Re: You can't Believe it! You can't Believe it!

[Guest guest]

Hi Jules --

-- In , " julesblucky " <julesblucky@y...> wrote:

> I'm glad to read the last couple posts as this is very similar to my

> experience. Thought that it MUST be something other than

> mold...chemical maybe...by the way it acted, and I responded, but now

> I know it must be the mycotoxins (stachy, asper, ...) that I'm

> reacting to. The real estate industry doesn't take any of this

> seriously nor do most of my friends and family! I believe they think

> I'm being emotionally hypersensitive, and haven't really even offered

> to help me. (

Man, does this sound familiar -- sorry!

>

> House, my belongings, dog are all contaminated, and my car, and

> mother's house are all cross-contaminated. Unfortunately, she's

> immunosuppressed from a heart transplant so I will have to have her

> house remediated. I've tried to clean many times but it doesn't seem

> to be working and now the stuff seems to be airborne. She says she

> doesn't feel it but I can hear her sniffling and coughing and I think

> she's reacting but isn't yet as sensitive as I am.

Hmmm ... I've had good luck being able to wash clothing, and myself. I would

think your dog would be cleanable too!

Sometimes I wonder if being immunosuppressed is not a positive condition as

relates to this, as there seems to be conncensus that basic allergic

reaction is the foundation for the release of toxins from spores.

>

> Seems that I brought a few toxic spores to my mother's house

> initially which were very obviously isolated at first (futon

> mattress, couch, wooden desk/computer, bathroom) but eventually they

> seemed to release their toxins and began filling the air. Feels like

> breathing dust or pepper and I have the burning feeling in my mouth.

> I moved the upholstered furniture out of the house once I realized it

> was contaminated but think it was too late. Does this sound correct

> or similar to what you all have experienced? Does it have something

> to do with Stachy multiplying quicker than other mold spores?

I feel that I made a major cross-contamination mistake by allowing my girlfriend

to borrow my vacuum -- think of the concentrating and dispersion

potential here without HEPA rated filtration!

Unless you have a humid or otherwise conducive environment for mold growth, I

wouldn't assume that you have reproduction happening. I feel that

what I experienced was gradually building reactivity to the residually

contaminated and cross-contaminated items in my home. I moved four times

before I figured it out -- each of the following houses I was in were almost

certainly not subject to active growth.

My overall reactivity seems to have advanced strongly after I finally was able

to detox following 10 days out of contaminated environments. Have

you detoxed yet?

>

> I'm sad that I'm having to face this situation, and sad that I don't

> have much support financial or otherwise. I have filed for

> mediation/arbitration with the seller of the property and her agent

> as they covered up the water damage/mold problem, but it will take

> months and I need to try to get my life back to " normal " asap. Not

> currently working (which is probably a good thing) and my

> unemployment runs out in a couple weeks...ought to be interesting.

Again, sounds familiar.....

>

> I've decided it's probably not a good idea for me to hire someone to

> remediate my house as I will never be able to live there and I doubt

> they can remediate the house or my belongings anyway, and I don't

> like the idea of future liability if I sell the house " remediated " ,

> even with full disclosure. I will probably sell the house to a

> contractor for a large financial loss.

Your homeowners insurance " should " cover this -- but the trick is to have them

admit there's a problem.

>

> I've also decided to move all of my stuff into storage and am not

> going to bother trying to clean it first since I can't clean

> everything (non-porous perhaps, but porous not and it will share the

> same space). Do the toxins eventually die down in everything?

> Books, clothing, linens, wood?

If in doubt, toss it -- finished wood might be remediable, but everything else

is not worth the hassle, probably. Clothing seems to be washable.

When I had my last episode after moving things into storage, I swore I would be

willing to lose it all.

>

> A friend has offered to let me stay at their house but I'm afraid of

> cross-contamination after what I've done to my mother's home.

> Thinking once I move everything into storage and am done dealing with

> my stuff, I'll stay at a series of motels without bringing anything

> with me, as I've read to do on this board. But that doesn't address

> the contaminated car issue.

Depends on level of contamination?-- but I think that wiping down al plastic

surfaces is probably effective. Then a high-powered vaccum in the

upholstery, but THIS HAS TO BE HEPA RATED -- otherwise, the exhaust will just

recontaminate everything, right?. Then shampoo?

COMMERCIAL VACUUMS AT THE CAR WASH have given me huge exposures -- blinding

headaches the next day. Think of how many crossed

environments a commercial unit gets exposed to!

How do you know when you're clean, or

> safe to stay with friends and family? Can I potentially contaminate

> friends houses and cars before I have gotten clean?

In my experience, if I have fresly laundered clothes, I don't seem to be

recontaminating my new car, despite being in environments that I am

moderately reactive to. However, I am going to institute policy of cleaning it

more often.

>

> Isn't there any agency that offers support out there? What a mess!

> This experience is very similar to what I went through when my mother

> had her heart failure/transplant as there wasn't much info available,

> it happened very fast and sudden, it was emotionally draining,

> everyone thought I was being emotionally hypersensitive, and I ended

> up connecting with others in the same situation through a message

> board, which saved both of our lives! Hooray for community!!!

I feel the same -- I would be out of my mind without knowing the experiences of

others. Thanks.

The community at Mold-Help.org has also been very helpful -- the moderators

there have deep personal and technical experience, in addition to

being committed activists.

[Guest guest]

I sure hate to hear about people throwing all their stuff away.

Who is to say that some effective means of neutralizing the toxins

might not be developed like the TAML activators?

But even without cleaning of any kind - possessions that used to

knock me flat are now safe.

The toxins DID lose their potency over time.

I decided to say " dry " storage because I've seen people put their

stuff in those cheap leaky metal sheds and in damp basements and this

type of storage provided the mold with enough water to keep growing.

Their stuff is still untouchable.

It must be DRY storage.

I'm not trying to claim that my experience or my flavor of Stachy

speaks for all - Some is more toxic than others - but what is the

pain of paying for storage compared to the loss of treasured

possessions?

Why not store it.

Try to reclaim an item or two from time to time and see how you feel.

(Might be a good idea to wear a respirator and decontaminate after

visiting your stuff)

You might be happy to have your possessions back someday and it gives

the appearance of being less crazy to store things than to throw

virtually all your stuff away.

-

[Guest guest]

I sure hate to hear about people throwing all their stuff away.

Who is to say that some effective means of neutralizing the toxins

might not be developed like the TAML activators?

But even without cleaning of any kind - possessions that used to

knock me flat are now safe.

The toxins DID lose their potency over time.

I decided to say " dry " storage because I've seen people put their

stuff in those cheap leaky metal sheds and in damp basements and this

type of storage provided the mold with enough water to keep growing.

Their stuff is still untouchable.

It must be DRY storage.

I'm not trying to claim that my experience or my flavor of Stachy

speaks for all - Some is more toxic than others - but what is the

pain of paying for storage compared to the loss of treasured

possessions?

Why not store it.

Try to reclaim an item or two from time to time and see how you feel.

(Might be a good idea to wear a respirator and decontaminate after

visiting your stuff)

You might be happy to have your possessions back someday and it gives

the appearance of being less crazy to store things than to throw

virtually all your stuff away.

-

[Guest guest]

---

> I sure hate to hear about people throwing all their stuff away.

> Who is to say that some effective means of neutralizing the toxins

> might not be developed like the TAML activators?

Hmmm?

> But even without cleaning of any kind - possessions that used to

> knock me flat are now safe.

> The toxins DID lose their potency over time.

Interesting -- I'm betting this was a function of sustained heat. These are

organic molecules, after all -- despite having somewhat alien properties.

> I decided to say " dry " storage because I've seen people put their

> stuff in those cheap leaky metal sheds and in damp basements and this

> type of storage provided the mold with enough water to keep growing.

> Their stuff is still untouchable.

> It must be DRY storage.

Sounds reasonable -- and it worked for you.

> I'm not trying to claim that my experience or my flavor of Stachy

> speaks for all - Some is more toxic than others - but what is the

> pain of paying for storage compared to the loss of treasured

> possessions?

> Why not store it.

If the item can tolerate that kind of environment for extended periods. I just

took a $3k vintage acoustic guitar to a consignment shop. I don't trust

it, and can't play it without any anxiety -- perhaps some non-reactive person

will enjoy it. I don't think that concetrated Ozone would do much for

the finish on that instrument....

> Try to reclaim an item or two from time to time and see how you feel.

> (Might be a good idea to wear a respirator and decontaminate after

> visiting your stuff)

Definitely! Though I ran into the owner of my storage facility in January while

wearing a respirator and tyvek Bunny suit.

He had some questions concerning weapons of mass destruction. Not joking.

> You might be happy to have your possessions back someday and it gives

> the appearance of being less crazy to store things than to throw

> virtually all your stuff away.

This is of as much value as anything -- but then again, those that are critical

of this will argue that there was never a problem in the first place.

Danged if you do, danged if you don't?

[Guest guest]

---

> I sure hate to hear about people throwing all their stuff away.

> Who is to say that some effective means of neutralizing the toxins

> might not be developed like the TAML activators?

Hmmm?

> But even without cleaning of any kind - possessions that used to

> knock me flat are now safe.

> The toxins DID lose their potency over time.

Interesting -- I'm betting this was a function of sustained heat. These are

organic molecules, after all -- despite having somewhat alien properties.

> I decided to say " dry " storage because I've seen people put their

> stuff in those cheap leaky metal sheds and in damp basements and this

> type of storage provided the mold with enough water to keep growing.

> Their stuff is still untouchable.

> It must be DRY storage.

Sounds reasonable -- and it worked for you.

> I'm not trying to claim that my experience or my flavor of Stachy

> speaks for all - Some is more toxic than others - but what is the

> pain of paying for storage compared to the loss of treasured

> possessions?

> Why not store it.

If the item can tolerate that kind of environment for extended periods. I just

took a $3k vintage acoustic guitar to a consignment shop. I don't trust

it, and can't play it without any anxiety -- perhaps some non-reactive person

will enjoy it. I don't think that concetrated Ozone would do much for

the finish on that instrument....

> Try to reclaim an item or two from time to time and see how you feel.

> (Might be a good idea to wear a respirator and decontaminate after

> visiting your stuff)

Definitely! Though I ran into the owner of my storage facility in January while

wearing a respirator and tyvek Bunny suit.

He had some questions concerning weapons of mass destruction. Not joking.

> You might be happy to have your possessions back someday and it gives

> the appearance of being less crazy to store things than to throw

> virtually all your stuff away.

This is of as much value as anything -- but then again, those that are critical

of this will argue that there was never a problem in the first place.

Danged if you do, danged if you don't?