Re: Patty another question, too

[Guest guest]

I forgot to say why I was asking. It seems like I feel worse when I take a green supplement. I took the freeze dried wheat grass for a few days prior to explant and I felt awful then a few days after I stopped I developed what I thought was a cold and then the past couple of days I tried Perfect Food which is a green superfood and I felt worse after taking it and I didn't know if it was disagreeing with me or if I was having detox effects. Thats when I remembered there was something about cytokines , I really dont even know what they are but I remember an issue with them. What exactly are cytokine levels that are elevated in us ? I know I ask a lot of questions but I am knew to all this. Thanks again

Barbara

[Guest guest]

I think it pretty much affects all of us who have been sick from implants. I was told that before I knew I had a thyroid issue, and it is primarily because eating alot of greens apparently raises the cytokine levels, which are already elevated in us. I think it also primarily has to do with juicing greens, because when you juice, you can consume way more pounds of food in juice than you ever could in bulk. So, I would think you don't really want to avoid all greens, as salads are very healthy. But I think it would also be prudent to stick with the kind of vegetables that you know you are not reacting to. (It takes time to be able to determine what you might be reacting to, but eventually it will become clearer.)

You might also want to get 's opinion on this, as I think she had pretty much the same experience, and I think she said she was pretty much stuck with green beans as her green vegetable...., can you clarify this for us?

Patty

----- Original Message -----

From: barbsul2002

Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2003 12:52 PM

Subject: Patty another question

Patty,I remember you saying you avoid greens due to cytokines, is that something that affects all of us who had implants or only if theres a thyroid issue? Barbara

[Guest guest]

Patty, I totally agree with all that you said about finding out what makes you sick. It depends on the person. I agree with the juicing theory, that perhaps too much of the green stuff is hard on some of us. With all our cytokine levels. Remember, I was freaking out about all the symptoms I was having while I was juicing about 3 pounds for breakfast for about a month? They made me ill feeling, like I was going to throw up and also have numbess and tingling everywhere. I also experienced headaches. So I backed off juicing everyday, and also the dark green stuff, and juice about twice a week- now with carrots (I dont have insulin issues so I can) celery, regular lettuce, a dab of green leaf lettuce, radishes, cucumbers, and types of squashes. And for antioxidant effects, some blueberries .

But sometimesI wonder Patty(after you got me hooked on the Gerson Therapy) which correlates with Mercola's theories, as well as all other homeopathic approaches that juicing is good for us, esp the greens, and wonder if we are having severe detoxing reactions due to othe juicing. And as bad as it seems, is as good as it is for us . Actually, when I saw Dr Mercola, and Jim (who does the live cells) they told me to go back on it again, as it was detoxing, and take it on for a while. Just go slow, and try to have something on your stomach before consuming it. I am nervous about that, but will keep you posted as I will attempt small amounts next week (I always have to start things on Sun so I am scheduled and remember)

My yeast is all gone, my mycos are much better- Praise the Lord! I still cant believe it. No more stubborn candida. I am waiting for blood work on my thyroid antibodies and c reactive proteins, but I do know from seeing the live cell, my toxins are very bad. Worse now since explant, too much stirred around and released in the bloodstream. I dont know if all the yeast on the screen was covering it up before, but its not good. I guess from all the detoxing I have been doing is getting it out, and that's good, I just need to eliminate ot better. So I am eating more raw friuts and veggies, taking a fiber supplement, and taking in two teaspoons of organic fish oil per day, as well as coconut (as the raw foods break it up, and the oils like coconut, and olive oil, are lubricants for your digestive system to get it out) and defintly staying on the Primal Defense. As it is working.

I guess it is one step at a time, on to new processes. But at least I am movin up.

Barbara, I would hate to tell you that something so good , so beneficial could harm you.It may be good for you. I think Patty would agree, try small amounts with some thing on our stomach, (maybe I was doing too too much) like 1/2 cup per day for at a least a week, and move up slowly. To see if you are senstive to any veggies, like the dark ones, use only one at a time, and keep a journal saying how it made you feel. Then you will know if a certain vegatable is bothering you. Dont do too many veggies at once, use only two or three, so process of elimination is better. And you can add some blueberries, or green apple to it to take away some of the bitter taste as well. And lemon! It is so cleansing for you, and I love the taste. Good luck to you. Let me know if you have any more questions.

>From: "*~Patty~*"

>Reply- >

>Subject: Re: Patty another question, too >Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2003 17:02:32 -0800 > >I think it pretty much affects all of us who have been sick from implants. I was told that before I knew I had a thyroid issue, and it is primarily because eating alot of greens apparently raises the cytokine levels, which are already elevated in us. I think it also primarily has to do with juicing greens, because when you juice, you can consume way more pounds of food in juice than you ever could in bulk. So, I would think you don't really want to avoid all greens, as salads are very healthy. But I think it would also be prudent to stick with the kind of vegetables that you know you are not reacting to. (It takes time to be able to determine what you might be reacting to, but eventually it will become clearer.) > >You might also want to get 's opinion on this, as I think she had pretty much the same experience, and I think she said she was pretty much stuck with green beans as her green vegetable...., can you clarify this for us? >Patty > ----- Original Message ----- > From: barbsul2002 > > Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2003 12:52 PM > Subject: Patty another question > > > Patty, > I remember you saying you avoid greens due to cytokines, is that > something that affects all of us who had implants or only if theres a > thyroid issue? > > Barbara > See when your friends are online with MSN Messenger 6.0. Download it now FREE!

[Guest guest]

Thank you Patty and you both are so knowledgeable and helpful. I am going to slow down with the greens, maybe every few days to see what happens.

Thanks Again,

Barbara

[Guest guest]

Barbara,

Hmmm, well, I cannot really tell you what cytokines are--I am not a medical professional, but I know they have something to do with the immune system and our immune systems are usually already in overdrive with these autoimmune conditions. The best thing I can say is to look it up on the net....here are two definitions.....I don't know if this will help you or not!

All cytokines have certain properties in common. They are all small molecular weight peptides or glycopeptides. Many are produced by multiple cell types such as lymphocytes, monocytes/macrophages, mast cells, eosinophils, even endothelial cells lining blood vessels. Each individual cytokine can have multiple functions depending upon the cell that produces it and the target cell(s) upon which it acts (called pleiotropism). Also, several different cytokines can have the same biologic function (called redundancy). Cytokines can exert their effect through the bloodstream on distant target cells (endocrine), on target cells adjacent to those that produce them (paracrine) or on the same cell that produces the cytokine (autocrine). Physiologically it appears that most cytokines exert their most important effects in a paracrine and/or autocrine fashion. Their major functions appear to involve host defense or maintenance and repair of the blood elements.

Cytokines are a unique family of growth factors. Secreted primarily from leukocytes, cytokines stimulate both the humoral and cellular immune responses, as well as the activation of phagocytic cells. Cytokines that are secreted from lymphocytes are termed lymphokines, whereas those secreted by monocytes or macrophages are termed monokines. A large family of cytokines are produced by various cells of the body. Many of the lymphokines are also known as interleukins (ILs), since they are not only secreted by leukocytes but also able to affect the cellular responses of leukocytes. Specifically, interleukins are growth factors targeted to cells of hematopoietic origin.

----- Original Message -----

From: BARBY4271@...

Sent: Sunday, October 26, 2003 7:39 PM

Subject: Re: Patty another question, too

I forgot to say why I was asking. It seems like I feel worse when I take a green supplement. I took the freeze dried wheat grass for a few days prior to explant and I felt awful then a few days after I stopped I developed what I thought was a cold and then the past couple of days I tried Perfect Food which is a green superfood and I felt worse after taking it and I didn't know if it was disagreeing with me or if I was having detox effects. Thats when I remembered there was something about cytokines , I really dont even know what they are but I remember an issue with them. What exactly are cytokine levels that are elevated in us ? I know I ask a lot of questions but I am knew to all this. Thanks againBarbara

[Guest guest]

Great Barbara! Good luck! julie

----- Original Message -----

From: BARBY4271@...

Sent: Monday, October 27, 2003 9:18 PM

Subject: Re: Patty another question, too

Thank you Patty and you both are so knowledgeable and helpful. I am going to slow down with the greens, maybe every few days to see what happens.Thanks Again,Barbara