RE: Re: Supplements (was SuperSize web site)

[Guest guest]

FWIW, I have been taking various vitamins and supplements for many years. Over

time, I've added to the list when I've seen evidence to support the value of the

additional item. Most recently, I began taking Melatonin before bed each night.

It appears to have had a positive effect on my sleep.

For the record, my daily intake:

B-Complex

Zinc

Selenium

Beta-Carotene

Vitamin E

Bee Pollen

Aspirin (regular)

Vitamin C

Gingko Biloba

Melatonin

While I eat a healthy, balanced diet and am confident that I get lots of my

nutritional needs the " natural " way, my feeling is that supplements make sure I

am getting them and, if too much, the excess is excreted.

Mark

I started out taking several supplements. Then I stopped (believing that

getting my nutrients from food was best).

I'm now taking: baby aspirin, Vit D, selenium and melatonin.

on 5/26/2004 8:27 AM, apricot85 at apricot85@... wrote:

> I'm a fan of supplements & vitamins. I support them as much as Walford

> did. But as you know, the foods provide many nutrients and

> interactions not yet identified. Al's post on calcium provides one

> study showing the benefit of calcium from dairy over supplements. IMO,

> the biggest negative about the a big mac diet is the fats... damaged,

> trans & no omega 3's. No one has yet identified any safe amount of

> trans fat.

>

> jwwright wrote:

>

>> Not that I disagree. but what would be left out if he also took a

>> vitamin pill - known stuff please, not guesses.

>> Regards.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

I take aspirin, vit D, an MV mostly for selenium, etc not in foods, and l-carnitine. l-carnitine is the only supp I could actually see a good result - in weight loss and BP. Almost everything else I've tried raises BP, or in the case of vit C mouth sores.

There is a lot of stuff in fruits and veggies, actually too much stuff to even begin to analyze. Some of it causes allergies, some like papaya are good for the digestive tract.

My biggest problem with supps, is that someone tries to establish an "RDA" and that means it will likely be at least 3 times what I need, based on how they calc it. Data on side effects of excess of a supp is rare.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: Francesca Skelton

Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2004 7:39 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: Supplements (was SuperSize web site)

I started out taking several supplements. Then I stopped (believing thatgetting my nutrients from food was best).I'm now taking: baby aspirin, Vit D, selenium and melatonin.on 5/26/2004 8:27 AM, apricot85 at apricot85@... wrote:> I'm a fan of supplements & vitamins. I support them as much as Walford> did. But as you know, the foods provide many nutrients and> interactions not yet identified. Al's post on calcium provides one> study showing the benefit of calcium from dairy over supplements. IMO,> the biggest negative about the a big mac diet is the fats... damaged,> trans & no omega 3's. No one has yet identified any safe amount of> trans fat. > > jwwright wrote:> >> Not that I disagree. but what would be left out if he also took a>> vitamin pill - known stuff please, not guesses.>> Regards.

[Guest guest]

This brings up the question of nurtient timing? When to take what - not just the

micro-nutrients but the macro one's as well?

I take my 500 mg Vit C after my cardio with a juice and soy protein shake.

The link:

http://www.nutraingredients-usa.com/news/news-NG.asp?id=52353

The article:

Vitamins enhance benefits of exercise for heart

- 5/25/2004 - Taking vitamin supplements appears to have a synergistic effect on

the benefits of exercise for heart health, according to new research on mice.

The combination of the nutrients and exercise significantly reduces the risk of

atherosclerosis by boosting the body's production of nitric oxide, which

protects against a variety of cardiovascular disorders, report researchers led

by medicine nobel laureate Louis Ignarro from UCLA.

Ignarro’s team found that moderate exercise reduced the development of

atherosclerosis, or hardening of the arteries, in mice that are genetically

prone to heart disease. Exercise alone has been shown to increase nitric oxide

in the body.

But adding the amino acid L-arginine and the antioxidants vitamins C and E to

the mix significantly magnified the effect, said Ignarro, who shared the 1998

Nobel Prize for his discoveries in the role that nitric oxide plays in the

cardiovascular system.

" This is the first study that shows that if you exercise in addition to taking

dietary supplements you have a markedly enhanced production of nitric oxide — in

science, we like to call it a synergistic effect, " said Ignarro.

The researcher, along with others from the University of Naples in Italy and the

Mayo Clinic Foundation, studied six groups of eight-week-old LDL

receptor-deficient male mice with high cholesterol over 18 weeks. The mice were

randomly divided into three dietary groups: one fed a high-cholesterol diet

alone, another fed a high-cholesterol diet along with the antioxidant vitamins C

and E, and a third fed a high-cholesterol diet and given both the antioxidants

and L-arginine. Some of the mice also were put on a swimming regimen, while

others did not exercise.

The mice from all three dietary groups lost weight and had lower cholesterol

when they exercised. The atherosclerotic lesions were significantly reduced in

the mice whose diets included the antioxidants and amino acid, the researchers

will report in this week’s online edition of the Proceedings of the National

Academy of Sciences.

They explain that exercise increases the amount of endothelial NO synthase, an

enzyme that converts L-arginine to nitric oxide, which in turn lowers abnormally

elevated blood pressure, prevents unwanted blood clotting and early inflammation

associated with coronary artery disease, and protects against stroke and

myocardial infarction.

The antioxidant vitamins C and E work together to remove destructive oxidants

from the blood stream, thereby stabilizing the nitric oxide, which can thus rise

to higher levels in the blood stream and produce a more beneficial effect.

Ignarro also noted that the supplements work well even in the absence of

exercise.

Sedentary mice fed with the supplements showed a 40 per cent reduction in

atherosclerosis lesions compared with the mice that were on a regular,

high-cholesterol diet but neither given the supplements nor put on an exercise

regimen. The mice that exercised, but were not fed the supplements, showed a 35

per cent reduction in the lesions.

The researcher concluded that simple lifestyle changes - doing moderate

exercise, eating a low-fat diet and taking dietary supplements - can make a

difference to vascular health. " It works in mice, it'll work in humans. "

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[Guest guest]

Rodney ~

Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I have not, in fact, had my calcium

level tested. My wife has osteoporosis, and deals with it in a number of ways. I

have blissfully assumed that it is not an issue for me, as a younger male.

Do you have information, or can you point me to a source for such information,

about healthy calcium levels for men of various ages (I am 52).

Thanks,

Mark

Hi Mark:

I see calcium is not on your list. Have you measured your nutrient

intakes, and are you sure you are not calcium-deficient also?

Fitday told me I was 50% deficient in Ca and Zn, fwiw. (My only two

deficiencies).

Rodney.

> FWIW, I have been taking various vitamins and supplements for many

years. Over time, I've added to the list when I've seen evidence to

support the value of the additional item. Most recently, I began

taking Melatonin before bed each night. It appears to have had a

positive effect on my sleep.

>

> For the record, my daily intake:

>

> B-Complex

> Zinc

> Selenium

> Beta-Carotene

> Vitamin E

> Bee Pollen

> Aspirin (regular)

> Vitamin C

> Gingko Biloba

> Melatonin

>

> While I eat a healthy, balanced diet and am confident that I get

lots of my nutritional needs the " natural " way, my feeling is that

supplements make sure I am getting them and, if too much, the excess

is excreted.

>

> Mark

[Guest guest]

Rodney ~

Unlike you, I regularly consume dairy products. My usual lunch is a container of

yogurt (low fat) with two portions of fruit. In addition, cheese is high on my

list of favorite food weaknesses. A slice of stilton with a glass of port is a

nightcap that I enjoy often.

Should I feel more sanguine about my calcium intake?

Mark

Hi Mark:

All I can tell you is that for a month I entered everything I ate

into Fitday and was astonished when it informed me that I was

consuming about half the calcium RDA. In part no doubt that is

because I do not eat much in the way of milk products. Although

other credible sources have told me that the proteins in milk tend to

militate against bone maintenance.

I now take a 500 mg calcium supplement (calcium carbonate) daily that

also contains 125 IU of vitamin D. I calculated that this should

make up the difference. I also read that calcium carbonate is well

absorbed.

Rodney.

> Rodney ~

>

> Thank you for bringing this to my attention. I have not, in fact,

had my calcium level tested. My wife has osteoporosis, and deals with

it in a number of ways. I have blissfully assumed that it is not an

issue for me, as a younger male.

>

> Do you have information, or can you point me to a source for such

information, about healthy calcium levels for men of various ages (I

am 52).

>

> Thanks,

>

> Mark

[Guest guest]

If you are adding ALC, you should also include lipoic acid. There is some

debate regarding the " best " form of lipoic acid R(+) enantiomer vs. racemic,

but it appears most " authorities " on the subject prefer the R(+) enantiomer.

If you include lipoic acid, you should also include biotin.......and so on!

>From: " Rodney " <perspect1111@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Supplements (was SuperSize web site)

>Date: Wed, 26 May 2004 19:29:45 -0000

>

>Hi folks:

>

>Well, although I can't imagine anyone would be interested to know

>what supplements I am curently taking, here is the list fwiw.

>

>Weekly:

>

>Folic acid

>Vitamin C

>Vitamin E

>Beta carotene

>Zinc

>Chromium

>Lycopene

>Aspirin

>Multi-vitamin

>

>Daily:

>

>Calcium with vitamin D

>

>In addition to the above I am thinking about adding acetyl-L-

>carnitine, weekly.

>

>Any input (up to and including ridicule) will be welcome : ^ )))

>

>Rodney.

>

>

> > FWIW, I have been taking various vitamins and supplements for many

>years. Over time, I've added to the list when I've seen evidence to

>support the value of the additional item. Most recently, I began

>taking Melatonin before bed each night. It appears to have had a

>positive effect on my sleep.

> >

> > For the record, my daily intake:

> >

> > B-Complex

> > Zinc

> > Selenium

> > Beta-Carotene

> > Vitamin E

> > Bee Pollen

> > Aspirin (regular)

> > Vitamin C

> > Gingko Biloba

> > Melatonin

> >

> > While I eat a healthy, balanced diet and am confident that I get

>lots of my nutritional needs the " natural " way, my feeling is that

>supplements make sure I am getting them and, if too much, the excess

>is excreted.

> >

> > Mark

>