EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater - right above kitchen sink

October 1, 2011

Hello all

new member here; i have a kitchen sink right below two gas water heaters that

are showing a 30-40milliGauss reading close to it. So at best i am going to be

exposed to 20-25milligauss for atleast a couple hours a day doing dishes getting

water etc.

In addition power for the home is also located right next to the washers that

are showing similarly high reading (which are also located right next to the gas

heater); and all of them are located right near the home entrance - so its not

like i can avoid them all together.

Given that i think i (and my family members) will be exposed to 30millGauss for

about 2-3hours a day. I am just researching about EMF stuff; but from what i can

tell this sounds horrible. am i correct?

Other than this part; the rest of the house is our dream house. We are debating

whether to stay here (which is hard wood flooring) or move to a carpeted house

and deal with the problem that come with carpeting.

In addition: this house is right next to a road that leads to a highway a mile

down; so i have a continuous stream of cars going through me; crap..

what would you do? stay or move?

thanks

-gariki

October 2, 2011

Hi Gariki,

I can't advise on the meter readings.Â Look up how close you are to cell towers

& antennas on antennasearch.comÂ Â How close you are to those is biggest

answer.

Electrical issues can be fixed. Living close to a highway is hard with the noise

and pollution.Â Most antennas are located along highways & major roads.

Hardwood floors are healthier than carpet.

Kathy

From: gariki <chetan.gariki@...>

t: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater - right above

kitchen sink

Â

Hello all

new member here; i have a kitchen sink right below two gas water heaters that

are showing a 30-40milliGauss reading close to it. So at best i am going to be

exposed to 20-25milligauss for atleast a couple hours a day doing dishes getting

water etc.

In addition power for the home is also located right next to the washers that

are showing similarly high reading (which are also located right next to the gas

heater); and all of them are located right near the home entrance - so its not

like i can avoid them all together.

Given that i think i (and my family members) will be exposed to 30millGauss for

about 2-3hours a day. I am just researching about EMF stuff; but from what i can

tell this sounds horrible. am i correct?

Other than this part; the rest of the house is our dream house. We are debating

whether to stay here (which is hard wood flooring) or move to a carpeted house

and deal with the problem that come with carpeting.

In addition: this house is right next to a road that leads to a highway a mile

down; so i have a continuous stream of cars going through me; crap..

what would you do? stay or move?

thanks

-gariki

October 2, 2011

any opinions anybody? its kind of urgent for us to decide because of lease

signing etc.

>

> Hello all

>

> new member here; i have a kitchen sink right below two gas water heaters that

are showing a 30-40milliGauss reading close to it. So at best i am going to be

exposed to 20-25milligauss for atleast a couple hours a day doing dishes getting

water etc.

>

> In addition power for the home is also located right next to the washers that

are showing similarly high reading (which are also located right next to the gas

heater); and all of them are located right near the home entrance - so its not

like i can avoid them all together.

>

> Given that i think i (and my family members) will be exposed to 30millGauss

for about 2-3hours a day. I am just researching about EMF stuff; but from what i

can tell this sounds horrible. am i correct?

>

> Other than this part; the rest of the house is our dream house. We are

debating whether to stay here (which is hard wood flooring) or move to a

carpeted house and deal with the problem that come with carpeting.

>

> In addition: this house is right next to a road that leads to a highway a mile

down; so i have a continuous stream of cars going through me; crap..

>

> what would you do? stay or move?

>

> thanks

> -gariki

>

October 2, 2011

Thanks Kathy. Thats a cool site.

But i am specifically concerned about the EMF from my hot water generators and

the power source (switch board). Just now learned that my steam cleaner that i

would have to use on the carpet shows a reading well above 50 as well (maybe

even in the hundreds). I guess there is no place to escape.

>

> Hi Gariki,

>

> I can't advise on the meter readings.Â Look up how close you are to cell

towers & antennas on antennasearch.comÂ Â How close you are to those is biggest

answer.

>

> Electrical issues can be fixed. Living close to a highway is hard with the

noise and pollution.Â Most antennas are located along highways & major roads.

Hardwood floors are healthier than carpet.

>

> Kathy

>

> From: gariki <chetan.gariki@...>

> t: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater - right above

kitchen sink

>

> Â

>

> Hello all

>

> new member here; i have a kitchen sink right below two gas water heaters that

are showing a 30-40milliGauss reading close to it. So at best i am going to be

exposed to 20-25milligauss for atleast a couple hours a day doing dishes getting

water etc.

>

> In addition power for the home is also located right next to the washers that

are showing similarly high reading (which are also located right next to the gas

heater); and all of them are located right near the home entrance - so its not

like i can avoid them all together.

>

> Given that i think i (and my family members) will be exposed to 30millGauss

for about 2-3hours a day. I am just researching about EMF stuff; but from what i

can tell this sounds horrible. am i correct?

>

> Other than this part; the rest of the house is our dream house. We are

debating whether to stay here (which is hard wood flooring) or move to a

carpeted house and deal with the problem that come with carpeting.

>

> In addition: this house is right next to a road that leads to a highway a mile

down; so i have a continuous stream of cars going through me; crap..

>

> what would you do? stay or move?

>

> thanks

>

> -gariki

>

October 2, 2011

On 10/2/2011 9:11 AM, gariki wrote:

> Thanks Kathy. Thats a cool site.

>

>But i am specifically concerned about the EMF from my hot water generators

>and the power source (switch board). Just now learned that my steam

cleaner

>that i would have to use on the carpet shows a reading well above 50

as well

>(maybe even in the hundreds). I guess there is no place to escape.

Well, you may be focused on the wrong thing -- the milligauss reading

doesn't seem to be the primary problem when it comes to health

problems. Rather it is the high-frequency noise that may or may not

be present, and your meter isn't even trying to detect.

Marc

October 2, 2011

high frequency noise? something i never thought about in particular. Can you

point me to more info or tell me more about it.

thanks!

> > Thanks Kathy. Thats a cool site.

> >

> >But i am specifically concerned about the EMF from my hot water generators

> >and the power source (switch board). Just now learned that my steam

> cleaner

> >that i would have to use on the carpet shows a reading well above 50

> as well

> >(maybe even in the hundreds). I guess there is no place to escape.

>

> Well, you may be focused on the wrong thing -- the milligauss reading

> doesn't seem to be the primary problem when it comes to health

> problems. Rather it is the high-frequency noise that may or may not

> be present, and your meter isn't even trying to detect.

>

> Marc

>

October 2, 2011

> high frequency noise? something i never thought about in particular.

> Can you point me to more info or tell me more about it.

Hi frequency noise is the stuff in the kilohertz, megahertz, and

gigahertz regimes -- something that a 60hz EMF meter does not

detect. This stuff comes from a variety of modern electronics --

refrigerators, TVs, computers, florescent lights, wireless

phones, dimmer switches, cellphones, wi-fi, smart meters for

utilities, etc. -- and if you share the same power transformer

with your neighbors, this stuff could be coming into your

house from next door...

I find that my health problems comes from these higher

frequencies -- for example, I can recall getting terrible

symptoms from a 15 " LCD monitor, even though my EMF

meter showed nearly zero milligauss. However, if I

put an AM radio next to the monitor (550 khz - 1200 khz),

I could hear all sorts of nasty buzzing on the radio.

Marc

October 2, 2011

Magnetic fields do matter. See Bioinitiative Report, Seletun scientific

statement 2011, among others.

You need to first identify the source of the magnetic field.

If the source is an appliance, usually 1 meter distance is sufficient.

If the source is net currents on the wire caused by a wiring error like ganged

neutrals, then you'd better correct the wiring error.

If the source is external from the outside power line or water pipes (e.g.,

still there when all the circuit breakers are off), you may not have many good

choices.

Shielding is not easy and expensive.

You might want to rearrange living spaces to minimize your time in high magnetic

field areas.

> >

> > Hi Gariki,

> >

> > I can't advise on the meter readings.Â Look up how close you are to cell

towers & antennas on antennasearch.comÂ Â How close you are to those is biggest

answer.

> >

> > Electrical issues can be fixed. Living close to a highway is hard with the

noise and pollution.Â Most antennas are located along highways & major roads.

Hardwood floors are healthier than carpet.

> >

> > Kathy

> >

> > From: gariki <chetan.gariki@>

> > t: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater - right

above kitchen sink

> >

> > Â

> >

> > Hello all

> >

> > new member here; i have a kitchen sink right below two gas water heaters

that are showing a 30-40milliGauss reading close to it. So at best i am going to

be exposed to 20-25milligauss for atleast a couple hours a day doing dishes

getting water etc.

> >

> > In addition power for the home is also located right next to the washers

that are showing similarly high reading (which are also located right next to

the gas heater); and all of them are located right near the home entrance - so

its not like i can avoid them all together.

> >

> > Given that i think i (and my family members) will be exposed to 30millGauss

for about 2-3hours a day. I am just researching about EMF stuff; but from what i

can tell this sounds horrible. am i correct?

> >

> > Other than this part; the rest of the house is our dream house. We are

debating whether to stay here (which is hard wood flooring) or move to a

carpeted house and deal with the problem that come with carpeting.

> >

> > In addition: this house is right next to a road that leads to a highway a

mile down; so i have a continuous stream of cars going through me; crap..

> >

> > what would you do? stay or move?

> >

> > thanks

> >

> > -gariki

> >

October 4, 2011

--- On Sun, 10/2/11, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote

what would you do? stay or move?

Hi,

If the other house has less problems with traffic, EMF's, cell towers, etc.

then carpet can be easily removed and a floor put down for probably less expense

than it would be to deal with the EMF problems.

For example, you would have to use Mu Metal on the ceiling or floor and the wall

to block the EMF's from your area. But enough sheets to do the job would

probably cost you about $2,000 to $5,000, You could put in a floor in the other

house for the same amount of money. Just my 2 cents.

C. Johhnson

Superdrove

.

October 4, 2011

Thanks for the inputs everyone.

We have decided to move back to the carpeted apartment (actually it was one we

lived in for 2years an year ago). The carpet is about 1year old; so neither too

new to offgas nor too old to be hosting a bunch of dust and germs etc.

Unfortunately this is the middle floor and we cant change it to carpet in the

future also.

But because i am more aware now than before we have eliminated both ground floor

(because of emfs from smart meters) and top floors due to emfs from wiring

above. Actually the ground floor was ok; since emf was only at one spot in the

house; the top floors; of both the houses i checked had emf above 6-7 all

through the house due to wiring in the crawl space above.

After this experience; we wonder.. where is the world going; by the time my kids

are old enough there wont be any place to hide. jeez.

-gariki

>

> --- On Sun, 10/2/11, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote

>

> what would you do? stay or move?

>

> Hi,

>

> If the other house has less problems with traffic, EMF's, cell towers, etc.

then carpet can be easily removed and a floor put down for probably less expense

than it would be to deal with the EMF problems.

>

> For example, you would have to use Mu Metal on the ceiling or floor and the

wall to block the EMF's from your area. But enough sheets to do the job would

probably cost you about $2,000 to $5,000, You could put in a floor in the other

house for the same amount of money. Just my 2 cents.

>

> C. Johhnson

> Superdrove

>

> .

>

October 4, 2011

Usually wiring isn't so bad except when there are

loops caused by ground loops or ganged neutrals.

There are a couple books on this (one by Ed Leeper I used).

Unfortunately probably 90% of electricians don't understand the

problem. Shielded wiring is nice, but won't solve the problem.

I suspect there was a similar " net current " probably at

your water heaters too... often this can be fixed by just

disconnecting the ground wire from the water pipes, though

code usual requires that wire be connected.

On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 8:53 AM, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote:

> **

>

> Thanks for the inputs everyone.

>

> We have decided to move back to the carpeted apartment (actually it was one

> we lived in for 2years an year ago). The carpet is about 1year old; so

> neither too new to offgas nor too old to be hosting a bunch of dust and

> germs etc. Unfortunately this is the middle floor and we cant change it to

> carpet in the future also.

>

> But because i am more aware now than before we have eliminated both ground

> floor (because of emfs from smart meters) and top floors due to emfs from

> wiring above. Actually the ground floor was ok; since emf was only at one

> spot in the house; the top floors; of both the houses i checked had emf

> above 6-7 all through the house due to wiring in the crawl space above.

>

> After this experience; we wonder.. where is the world going; by the time my

> kids are old enough there wont be any place to hide. jeez.

>

> -gariki

>

> >

> > --- On Sun, 10/2/11, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote

>

> >

> > what would you do? stay or move?

> >

> > Hi,

> >

> > If the other house has less problems with traffic, EMF's, cell towers,

> etc. then carpet can be easily removed and a floor put down for probably

> less expense than it would be to deal with the EMF problems.

> >

> > For example, you would have to use Mu Metal on the ceiling or floor and

> the wall to block the EMF's from your area. But enough sheets to do the job

> would probably cost you about $2,000 to $5,000, You could put in a floor in

> the other house for the same amount of money. Just my 2 cents.

> >

> > C. Johhnson

> > Superdrove

> >

> > .

> >

October 4, 2011

According to the National Electrical Code, just updated this past year: it is NO

longer code for water pipes to be grounded. Code calls for grounding of water

line AT the service entrance (this is where the water comes into the house.)

Lizzie

>

> From: wbruno@...

> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 10:18:40 -0600

> Subject: Re: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater

- right above kitchen sink

>

> Usually wiring isn't so bad except when there are

> loops caused by ground loops or ganged neutrals.

> There are a couple books on this (one by Ed Leeper I used).

> Unfortunately probably 90% of electricians don't understand the

> problem. Shielded wiring is nice, but won't solve the problem.

> I suspect there was a similar " net current " probably at

> your water heaters too... often this can be fixed by just

> disconnecting the ground wire from the water pipes, though

> code usual requires that wire be connected.

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 8:53 AM, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote:

>

> > **

> >

> > Thanks for the inputs everyone.

> >

> > We have decided to move back to the carpeted apartment (actually it was one

> > we lived in for 2years an year ago). The carpet is about 1year old; so

> > neither too new to offgas nor too old to be hosting a bunch of dust and

> > germs etc. Unfortunately this is the middle floor and we cant change it to

> > carpet in the future also.

> >

> > But because i am more aware now than before we have eliminated both ground

> > floor (because of emfs from smart meters) and top floors due to emfs from

> > wiring above. Actually the ground floor was ok; since emf was only at one

> > spot in the house; the top floors; of both the houses i checked had emf

> > above 6-7 all through the house due to wiring in the crawl space above.

> >

> > After this experience; we wonder.. where is the world going; by the time my

> > kids are old enough there wont be any place to hide. jeez.

> >

> > -gariki

> >

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 10/2/11, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote

> >

> > >

> > > what would you do? stay or move?

> > >

> > > Hi,

> > >

> > > If the other house has less problems with traffic, EMF's, cell towers,

> > etc. then carpet can be easily removed and a floor put down for probably

> > less expense than it would be to deal with the EMF problems.

> > >

> > > For example, you would have to use Mu Metal on the ceiling or floor and

> > the wall to block the EMF's from your area. But enough sheets to do the job

> > would probably cost you about $2,000 to $5,000, You could put in a floor in

> > the other house for the same amount of money. Just my 2 cents.

> > >

> > > C. Johhnson

> > > Superdrove

> > >

> > > .

> > >

October 4, 2011

No, it is the other way around.

They do not want to ground the water pipes.

They want want to use the water pipes for grounding.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton

RE: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater

- right above kitchen sink

According to the National Electrical Code, just updated this past year: it is

NO longer code for water pipes to be grounded. Code calls for grounding of water

line AT the service entrance (this is where the water comes into the house.)

Lizzie

October 4, 2011

Yes, you are correct. And for years/decades, in the US, it was Code to do it

that way.

It is now no longer Code to use the water pipes for grounding.

Lizzie

From: charles@...

Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 19:23:17 +0200

Subject: Re: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater -

right above kitchen sink

No, it is the other way around.

They do not want to ground the water pipes.

They want want to use the water pipes for grounding.

Greetings,

Claessens

member Verband Baubiologie

www.milieuziektes.nl

www.milieuziektes.be

www.hetbitje.nl

checked by Norton

RE: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater -

right above kitchen sink

According to the National Electrical Code, just updated this past year: it is NO

longer code for water pipes to be grounded. Code calls for grounding of water

line AT the service entrance (this is where the water comes into the house.)

Lizzie

October 5, 2011

Hi Bill and Gariki,

<Unfortunately probably 90% of electricians don't understand the

problem.>

So true. I could have gone to school and learned wiring myself and rewired our

house, also, in the time it took to find one who would do it the way I asked!

It was a painful process.

We had shielded wiring put in, however, that only works as well as your ability

to keep frequencies out of the house. In some circumstances emfs penetrate our

brick walls. We have particular problems with emfs penetrating during a 3 hour

window on Sunday mornings. When this happens, those frequencies radiate around

the house due to the metal shielded wiring itself. So, I would definitely not

put metal wiring in in the future, seeing smart meters and possible satellite

transmissions coming down the pike.

<I suspect there was a similar " net current " probably at

your water heaters too... >

Gariki, I don't remember all the particulars of your original post, however, I

remember you writing about having problems around your sink.... We had similar

problems with our water and water heater.... To fix it we bought a gas only hot

water heater and had it installed, and we had the water pipes moved to a

different course into the house which avoided electric wiring. (In our

circumstance, the water pipes snaked all thru the house and under the bedrooms,

when all they needed to do was to come in to the back of the house and go

directly to the bath and kitchen.) I don't know whether this is helpful info

for you or not, but if you are trading a single dwelling for an apartment or

condo, I would definitely keep the single dwelling and change the water

situation. If/ when smart meters come to your area, you will need all the space

from others' meters that you can get.

My 2 cents,

Diane

________________________________

October 5, 2011

I believe, tho, Lizzie, there are State codes which enforce this.Â Here in Pa,

they want water pipes grounded, but I know for fact this is not the case in all

States.

Diane

________________________________

From: thode <lizt777@...>

esens

Sent: Tuesday, October 4, 2011 12:59 PM

Subject: RE: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater -

right above kitchen sink

Â

According to the National Electrical Code, just updated this past year: it is NO

longer code for water pipes to be grounded. Code calls for grounding of water

line AT the service entrance (this is where the water comes into the house.)

Lizzie

>

> From: wbruno@...

> Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2011 10:18:40 -0600

> Subject: Re: Re: EMF reading of 30milliGauss close to gas water heater

- right above kitchen sink

>

> Usually wiring isn't so bad except when there are

> loops caused by ground loops or ganged neutrals.

> There are a couple books on this (one by Ed Leeper I used).

> Unfortunately probably 90% of electricians don't understand the

> problem. Shielded wiring is nice, but won't solve the problem.

> I suspect there was a similar " net current " probably at

> your water heaters too... often this can be fixed by just

> disconnecting the ground wire from the water pipes, though

> code usual requires that wire be connected.

>

> On Tue, Oct 4, 2011 at 8:53 AM, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote:

>

> > **

> >

> > Thanks for the inputs everyone.

> >

> > We have decided to move back to the carpeted apartment (actually it was one

> > we lived in for 2years an year ago). The carpet is about 1year old; so

> > neither too new to offgas nor too old to be hosting a bunch of dust and

> > germs etc. Unfortunately this is the middle floor and we cant change it to

> > carpet in the future also.

> >

> > But because i am more aware now than before we have eliminated both ground

> > floor (because of emfs from smart meters) and top floors due to emfs from

> > wiring above. Actually the ground floor was ok; since emf was only at one

> > spot in the house; the top floors; of both the houses i checked had emf

> > above 6-7 all through the house due to wiring in the crawl space above.

> >

> > After this experience; we wonder.. where is the world going; by the time my

> > kids are old enough there wont be any place to hide. jeez.

> >

> > -gariki

> >

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 10/2/11, gariki <chetan.gariki@...> wrote

> >

> > >

> > > what would you do? stay or move?

> > >

> > > Hi,

> > >

> > > If the other house has less problems with traffic, EMF's, cell towers,

> > etc. then carpet can be easily removed and a floor put down for probably

> > less expense than it would be to deal with the EMF problems.

> > >

> > > For example, you would have to use Mu Metal on the ceiling or floor and

> > the wall to block the EMF's from your area. But enough sheets to do the job

> > would probably cost you about $2,000 to $5,000, You could put in a floor in

> > the other house for the same amount of money. Just my 2 cents.

> > >

> > > C. Johhnson

> > > Superdrove

> > >

> > > .

> > >

October 5, 2011

Hello Diane,

Thanks for your post. Yes; our kitchen sink where we do most dishes is right

below the heaters. And i talked to the landlord about moving the sink elsewhere

but he said it would need ripping a lot of stuff. Anyways because of this and

other things we are moving out; back into the apartment i was an year ago.

For the most part this place is clean. Now i hear a lot of concern from folks on

this board about smart meters; before i joined this board a couple days ago; i

never even gave them a single thought. Now for the apartmets i am moving to;

there are a set of about 6 meters attached to the wall right outside on the

ground (first) floor. So in the first floor bedroom there is some of that signal

(i was using a cheap emf meter; but it picked up about 7-9 milligauss inside

there). On the second floor that must be significantly lower but now that i am

aware of this atleast i will not put my bed near that wall for sure.

BTW how bad are these smart meters? would appreciate any links.

thanks!

-gariki

>

> Hi Bill and Gariki,

>

> <Unfortunately probably 90% of electricians don't understand the

> problem.>

>

> So true. I could have gone to school and learned wiring myself and rewired

our house, also, in the time it took to find one who would do it the way I

asked! It was a painful process.

>

> <Shielded wiring is nice, but won't solve the problem.>

>

> We had shielded wiring put in, however, that only works as well as your

ability to keep frequencies out of the house. In some circumstances emfs

penetrate our brick walls. We have particular problems with emfs penetrating

during a 3 hour window on Sunday mornings. When this happens, those frequencies

radiate around the house due to the metal shielded wiring itself. So, I would

definitely not put metal wiring in in the future, seeing smart meters and

possible satellite transmissions coming down the pike.

>

> <I suspect there was a similar " net current " probably at

> your water heaters too... >

>

> Gariki, I don't remember all the particulars of your original post, however, I