the whole cell vaccine a lot longer than they did in Europe--

don't

> > know about Canada.

> > >

> > > I wonder how individuals who are pre-disposed to react so

> > vigorously to the pertussis shot would fare if infected with the

> > Bordetella pertussis infection naturally--maybe they would have a

> > more severe disease course also than the average person.

> > >

> > > Judy in Baltimore

> > > Re: Re: vaccines

> > >

> > >

> > > Thanks for the input and info. I would love more if

> > > anyone wants to send it to me. At this point neither

> > > one of my girls will recieve anymore petussis vaccines

> > > though. Summer had a fever of 105 for 5 days. nothing

> > > brought it down. that is not a minor reaction. She was

> > > vomiting and screaming endlessly. she couldn't sleep

> > > until she exhausted herself and then startled awake to

> > > start again. Jordanna who never sleeps. she goes on

> > > maybe an hour all day long went to sleep in the office

> > > after her shot and slept until 10:30 the next morning.

> > > this child is up twice at night without fail for

> > > feedings. she slept through the night. I had

> > > difficulty rousing her enough to feed her something

> > > before tucking her in. excessive sleepiness was a

> > > contraindication against giving a child more of the

> > > pertussis vaccine right up until 1988. No more of that

> > > one for my girls. I haven't decided about the others

> > > yet but that one for sure. teela

> > >

> > > _______________________________________________________

> > >

[Guest guest]

Vivian,

I guess they are just real stingy down here in Texas. I was a little

nervous sending him to out of counsel (Colorado) summer camp without

a booster. But I eventually figured that if he needed it, they would

find some somewhere. I told his dad, " Now if ends up needing

a Tetenus shot, be sure to get written verification for our (and the

school's) records. " Yeah, right!

Melinda

> > > > Wow, that WAS awful. My son also had bad reactions to the

DPT

> > > shots, but he's 15 yo now, so that was with the earlier version

> of

> > > the vaccine. I believe you can get the shots separately now,

> > without

> > > the pertussis. Are you in Canada or the US? I know the US

held

> > onto

> > > the whole cell vaccine a lot longer than they did in Europe--

> don't

> > > know about Canada.

> > > >

> > > > I wonder how individuals who are pre-disposed to react so

> > > vigorously to the pertussis shot would fare if infected with

the

> > > Bordetella pertussis infection naturally--maybe they would have

a

> > > more severe disease course also than the average person.

> > > >

> > > > Judy in Baltimore

> > > > Re: Re: vaccines

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Thanks for the input and info. I would love more if

> > > > anyone wants to send it to me. At this point neither

> > > > one of my girls will recieve anymore petussis vaccines

> > > > though. Summer had a fever of 105 for 5 days. nothing

> > > > brought it down. that is not a minor reaction. She was

> > > > vomiting and screaming endlessly. she couldn't sleep

> > > > until she exhausted herself and then startled awake to

> > > > start again. Jordanna who never sleeps. she goes on

> > > > maybe an hour all day long went to sleep in the office

> > > > after her shot and slept until 10:30 the next morning.

> > > > this child is up twice at night without fail for

> > > > feedings. she slept through the night. I had

> > > > difficulty rousing her enough to feed her something

> > > > before tucking her in. excessive sleepiness was a

> > > > contraindication against giving a child more of the

> > > > pertussis vaccine right up until 1988. No more of that

> > > > one for my girls. I haven't decided about the others

> > > > yet but that one for sure. teela

> > > >

> > > > _______________________________________________________

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Melinda - If the DT you are referring to is tetanus, we can't get it around

here either. They are not even using it in emergency rooms as a

preventative. My oldest son just had his college physical, and our doctor

said no one in the state can get it unless it's an absolute emergency. Cyndi

in VA

[Guest guest]

Wow, that's interesting...some states have it and some don't. I

guess we just have to look out for rusty nails!

Melinda

> Melinda - If the DT you are referring to is tetanus, we can't get

it around

> here either. They are not even using it in emergency rooms as a

> preventative. My oldest son just had his college physical, and our

doctor

> said no one in the state can get it unless it's an absolute

emergency. Cyndi

> in VA

[Guest guest]

---------- Fw: VACCINES

Greetings and Salutations,

Observations on Vaccines.

It takes " simple old " teachers, utilising the powers of observation that God

has blessed them with, to realise that by stopping their pupils at lunch

time from eating " junk food " , produces an immediate improvement in their

behaviour.

They confound our learned men of science who seem to have forgotten one of

the basic laws of science. Very few ever listen to their patients long

enough to ask the question as to what the possible basic cause of the

problem could be before having to dash to a microscope or a machine and

produce a pill or vaccine to " cure " the problem.

Thirty years ago Hyperactive children were unheard of. Autism had not yet

been created, asthmatics were few and far between, one in something like one

in thirty got cancer and we could go on and on. These facts have not been

adequately addressed yet today.

Throwing money at a problem will not make it go away, neither will a fire

be put out while the gas main remains open.

We have some comments here from a man who not only has much knowledge in the

sphere of medicine but has applied those simple powers of observation to

make some very bold and basic conclusions that we should have heard from our

Masters of Wisdom and Learning a long time ago.

We are grateful that he has extended a hand of friendship across the Pacific

to add his voice to ours in the debate on the safety of vaccinations.

Dr Duffy has a website www.duffyslaw.com <http://www.duffyslaw.com> with

some healthy

comments on the abuse of vaccinations and your rights as free individuals.

Our grateful thanks to him for his advice.

Regards

Kiwi Joe

VACCINES

Sir,

Your debate on vaccines should be simply to eliminate COMPULSORY

vaccination.

ANY consideration of ANY vaccine being declared COMPULSORY under ANY

condition, for ANY reason is simply intolerable.

No human being has the right to FORCEFULLY, UNDER PROTECTION OF LAW, inflict

another human being with ANY type of medical treatment.

This violates the most basic right of a human being - to protect his/her own

body against invasion by the state. The notion that the state has the right

to

penetrate the body of a citizen and inject ANYTHING into the citizen's body

against the citizen's desire is absolutely insane. This provides the citizen

with

the right to use lethal force to resist such penetration because the

scientific

evidence proves that vaccines kill people. Therefore vaccination is a lethal

force.

The principle espoused herein was laid down at Nuremberg over fifty years

ago. NO COMPULSORY MEDICAL TREATMENT OF ANY TYPE FOR

ANY REASON UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE - QUARANTINE IS THE

ONLY RECOURSE OF A GOVERNMENT - do everything you can to get

medical influences out of your legislature and any time anything medical

appears in your legislative approach you need to attack it vigorously and

eliminate it. The world is presently suffering from the tyranny of medicine

that was predicted by Rush, one of the signers of the American

constitution - he warned that doctors should be forever barred from

participation

in government and never be given any type of political power lest they usurp

government and form what we now see worldwide, the tyranny of medicine.

The notion of transmissable diseases is a false notion that should have been

laid to rest a century ago but has been kept alive by criminal activity in

the

medical professions and the pharmaceuticals.

1. No vaccine has ever prevented, cured or ameliorated any " epidemic "

disease.

2. Every vaccine is a form of Russian Roulette.

3. Every vaccine is an insult to the immune system.

4. History will eventually teach that vaccination was the greatest

embarrassment of medicine.

5. In light of the scientific evidence, any doctor who vaccinates a neonate

or innocent child belongs in jail, not in practice. It is only the great

political, psychological and financial power of medicine and the

pharmaceuticals that have kept this awful habit in vogue.

I am a retired air force officer and have thirty years experience as a small

town family

doctor. After my first vaccination in the military I never submitted to

another although I spent

21 years in the military. My medical education began at the tender age of 17

following my first vaccination and I can tell you that there is absolutely

no evidence of ANY vaccine EVER having ANY beneficial effect ANYWHERE on the

globe, for ANY disease - including tetanus which responds quickly to

intravenous vitamin C.

Dr H Duffy Sr

Geneva, Ohio

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/22/2002 10:52:53 PM Central Standard Time,

sandraray@... writes:

> I know PID kids shouldn't get vaccines, but until now

> I've never really been worried about it. We got all of Autumn's shots

> without incident--

>

:

I'm behind on mail and coming in in the middle of this, I hope you don't

mind. But I was wondering why you said that. Except for live vaccines, I

would think PID kids need vaccines MORE than other kids, as that could be

their only protection if their systems can't fight the " real " disease. I know

I agonized over finally getting the MMR when the immuno said to, but other

than that I am always grateful she has the protection against everything she

got immunized for.

Just my thoughts...

(mom to , age 3. Currently has polysaccharide antibody def,

previously had transient IgG, IgA, t-cell & other defs)

[Guest guest]

,

I probably meant live vaccines--I was struggling with an awful migraine

yesterday & dh accused me of being incoherent at times.

He's due for his 12 month shots right now (sorry, can't remember which ones

those are). Autumn did ok with hers--she even had the oral polio--now the

ped only does the im polio.

Ray, mother to Tabitha (age 6), Autumn, age 4 (IgG def., asthma,

chronic sinusitis, and allergies), and Duncan (14 months)

[Guest guest]

Rebekah has horrid reactions to every vaccination series. After the 1 year

vaccines, she was sick for SIX MONTHS! I suspect that the combination of

live MMR and varivax was too much for her. Also, the DPT stuff causes her

to get very, very sick! I WILL NOT VACCINATE HER AGAIN! I think we are

lucky that she survived her vaccines. I think that Rebekah could easily

have been one of those unfortunate statistics that they have in fine print

on the consent to vaccinate sheets, you know, the ones that read 1 in

100,000 children will have a serious or fatal response to this vaccine!

Pam

Mom to 4

Rebekah with CVID??

> I know PID kids shouldn't get vaccines, but until now

> I've never really been worried about it. We got all of Autumn's shots

> without incident--

>

:

I'm behind on mail and coming in in the middle of this, I hope you don't

mind. But I was wondering why you said that. Except for live vaccines, I

would think PID kids need vaccines MORE than other kids, as that could be

[Guest guest]

My daughter had a bad reaction to the first childhood immunisation programme

and was ill for 3 weeks. She then had the 2nd lot and ended up in intensive

care. I thought the vaccines were making her ill but the medical

proffesionals wouldn`t accept that. Needless to say she hasn`t had any

vaccines since. October 01 we saw the immunologist and she recommended that

she continue with the vaccines even though her T cells and helper T cells

are still outside the normal range. I trusted my gut instinct on this one. I

know she will be very ill if she gets measles and possibly chicken pox but I

know she will react badly to the vaccines also, so like you I`m damned if I

do and damned if I don`t but at least I will only have the diseases to deal

with and not the impurites that are added to the vaccines. Please note this

is just my personal thought on the subject and what I am doing with my

daughter. All my other children have been vaccinated with no ill effect.

Carol mum to Maya aged 2 years 7 months.

_________________________________________________________________

Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8.

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[Guest guest]

AS a Nurse RIGHT ON! Our guts as moms have over and over proved out for our

special kids. Lucas does not get live vaccines period. I was not a popular

colleague but he has had a reaction to all but the flu vaccine. BARBIE

[Guest guest]

Thank God for IVIg. BARBIE

[Guest guest]

Usually the Pneumovax is not given until atleast age 2. If I am recalling

correctly. BARBIE ( Lucas, 7, CVID, IVIg, Bipolar)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/15/2003 11:38:06 PM Central Standard Time,

MOTHER1544@... writes:

> Usually the Pneumovax is not given until atleast age 2. If I am recalling

> correctly. BARBIE ( Lucas, 7, CVID, IVIg, Bipolar)

>

>

Barbie:

That's correct. However, our immuno does not bother to ever give Pneumovax to

PID pumpkins who do not respond well to Prevnar, her theory being that if

they don't respond to the conjugate, there's no way they'll respond to the

" regular " vaccine.

(mom to Kate, born 9/19/02; and , age 4 -- currently has

polysaccharide antibody def, previously had transient IgG, IgA, t-cell &

other defs)

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 2/15/2003 11:38:06 PM Central Standard Time,

MOTHER1544@... writes:

> Usually the Pneumovax is not given until atleast age 2. If I am recalling

> correctly. BARBIE ( Lucas, 7, CVID, IVIg, Bipolar)

>

>

Barbie:

That's correct. However, our immuno does not bother to ever give Pneumovax to

PID pumpkins who do not respond well to Prevnar, her theory being that if

they don't respond to the conjugate, there's no way they'll respond to the

" regular " vaccine.

(mom to Kate, born 9/19/02; and , age 4 -- currently has

polysaccharide antibody def, previously had transient IgG, IgA, t-cell &

other defs)

[Guest guest]

Since Maya`s awful reaction to immunisations at the age of 5 months, I have

read alot into vaccines and consequently decided that Maya and the rest of

my children won`t be having any more vaccines. I have 4 daughters aged

16,14,11 and Maya 3. The eldest has not had any boosters on leaving school

and the 14 year old did not have her BCG. When you think of all the

autoimmune disorders and allergies that are on the increase it does make me

wonder why they are on the increase. I watched a programme the other night

about a young lady who was allergic to alot of food stuffs and the allergist

thought that vaccines were contributing to this. Maya hasn`t had the MMR and

vaccines are not compulsory in the UK.

Carol

_________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Carol,

Since vaccines are not mandatory in the UK, are there lots of people

choosing not to vaccinate? Are diseases that are controlled in the

states(measles, mumps, polio) still all around the UK? Or, are people still

vaccinating their children regardless of whether they have to or not?

Belinda Rose,

Mom to Allyssa (11) and Cassie (8), igg immunodeficient, asthma, sinusitis,

IVIG for 6 years, heart condition