Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 I really would recommend a therapist for you and your daughter. Sometimes being able to break down and vent to a third party is the best! I was never a fan of counseling, but I went today for the first time in years and feel much better. I feel like such a burden to my family, a failure as a mother and I fear my children will inherit this disease. To be able to 'vomit' up all these emotions to someone who wasn't trying to 'fix' or 'judge' was priceless. I'm in my late 30s and my friends (who are Lets!) ask " are you better yet? " So even the people in the 'know' have to be educated. Maybe you should throw a formal party for your daughter and have a speaker from the Arthritis Society in to educate folks. It could be a fundraiser/awareness party. For example, I am an Arbonne consultant. I am going to throw an Arbonne party and invite all my friends. I am going to have a speaker talk about RA. All proceeds from things purchased that night will go to the Arthritis Foundation. My goal is to raise $1500. And maybe my friends and relatives will learn something so I don't have to explain myself everytime. {{{big gentle hugs}}} _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Lesley Rafferty Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 2:47 PM Subject: Re: [ ] Depression Of course you are affected, it is our natural instinct to protect our children. Is there someone that you can talk to about this? Perhaps see your doctor. However, your daughter needs you. She is going through something that is painful, which can cause depression. You need to distance yourself from your pain and be strong for her. Yes, by all means scream and shout when she isn't there but while she is around you need to be matter of fact and supportive. By turning away from her now you are rejecting her. A teenage girl is vulnerable at the best of times. To have this awful, hateful disease on top of everything is heartbreaking but you need to be strong for her. Stop concentrating on the bad things. Focus on what she can do. Is there a heated swimming pool nearby that she can use? If her own mother can turn away from her how abandoned will she feel? Her self image is very delicate at this age. Please re enforce her positives. She needs you, this is her time, Look after yourselves and giver her as much love and support as she needs x From: Alleys <alley5comcast (DOT) <mailto:alley5%40comcast.net> net> Subject: [ ] Depression @gro <mailto: %40> ups.com Date: Friday, 13 February, 2009, 8:02 PM I'm just wondering if folks here have any tips or thoughts on how to deal with this? Perhaps it is different for me, since it's my daughter not myself that is dealing with this disease, not sure how that might effect coping mechanisms. I'm finding this is truly the hardest thing I've ever had to deal with emotionally (and it's not like I've never had rough stuff to deal with before, I have been through a lot) and I must admit I am NOT dealing with it very well at all. I can't go to sleep at night because all I can think is my daughter is in pain and there is nothing I can do about it, and then I do not want to get up in the morning because I don't want to face the reality that my daughter is in severe pain and there is nothing I can do about it. It was less than a year ago I was watching my daughter climb up a very tall tree and I had to turn my back and walk away from her because while I knew she would be cautious as her mom I worry she might get hurt, so my instinct is to have her feet firmly planted on the ground and to never take any risks. now I watch my daughter struggle to make it up the sidewalk, or cross the floor without falling, and I have to turn away because I am so scared for her just doing the normal 'safe' things and it breaks my heart! She has been dancing ballet since she was 4 and had been doing pointe work for a few years before this struck and so many times I would worry about that, she would be so sore and dancing on bloody toes, etc., but the joy I saw on her face every day after two hours of practice and it wasn't enough, and especially the happiness she found in performing, I felt she was so blessed to have found her passion, I've never had that, known exactly what I wanted to do and what made me happy and she many times told me how incredibly fortunate she was she got to live her dream of dancing and she also enjoyed acting and sparring, she would get so bruised up and never minded the pain, so I know this arthritis must be really bad, but it just kills me because she has always been so physical and now she can't even turn a door knob by herself and can barely walk. it doesn't seem fair to have this all taken away from her. Her friends have stopped calling. they would always be asking, " are you better, yet? Can you come play again? " .all the things they did involved a great deal of physical activity because that's what she enjoyed, she's never been a sit still kind of girl. We kept thinking this is something that would just go away soon we just had to get through this but more and more we are starting to think maybe it won't go away. the first time I even realized that was a possibility was after going to see the pediatric rheumatologist and after that visit I spent a week and a half crying in my room. I mean this is just terrible, I can't even imagine how hard this must be for my daughter and I'm sure the last thing she needs is an absent mother who can't even get it together enough to make breakfast for her and her siblings! I talked myself out of that, but I feel it coming on again and we keep trying new things and it all feels so hopeless. I need to be better and stronger, but all I do is try not to cry. I find myself actually *avoiding* my daughter because it hurts so much to see her fingers so swollen, her joints are bigger than her father's, and to see her sitting there all the time and then watch her struggle in excruciating pain just to get up or rearrange herself and I know she is bored out of her mind and I need to find things for her to do but I CAN'T FACE IT! She deserves better. I find myself grateful for the cold because with the long sleeves and long legs I don't have to see her swollen elbows, knees and ankles. seeing her come out of the shower is pure torture, I just want to scream at the world. I just can't accept this reality, and I know I need to. So, I don't know, is this something that will just always come and go, or is it just so terrible right now as we come up against the realities of the situation and it will eventually get easier to deal with? I wonder too about letting my daughter know how I feel or putting up a front. initially when this all first started I made very light of it while all the time I was completely freaking out and she later said how nice it was to have her pain and symptoms validated once we saw the specialist and so I felt bad that maybe in my efforts to make her feel this was nothing to worry about I may have made her feel I wasn't taking her seriously. Maybe now she thinks I don't care? But I feel if I let her know how much this tears me up she will have a harder time dealing with it herself. I know that I find great help in my husband's strength and when he gets upset I feel completely lost. It's hard to know the right thing, and it's even harder to feel maybe there is no right thing, it all just feels wrong. Anyways, thanks for 'listening', if anyone has any thoughts I'd appreciate it. I don't know if I need a shoulder to cry on or a good reality slap to get over myself. I know there is so much in the world I can't control, I can do nothing about, but I always thought I could at least be there for my children and make their lives great, but now?.... Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 On Behalf Of Janet Cumbo Sorry to be harsh, but toughen up, you need to be strong for your daughter and fight for her. I doubt you could be any harsher than I am on myself, so no worries there! I definitely realize I need to be stronger. I'm just not sure how to go about that, to get to that point. I managed for awhile by just pretending this isn't really happening. I need to find a way to manage without ignoring the reality. I need to be able to accept the situation and be joyful. I just don't know if it's something that will just come with time and maybe I don't need to be so hard on myself, maybe it's just all part of the grieving process of letting go of that life right now and learning to accept a new one, or if there is more I can or should be doing to move towards that goal, if what I'm feeling and how I'm not coping so well is beyond how I should be feeling. Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 Thank you, Heidi, this is very helpful. her friends are all very considerate and supportive, it's just that her relationships were very much activity based and she can't do those activities so it doesn't really make sense to hang out. she's never been a just hang out person, she's always needed to be very active and so those were the friends she sought out and enjoyed. She's always welcome to go watch her friends doing all the things she can no longer do, but it's not exactly something she wants to do and she doesn't really have much else to relate to with them. hanging out with people because they feel sorry for you when they would really rather be doing something else isn't very fun for her either (she's been offered this and passed. of course if not for her RA she would not be interested in hanging out with folks that wanted to just sit around herself). true, we have discovered a fair weather friend or two, but for the most part it isn't about that, it's just all her friends are just as busy doing all the things she used to be just as busy doing and the rest is coming more from her not really be interested at this time. At any rate, I appreciate your comments, I just really want to know that she can be happy and ways I can help with that, it helps to know I can do something for her. Sharon _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of sposy@... Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 12:42 PM Subject: Re: [ ] Depression Hi Sharon, It's good for you to vent here. You do need to be there for your daughter. I know how she must be feeling, not being able to do the things she used to, but once she's on the right medications, she will gain back some of what she lost. There are no guarantees, but the meds do help. As for her friends, perhaps they need to be educated as to what your daughter has. Teenagers, or tweens are tough, but I firmly believe her real friends are not going to leave her. The last thing your daughter needs is to feel isolated. If you cry every time you see her, or act nervous, etc...she will feed off of you and maybe start to think she can't do anything. With RA, you learn to do things in smaller steps. You can have a life, but you do need to make some adjustments. Please stay positive.............your daughter needs that. Let the medications work. We're here to listen, so let it out! Hugs to you... Heidi in Mass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 Thanks, , I did not join a JRA group because according to the rheumatologist my daughter does not have this, he feels because of her age and her symptoms she is really in the adult form category and talking to people dealing with JRA it seems very different. I mean these are usually young kids, maybe I'm wrong, but it feels different to me dealing with a young child going through this, I feel like my daughter is a young adult, even as young as she is. she's always been so grown up to me!... and I see her life being robbed from her just as it's really barely begun. Understanding how other adults are able to navigate this disease feels more helpful to me right now and I've been able to gain some insight into this which I am so grateful for, that I just haven't been able to talking to parents with children with JRA... she isn't yet having to worry about earning a living or caring for her own children (although she talks about this all the time and I wonder about that for her as well) but in all other ways I feel she was very independent and in control of her own life and goals, she had it all mapped out already and was very much in charge and now she has to rely on the rest of us and her life plans will be very different. Or maybe I'm just making excuses to avoid reading about poor little kids suffering with this. it's a good idea to ask the PR about help in this and I have thought of that, but it's hard because my daughter's there and I'm still trying to keep up that happy, joyful front and my efforts to get a private moment never seem to work out. and, again, while on one hand I'm sure other parents would be able to relate to the pressure of making difficult medical decisions, ultimately I just want to have an understanding of what it feels like from her perspective. She's really enjoyed communicating with other adults dealing with this disease and seems to have more in common and more to relate to with other adults with RA than with other children. Maybe I should reconsider and join that group as well, though. Thank you for the link. Sharon _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 1:40 PM Subject: Re: [ ] Depression Sharon, I'm very sorry about what your daughter and you are going through. It may help to join a group for parents with children who have arthritis, like this one: http://health. <juvenile arthritis/> /group/juvenile arthritis/ Your daughter's pediatric rheumatologist may also have ideas about a counselor or other parents with whom you can discuss these issues. Good luck, Not an MD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 13, 2009 Report Share Posted February 13, 2009 >On Behalf Of Lesley Rafferty: >You need to distance yourself from your pain and be strong for her. Yes, by all means scream and shout when she isn't there but while she is around you need to be matter of fact and supportive. By turning away from her now you are rejecting her. A teenage girl is >vulnerable at the best of times. To have this awful, hateful disease on top of everything is heartbreaking but you need to be strong for her. Stop concentrating on the bad things. Focus on what she can do. Is there a heated swimming pool nearby that she can use? ..If her own mother can turn away from her how abandoned will she feel? Her self image is very delicate at this age. Please re enforce her positives. She needs you, this is her time, I think a big factor in this for me is that I want to be hopeful and yet that seems to lead to disappointment so rather than focusing on what she can do, as you suggest, I continue to reconfront all those bad things again and again. we are starting to make changes to redefine her life, because it just can't be what it once was. it's hard to find that balance between having hope that she can someday return to her dreams and learning to find new dreams and neither one of us right now is quite certain which direction to invest our energies in. For the record, just to reassure everyone, because of this disease I actually end up spending much more time with her now that she is not so busy doing so many things (although we are working on finding more activities for her that she can enjoy regardless of RA, haven't tried the swimming yet but hope to start with that next week, actually!), so while I sometimes stay a little longer in the bathroom or check on things on the stove a little more than I need to, she is still getting more mommy time than ever. I just want to keep it that way and keep being positive for her, as it sounds like I really need to be. I'm afraid that if she sees how sad I am she will think she's a burden, and I'm afraid that if I pretend not to care she will think I think she's weak, and, really, I'm just afraid. I want the best for her, and it doesn't matter to me what that is, but it matters to me terribly how it matters to her. So, again, thanks for 'listening' Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 Hi Sharon I truly feel for your situation. I personally as a sufferer feel helpless at times helping myself but it would feel even worse to have to watch your child suffer and feel this helpless. All you are feeling is natural and things I believe will change over time. At least that is how I have been. Sometimes I think the anger and lack of acceptane is part of the course to help us fight. My thinking goes that there's a good balance somewhere between acceptance and fighting. If you lay back and accept it too much it can take you over but if you fight it too much it can make you worse - we / she is sick that's the unfortunately reality. I'm going to digress from what others have said and suggest that it's not always great to show constant strength. Maybe you daughter needs to know it's ok not to feel ok with this all - and that it's hurting you too - if not physically emotionally. If you can let her know this she knows not only that you're human but she can let herself go this way too if at sometimes she needs to just " feel sorry for herself " sometimes. Because quite frankly although i'm tough and pretend it doesn't every so often - I need to do that. Once it's out it's over and I feel so much better, even if no one is here to hear me. It's natural to feel like this. In addition I truly get what you say about your daughter being an active and activity based friend. This is tough. As i'm the same I used to wonder why it was me that got this dreaded disease when my sisters are more than happy to sit and read a book day in day out for a good time and not swing on swings, ice or roller blade or bike ride with their kids like I always did. I know I truly never wished it on them but they didn't use their bodies but could! The way I got around the physical stuff as best I could was to focus not on what I couldn't do but what I could still DO. Could you get her engaged in swimming or a water based sports? They are great for arthritis and something that she may still be able to do as it's non weight bearing and is great for keeping the muscles moving etc. The key is to not overdue it, especially at the start -not just pain bu for fatigue also. I also found that even though it hurt walking which i'd always loved (but 18km hikes not around the block meanders!) soon made me feel emotionally better than sitting around the house doing naught. Anyway check with her Rheumy but mine said it wasn't increasing the damage and I found the endorphines produced with the exercise actually helped significantly with my pain and depression - sure it won't make it disappear but every little bit helps. Maybe take the time to do these things with her or ask one of her friends to join her - this will encourage her and help take her mind off pain that may still be there. Think outside that square when you feel in the right frame of mind. Consider things she might not have normally done that she could still do now, we aren't disabled we're just physically challenged - discuss the activity with her and if she'd like to try it at a time when she's not too overwhelmed. You might be surprised at what she is still capable of - and some days might be one activity but not another depending on the degree of joint involvement each time. There's a lot can be said about positive thinking - it can really open our minds! Anyway take care of yourself and it's great she has a mum who truly cares and wants to do everything she can even if at times you feel helpless you just being there with her is something that not all of us have that i'm sure helps more than you realise. > > I'm just wondering if folks here have any tips or thoughts on how to deal > with this? Perhaps it is different for me, since it's my daughter not > myself that is dealing with this disease, not sure how that might effect > coping mechanisms. I'm finding this is truly the hardest thing I've ever > had to deal with emotionally (and it's not like I've never had rough stuff > to deal with before, I have been through a lot) and I must admit I am NOT > dealing with it very well at all. I can't go to sleep at night because all > I can think is my daughter is in pain and there is nothing I can do about > it, and then I do not want to get up in the morning because I don't want to > face the reality that my daughter is in severe pain and there is nothing I > can do about it. It was less than a year ago I was watching my daughter > climb up a very tall tree and I had to turn my back and walk away from her > because while I knew she would be cautious as her mom I worry she might get > hurt, so my instinct is to have her feet firmly planted on the ground and to > never take any risks. now I watch my daughter struggle to make it up the > sidewalk, or cross the floor without falling, and I have to turn away > because I am so scared for her just doing the normal 'safe' things and it > breaks my heart! She has been dancing ballet since she was 4 and had been > doing pointe work for a few years before this struck and so many times I > would worry about that, she would be so sore and dancing on bloody toes, > etc., but the joy I saw on her face every day after two hours of practice > and it wasn't enough, and especially the happiness she found in performing, > I felt she was so blessed to have found her passion, I've never had that, > known exactly what I wanted to do and what made me happy and she many times > told me how incredibly fortunate she was she got to live her dream of > dancing and she also enjoyed acting and sparring, she would get so bruised > up and never minded the pain, so I know this arthritis must be really bad, > but it just kills me because she has always been so physical and now she > can't even turn a door knob by herself and can barely walk. it doesn't seem > fair to have this all taken away from her. Her friends have stopped > calling. they would always be asking, " are you better, yet? Can you come > play again? " .all the things they did involved a great deal of physical > activity because that's what she enjoyed, she's never been a sit still kind > of girl. We kept thinking this is something that would just go away soon we > just had to get through this but more and more we are starting to think > maybe it won't go away. the first time I even realized that was a > possibility was after going to see the pediatric rheumatologist and after > that visit I spent a week and a half crying in my room. I mean this is just > terrible, I can't even imagine how hard this must be for my daughter and I'm > sure the last thing she needs is an absent mother who can't even get it > together enough to make breakfast for her and her siblings! I talked myself > out of that, but I feel it coming on again and we keep trying new things and > it all feels so hopeless. I need to be better and stronger, but all I do is > try not to cry. I find myself actually *avoiding* my daughter because it > hurts so much to see her fingers so swollen, her joints are bigger than her > father's, and to see her sitting there all the time and then watch her > struggle in excruciating pain just to get up or rearrange herself and I > know she is bored out of her mind and I need to find things for her to do > but I CAN'T FACE IT! She deserves better. I find myself grateful for the > cold because with the long sleeves and long legs I don't have to see her > swollen elbows, knees and ankles. seeing her come out of the shower is pure > torture, I just want to scream at the world. I just can't accept this > reality, and I know I need to. > > > > So, I don't know, is this something that will just always come and go, or is > it just so terrible right now as we come up against the realities of the > situation and it will eventually get easier to deal with? I wonder too about > letting my daughter know how I feel or putting up a front. initially when > this all first started I made very light of it while all the time I was > completely freaking out and she later said how nice it was to have her pain > and symptoms validated once we saw the specialist and so I felt bad that > maybe in my efforts to make her feel this was nothing to worry about I may > have made her feel I wasn't taking her seriously. Maybe now she thinks I > don't care? But I feel if I let her know how much this tears me up she will > have a harder time dealing with it herself. I know that I find great help in > my husband's strength and when he gets upset I feel completely lost. It's > hard to know the right thing, and it's even harder to feel maybe there is no > right thing, it all just feels wrong. > > > > Anyways, thanks for 'listening', if anyone has any thoughts I'd appreciate > it. I don't know if I need a shoulder to cry on or a good reality slap to > get over myself. I know there is so much in the world I can't control, I > can do nothing about, but I always thought I could at least be there for my > children and make their lives great, but now?.... > > > > Sharon > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 Sharon - I'm going to be blunt, here. Snap out of it woman! This isn't about you - its about your daughter. She needs your unconditional love and support. She doesn't need to know how you're feeling - she has enough to deal with on her own. Find a support group or a psychologist who specializes in parents dealing with their children's chronic illnesses. Find out what kind of " hands on " things your daughter may like to do. Get creative. If you're feeling depressed, can you just imagine what your daughter must be feeling? She needs your compassion. She needs you to get out of that bed every morning and do the things that you used to do before she became ill. If she's falling alot - what about a walker? If her hands are huge and swollen, what about one of those wax things to dip her hands in? Change your door knobs to levers. If her RA meds are not helping her - call her Rheumy. If he/she isn't helping your daughter to your satisfaction, find another one! Sharon, its time to stop focusing on what your daughter CAN'T do anymore and find something she CAN do. She needs friends that would be willing to just sit with her and talk kid talk. Its time to stop living your life THROUGH your daughter and start living it FOR her (and her siblings). I know none of this is easy. I know its breaking your heart to see her become crippled. But, think of the little girl INSIDE - she's still there - that hasn't changed. Her shell may be cracking and falling apart, but INSIDE she is still the daughter you have loved since birth. SHE NEEDS YOU!! Don't avoid her - that must hurt her so much - she must feel so unloved and like some kind of a monster. DON'T DO THAT TO HER!! I have a daughter that has suffered crippling migraines since she was 9 years old. I know the feeling of helplessness. This same daughter suffered a stroke two weeks after her son was born. This same daughter is being taken down physically by Multiple Sclerosis. I KNOW how you are feeling. But, we can't take the time for a pity party. They needs us - we have to keep it all together as best we can so we can be there for them. Be thankful YOU are healthy and can help your daughter. I have RA and FM that is taking me down too. I CAN'T help my daughter in the ways I wish I could. I would give anything to be healthy so that I could help MY daughter. But you CAN help yours. Get determined. Do research. Get professional help. Do whatever you have to do to help your whole family to deal with this. Don't make your daughter feel like a pariah, an outcast. Get her involved in things she can do. Above all, DON'T GIVE UP!! Hang in there, Sharon. Keep posting. We DO care.....Doreen > > I'm just wondering if folks here have any tips or thoughts on how > to deal with this? Perhaps it is different for me, since it's my > daughter not myself that is dealing with this disease, not sure how > that might effect coping mechanisms. I'm finding this is truly the > hardest thing I've ever had to deal with emotionally (and it's not > like I've never had rough stuff to deal with before, I have been > through a lot) and I must admit I am NOT dealing with it very well > at all. I can't go to sleep at night because all I can think is my > daughter is in pain and there is nothing I can do about it, and > then I do not want to get up in the morning because I don't want to > face the reality that my daughter is in severe pain and there is > nothing I can do about it. It was less than a year ago I was > watching my daughter climb up a very tall tree and I had to turn my > back and walk away from her because while I knew she would be > cautious as her mom I worry she might get hurt, so my instinct is > to have her feet firmly planted on the ground and to never take any > risks. now I watch my daughter struggle to make it up the sidewalk, > or cross the floor without falling, and I have to turn away because > I am so scared for her just doing the normal 'safe' things and it > breaks my heart! She has been dancing ballet since she was 4 and > had been doing pointe work for a few years before this struck and > so many times I would worry about that, she would be so sore and > dancing on bloody toes, etc., but the joy I saw on her face every > day after two hours of practice and it wasn't enough, and > especially the happiness she found in performing, I felt she was so > blessed to have found her passion, I've never had that, known > exactly what I wanted to do and what made me happy and she many > times told me how incredibly fortunate she was she got to live her > dream of dancing and she also enjoyed acting and sparring, she > would get so bruised up and never minded the pain, so I know this > arthritis must be really bad, but it just kills me because she has > always been so physical and now she can't even turn a door knob by > herself and can barely walk. it doesn't seem fair to have this all > taken away from her. Her friends have stopped calling. they would > always be asking, " are you better, yet? Can you come play again? " > All the things they did involved a great deal of physical activity > because that's what she enjoyed, she's never been a sit still kind > of girl. We kept thinking this is something that would just go > away soon we just had to get through this but more and more we are > starting to think maybe it won't go away. the first time I even > realized that was a possibility was after going to see the > pediatric rheumatologist and after that visit I spent a week and a > half crying in my room. I mean this is just terrible, I can't even > imagine how hard this must be for my daughter and I'm sure the last > thing she needs is an absent mother who can't even get it together > enough to make breakfast for her and her siblings! I talked myself > out of that, but I feel it coming on again and we keep trying new > things and it all feels so hopeless. I need to be better and > stronger, but all I do is try not to cry. I find myself actually > *avoiding* my daughter because it hurts so much to see her fingers > so swollen, her joints are bigger than her father's, and to see her > sitting there all the time and then watch her struggle in > excruciating pain just to get up or rearrange herself and I > know she is bored out of her mind and I need to find things for her > to do but I CAN'T FACE IT! She deserves better. I find myself > grateful for the cold because with the long sleeves and long legs I > don't have to see her swollen elbows, knees and ankles. seeing her > come out of the shower is pure torture, I just want to scream at > the world. I just can't accept this reality, and I know I need > to. > > So, I don't know, is this something that will just always come and > go, or is it just so terrible right now as we come up against the > realities of the situation and it will eventually get easier to > deal with? I wonder too about letting my daughter know how I feel > or putting up a front. initially when this all first started I made > very light of it while all the time I was completely freaking out > and she later said how nice it was to have her pain and symptoms > validated once we saw the specialist and so I felt bad that maybe > in my efforts to make her feel this was nothing to worry about I may > have made her feel I wasn't taking her seriously. Maybe now she > thinks I don't care? But I feel if I let her know how much this > tears me up she will have a harder time dealing with it herself. I > know that I find great help in my husband's strength and when he > gets upset I feel completely lost. It's hard to know the right > thing, and it's even harder to feel maybe there is no right thing, > it all just feels wrong. > > Anyways, thanks for 'listening', if anyone has any thoughts I'd > appreciate it. I don't know if I need a shoulder to cry on or a > good reality slap to get over myself. I know there is so much in > the world I can't control, I can do nothing about, but I always > thought I could at least be there for my children and make their > lives great, but now?.... > > Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 Ok, I know I already posted a rather harsh post and I really don't want to keep it up, but I have to address something you said: " ...she's never been a just hang out person...we have discovered a fair weather friend or two... " Seems life's injustices has created just exactly what you two have never wanted to be. It's time to learn how to be just a " hang out person " and stop being a " fair weathered friend " yourselves. I understand not wanting to " hang out " and watch friends do what you are unable to do anymore. But, there are so many other rewarding things you could be doing together while taking her handicap into consideration at the same time. It sounds like she is already feeling depressed. Please, please, please get some help before it is too late.....Doreen :| > > Thank you, Heidi, this is very helpful. her friends are all very > considerate and supportive, it's just that her relationships were > very much activity based and she can't do those activities so it > doesn't really make sense to hang out. she's never been a just hang > out person, she's always needed to be very active and so those were > the friends she sought out and enjoyed. She's always welcome to go > watch her friends doing all the things she can no longer do, but > it's not exactly something she wants to do and she doesn't really > have much else to relate to with them. hanging out with people > because they feel sorry for you when they would really rather be > doing something else isn't very fun for her either (she's been > offered this and passed. of course if not for her RA she would not > be interested in hanging out with folks that wanted to just sit > around herself). true, we have discovered a fair weather friend or > two, but for the most part it isn't about that, it's just all her > friends are just as busy doing all the things she used to be just > as busy doing and the rest is coming more from her not really be > interested at this time. > > At any rate, I appreciate your comments, I just really want to know > that she can be happy and ways I can help with that, it helps to > know I can do something for her. > > > Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 “In addition I truly get what you say about your daughter being an active and activity based friend. This is tough. As i'm the same I used to wonder why it was me that got this dreaded disease when my sisters are more than happy to sit and read a book day in day out for a good time and not swing on swings, ice or roller blade or bike ride with their kids like I always did. I know I truly never wished it on them but they didn't use their bodies but could!” Thank you so much for writing this! This is what just really frustrates me, of course I wouldn’t wish this on anyone either, but quite frankly some people’s lives wouldn’t skip a beat! I, for one, don’t use my body or appreciate it anywhere close to my daughter, this would be MUCH easier on me, it just isn’t fair, and she never even once took it for granted, nearly every day she would tell me how lucky she was, argh! Just this last week she missed out on two really great opportunities, both would’ve been paid as well! And one is still a possibility next year, but even if she recovers by then she won’t be in the same shape, so…??? “. If you can let her know this she knows not only that you're human but she can let herself go this way too if at sometimes she needs to just " feel sorry for herself " sometimes. Because quite frankly although i'm tough and pretend it doesn't every so often - I need to do that. Once it's out it's over and I feel so much better, even if no one is here to hear me. It's natural to feel like this.” I think you are right… I think this needs to be true for me regardless at this point, because as much as I try to talk myself out of being so sad, it only seems to get worse and then THAT is what holds me back and makes me run off into another room, so she doesn’t see my tears. I decided no matter how upset I was I’m just going to be there, and if I can’t hold back, so be it, and I feel so much freer and less angry and less helpless… also, when I just said to her yesterday I’m a little sad that the methotrexate isn’t working and worried, my daughter had a complete breakdown… in all her life I’ve never seen her this upset and she kept apologizing and I just kept telling her it’s okay and ultimately she said she feels better. She was talking to another lady with RA awhile ago who told her she didn’t know how she could stand the pain, and my daughter just said she had a choice about it, she could spend her time feeling miserable when she’s already in enough pain, or she could choose to focus on the good in her life and she has so much good to be happy about… I think I wanted to be just as amazing as she is and forgot to realize she struggles to. I think it feels easier to be honest with each other about this… maybe I’m wrong, but I just can’t keep up the façade anymore and it felt really good, as hard as it was to handle seeing my daughter so sad, to just let it out… I didn’t even feel so sad honestly, I think trying so hard to hide my feelings has just made me feel worse. I’m going to try getting her walking outside as well… she’s never been much for that, except hiking and running and more adventurous stuff, but I think getting out in the fresh air, even if it doesn’t feel as exciting for her and more like work will definitely help and be worth the effort, thank you so much for suggesting that, no doubt being inside so much is wearing down on her and I hadn’t really thought of how important that might be! I also think I’ve been making the mistake of avoiding things she can’t *always* do and as you say, some days are better than others so we don’t have to give up on those things entirely. I really appreciate you sharing your feelings and suggestions with me, ! Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 14, 2009 Report Share Posted February 14, 2009 I'm sorry, Doreen, if maybe I didn't express this well, I really shouldn't have used the term " fair-weathered " friend. these are just kids and young adults I'm talking about here really. I just was trying to express I don't think because her friends aren't around as much means they aren't really friends or caring people. If you stop playing golf you just aren't going to have your golf buddies anymore. I don't think that means your golf buddies aren't really buddies. I, personally, love just hanging out, but this isn't what my daughter is interested in although she doesn't have much choice about it now. it works for me, not so much for her, and so I just feel bad about that, for her. It's a radical change for her. she was always in nonstop motion, we were just watching some old videos recently and my daughter was never once still in any of them, she danced even while watching tv, or being read to, etc. Anyways, I think in my effort to attempt to make it clear that it isn't about people being thoughtless and uncaring but more about just not having as much to do, really, I may have made it less clear? She doesn't want her friends to stop doing what they would always do just for her, she just truly isn't interested in that, not from a place of feeling sorry for herself, but because that's not her thing. I hope that makes sense. Sharon _____ From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of Mimi Sent: Saturday, February 14, 2009 6:53 AM Subject: [ ] Re: Depression Ok, I know I already posted a rather harsh post and I really don't want to keep it up, but I have to address something you said: " ...she's never been a just hang out person...we have discovered a fair weather friend or two... " Seems life's injustices has created just exactly what you two have never wanted to be. It's time to learn how to be just a " hang out person " and stop being a " fair weathered friend " yourselves. I understand not wanting to " hang out " and watch friends do what you are unable to do anymore. But, there are so many other rewarding things you could be doing together while taking her handicap into consideration at the same time. It sounds like she is already feeling depressed. Please, please, please get some help before it is too late.....Doreen :| Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2009 Report Share Posted February 15, 2009 I have a friend whose daughter at 18 months is insulin dependent diabetic who has to have 4 shots and blood sugar checks a day. It has been heck on the mom and the child. I feel for you. I think that having an ill child would be worse than having it myself. Have you tried medications? They help some. [ ] Depression I'm just wondering if folks here have any tips or thoughts on how to deal with this? Perhaps it is different for me, since it's my daughter not myself that is dealing with this disease, not sure how that might effect coping mechanisms. I'm finding this is truly the hardest thing I've ever had to deal with emotionally (and it's not like I've never had rough stuff to deal with before, I have been through a lot) and I must admit I am NOT dealing with it very well at all. I can't go to sleep at night because all I can think is my daughter is in pain and there is nothing I can do about it, and then I do not want to get up in the morning because I don't want to face the reality that my daughter is in severe pain and there is nothing I can do about it. It was less than a year ago I was watching my daughter climb up a very tall tree and I had to turn my back and walk away from her because while I knew she would be cautious as her mom I worry she might get hurt, so my instinct is to have her feet firmly planted on the ground and to never take any risks. now I watch my daughter struggle to make it up the sidewalk, or cross the floor without falling, and I have to turn away because I am so scared for her just doing the normal 'safe' things and it breaks my heart! She has been dancing ballet since she was 4 and had been doing pointe work for a few years before this struck and so many times I would worry about that, she would be so sore and dancing on bloody toes, etc., but the joy I saw on her face every day after two hours of practice and it wasn't enough, and especially the happiness she found in performing, I felt she was so blessed to have found her passion, I've never had that, known exactly what I wanted to do and what made me happy and she many times told me how incredibly fortunate she was she got to live her dream of dancing and she also enjoyed acting and sparring, she would get so bruised up and never minded the pain, so I know this arthritis must be really bad, but it just kills me because she has always been so physical and now she can't even turn a door knob by herself and can barely walk. it doesn't seem fair to have this all taken away from her. Her friends have stopped calling. they would always be asking, " are you better, yet? Can you come play again? " .all the things they did involved a great deal of physical activity because that's what she enjoyed, she's never been a sit still kind of girl. We kept thinking this is something that would just go away soon we just had to get through this but more and more we are starting to think maybe it won't go away. the first time I even realized that was a possibility was after going to see the pediatric rheumatologist and after that visit I spent a week and a half crying in my room. I mean this is just terrible, I can't even imagine how hard this must be for my daughter and I'm sure the last thing she needs is an absent mother who can't even get it together enough to make breakfast for her and her siblings! I talked myself out of that, but I feel it coming on again and we keep trying new things and it all feels so hopeless. I need to be better and stronger, but all I do is try not to cry. I find myself actually *avoiding* my daughter because it hurts so much to see her fingers so swollen, her joints are bigger than her father's, and to see her sitting there all the time and then watch her struggle in excruciating pain just to get up or rearrange herself and I know she is bored out of her mind and I need to find things for her to do but I CAN'T FACE IT! She deserves better. I find myself grateful for the cold because with the long sleeves and long legs I don't have to see her swollen elbows, knees and ankles. seeing her come out of the shower is pure torture, I just want to scream at the world. I just can't accept this reality, and I know I need to. So, I don't know, is this something that will just always come and go, or is it just so terrible right now as we come up against the realities of the situation and it will eventually get easier to deal with? I wonder too about letting my daughter know how I feel or putting up a front. initially when this all first started I made very light of it while all the time I was completely freaking out and she later said how nice it was to have her pain and symptoms validated once we saw the specialist and so I felt bad that maybe in my efforts to make her feel this was nothing to worry about I may have made her feel I wasn't taking her seriously. Maybe now she thinks I don't care? But I feel if I let her know how much this tears me up she will have a harder time dealing with it herself. I know that I find great help in my husband's strength and when he gets upset I feel completely lost. It's hard to know the right thing, and it's even harder to feel maybe there is no right thing, it all just feels wrong. Anyways, thanks for 'listening', if anyone has any thoughts I'd appreciate it. I don't know if I need a shoulder to cry on or a good reality slap to get over myself. I know there is so much in the world I can't control, I can do nothing about, but I always thought I could at least be there for my children and make their lives great, but now?.... Sharon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2009 Report Share Posted April 14, 2009 I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, which is very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and you may be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every day where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light bulbs in my house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I changed so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not get the flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just happened " to be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a row. I am usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this year.was totally fine. Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it comes to depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the literature, but look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily walk, not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and breathing in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing him up and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended up losing my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the sake of exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any kind of exercise seems easier. It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had pulled) caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall bladder issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My life is COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last year, I had lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 lbs. People were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the mirror and all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I decided to get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I weighed 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My body is SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new bikinis I bought last month!! ) Have a blessed day! Evie Maddox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2009 Report Share Posted April 14, 2009 Are you familiar with the benefits of vitamin D3 - check out Dr. Weil's take on it or just google it The benefits discovered are amazing especially for those who do not get enough sun! good luck FB On Apr 14, 2009, at 7:02 AM, Evie Maddox wrote: > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2009 Report Share Posted April 14, 2009 I had major depression, these are the things that helped me. Quit drinking milk, however if you can get ahold of some kefir grains this is GREAT for depression. In turkey, the word kefir means " feel good " . The day after a liver flush i feel like a million bucks however the following day im usely not as uphoric, but im sure as the flushing continues it will get better and better.(everyone might not react this way but i hear it's common). Turmeric is also in my tool bag for depression. In chinese , turmeric means " golden for depression " . Turmeric moves liver chi, liver stagnation is related to depression and anger. However you have to take a certain amount, one 500 miligram capsule wont cut it. I had to take at least 2 grams of regular turmeric(not curcumin) at a time. When times were bad i would take it 3 times a day, I only take it on the average of once a day now. And finally the Bible says that " if any of you lacks wisdom let him ask of God and He will give liberally and to all without reproach " . Ask God for wisdom, daily at least for a while. > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 Isaiah's info on the link between liver congestion and depression is great stuff. any and all cholegagues (bile stimulants) would be appropriate, especially if disrupted sleep is a component. In TCM the heart is the organ of joy and sadness so is also a major player. The emotions can literally create physiological dysfunction. The Lungs the organ of grief so if grief is a component and there are common lung ailments, shortness of breath etc., one should look at strengthening this. Keep in mind when we talk about Lung, heart, liver, etc., we are not talking about the visceral organ but an energetic pattern, pathway, quality, and quantity. In terms of biochemical and visceral considerations, the brain is a major player. The numero uno supplement being L-tyrosine (D-phenalalanine at times). If hyper activity then burnout preceded one could look at GABA even though it is calming in nature. A combo of polygala and zizyphus (jube jube) seed is classic in TCM for any neurological issue. If anxiety is also present, an ayurvedic herb, shank pushpi ( convoluvus) is a miracle herb at times. Have clients that get through the day on it. When out, you can hear clawing and chewing at the door... Always, in all ways, -Dave Re: Re:Depression I had major depression, these are the things that helped me. Quit drinking milk, however if you can get ahold of some kefir grains this is GREAT for depression. In turkey, the word kefir means " feel good " . The day after a liver flush i feel like a million bucks however the following day im usely not as uphoric, but im sure as the flushing continues it will get better and better.(everyone might not react this way but i hear it's common). Turmeric is also in my tool bag for depression. In chinese , turmeric means " golden for depression " . Turmeric moves liver chi, liver stagnation is related to depression and anger. However you have to take a certain amount, one 500 miligram capsule wont cut it. I had to take at least 2 grams of regular turmeric(not curcumin) at a time. When times were bad i would take it 3 times a day, I only take it on the average of once a day now. And finally the Bible says that " if any of you lacks wisdom let him ask of God and He will give liberally and to all without reproach " . Ask God for wisdom, daily at least for a while. > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 Woops, sorry, forgot the xanthones. these are a group of polyphenols that have been clinically shown to be effective. Gentian root is the highest known source (could draining liver herb, what a coincidence). My favorite baical scullcap root (another fantastic liver herb, what a coincidence) is another high source. And of course the MLM favorite (tastes good, and is really expensive too) mangosteen (needs to be whole fruit extract including the pericarp). -D Re: Re:Depression I had major depression, these are the things that helped me. Quit drinking milk, however if you can get ahold of some kefir grains this is GREAT for depression. In turkey, the word kefir means " feel good " . The day after a liver flush i feel like a million bucks however the following day im usely not as uphoric, but im sure as the flushing continues it will get better and better.(everyone might not react this way but i hear it's common). Turmeric is also in my tool bag for depression. In chinese , turmeric means " golden for depression " . Turmeric moves liver chi, liver stagnation is related to depression and anger. However you have to take a certain amount, one 500 miligram capsule wont cut it. I had to take at least 2 grams of regular turmeric(not curcumin) at a time. When times were bad i would take it 3 times a day, I only take it on the average of once a day now. And finally the Bible says that " if any of you lacks wisdom let him ask of God and He will give liberally and to all without reproach " . Ask God for wisdom, daily at least for a while. > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 What comes first chicken or egg........I had a lot of depression when in my teens/20's and 30's..... clearing out my bowel helped a lot...and also dealing with my upbringing too.....I think all health issues need to always be viewed nutritionally/emotionally/mentally/ most of us need to clear out our back pack of negative emotional core beliefs to truly heal..then the good nutrition ...herbs...detoxing, etc can really work much better... AJD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 Thank you all for your comments and information. the other symptom I am suffering from in addition to depression is lack of ability to concentrate. for example, even reading through the emails and trying to figure out what to do next becomes a daunting task. I think I would like to start by doing another gall bladder flush. Rose ________________________________ From: Dave Shelden <wholehealthawareness@...> gallstones Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 5:31:35 AM Subject: Re: Re:Depression Woops, sorry, forgot the xanthones. these are a group of polyphenols that have been clinically shown to be effective. Gentian root is the highest known source (could draining liver herb, what a coincidence) . My favorite baical scullcap root (another fantastic liver herb, what a coincidence) is another high source. And of course the MLM favorite (tastes good, and is really expensive too) mangosteen (needs to be whole fruit extract including the pericarp). -D Re: Re:Depression I had major depression, these are the things that helped me. Quit drinking milk, however if you can get ahold of some kefir grains this is GREAT for depression. In turkey, the word kefir means " feel good " . The day after a liver flush i feel like a million bucks however the following day im usely not as uphoric, but im sure as the flushing continues it will get better and better.(everyone might not react this way but i hear it's common). Turmeric is also in my tool bag for depression. In chinese , turmeric means " golden for depression " . Turmeric moves liver chi, liver stagnation is related to depression and anger. However you have to take a certain amount, one 500 miligram capsule wont cut it. I had to take at least 2 grams of regular turmeric(not curcumin) at a time. When times were bad i would take it 3 times a day, I only take it on the average of once a day now. And finally the Bible says that " if any of you lacks wisdom let him ask of God and He will give liberally and to all without reproach " . Ask God for wisdom, daily at least for a while. > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 Rose, i think your making the right choice. > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 have you tried the series of 4 exercise - it helps you focus and gives you control - many have had great success Here it is inhale to a count of 4 using a word of the moment- in your case concentrate- could be any work- relax, focus, sleep etc hold your breath for a count of 4 saying concentrate 4 times exhale for a count of 4 saying concentrate 4 times do not breathe hold breath for count of 4 saying concentrate 4 times This is one set - do it 4 times good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 What you are describing is commonly referred to as " brain fog " . There are many reasons for this, but one of the most common undiagnosed reasons is candida. I know that another is mercury. I have noticed an improvement in my brain fog. I have reduced my candida problem and also reduced my mercury load. So I am not sure which to attribute the improvement to. Do you have a candida problem? How much mercury do you have in your body? > > > > > > > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > > > which is > > > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > > > you may > > > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > > > day > > > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > > > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > > > bulbs in my > > > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > > > changed > > > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > > > get the > > > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > > > happened " to > > > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > > > row. I am > > > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > > > year.was totally fine. > > > > > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > > > comes to > > > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > > > literature, but > > > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > > > walk, > > > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > > > breathing > > > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > > > him up > > > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > > > up losing > > > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > > > sake of > > > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > > > kind of > > > exercise seems easier. > > > > > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > > > pulled) > > > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > > > bladder > > > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > > > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > > > life is > > > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > > > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > > > > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > > > year, I had > > > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > > > lbs. People > > > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > > > mirror and > > > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > > > decided to > > > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > > > weighed > > > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > > > body is > > > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > > > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > > > > > Have a blessed day! > > > > > > Evie Maddox > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 You all are great! thanks for all the feedback. Yes, I definitely have brain fog. I probably have candida. I had the mercury amalgams removed years ago. I don't know how much murcury I have in my body. Is there an easy way to find out? Or how do you remove it? I can just follow the protocol (hopefully) without testing for it. I know I will definitely start another gall bladder flush very soon and then I will clear up enough to sift through and implement other things into my daily routine (which is on again off again). The one thing I have been very religious about is following a gall bladder diet...no animal fats...breaking this would send me straight to the hospital. Thank you all. Rose ________________________________ From: fjnie1234 <Fred.Niehaus@...> gallstones Sent: Wednesday, April 15, 2009 12:51:30 PM Subject: Re:Depression What you are describing is commonly referred to as " brain fog " . There are many reasons for this, but one of the most common undiagnosed reasons is candida. I know that another is mercury. I have noticed an improvement in my brain fog. I have reduced my candida problem and also reduced my mercury load. So I am not sure which to attribute the improvement to. Do you have a candida problem? How much mercury do you have in your body? > > > > > > > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > > > which is > > > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > > > you may > > > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > > > day > > > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > > > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > > > bulbs in my > > > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > > > changed > > > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > > > get the > > > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > > > happened " to > > > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > > > row. I am > > > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > > > year.was totally fine. > > > > > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > > > comes to > > > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > > > literature, but > > > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > > > walk, > > > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > > > breathing > > > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > > > him up > > > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > > > up losing > > > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > > > sake of > > > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > > > kind of > > > exercise seems easier. > > > > > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > > > pulled) > > > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > > > bladder > > > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > > > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > > > life is > > > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > > > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > > > > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > > > year, I had > > > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > > > lbs. People > > > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > > > mirror and > > > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > > > decided to > > > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > > > weighed > > > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > > > body is > > > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > > > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > > > > > Have a blessed day! > > > > > > Evie Maddox > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 15, 2009 Report Share Posted April 15, 2009 Mercury testing is very controversial and mercury removal is very controversial. In my quest to get well, this has been the most frustrating aspect. There are many options on both. You may decide not to do the testing and just try to reduce your level. If you decide to get tested, you can get a " provoked " urine test for about $100. DMSA is used but is considered safe by most. As for the removal, I had been using a product called Chelorex (ScienceFormulas.com). But I have discontinued this because it contains magnesium stearate which is a filler found in many supplements. Some believe magnesium stearate is toxic. I don't want to take any chances. I am now using a comparable product without any fillers. I would strongly recommend that you address any candida issues. I had never heard of candida until 2 years ago, but now realize that I have had many candida symptoms/problems most of my life. An area where modern medicine has failed me! Lastly, you may want to consider food allergy testing. Another area of controversy. I have not had much luck with allergists for food allergy testing. Try an osteopath. Undiagnosed food allergies are known to cause gallbladder problems. They also contribute to candida as well. Good luck! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > > > > > which is > > > > > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > > > > > you may > > > > > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > > > > > day > > > > > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > > > > > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > > > > > bulbs in my > > > > > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > > > > > changed > > > > > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > > > > > get the > > > > > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > > > > > happened " to > > > > > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > > > > > row. I am > > > > > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > > > > > year.was totally fine. > > > > > > > > > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > > > > > comes to > > > > > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > > > > > literature, but > > > > > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > > > > > walk, > > > > > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > > > > > breathing > > > > > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > > > > > him up > > > > > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > > > > > up losing > > > > > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > > > > > sake of > > > > > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > > > > > kind of > > > > > exercise seems easier. > > > > > > > > > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > > > > > pulled) > > > > > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > > > > > bladder > > > > > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > > > > > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > > > > > life is > > > > > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > > > > > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > > > > > > > > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > > > > > year, I had > > > > > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > > > > > lbs. People > > > > > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > > > > > mirror and > > > > > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > > > > > decided to > > > > > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > > > > > weighed > > > > > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > > > > > body is > > > > > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > > > > > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > > > > > > > > > Have a blessed day! > > > > > > > > > > Evie Maddox > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2009 Report Share Posted April 16, 2009 for depression, get outside and get sun on your face...don't eat sugar, and ride bike or exercise. I am in China now, so my answers have to be short...get outside and have fun. Jay From: fjnie1234 <Fred.Niehaus@...> Subject: Re:Depression gallstones Date: Wednesday, April 15, 2009, 9:51 AM What you are describing is commonly referred to as " brain fog " . There are many reasons for this, but one of the most common undiagnosed reasons is candida. I know that another is mercury. I have noticed an improvement in my brain fog. I have reduced my candida problem and also reduced my mercury load. So I am not sure which to attribute the improvement to. Do you have a candida problem? How much mercury do you have in your body? > > > > > > > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > > > which is > > > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > > > you may > > > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > > > day > > > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > > > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > > > bulbs in my > > > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > > > changed > > > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > > > get the > > > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > > > happened " to > > > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > > > row. I am > > > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > > > year.was totally fine. > > > > > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > > > comes to > > > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > > > literature, but > > > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > > > walk, > > > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > > > breathing > > > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > > > him up > > > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > > > up losing > > > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > > > sake of > > > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > > > kind of > > > exercise seems easier. > > > > > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > > > pulled) > > > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > > > bladder > > > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > > > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > > > life is > > > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > > > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > > > > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > > > year, I had > > > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > > > lbs. People > > > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > > > mirror and > > > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > > > decided to > > > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > > > weighed > > > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > > > body is > > > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > > > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > > > > > Have a blessed day! > > > > > > Evie Maddox > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 16, 2009 Report Share Posted April 16, 2009 Evie Thanks for this writing, it was a nice read. Jay > > > I've struggled with mainly seasonal affective disorder in the past, > which is > very possible for you given that spring hasn't quite sprung yet, and > you may > be suffering from a lack of sunshine. This winter, I went out every > day > where it was warm enough or sunny enough to do so. I also visited the > tanning bed once a week. I had installed those Dr. Mercola light > bulbs in my > house as well, but don't know if they made much difference since I > changed > so many things at one time. This was my best winter EVER. I did not > get the > flu this year. I did get a bad cold for a month, but it " just > happened " to > be when I couldn't get to the tanning bed for almost 3 weeks in a > row. I am > usually sick for either Thanksgiving or Christmas (or both!) and this > year.was totally fine. > > Aside from the light aspect, getting exercise is HUUUUUUGE when it > comes to > depression or stress. I think a lot of us read that in the > literature, but > look past it because we want an easier fix. Start with just a daily > walk, > not for the exercise, but for the enjoyment of being out there and > breathing > in the outside. When I had post partum with my first baby, pushing > him up > and down the street was a great break for me, and him, and I ended > up losing > my baby weight and enjoying it very much. When we exercise for the > sake of > exercising, it's hard to continue, but once you are enjoying it, any > kind of > exercise seems easier. > > It's possible that my amalgam fillings and bad teeth (that I had > pulled) > caused a lot of my health problems in the past, including the gall > bladder > issues. Now that my mouth is " good " and I know how to keep my liver > healthier, I can't describe to you the difference in how I feel. My > life is > COMPLETELY different. Just work on " fixing " one thing at a time and > hopefully you will come out the other side feeling as good. > > Oh.I meant to tell you all before. When I joined this group last > year, I had > lost 20 lbs due to my " gall bladder diet " and I was 5'6 " and 100 > lbs. People > were so worried about me! A couple of weeks ago, I looked in the > mirror and > all of a sudden I looked SO much better. Around the same time, I > decided to > get a bathroom scale because I had no idea what I weighed anymore. I > weighed > 115! The good thing is that it is HEALTHY weight, mostly muscle. My > body is > SOOOOO much healthier than last year and I can't wait to wear the new > bikinis I bought last month!! ) > > Have a blessed day! > > Evie Maddox > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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