Re: Normalizing EtG

[Guest guest]

Here's the seminal study with link.

Basically EtG is exponentially but directly proportional to Creatinine.

So "standardization" can mathematically cause a false positive

if creatinine is very dilute say 10 and standardized to 100

EtG of 99ng/ml real value would become 990ng/ml false positive.

I would let sleeping dogs lie only bring it up if it was a source of my

false positive if I ever had one...

Alcohol and Alcoholism

383k - Adobe PDF - View as HTML

EtG was determined using LC/MS-MS in addition to standard testing. The main outcome measure ... all EtG values on creatinine 100, resulting in calculated UEtG ...alcalc.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/reprint/ agh078v1.pdf

From: Joan <flamin98@...>Subject: Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronide Date: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

The dog's not sleeping. I do the private EtG's to compare to the board's result. Unfortunately, I lose every hand. My lab reported "non-detected" when the board had a result of 1800 and 1500. Yet even standardized, my results of those days would have still been under the cutoff.

So these are the questions:

Is immunoassay that inaccurrate?

Did the fermentation occur in the cup before analysis by NMS? Joan

From: Joan <flamin98 (DOT) com>Subject: Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronideDate: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their

result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

are you testing your #2 split with your private lab Joan?

or a different sample the same day?

do you have your precise creatinine values?

Immunoassay is very accurate would not account for such a difference.

Sitting around EtG up to 72,000ng/ml can be made by E. Coli according to

recent study posted here maybe what happened with the board sample.

Hang in there,r

From: Joan <flamin98 (DOT) com>Subject: Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronideDate: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their

result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

It is the same sample. Pee into one cup, 2 vials for compass, 2 for the private lab. I did discover if the sample is given after 1pm, it doesn't fedex out until the next day. Yes, it sits unrefrigerated for at least 20 hours.

I am already on diflucan 100mg once a week after a loading dose treatment of once a day for 14 days, then every other day for a month.

Recommendations for Ecoli treatment, full course treatment followed by continued prophylaxis?

I think that Lorie and I need to be studied. We seem to have same high frequency of positives.

Any information about IBS treatment with diflucan. I wonder how may of us former opiate dependent are in this group. I also take a probiotic.

Thanx,

Joan

From: Joan <flamin98 (DOT) com>Subject: Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronideDate: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their

result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

time delay with the board sample has to be the answer on that one Joan...

otherwise all 4 samples would test the same.

Maybe hair EtG/EtS by the board lab would make them admit their error.

If you were endogenously producing it would be in all samples.

So it has to be lab error on their part from sitting around.

Would also affect their split too so no help there

regards,

From: Joan <flamin98 (DOT) com>Subject: Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronideDate: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their

result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

Regarding "normalizing" results: I remember this was a big issue for a while (amongst those of us on this site). I believe if you mention "normalizing" to Maximus or a probation monitor, their reaction would probably be "huuuuuh?" I remember that the positive test that got me kicked out in 2004 was an EtG level of 1100. When normalized, the level dropped below the 250 cutoff. I seemed to think this was a pretty significant fact. Nobody else did. Even my attorney snubbed this whole concept. His attitude was that NO level of EtG is acceptable. He said it was splitting hairs.

I also recall discussing "normalization" with the head of one of the labs down in San Diego. He said that the lab cannot provide any manipulation of the numbers to their clients (such as "normalization"). They can only report the raw data. As he put it, "They can buy a $10 calculator and do it themselves...It's an easy formula." The problem is that nobody does it!

-------------- Original message -------------- From: "Joan" <flamin98@...>

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their result?Thanx,Joan

[Guest guest]

I believe the immunoassay test is less sensitive (i.e. higher EtG levels are necessary for detection). In other words, the EtG may have been in the immunoassay samples, but just were not detected. When Skipper first mentioned that they were developing the less-expensive immunoassay test, I believe he mentioned that cutoffs would probably be 1,000+. In other words, it could not reliably pick-up EtG levels below that.

--------- Normalizing EtGEthylglucuronideDate: Wednesday, July 30, 2008, 12:14 AM

I up to post #4700, whew! I want to start by stating my appreciation of all the people that went before me. The information on this site has proved invaluable and I have made more adjustments to my regime. I had been going it alone, doing all my own research. I went into my administrative hearing basically ignorant though I thought I knew so much.I would like to ask a few questions at this point. I have EtG's done privately each time I drop for Compass. The lab is using immunoassay. My results are reported ng/ml. Do these need to be normalized? The lab knows nothing about the formula. The lab results, though negative by the BRN cutoff, are never adjusted for the creatinine. I can get the creatinine, as they are always done when the EtG's are done. Does the lab need to build this formula into their result?Thanx,Joan