thyroid blood test results

[Guest guest]

I was panicking because the endo I saw insisted that I have my

thyroid blood tests taken 4 hours after I had taken 2.5 grains armour

& 50mcg thyroxine. I got the results today & was amazed that the

results are pretty much the same as before which was early morning

(just before 9am) and before taking my daily thyroid, so I need not

have worried. I had thought that thyroid results naturally go up

during the day (I must have read that somewhere) and obviously

expected a high FT4 & particularly high FT3 result having taken my

meds.

The results were: TSH <0.02 (which he is complaining about as

supressed), range 0.34 - 5.6,

FT4 14.86 with range 7.5-21.1 - mid range exactly as I like it & I am

sure that my brain is better with this than lower,

FT3 10.09 with range 3.67-10.43 so towards the top of the range &

again exactly where I like it to be.

Now I just have to convince the GP that this is good for me - I have

printed off several papers saying that supressed TSH is fine

(including BMJ ones) so hopefully he will read at least some of them

and see my point.

Val

[Guest guest]

hiya; my results are similar to yours with my tsh suppressed at 0.06 (0.34-5.50), the lab result page says " tsh suppressed on T4 ?overtreated" i am going to the endo in early july, can you tell me which papers you printed off please just in case i need the ammo ! kind regards jane

Sent from .

A Smarter Email.

[Guest guest]

>> I was panicking because the endo I saw insisted that I have my > thyroid blood tests taken 4 hours after I had taken 2.5 grains armour > & 50mcg thyroxine. I got the results today & was amazed that the > results are pretty much the same as before which was early morning > (just before 9am) and before taking my daily thyroid, so I need not > have worried. I had thought that thyroid results naturally go up > during the day (I must have read that somewhere) and obviously > expected a high FT4 & particularly high FT3 result having taken my > meds.

This is extremely unusual Val, because when you take Armour Thyroid, it has the 'active' hormone(s) T3 and T2, and we know for a fact that the T3 in the blood 'peaks' a couple or so hours after taking it. We advise people NOT to take their thyroid hormone medication on the morning they have their blood tested because blood tests are usually carried out in the morning and fairly early. If you have an appointment for say 10.00a.m. then I would not take your Armour - it does give an incorrect reading, and quite often, because of the high T3 level, a doctor will tell you to that you are going hyper and that you need to cut down your medication.

> The results were: TSH <0.02 (which he is complaining about as > supressed), range 0.34 - 5.6,> FT4 14.86 with range 7.5-21.1 - mid range exactly as I like it & I am > sure that my brain is better with this than lower,> FT3 10.09 with range 3.67-10.43 so towards the top of the range & > again exactly where I like it to be. > > Now I just have to convince the GP that this is good for me - I have > printed off several papers saying that supressed TSH is fine > (including BMJ ones) so hopefully he will read at least some of them > and see my point.

Hope you manage to 'educate' your GP. It is crazy how they believe that thyroid function tests should be exactly the same for people taking the inactive levothyroxine as the tests when people are taking ALL the thyroid hormones. Let us know how you get on.

Luv - Sheila> > Val>

[Guest guest]

This is extremely unusual Val, because when you take Armour Thyroid, ithas the 'active' hormone(s) T3 and T2, and we know for a fact that theT3 in the blood 'peaks' a couple or so hours after taking it. If you have an appointment for say10.00a.m. then I would not take your Armour - it does give an incorrectreading, and quite often, because of the high T3 level, a doctor willtell you to that you are going hyper and that you need to cut down yourmedication.

V; That is what I was worried about & tried to argue my case with the endo, who would not listen.Hope you manage to 'educate' your GP. Let us know how you get on.

V; Will do. At the best I will be able to get thyroid & hc from him, at the worst...

Val

[Guest guest]

Hi Val

Out of interest what were your TFTs before starting medication.

Chris

>

> I was panicking because the endo I saw insisted that I have my

> thyroid blood tests taken 4 hours after I had taken 2.5 grains

armour

> & 50mcg thyroxine. I got the results today & was amazed that the

> results are pretty much the same as before which was early morning

> (just before 9am) and before taking my daily thyroid, so I need

not

> have worried. I had thought that thyroid results naturally go up

> during the day (I must have read that somewhere) and obviously

> expected a high FT4 & particularly high FT3 result having taken my

> meds.

> The results were: TSH <0.02 (which he is complaining about as

> supressed), range 0.34 - 5.6,

> FT4 14.86 with range 7.5-21.1 - mid range exactly as I like it & I

am

> sure that my brain is better with this than lower,

> FT3 10.09 with range 3.67-10.43 so towards the top of the range &

> again exactly where I like it to be.

>

> Now I just have to convince the GP that this is good for me - I

have

> printed off several papers saying that supressed TSH is fine

> (including BMJ ones) so hopefully he will read at least some of

them

> and see my point.

>

> Val

>

[Guest guest]

Hi

TSH 5.62 range 0.3-5.6, FT3 5 range 0.3-5.6, FT4 11.9 range 10-25.

This was 5 years ago. Why do you ask?

Val

Out of interest what were your TFTs before starting medication.Chris

[Guest guest]

With those results, just out of interest, what amount of meds are you on now?

My highest TSH was 8 something and Im now on 150mcg of Levo

From: valerieforster56 <valerieforster56@...>Subject: Re: thyroid blood test resultsthyroid treatment Date: Sunday, 22 June, 2008, 11:37 AM

Hi

TSH 5.62 range 0.3-5.6, FT3 5 range 0.3-5.6, FT4 11.9 range 10-25.

This was 5 years ago. Why do you ask?

Val

Out of interest what were your TFTs before starting medication.Chris

Sent from .

A Smarter Email.

[Guest guest]

The labs that you use seem to have a wide range for T3? Up to 10??

From: chrischids <no_reply >Subject: Re: thyroid blood test resultsthyroid treatment Date: Sunday, 22 June, 2008, 8:28 AM

Hi ValOut of interest what were your TFTs before starting medication.Chris>> I was panicking because the endo I saw insisted that I have my > thyroid blood tests taken 4 hours after I had taken 2.5 grains armour > & 50mcg thyroxine. I got the results today & was amazed that the > results are pretty much the same as before which was early morning > (just before 9am) and before taking my daily thyroid, so I need not > have worried. I had thought that thyroid results naturally go up > during the day (I must have read that somewhere) and obviously > expected a high FT4 & particularly high FT3 result having taken my > meds.> The results were: TSH

<0.02 (which he is complaining about as > supressed), range 0.34 - 5.6,> FT4 14.86 with range 7.5-21.1 - mid range exactly as I like it & I am > sure that my brain is better with this than lower,> FT3 10.09 with range 3.67-10.43 so towards the top of the range & > again exactly where I like it to be. > > Now I just have to convince the GP that this is good for me - I have > printed off several papers saying that supressed TSH is fine > (including BMJ ones) so hopefully he will read at least some of them > and see my point.> > Val>

Sent from .

A Smarter Email.

[Guest guest]

Hi Val

I am interested to see how the medication changes the results and by

how much. Your FT4 does not seem to have gone up very much, and your

FT3 doubled but still at the top of the range. The major change is

your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much and

what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was

told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no difference

to my FT4 results.

Chris

>

> Hi

> TSH 5.62 range 0.3-5.6, FT3 5 range 0.3-5.6, FT4 11.9 range 10-25.

> This was 5 years ago. Why do you ask?

> Val

>

> Out of interest what were your TFTs before starting medication.

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Chris

Val's FT4 has gone up as expected, and so has her FT3 as expected, and

her TSH is suppressed, as is usual for anybody taking Armour. Using

natural thyroid extract would expect such results , 'cos you are taking

all the thyroid hormones your body requires. Practically everybody

taking Armour at the dosage that makes them well will have a suppressed

TSH.

Sheila

>

> Hi Val

>

> I am interested to see how the medication changes the results and by

> how much. Your FT4 does not seem to have gone up very much, and your

> FT3 doubled but still at the top of the range. The major change is

> your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much and

> what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was

> told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no difference

> to my FT4 results.

>

> Chris

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila

I have not said these results are not to be " expected " .

I am merely interested to know the comparisons.

Chris

>

>

>

> Hi Chris

>

> Val's FT4 has gone up as expected, and so has her FT3 as expected,

and

> her TSH is suppressed, as is usual for anybody taking Armour.

Using

> natural thyroid extract would expect such results , 'cos you are

taking

> all the thyroid hormones your body requires. Practically everybody

> taking Armour at the dosage that makes them well will have a

suppressed

> TSH.

>

> Sheila

> >

> > Hi Val

> >

> > I am interested to see how the medication changes the results

and by

> > how much. Your FT4 does not seem to have gone up very much, and

your

> > FT3 doubled but still at the top of the range. The major change

is

> > your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how

much and

> > what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I

was

> > told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no

difference

> > to my FT4 results.

> >

> > Chris

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Yes but do you know how much T3 is in armour as too much can do more harm than good, it may contain all the thyroid meds in one pill/grain, but do u really know how much you are taking?

From: campaigner77 <sheilaturner@...>Subject: Re: thyroid blood test resultsthyroid treatment Date: Sunday, 22 June, 2008, 7:18 PM

Hi ChrisVal's FT4 has gone up as expected, and so has her FT3 as expected, andher TSH is suppressed, as is usual for anybody taking Armour. Usingnatural thyroid extract would expect such results , 'cos you are takingall the thyroid hormones your body requires. Practically everybodytaking Armour at the dosage that makes them well will have a suppressedTSH.Sheila>> Hi Val>> I am interested to see how the medication changes the results and by> how much. Your FT4 does not seem to have gone up very much, and your> FT3 doubled but still at the top of the range. The major change is> your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much and> what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was> told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no difference> to my FT4 results.>>

Chris>>

Sent from .

A Smarter Email.

[Guest guest]



,

If you take too much T3 (or even T4 for those who convert properly), your body will tell you. You go hyper with all the symptoms of hyper. So whatever the amount is in Armour, if you take too much armour you will go hyper and therefore you will cut back to a lower dose.

Even if you knew precisely how much T3 is in Armour, still how would you know if you are taking too much or not. One size does not fit all. If someone finds 20mcg suits them fine that does not mean that 20 would suit anyone else.

Even those people who take 60mcg T3 have worked they way to that amount slowly, starting with 10mcg - just as you would with armour, start and increase extremely gradually, as it takes time to get into the system.

That being said it does state the equivalent T3 and T4 in each grain. If you look in the files section it might be there. I do not have a bottle in front of me at the moment.

Lilian

Re: thyroid blood test resultsthyroid treatment Date: Sunday, 22 June, 2008, 7:18 PM

Hi ChrisVal's FT4 has gone up as expected, and so has her FT3 as expected, andher TSH is suppressed, as is usual for anybody taking Armour. Usingnatural thyroid extract would expect such results , 'cos you are takingall the thyroid hormones your body requires. Practically everybodytaking Armour at the dosage that makes them well will have a suppressedTSH.Sheila>> Hi Val>> I am interested to see how the medication changes the results and by> how much. Your FT4 does not seem to have gone up very much, and your> FT3 doubled but still at the top of the range. The major change is> your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much and> what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was> told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no difference> to my FT4 results.>> Chris>>

Sent from . A Smarter Email.

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I am taking 50mcg thyroxine, & 2.75 or 3 grains armour (depending on whether I feel I need the extra 1/4 grain).

Val

My highest TSH was 8 something and Im now on 150mcg of Levo

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Different labs use different ranges - this is why you do not look at the numbers (TSH excepted), but look to see where you are within the range. In the past I had FT3 done close together with way different ranges but the position within the range was the same but with way different numbers. Different ranges are generally from different labs, but they can also be the same lab changing their method.

My most recent tests show this:

dec07 FT3 5.7 range 3.9-6.2, jun08 10.09 range 3.7-10.4

dec07 FT4 15.2 range 7.5-21.1, jun08 14.86 range same.

The latter was surprising to me as it was 4 hours after taking 50mcg thyroxine & 2.5 grains armour.

Val

The labs that you use seem to have a wide range for T3? Up to 10??

[Guest guest]

Hi

My TSH does not really change at all. It is always suppressed. I take 50mcg thyroxine because I feel that I feel better with my ft4 in the middle of the range rather than lower & I once read that T4 is needed although not in the same way as T3. Unfortunately I cannot locate where I read this, but I remember it saying something about brain function and that this was less important than the T3 action - it was sort of dismissing this as being not that important in comparison. I took this to mean that I needed more than the 25mcg thyroxine I was taking to help balance the armour & so double this to 50mcg & I think I feel better for it.

I have never been on just thyroxine - I was started on armour & added in the T4 afterwards. I now take 2.75 armour daily with the 50mcg thyroxine.

Taking armour instead of thyroxine will probably lead to low FT4 which may be fine for you. If you do not want this then you also will need to take a little thyroxine.

Val

The major change is your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much and what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no difference to my FT4 results.Chris

[Guest guest]

That is why we have regular blood tests. Mine seem to be quite constant at the moment. It is the FT4 & FT3 I look at.

Val

Yes but do you know how much T3 is in armour as too much can do more harm than good, it may contain all the thyroid meds in one pill/grain, but do u really know how much you are taking?

[Guest guest]

Hi Val

Thanks for your reply.

My TSH is always suppressed too at the same level whatever dose I

take of levothyroxine albeit high doses for my size. Oddly my TSH

was never tested when I was on natural (I say natural because I

cannot say it was Armour as I believe it was bovine manufactured by

I dont know who) even though there was a space for it on the resuts

that bit was not filled in. My T3 uptake then seemed to be the

important estimate which was at the very top of the range every

time, but the FT4 way over the top of the range just the same as it

is now with levo and I was taking 0.1mg twice a day. My T3 is at the

top of the range on levo also.

When I asked the endo about taking Armour to reduce my T4 he did say

it would not reduce it and based on previous tests he is correct but

having bought some myself to try, I went hypo even on 3 1/2 grains

it just did not seem to work for me. I went back on the levo and

felt fine again.

I am unsure whether it was maybe the reduced T4 on taking the Armour

as it is different to what I used to take or whether GP prescribed

Armour is somehow different to what you can buy privately. Any

thoughts?

Chris

>

> Hi

>

> My TSH does not really change at all. It is always suppressed. I

take 50mcg thyroxine because I feel that I feel better with my ft4

in the middle of the range rather than lower & I once read that T4

is needed although not in the same way as T3. Unfortunately I

cannot locate where I read this, but I remember it saying something

about brain function and that this was less important than the T3

action - it was sort of dismissing this as being not that important

in comparison. I took this to mean that I needed more than the

25mcg thyroxine I was taking to help balance the armour & so double

this to 50mcg & I think I feel better for it.

>

> I have never been on just thyroxine - I was started on armour &

added in the T4 afterwards. I now take 2.75 armour daily with the

50mcg thyroxine.

>

> Taking armour instead of thyroxine will probably lead to low FT4

which may be fine for you. If you do not want this then you also

will need to take a little thyroxine.

>

> Val

>

>

> The major change is

> your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much

and

> what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I

was

> told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no

difference

> to my FT4 results.

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

Hi

There is only 1 armour, but there are different other desiccated thyroid drugs, which we may have to consider if the shortage gets worse.

Val

whether GP prescribed Armour is somehow different to what you can buy privately. Any thoughts?Chris

[Guest guest]

Hope you have good luck with your GP Val.

Chris

>

> Hi

>

> There is only 1 armour, but there are different other desiccated

thyroid drugs, which we may have to consider if the shortage gets

worse.

>

> Val

>

> whether GP prescribed

> Armour is somehow different to what you can buy privately. Any

> thoughts?

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Val, Hi

it ws in the article, Hypothyroidism: Sensitive Diagnosis and Optimal

Treatment

of All Types and Grades—A Comprehensive Hypothesis

Based on a Review of the Standard and " Alternative " Literature

and Extensive Clinical Experience

V. Dommisse, MD, MBChB, FRCP©*

where it is discussed that the brain cells require lots of T4 because

it is transported more briskly across the blood-brain barrier,

however the article goes on to state at least twice that because of

this, the brain also requires lots of T3... now either there is a

typo, or it has something to do with the conversion differences

between the brain tissue and say, muscle tissue. I am only guessing

now, but if the brain uses T4 quickly unlike muscle tissue which uses

T3 preferentially, then the brain requires a background stable T3

level because it is quicky using T4. muscle tissue requires a stable

background of T4 for its preferred supply of T3.

I am sure that there is a similar difference in fuel preferences

between blood and brain tissue. The brain actually preferes glucose,

quickly uptaken, whereas muscles actually do better on glycogen,

stored, slowly broken down and used.

Have a look at the article and tell me if you understand it clearer!

Wannette

>

> Hi

>

> My TSH does not really change at all. It is always suppressed. I

take 50mcg thyroxine because I feel that I feel better with my ft4 in

the middle of the range rather than lower & I once read that T4 is

needed although not in the same way as T3. Unfortunately I cannot

locate where I read this, but I remember it saying something about

brain function and that this was less important than the T3 action -

it was sort of dismissing this as being not that important in

comparison. I took this to mean that I needed more than the 25mcg

thyroxine I was taking to help balance the armour & so double this to

50mcg & I think I feel better for it.

>

> I have never been on just thyroxine - I was started on armour &

added in the T4 afterwards. I now take 2.75 armour daily with the

50mcg thyroxine.

>

> Taking armour instead of thyroxine will probably lead to low FT4

which may be fine for you. If you do not want this then you also

will need to take a little thyroxine.

>

> Val

>

>

> The major change is

> your TSH. Have you ever been on just levothyroxine, if so how much

and

> what were your results then. I know I'm nosey, but curious as I was

> told taking armour instead of levothyroxine would make no

difference

> to my FT4 results.

>

> Chris

>

[Guest guest]

THanks, I think it went ok, but have to phone at the end of the week to find out if I can get armour & hc on the NHS.

Val

Hope you have good luck with your GP Val. Chris

[Guest guest]

If you can Val, can you please let me know the area you are in or the PCT area if you know it. Fingers crossed. You can email me privately with this information if you prefer.

Lilian

THanks, I think it went ok, but have to phone at the end of the week to find out if I can get armour & hc on the NHS.