Ohio's Law Close to being on Books - Re: Took the test

[Guest guest]

Dear All,

I solicited my colleague and friend Fred Shackelford on this topic

today, Tuesday, December 23, 2008 at 8:08 AM via email. Fred has been

in pharmacy longer than I have, one of my mentors! Fred is very busy

at work right now, and had not had a chance to see the recent

dialogue/postings. He gave me his permission to post his response

with his name. I asked for more explanation and he provided this too.

Jeanetta

RE: Re: Re: Ohio's Law Close to being

on Books - Re: Took the test Tuesday, December 23, 2008 9:02 AM

" Jeanetta,

You could turn her in, assuming her boss would listen to you and not

take her side. What I have found is that documentation is very

important. If there is anyone else who can back up your side, or agree

with you that the pharmacist(or tech, sometimes) is consistently a

problem or making errors in judgment, that would also help. Before

turning her in, write down everything that happened, including any

copies of info (without patient's names, of course) to help your case.

You are doing this for patient safety, not revenge. If patient safety

is not an issue, let it go after talking to the person.

Fred "

RE: Re: Re: Ohio's Law Close to being

on Books - Re: Took the test Tuesday, December 23, 2008 9:17 AM

" Dear Fred, Thank you for your input.

It appears you are responding to one of the scenario in which

contunual behavior is a problem. I agree documentation is key.

However I am mostly interested in the other scenario that is not

defined here but rather on the site. I stupidly assumed that you may

be following along, but I forgot you have been busy with jury duty. By

the way who is/was the judge may I ask (tell me after the case since I

am sure it is a public record).

In this case a tech made a heparin incorrectly. She told the

pharmacist who said nothing is wrong. She tells the pharmacist it just

does not seem right. She has no education on how to look things up for

UAD MDD etc. and has little experience as a hospital tech in a state

other than CA or WA or Utah. The pharmacist insists nothing is wrong.

The heparin is issued and it is a lethal dose to a peds pt.

She is fired, he is fired. She takes another retail job, someone

reports her to the retail chain they let her go.

Questions is what would you do differently and or what else could she

do legally?

I address this head on in the last email/post attached at the bottom.

But you may not want to read it and tell me your view first.

But then again perhaps you did respond to both scenarios and I

misunderstood.

Thanks

Jeanetta "

RE: Re: Re: Ohio's Law Close to being

on Books - Re: Took the test Tuesday, December 23, 2008 10:13 AM

" I still think this is a documentation issue, Jeanetta. Assuming there

are more than 2 people working, she needs to get help from the other

people about the pharmacist who insisted that the dose was OK. She can

actually refuse to make the dose, but in order not to be fired, she

would need a very good reason for not doing what her supervisor told

her to do (the pharmacist). The retail chain has no reason to let her

go - she can file a grievance for that. She is in a bad situation

since she has little experience or education - it makes it hard for

her to justify in her mind going to someone higher up to question what

the pharmacist has said. With documentation (writing down everything

that happened), she could justify not getting fired in the first place.

my random thoughts,

Fred "

RE: Re: Re: Ohio's Law Close to being

on Books - Re: Took the test Tuesday, December 23, 2008 1:42 PM

" Great Fred! I understand what you mean about the documentation. I

thought it was for the ongoing retail situation by . Since the

IV is an immediate need product I did not understand the " what else

could she do? " part that you put together.

Can I share this on the site w/o your name or w/your name or would you

like to share it?

Jeanetta "

RE: Re: Re: Ohio's Law Close to being

on Books - Re: Took the test Tuesday, December 23, 2008 2:38 PM

" Go ahead and put my response on the site - you can use my name

Fred "

>

> This is a good question.

>

> As a technician what would you have done in this case?

>

> I brought this up with my class and some of the comments I heard were

>

> Call the patient.

>

> Grab it and destroy it before it got to the patient.

>

> Tell someone higher up.

>

> I have not included my response to these answers as I would like to know

>

> what some of you think the Tech should have done.

>

> Julette Barta CPhT, BSIT, MA Ed.

>

> Pharmacy Instructor

>

> CRY-ROP

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