Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

[Guest guest]

nah, I honor your positive experiences with soy. I have had them, too.

I noticed some very dramatic changes in the female department when I

re-introduced soy after having been scared off of it.

Would you consider eating traditionally processed and fermented soy

products, primarily? (Miso, tempeh, natto, tamari)

Nina

Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

Sol,

I don't know if this will help, but reading your posts one thing

strikes me. You say you stuck to Atkins 100%, and I believe you. The

problem is, I just don't believe that's the right thing to do.

In my experience, and it's a long one now *sigh*, diets just don't

work. Maybe it's just me, but I don't have the psyche for counting or

following someone else's predetermined food plan. I certainly have the

self-discipline, and I've done it many times. But such unnatural

restrictions ALWAYS create cravings in my body, and I ultimately fall

off the wagon and undo any good I did. Sometimes I believe I've

actually caused damage by trying some doctor's or nutritionist's diet.

I have to listen to my own body and give that priority over

the " experts. "

I would suggest to EASE into eating the way that you feel is best for

your body. Carry that intention with you every day, but don't FORCE

it. If you really need a potato or a slice of bread, have it! Maybe

your body needs it right now, while it's on the path of cutting down

carbs.

I know that any time I've tried something drastic, I get negative

results. When I've needed to wean myself off of high carbs, I've

needed to do just that......quit VERY slowly and listen intently to my

own body.

For the last several months, I've been working on cutting down on all

carbohydrates. At times, I'd have a meat and veggie lunch, only to

feel an intense craving after, and then I'd have a 1/4 inch slice of a

snickers bar. That never happens anymore, but every few days, I work

in a small slice of sourdough bread or a small potato or a little

pasta or a tiny bowl of popcorn. I'm cutting down, and the cravings

have almost disappeared, but it won't happen all at once, not even in

a couple weeks or months. It's gradual, and as a result, less

stressful and more effective and permanent. I can walk right past

sugary treats and think of them as poison, certainly nothing that I

want for myself. [And I live in a house with other people who eat

them, and I just hope someday they'll see the light! Maybe once they

get sick.... ]

We live in a high grain society. Occasionally, especially when I'm

traveling, the best I can do is a turkey sandwich. So I order it on a

croissant and enjoy! When I'm out to dinner, I might order the

tilapia with pasta, and then eat all of the fish and veggies and a few

bites of the pasta. Maybe I'll have ONE bite of a shared dessert.

Then I'm back to turkey burger and cauliflower or chicken

and asparagus or avocado-onion-cilantro-jack cheese-omelet with salsa

the next day. I need to do this gradually, and in this way, I really

don't mind! I know I can have the carbs if I really want them. I'm

not counting anything or trying to prove anything. I'm just eating in

the healthiest way I can right now. And it's all getting better,

every day, in every way.

Just a word on soy. I LOVE it! Soy milk. Tofu. I know it's not PC

right now, but to me, it's the perfect food. It's satisfying and it

gives me energy and stabilizes my blood sugar for hours, and I won't

give it up, no matter how many studies say I should and no matter

how many " important " people say it's bad. Maybe as a post-menopausal

woman it's better for me than for others, but I hear my body saying

" yum, yum, yum, THANK YOU! " And, my hormone levels are like a much

younger woman, with plenty of estrogen and lots more progesterone.

Ok, that was more than one word, but I'm tired of soy being trashed.

It's my friend.

I went on and on...but I hope this helps a little. Feel free to email me.

Cheers!

nah

>

> I have read parts of Rosedale's book, but his diet is too low in animal

> fat and protein for me. And too high in fruits as I recall. I should

> read it again.

> But doesn't he say leptin resistance and cravings leave in a short time

> if you are on his diet?

> In the low carb diet world this is such a common assumption, I hear it

> constantly that cravings leave in a couple weeks if one is strict with

> staying off the carbs on whatever eating plan is being touted. But my

> carb cravings have never left, ever.

> I have to assume that people just don't believe I've been strict and

> have not cheated at all. Two and a half months Atkins induction, 100%

> strict compliance did not reduce or eliminate carb cravings for me. I

> have found that as long as I have these strong cravings I will

> eventually slip.

> Metabolic typing says that carb cravings can come from not having

enough

> of the right carbs, as well as from eating too much, but that is a

very

> slippery slope for me, and so far I keep losing my footing on it and

> sliding right back down into eating not only carbs, but sugar.

> So far I've not slipped deeply enough, long enough to go back to the

> very high triglycerides I used to have, so I take small comfort in

that.

> My fasting blood sugar is ok and my hypoglycemia is also mostly under

> control. By definitions I've read I am " pre-diabetic " , so this isn't

> just a preference for me, I NEED to be high protein, high fat, and low

> carb (Dr. Bernstein's diet for diabetes). I believe I read that Dr.

> Bernstein himself hasn't eaten fruit for several decades.

> oops, I've gone on too long, again,

> sol

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

nah,

Thanks for the reminder, and I know I need to ease back into stricter

low carb, and I am doing that.

But just for the record, I've been on " diets " and " eating plans " and

I've been on your idea of allowing myself just " one bite " of something.

Been there, done that also, for umpteen years. I'm 62 years old and

didn't just start out with all this, LOLOLOL.

The problem for me is that I get to a fair place, then think I can

allow " one bite " of something, and do ok the first day, but then I'm

right back to feeling increased cravings right away. In a week or two,

or three, I've dived back into the cookie jar. That " one bite " of pasta,

snickers, whatever is the start of the slippery slide for me.

As to soy, it may do well for you, but down the road long years from

now, you may find yourself suffering from a thyroid problem or female

hormone imbalances. It takes many YEARS for the damage to build up.

However you may also get by with it for your entire life.

I ate soy for 30 years thinking it was healthy, used soymilk for

longer than that because my son was allergic to cow and goat milk and

soy formula is what he got (if I knew then what I know now about soy, I

would have found another alternative, believe me). I never liked soy

except for one or two things I made with tofu. I despise soy milk and

always have. And no soy product agrees with me, even in my 20s they gave

me terrible gas. But by god the " experts " all said it was healthy and so

I ate it. Even put soy flour in all baked goods. Now, I have a thyroid

problem, and Hashimoto's. Did soy alone cause it, no. Did soy have a

huge part in it, absolutely. FWIW, I used to make my own soy milk and

tofu from dried soybeans. Not fermented but the real deal, not the crap

from hydrolysed soy and isolated soy proteins that I switched to when

soy became popular. That was likely a huge mistake, but I'm not going to

go back to making my own soy stuff, as I never liked it and as I say, it

never agreed with my guts. And to use such a strong goitrogen now, as

well as its other detriments to ME, nope.

I learned a great lesson though. NOTHING I do now is because some

authority or expert told me to, or I read it in a respected author's

book or in a medical article, or because " they allow it to be sold, so

it must be safe-good for me. I started looking beyond soy and

vegetarianism/veganism because severely deteriorating healh forced me to

look beyond the " experts " I had believed in for decades. My body forced

me into it. Now, I read and research, and if I find something that seems

like it is worth a try, I try it. If it works for me, I keep on with it,

if it doesn't work or makes me feel worse, I abandon it. Soy is one

thing I've abandoned. And I believe most of the bad stuff I read about

it because it fits my personal experience and my body's reactions to a

T. I don't believe it just because I read it, but because what I read

tracks with my experience and explains a lot of experience that was

formerly unexplainable.

BTW, this is the same process I went through with fats, I no longer

believe any vegetable oil is truly good, just that some are less harmful

than others. So I am careful which ones I use, and how much, and stick

mainly to animal fats and coconut oil if I could get unhydrogenated

lard, I would use that instead of ANY veg oil. Someday I may find a

source for organic pork fat, and then I may try rendering the lard

myself. As it is, I save the fat from natural chicken and clean/store

that and use it for some things.

sol

[Guest guest]

Sol, nah,

I am wondering if perhaps what needs changing here is your thought process.

What we put out to the universe is what comes back to us, full force. If

you keep telling yourself you really, really want those carbs but you are on

a restricted diet and can't, guess what is going to happen. You will

eventually get back into the carbs and sabotage your original plan.

How about incorporating some positive affirmations into your plan, such as:

Optimal health is my divine right and I claim it now. Or, at the very least

tell yourself: I can have that carb if I choose, I just choose to not have

it at this time.

Removing the feeling of " restriction " will be replaced with the sense of

freedom and success. You make the choice.

Abundant Blessings,

[Guest guest]

Not nah, but,

So far the only product I have found that I trust (I hope not

mistakenly) to be actually traditionally fermented is one brand of

Tamari, and I do use that. I haven't looked too hard for the others as

I have never liked the versions I tried back when I was eating soy as my

main protein source. But even me with my anti-soy stance, would use

those if I could find ones truly traditionally fermented, if I liked

them, that is. But I would not use them heavily or often.

Yet another issue with soy is that nearly 100% of it is now

genetically modified, either deliberately or by contamination of non-GMO

fields with pollen from surrounding/neighboring GMO fields. This problem

obtains even with traditionally fermented soy foods like tempeh, miso,

natto. But I repeat, the main reason is my personal experience of soy,

and my dislike of it. But I do believe soy in general is much worse

today than it was 30 or 40 years ago.

For the female hormone support you mention, I would use Red Clover

and Black Cohosh.

sol

Nina Moliver wrote:

> nah, I honor your positive experiences with soy. I have had them, too.

> I noticed some very dramatic changes in the female department when I

> re-introduced soy after having been scared off of it.

>

> Would you consider eating traditionally processed and fermented soy

> products, primarily? (Miso, tempeh, natto, tamari)

>

[Guest guest]

Regarding GMO's, you are so right.

Nina

Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

Not nah, but,

So far the only product I have found that I trust (I hope not

mistakenly) to be actually traditionally fermented is one brand of

Tamari, and I do use that. I haven't looked too hard for the others as

I have never liked the versions I tried back when I was eating soy as my

main protein source. But even me with my anti-soy stance, would use

those if I could find ones truly traditionally fermented, if I liked

them, that is. But I would not use them heavily or often.

Yet another issue with soy is that nearly 100% of it is now

genetically modified, either deliberately or by contamination of non-GMO

fields with pollen from surrounding/neighboring GMO fields. This problem

obtains even with traditionally fermented soy foods like tempeh, miso,

natto. But I repeat, the main reason is my personal experience of soy,

and my dislike of it. But I do believe soy in general is much worse

today than it was 30 or 40 years ago.

For the female hormone support you mention, I would use Red Clover

and Black Cohosh.

sol

Nina Moliver wrote:

> nah, I honor your positive experiences with soy. I have had them,

too.

> I noticed some very dramatic changes in the female department when I

> re-introduced soy after having been scared off of it.

>

> Would you consider eating traditionally processed and fermented soy

> products, primarily? (Miso, tempeh, natto, tamari)

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Sol,

Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding vegetable

oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews, and so

forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much better

for you than the unsaturated ones.

Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable oils.

When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out for

the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat them

with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame tahini

with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the combination.

Nina

Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

nah,

Thanks for the reminder, and I know I need to ease back into stricter

low carb, and I am doing that.

But just for the record, I've been on " diets " and " eating plans " and

I've been on your idea of allowing myself just " one bite " of something.

Been there, done that also, for umpteen years. I'm 62 years old and

didn't just start out with all this, LOLOLOL.

The problem for me is that I get to a fair place, then think I can

allow " one bite " of something, and do ok the first day, but then I'm

right back to feeling increased cravings right away. In a week or two,

or three, I've dived back into the cookie jar. That " one bite " of pasta,

snickers, whatever is the start of the slippery slide for me.

As to soy, it may do well for you, but down the road long years from

now, you may find yourself suffering from a thyroid problem or female

hormone imbalances. It takes many YEARS for the damage to build up.

However you may also get by with it for your entire life.

I ate soy for 30 years thinking it was healthy, used soymilk for

longer than that because my son was allergic to cow and goat milk and

soy formula is what he got (if I knew then what I know now about soy, I

would have found another alternative, believe me). I never liked soy

except for one or two things I made with tofu. I despise soy milk and

always have. And no soy product agrees with me, even in my 20s they gave

me terrible gas. But by god the " experts " all said it was healthy and so

I ate it. Even put soy flour in all baked goods. Now, I have a thyroid

problem, and Hashimoto's. Did soy alone cause it, no. Did soy have a

huge part in it, absolutely. FWIW, I used to make my own soy milk and

tofu from dried soybeans. Not fermented but the real deal, not the crap

from hydrolysed soy and isolated soy proteins that I switched to when

soy became popular. That was likely a huge mistake, but I'm not going to

go back to making my own soy stuff, as I never liked it and as I say, it

never agreed with my guts. And to use such a strong goitrogen now, as

well as its other detriments to ME, nope.

I learned a great lesson though. NOTHING I do now is because some

authority or expert told me to, or I read it in a respected author's

book or in a medical article, or because " they allow it to be sold, so

it must be safe-good for me. I started looking beyond soy and

vegetarianism/veganism because severely deteriorating healh forced me to

look beyond the " experts " I had believed in for decades. My body forced

me into it. Now, I read and research, and if I find something that seems

like it is worth a try, I try it. If it works for me, I keep on with it,

if it doesn't work or makes me feel worse, I abandon it. Soy is one

thing I've abandoned. And I believe most of the bad stuff I read about

it because it fits my personal experience and my body's reactions to a

T. I don't believe it just because I read it, but because what I read

tracks with my experience and explains a lot of experience that was

formerly unexplainable.

BTW, this is the same process I went through with fats, I no longer

believe any vegetable oil is truly good, just that some are less harmful

than others. So I am careful which ones I use, and how much, and stick

mainly to animal fats and coconut oil if I could get unhydrogenated

lard, I would use that instead of ANY veg oil. Someday I may find a

source for organic pork fat, and then I may try rendering the lard

myself. As it is, I save the fat from natural chicken and clean/store

that and use it for some things.

sol

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

I think you could be right. I've been coming to the decision over the

past few weeks that the only thing I have control over is my attitude.

I didn't jump into it, but the idea has been creeping up on me, and I

actually have started working on my thoughts/attitudes towards food just

this morning. Quite a coincidence to get your email this afternoon, =-O

sol

wrote:

> Sol, nah,

>

> I am wondering if perhaps what needs changing here is your thought process.

>

[Guest guest]

LOL, I thought about that after my finger hit the send button. Be

careful of hasty over-broad statements! I should have been more

specific, I did not mean to include coconut oil, I would not give that

up, I was thinking of the unsaturated and polyunsaturated oils

substituted for lard in the past 60 or more years---corn oil, soy oil,

safflower oil, canola oil, that sort of oil, whether hydrogenated into

vegetable shortening and margarine or not. I would probably use some

virgin olive oil for salad dressings, too. And of course real butter. I

continue to search for a good organic butter. The only brand sold where

I live is awful--it tastes like margarine so much it makes me sick.

I love cashews, and now that i'm going much less dairy, if not quite

dairy free yet, I love thick cashew cream for my coffee and tea. I also

like almond milk but it is a pain to make. I culd put the strained

solids into my VCO " candy " though, so I may re-think that. Sesame milk

is something I may also start making again, awful in coffee, but I like

to drink it. I have to be stingy about sesame though, as I have some

allergey problems with it.

sol

Nina Moliver wrote:

> Sol,

>

> Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding vegetable

> oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

> unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews, and so

> forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much better

> for you than the unsaturated ones.

>

> Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable oils.

> When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out for

> the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat them

> with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame tahini

> with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the combination.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks! I will check it out right away.

sol

van essa wrote:

> Three of us just put in a big order (to save on shipping) from Good

> Earth Farms in Wisconsin. Their bacon, pork fat .. heck, anything

> pork they have is SOOO good!

>

> If you can order enough - usually like 40lbs. the shipping works out

> to be roughly $1.25/lb.

>

> These guys are wonderful to work with too.

>

> -vanessa

>

> ... pork fat rules!

>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sol wrote: I think you could be right. I've been coming to the decision over

the

past few weeks that the only thing I have control over is my attitude.

I didn't jump into it, but the idea has been creeping up on me, and I

actually have started working on my thoughts/attitudes towards food just

this morning. Quite a coincidence to get your email this afternoon

Hummmmmm. perhaps not coincidence...perhaps I am reading you J

Abundant Blessings

[Guest guest]

In my experience as an ex-sugar-junkie, I came to the conclusion that

small nibbles can cause severe cravings. Carbs can be an addiction,

just like heroin, tobacco, crack cocaine, and alcohol. If an

ex-junkie has a small amount of heroin, he of she stops being an

ex-junkie and is back to being a junkie.

Carb addiction seems to be tied into leptin resistance. From what I

have read, people who are not leptin resistant are able to have carbs

and sweets in moderation, but those who are leptin resistant are much

more prone to binge and have a real difficult time getting back to a

low carb lifestyle.

Alobar

On 11/21/08, sol <solbun@...> wrote:

> nah,

> Thanks for the reminder, and I know I need to ease back into stricter

> low carb, and I am doing that.

> But just for the record, I've been on " diets " and " eating plans " and

> I've been on your idea of allowing myself just " one bite " of something.

> Been there, done that also, for umpteen years. I'm 62 years old and

> didn't just start out with all this, LOLOLOL.

> The problem for me is that I get to a fair place, then think I can

> allow " one bite " of something, and do ok the first day, but then I'm

> right back to feeling increased cravings right away. In a week or two,

> or three, I've dived back into the cookie jar. That " one bite " of pasta,

> snickers, whatever is the start of the slippery slide for me.

> As to soy, it may do well for you, but down the road long years from

> now, you may find yourself suffering from a thyroid problem or female

> hormone imbalances. It takes many YEARS for the damage to build up.

> However you may also get by with it for your entire life.

> I ate soy for 30 years thinking it was healthy, used soymilk for

> longer than that because my son was allergic to cow and goat milk and

> soy formula is what he got (if I knew then what I know now about soy, I

> would have found another alternative, believe me). I never liked soy

> except for one or two things I made with tofu. I despise soy milk and

> always have. And no soy product agrees with me, even in my 20s they gave

> me terrible gas. But by god the " experts " all said it was healthy and so

> I ate it. Even put soy flour in all baked goods. Now, I have a thyroid

> problem, and Hashimoto's. Did soy alone cause it, no. Did soy have a

> huge part in it, absolutely. FWIW, I used to make my own soy milk and

> tofu from dried soybeans. Not fermented but the real deal, not the crap

> from hydrolysed soy and isolated soy proteins that I switched to when

> soy became popular. That was likely a huge mistake, but I'm not going to

> go back to making my own soy stuff, as I never liked it and as I say, it

> never agreed with my guts. And to use such a strong goitrogen now, as

> well as its other detriments to ME, nope.

> I learned a great lesson though. NOTHING I do now is because some

> authority or expert told me to, or I read it in a respected author's

> book or in a medical article, or because " they allow it to be sold, so

> it must be safe-good for me. I started looking beyond soy and

> vegetarianism/veganism because severely deteriorating healh forced me to

> look beyond the " experts " I had believed in for decades. My body forced

> me into it. Now, I read and research, and if I find something that seems

> like it is worth a try, I try it. If it works for me, I keep on with it,

> if it doesn't work or makes me feel worse, I abandon it. Soy is one

> thing I've abandoned. And I believe most of the bad stuff I read about

> it because it fits my personal experience and my body's reactions to a

> T. I don't believe it just because I read it, but because what I read

> tracks with my experience and explains a lot of experience that was

> formerly unexplainable.

> BTW, this is the same process I went through with fats, I no longer

> believe any vegetable oil is truly good, just that some are less harmful

> than others. So I am careful which ones I use, and how much, and stick

> mainly to animal fats and coconut oil if I could get unhydrogenated

> lard, I would use that instead of ANY veg oil. Someday I may find a

> source for organic pork fat, and then I may try rendering the lard

> myself. As it is, I save the fat from natural chicken and clean/store

> that and use it for some things.

>

> sol

>

>

[Guest guest]

I have a terrible sleep disorder, but potatoes, in particular, jeopardize my

sleep. Bread and potatoes act like sugar in the body.

Nina

Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

Well said, . That was sort of what I was trying to suggest.

When we tell ourselves we can't have something, we want it. And

that's why I'll let myself have bread or potatoes anytime I want.

However, I fully understand that those will jeopardize my health,

weight, sleep, etc. So I choose wisely most of the time and have

managed a gradual, healthy weight loss.

thanks for your words,

nah

>

> Sol, nah,

>

>

>

> I am wondering if perhaps what needs changing here is your thought

process.

> What we put out to the universe is what comes back to us, full

force. If

> you keep telling yourself you really, really want those carbs but

you are on

> a restricted diet and can't, guess what is going to happen. You will

> eventually get back into the carbs and sabotage your original plan.

......

>

> Removing the feeling of " restriction " will be replaced with the sense of

> freedom and success. You make the choice.

>

>

>

> Abundant Blessings,

>

>

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Bread, potatoes, and all carbs break down into glucose in the body.

Alobar

On 11/22/08, Nina Moliver <yoganina@...> wrote:

> I have a terrible sleep disorder, but potatoes, in particular, jeopardize my

> sleep. Bread and potatoes act like sugar in the body.

>

>

> Nina

>

[Guest guest]

We all need glucose, so eventually, something or other is going to have to

be transformed into glucose for the body and the brain. It's a question of

how fast it is released into the bloodstream. Sorry, I should have been more

clear. Bread and potatoes change to glucose very fast.

Nina

Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

Bread, potatoes, and all carbs break down into glucose in the body.

Alobar

On 11/22/08, Nina Moliver <yoganina@...> wrote:

> I have a terrible sleep disorder, but potatoes, in particular, jeopardize

my

> sleep. Bread and potatoes act like sugar in the body.

>

>

> Nina

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Yummy! I love some of the foods you describe.

As a general rule, we recommend olive oil and sesame oil as the only safe,

stable unsaturated oils. Corn oil, soy oil, safflower oil, canola oil - uh,

uh, don't touch. They go rancid in the body very fast, if not in the bottle.

Nina

Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

LOL, I thought about that after my finger hit the send button. Be

careful of hasty over-broad statements! I should have been more

specific, I did not mean to include coconut oil, I would not give that

up, I was thinking of the unsaturated and polyunsaturated oils

substituted for lard in the past 60 or more years---corn oil, soy oil,

safflower oil, canola oil, that sort of oil, whether hydrogenated into

vegetable shortening and margarine or not. I would probably use some

virgin olive oil for salad dressings, too. And of course real butter. I

continue to search for a good organic butter. The only brand sold where

I live is awful--it tastes like margarine so much it makes me sick.

I love cashews, and now that i'm going much less dairy, if not quite

dairy free yet, I love thick cashew cream for my coffee and tea. I also

like almond milk but it is a pain to make. I culd put the strained

solids into my VCO " candy " though, so I may re-think that. Sesame milk

is something I may also start making again, awful in coffee, but I like

to drink it. I have to be stingy about sesame though, as I have some

allergey problems with it.

sol

Nina Moliver wrote:

> Sol,

>

> Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding vegetable

> oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

> unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews, and

so

> forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much better

> for you than the unsaturated ones.

>

> Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable oils.

> When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out for

> the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat them

> with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame tahini

> with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the combination.

>

>

------------------------------------

[Guest guest]

Yes...agreeing with Nina. After doing some research a few years back, I

stopped purchasing (and told others to) anything but olive oil (only for dh,

who doesn't like coconut), coconut oil and sesame oil. Just a few days ago I

got my first bottle of red palm oil. I am wondering about the brand I got

(it was recommended, I think on this list, but I'm¹ not sure). I am not fond

of the Red Palm so far for cooking, but I thought it was rather amazing on

the skin! So, even if I don't end up using it for food, I can see quite

happily using it on my skin....

Does anyone else use it and what has been your experience with it?

I like fixing EVERYTHING in coconut oil. It is by far my personal favorite.

I do anything and everything with that and really find no need for anything

else.

After some research I did again this morning, I realize that for weight

loss, it might benefit me to get some EFA oil again though. I read this

morning how this has leptin or increases leptin and that that is one reason

it promotes weight loss.

Chantelle

On 11/22/08 3:18 PM, " Nina Moliver " <yoganina@...> wrote:

>

>

>

> Yummy! I love some of the foods you describe.

>

> As a general rule, we recommend olive oil and sesame oil as the only safe,

> stable unsaturated oils. Corn oil, soy oil, safflower oil, canola oil - uh,

> uh, don't touch. They go rancid in the body very fast, if not in the bottle.

>

> Nina

>

> Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

>

> LOL, I thought about that after my finger hit the send button. Be

> careful of hasty over-broad statements! I should have been more

> specific, I did not mean to include coconut oil, I would not give that

> up, I was thinking of the unsaturated and polyunsaturated oils

> substituted for lard in the past 60 or more years---corn oil, soy oil,

> safflower oil, canola oil, that sort of oil, whether hydrogenated into

> vegetable shortening and margarine or not. I would probably use some

> virgin olive oil for salad dressings, too. And of course real butter. I

> continue to search for a good organic butter. The only brand sold where

> I live is awful--it tastes like margarine so much it makes me sick.

> I love cashews, and now that i'm going much less dairy, if not quite

> dairy free yet, I love thick cashew cream for my coffee and tea. I also

> like almond milk but it is a pain to make. I culd put the strained

> solids into my VCO " candy " though, so I may re-think that. Sesame milk

> is something I may also start making again, awful in coffee, but I like

> to drink it. I have to be stingy about sesame though, as I have some

> allergey problems with it.

> sol

>

> Nina Moliver wrote:

>> > Sol,

>> >

>> > Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding vegetable

>> > oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

>> > unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews, and

> so

>> > forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much better

>> > for you than the unsaturated ones.

>> >

>> > Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable oils.

>> > When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out for

>> > the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat them

>> > with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame tahini

>> > with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the combination.

>> >

>> >

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Chantell

I am a Canadian living in Hong Kong and I have been using the Red Palm oil

for about 18 months. I got my firs from a friend in a Farmers Market in

Northern Alberta. She buys in bulk and rebottles it. She said it was from

Africa.

After returning to Hong Kong I searched the city but could not find any,

even in the HFS's. Found several on the net and ended up buying from

Australia. Brand is " elais organic " . It is Australian Certified Organic but

is a product of Columbia. At the same time I bought coconut oil, also

Australian Certified Organic and it is a product of Fiji.

www.elaeisorganic.com info@... I got 6 quarts of each

on a promotion at this time last year.

I really like it for stirfrying veggies and stews, curries and chillies.

Also wonderful on the skin but tends to stain a bit. Good for slow frying

eggs.

Cheers, Doug

Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

>

> LOL, I thought about that after my finger hit the send button. Be

> careful of hasty over-broad statements! I should have been more

> specific, I did not mean to include coconut oil, I would not give that

> up, I was thinking of the unsaturated and polyunsaturated oils

> substituted for lard in the past 60 or more years---corn oil, soy oil,

> safflower oil, canola oil, that sort of oil, whether hydrogenated into

> vegetable shortening and margarine or not. I would probably use some

> virgin olive oil for salad dressings, too. And of course real butter. I

> continue to search for a good organic butter. The only brand sold where

> I live is awful--it tastes like margarine so much it makes me sick.

> I love cashews, and now that i'm going much less dairy, if not quite

> dairy free yet, I love thick cashew cream for my coffee and tea. I also

> like almond milk but it is a pain to make. I culd put the strained

> solids into my VCO " candy " though, so I may re-think that. Sesame milk

> is something I may also start making again, awful in coffee, but I like

> to drink it. I have to be stingy about sesame though, as I have some

> allergey problems with it.

> sol

>

> Nina Moliver wrote:

>> > Sol,

>> >

>> > Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding

>> > vegetable

>> > oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

>> > unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews,

>> > and

> so

>> > forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much

>> > better

>> > for you than the unsaturated ones.

>> >

>> > Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable

>> > oils.

>> > When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out

>> > for

>> > the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat

>> > them

>> > with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame

>> > tahini

>> > with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the

>> > combination.

>> >

>> >

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Sorry, Duncan, I don't.

Nina

Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

Nina, if you have the fatty acids figures for the profile of sesame

oil, we can add it to my worksheet that shows its peroxidation index

and calculates your own peroxidation index based on the oils in your

diet. The worksheet and corresponding screen shot is posted on my

coconut oil page:

http://tinyurl.com/oil-references

If you like just have a look and post the figures here and I'll add

them.

Duncan

> > Sol,

> >

> > Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding

vegetable

> > oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with

is

> > unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados,

cashews, and

> so

> > forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much

better

> > for you than the unsaturated ones.

> >

> > Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated

vegetable oils.

> > When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me

out for

> > the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I

eat them

> > with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame

tahini

> > with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the

combination.

> >

> >

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Mine seems rancid to me (the Red Palm Oil). It is not out of date. It says

on it that it does not need to be refrigerated. I¹m feeling really confused

about it. Tried to cook some potatoes for my kids in it and they did not

like them. It bothered me even just while cooking.

Yeah, I noticed it stained the skin a bit, but I guess I liked the tint. LOL

Chantelle

On 11/23/08 1:35 AM, " Murray " <doublaswalter@...> wrote:

>

>

>

> Hi Chantell

> I am a Canadian living in Hong Kong and I have been using the Red Palm oil

> for about 18 months. I got my firs from a friend in a Farmers Market in

> Northern Alberta. She buys in bulk and rebottles it. She said it was from

> Africa.

> After returning to Hong Kong I searched the city but could not find any,

> even in the HFS's. Found several on the net and ended up buying from

> Australia. Brand is " elais organic " . It is Australian Certified Organic but

> is a product of Columbia. At the same time I bought coconut oil, also

> Australian Certified Organic and it is a product of Fiji.

> www.elaeisorganic.com info@...

> <mailto:info%40neoearthorganics.com> I got 6 quarts of each

> on a promotion at this time last year.

>

> I really like it for stirfrying veggies and stews, curries and chillies.

> Also wonderful on the skin but tends to stain a bit. Good for slow frying

> eggs.

> Cheers, Doug

>

> Re: Re: Formerly Soy - now Diets

>> >

>> > LOL, I thought about that after my finger hit the send button. Be

>> > careful of hasty over-broad statements! I should have been more

>> > specific, I did not mean to include coconut oil, I would not give that

>> > up, I was thinking of the unsaturated and polyunsaturated oils

>> > substituted for lard in the past 60 or more years---corn oil, soy oil,

>> > safflower oil, canola oil, that sort of oil, whether hydrogenated into

>> > vegetable shortening and margarine or not. I would probably use some

>> > virgin olive oil for salad dressings, too. And of course real butter. I

>> > continue to search for a good organic butter. The only brand sold where

>> > I live is awful--it tastes like margarine so much it makes me sick.

>> > I love cashews, and now that i'm going much less dairy, if not quite

>> > dairy free yet, I love thick cashew cream for my coffee and tea. I also

>> > like almond milk but it is a pain to make. I culd put the strained

>> > solids into my VCO " candy " though, so I may re-think that. Sesame milk

>> > is something I may also start making again, awful in coffee, but I like

>> > to drink it. I have to be stingy about sesame though, as I have some

>> > allergey problems with it.

>> > sol

>> >

>> > Nina Moliver wrote:

>>>> >> > Sol,

>>>> >> >

>>>> >> > Coconut oil is a vegetable oil, so I suggest not saying avoiding

>>>> >> > vegetable

>>>> >> > oils in general. It sounds like what you are having trouble with is

>>>> >> > unsaturated vegetable oils. Coconut oil, palm oil, avocados, cashews,

>>>> >> > and

>> > so

>>>> >> > forth have saturated vegetable fats, and they apparently work much

>>>> >> > better

>>>> >> > for you than the unsaturated ones.

>>>> >> >

>>>> >> > Here's my story - I have a terrible time with unsaturated vegetable

>>>> >> > oils.

>>>> >> > When I take a small amount (a fraction of a teaspoon), it wipes me out

>>>> >> > for

>>>> >> > the full day following. However, what helps here is miso. When I eat

>>>> >> > them

>>>> >> > with miso, I seem to do fine with them. I have been eating sesame

>>>> >> > tahini

>>>> >> > with miso every day, and I have gotten great benefit from the

>>>> >> > combination.

>>>> >> >

>>>> >> >

>> >

>> > ------------------------------------

>> >

>> >