Re: Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and Baldness

[Guest guest]

Equol is a metabolite of daidzen, a major isoflavone in soy. It's probably

present in fair quantity in most soy products:

" In addition to whole soybeans, foods derived from soy include tofu, tempeh,

soymilk, textured and hydrolyzed vegetable protein, meat substitutes, soy

flour, miso, and soy sauce. Soy is also available as a supplement, as soy

protein or isoflavone in powder, capsule, or tablet form. High levels of

soy-based isoflavones are in roasted soy nuts, tofu, tempeh, soymilk, and

some soy protein isolates. "

Also, note green tea and soy synergy:

Asian Pac J Cancer Prev. 2003 Aug-Dec;4(4):297-301. Related Articles, Links

Higher consumption of green tea may enhance equol production.

Miyanaga N, Akaza H, Takashima N, Nagata Y, Sonoda T, Mori M, Naito S, Hirao

Y, Tsukamoto T, Fujioka T.

Department of Urology, Post-graduate University of Tsukuba, Ibaraki,

305-8575, Japan. akazah@...

BACKGROUND: Our previous case-control study revealed that Japanese living in

Japan and Koreans living in Korea can be divided into equol producers who

have an ability to metabolize daidzein to equol and non-producers, and that

the incidence of prostate cancer is higher in the latter group. In the

present study, we examined relationships between type of food intake and the

capacity for equol production in Japanese subjects. METHODS: The subjects

were the individuals analyzed for the ability to produce equol in our

previous study and newly registered cases. From December 2000 to December

2002, 276 hospitalized patients were interviewed face-to-face and blood

samples were collected before breakfast. These included 122 patients with

prostate cancer and 154 age-matched controls. RESULTS: The frequency of

equol producers (0.5 ng/ml or more) among cases and controls was 29% and

45%, respectively (p = 0.004). The consumption of soybeans and green tea

were significantly higher in equol producers than in the non-producers

(p<0.05). By contrast, the consumption of selenium and fiber was

significantly lower in equol producers (p<0.05). CONCLUSIONS: Our results

suggest that higher consumption of soybean and green tea are strongly

related to the establishment of a capacity for equol production.

PMID: 14728586 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

>From: " Rodney " <perspect1111@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and Baldness

>Date: Sun, 18 Jul 2004 13:28:09 -0000

>

>Hi :

>

>It may, possibly, matter which part(s) of the bean you eat, and which

>parts you avoid. Do we know whether equol comes accompanied by the

>fat, or by the protein?

>

>Rodney.

>

>

> > According to this study equol prevents the hormone

> > dihydrotestosterone from stimulating prostate growth and causing

> > baldness. If this is true real men are going to start eating soy by

> > the scoopfuls (if they don't already). I fearlessly eat it

> > because it was generally recognized as safe by the Okinawins.

> >

> >

> >

> > http://www.biolreprod.org/cgi/content/abstract/70/4/1188

> >

> > Equol Is a Novel Anti-Androgen that Inhibits Prostate Growth and

> > Hormone Feedback1

> > Trent D. Lund2,3, J. Munson3, E. Haldy3, D.R.

> > Setchell4, Edwin D. Lephart5 and J. Handa3

> > Department of Biomedical Sciences,3 Colorado State University, Fort

> > , Colorado 80524 Clinical Mass Spectrometry,4 Children's

> > Hospital Medical Center, Cincinnati, Ohio 45229 The Neuroscience

> > Center and Department of Physiology and Developmental Biology,5

> > Brigham Young University, Provo, Utah 84602

> > Equol (7-hydroxy-3[4'hydroxyphenyl]-chroman) is the major

>metabolite

> > of the phytoestrogen daidzein, one of the main isoflavones found

> > abundantly in soybeans and soy foods. Equol may be an important

> > biologically active molecule based on recent studies demonstrating

> > that equol can modulate reproductive function. In this study, we

> > examined the effects of equol on prostate growth and LH secretion

> > and determined some of the mechanisms by which it might act.

> > Administration of equol to intact male rats for 4–7 days reduced

> > ventral prostate and epididymal weight and increased circulating LH

> > levels. Using binding assays, we determined that equol specifically

> > binds 5 -dihydrotestosterone (DHT), but not testosterone,

> > dehydroepiandrosterone, or estrogen with high affinity. Equol does

> > not bind the prostatic androgen receptor, and has a modest affinity

> > for recombinant estrogen receptor (ER) ß, and no affinity for ER .

> > In castrated male rats treated with DHT, concomitant treatment with

> > equol blocked DHT's trophic effects on the ventral prostate gland

> > growth and inhibitory feedback effects on plasma LH levels without

> > changes in circulating DHT. Therefore, equol can bind circulating

> > DHT and sequester it from the androgen receptor, thus altering

> > growth and physiological hormone responses that are regulated by

> > androgens. These data suggest a novel model to explain equol's

> > biological properties. The significance of equol's ability to

> > specifically bind and sequester DHT from the androgen receptor have

> > important ramifications in health and disease and may indicate a

> > broad and important usage for equol in the treatment of androgen-

> > mediated pathologies.

> > 1 Supported in part by NIH grants AA12693 and NS39951 (R.J.H.) and

> > USDA grant 2002-00798 (E.D.L.).

> > 2 Correspondence: Trent D. Lund, Department of Biomedical Science,

> > Colorado State University, Anatomy W103, 1617 Campus Delivery, Ft.

> > , CO 80523-1670. FAX: 970 491 7907; tlund@c...

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Alan,

Looking at this logically, PCa is about 4th, right? and American men don't eat that much tofu. But there are other foods with daidzein in lesser amounts. So all that sounds like it wouldn't make much diff if they were equol producers or not, right? If we don't make equol, we'd need a pill. If we do make it we'd need to eat soy, (I think textured vegetable protein (TVP) is fat free).

The next question is how much do we eat? Do you think 1 oz of soy protein isolate (SPI) /day is enough (soy protein isolate), if our relatives don't have PCa?

An oz of SPI contains 17 mg daidzein, 30 mg genistein, 3 glycitein, and provides 25.4 grams Protein.

The next thing that comes to mind is that BPH can be controlled (PROSCAR) by manipulating the hormones, so eating SPI should help shrink the prostate as well, right? Not a lot of info on BPH.

Using SPI in place of whey is something I could test.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: old542000

Sent: Sunday, July 18, 2004 11:47 AM

Subject: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and Baldness

An excellent find, Rodney, and hi All,But, more than that, see the below which seems to say that us North Americans have the deck stacked against us.Cheers, Al Pater.Jpn J Clin Oncol. 2004 Feb;34(2):86-9. Comparisons of percent equol producers between prostate cancer patients and controls: case-controlled studies of isoflavones in Japanese, Korean and American residents.BACKGROUND: Our previous case-control study revealed that the Japanese residents in Japan could be divided into those who are able to degrade daidzein, a soybean isoflavone, to equol and those without this ability, and that the incidence of prostate cancer is higher in the latter group. METHODS: We .... The incidence of prostate cancer in Korean residents is known to be close to that of Japanese residents in Japan. On the other hand, American residents in the United States have a markedly higher incidence of prostate cancer as compared to Japanese residents in Japan. RESULTS: The number of subjects was 295 in Japan (133 patients and 162 controls), 122 in Korea (61 patients and 61 controls) and 45 in the United States (24 patients and 21 controls). The percentage of equol producers among patients and controls was 29% and 46% in Japan (P = 0.004) and 30% and 59% in Korea (P = 0.001), respectively. The active isoflavone level was markedly lower and the percentage of equol producers was also lower (17% for patients and 14% for controls) for Americans as compared to the Japanese and Koreans. CONCLUSIONS: These results suggest that the ability of producing equol or equol itself is closely related to the lower incidence of prostate cancer. The results also suggest that a diet based on soybean isoflavones will be useful in preventing prostate cancer.PMID: 15067102 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE] > Equol is a metabolite of daidzen, a major isoflavone in soy. It's probably > present in fair quantity in most soy products:>

[Guest guest]

Urinary

isoflavone kinetics: the effect of age, gender, food matrix and

chemical composition.

This study (April '04) used 0.44 mg isoflavones/kg body

weight.

Conclusion:

Together these data suggest that

the fractional absorption of genistein is potentially different in men

and women and is influenced by the food matrix and chemical

composition. Furthermore, the data suggest that the metabolism of

daidzein may be altered by the chemical composition of the isoflavones

ingested. Further studies are required to examine the effect

of higher intake and define the relative influence of these factors in

elderly population groups (my emphasis).

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15035683

http://snipurl.com/7v8x

-------- Original Message

--------Subject: Re: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and

BaldnessFrom: "jwwright" jwwright@...

So all that sounds like it wouldn't make

much diff if they were equol producers or not, right? If we don't make

equol, we'd need a pill. If we do make it we'd need to eat soy,

The next question is how much do we eat?

Regards.

[Guest guest]

Thanks, ,

That means about 1 oz of SPI (I guess it's really a concentrate because it's about 98% protein), for a 135 # person. For 110 kcals.

I can do that. (until I forget to do it (ha)).

I've used SPI© in the past to get enough Pro with a veggie diet. May be a good trade off with milk for a while. I can see if it effects the BPH or PSA.

I know nothing else with claimed effects has changed anything so far. The isoflavone pills do nothing.

That's for

----- Original Message -----

From: scott@...

Sent: Monday, July 19, 2004 4:27 PM

Subject: RE: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and Baldness

Urinary isoflavone kinetics: the effect of age, gender, food matrix and chemical composition.

This study (April '04) used 0.44 mg isoflavones/kg body weight.

Conclusion:

Together these data suggest that the fractional absorption of genistein is potentially different in men and women and is influenced by the food matrix and chemical composition. Furthermore, the data suggest that the metabolism of daidzein may be altered by the chemical composition of the isoflavones ingested. Further studies are required to examine the effect of higher intake and define the relative influence of these factors in elderly population groups (my emphasis).

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve & db=pubmed & dopt=Abstract & list_uids=15035683

http://snipurl.com/7v8x

-------- Original Message --------Subject: Re: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and BaldnessFrom: "jwwright" jwwright@...

So all that sounds like it wouldn't make much diff if they were equol producers or not, right? If we don't make equol, we'd need a pill. If we do make it we'd need to eat soy,

The next question is how much do we eat? Regards.

[Guest guest]

That's advanced cancer. A whole nuther domain.

The idea of ANY food interfering with any disease, IMV, is not very realistic. It's just something we can do while we're waiting until the diagnosis and treatment.

MAYBE, they prevent - probably not. We can try.

There are other factors, like Soy is a bean, peanuts is a bean, dried beans is a bean, and those beans make my pressure rise and my muscles/joints inflamed.

Without those I don't need an NSAID.

Maybe a lower amount of soy aids prevention. I think a scoop (oz) is to much.

But I can eat baby limas, beans picked green, black eyed peas with snaps, without problem. And that's where my veggie protein has to come from unless I use milk.

MAYBE low fat is a prevention aid for CAD.

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: old542000

Sent: Monday, July 19, 2004 8:13 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: Soy - Prostate Cancer and Baldness

Hi All,The 20% isoflavone-rich soy protein isolate (SPI) seems inordinately high. PMID: 12518321 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]> Thanks, ,> That means about 1 oz of SPI (I guess it's really a concentrate because it's about 98% protein), for a 135 # person. For 110 kcals. > > I can do that. (until I forget to do it (ha)).> > I've used SPI© in the past to get enough Pro with a veggie diet. May be a good trade off with milk for a while. I can see if it effects the BPH or PSA. > I know nothing else with claimed effects has changed anything so far. The isoflavone pills do nothing.