Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 I'm using them sorry, would you like them after I have finished . Luv nne Right, that's it - where are the doll and the needles ...... Love, xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 I cannot understand how someone can get it so wrong and still be practicing - this is dreadful beyond words. JB did do us proud and the fact co-authored a book with Holford (food is better medicine than drugs) makes him aok in my view anyway. Luv nne Most frightening though nne is that he speaks from such a high place..... http://www.shef.ac.uk/medicine/staff/weetman.html Burne did us proud last Tuesday, we just have to keep up the pressure now and make changes happen. Weetman thinks he is god - he isn't. Luv - Sheila Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 I have sent the following to Professor Weetman today and I am putting this on our website so he can see we will not give up. luv - Sheila _______________________________________ Dear Professor Weetman, I have not previously asked the following question, but I would be grateful for a response from you. You stated in your article published in ‘Medscape’ and ‘Journal of Clinical Endocrinology’ “Whose Thyroid Hormone is it Anyway?” – and I quote: "The majority of patients who demand thyroid hormone treatment for multiple symptoms, despite normal thyroid function tests, have functional somatoform disorders..." The hypothyroid patient community finds your statement irresponsible, inaccurate and insulting. As a mark of real concern for hypothyroid sufferers, would you please publish a follow-up article in the same journals giving your reasons for coming to this conclusion, and, at the same time, providing evidence and appropriate references? I feel you have a responsibility to sufferers of thyroid disease, as well as workers in related medical fields, to provide a reliable and irrefutable explanation for your opinion. I noted on Shomon’s About.com/Thyroid Forum http://thyroid.about.com/od/newscontroversies/a/weetman_4.htm that you responded to her articles as follows: Sorry but you have missed at least one crucial point - somatoform disorders are neither hypochondriacal nor psychiatric - I make the point that future research will show that there is basis for these that currently eludes us. Will you give evidence and appropriate references regarding your “one crucial point” suggesting “somatoform disorders are neither hypochondriacal nor psychiatric”. Would you also please explain how you conclude that “future research” will be done to show such a basis, as well as giving me your interpretation of somatoform disorder? Kind regards Sheila www.tpa-uk.org.uk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Interestingly though nne, it wouldnt have been considered a somatoform disorder in say, US, Germany etc but would be considered hypothyroidism - how does weetman respond to that? Im sure he will come up with some other drivvle, possibly that its completely different populations (how so I would like to know when all white americans have ancestry in other countries - such as the UK where the TSH range is higher!!). Gill That is brilliant Sheila, I want to know if I had Somatoform Disorder for all of those years that I felt under par Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date: 21/12/07 13:17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Oh I do hope so - wouldnt it be nice to see him sitting in the chair that Dr Skinner so recently evacuated!! No matter how he responded Gill, I am sure that 99% of the population will soon be able to think as we on the group do, that he talks from a place that he spends a lot of time sitting on!!! Luv nne .. Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date: 21/12/07 13:17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Brilliant mail, Sheila ) Wonder if he will reply ...... Since dear Prof. Weetman states : "The majority of patients who demand thyroid hormone treatment for multiple symptoms, despite normal thyroid function tests, have functional somatoform disorders..." and Wikipedia enlarges: A diagnosis of a somatoform disorder implies that psychological factors are a large contributor to the symptoms' onset, severity and duration. It is important to note that somatoform disorders are not the result of conscious malingering or factitious disorders. There can only be one logical conclusion: The majority of patients (who demand thyroid hormone treatment for multiple symptoms despite normal thyroid function tests) are basket cases !! - Why doesn't this pompous excuse for a doctor call a spade a spade? Oh, sorry... forgot - he's muuuch to educated for plain speech .... Right, that's it - where are the doll and the needles ...... Love, xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 i'VE GOT BOTH THE DOLL AND THE VERY LONG NEEDLE ... Luv - Sheila There can only be one logical conclusion: The majority of patients (who demand thyroid hormone treatment for multiple symptoms despite normal thyroid function tests) are basket cases !! - Why doesn't this pompous excuse for a doctor call a spade a spade? Oh, sorry... forgot - he's muuuch to educated for plain speech .... Right, that's it - where are the doll and the needles ...... Love, xx No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.2/1221 - Release Date: 12/01/2008 14:04 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 And Ive some wax and a box of pins!!! Re: Re: Somatoform Disorder i'VE GOT BOTH THE DOLL AND THE VERY LONG NEEDLE ... Luv - Sheila There can only be one logical conclusion: The majority of patients (who demand thyroid hormone treatment for multiple symptoms despite normal thyroid function tests) are basket cases !! - Why doesn't this pompous excuse for a doctor call a spade a spade? Oh, sorry... forgot - he's muuuch to educated for plain speech .... Right, that's it - where are the doll and the needles ...... Love, xx No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.2/1221 - Release Date: 12/01/2008 14:04 Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.17.6/1192 - Release Date: 21/12/07 13:17 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Very good Sheila. A pity you didn't make the point that nobody can foretell the future. That is not a scientific comment. You too could say that future research will show he is wrong. >>>>I make the point that future research will show <<<< Lilian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 >>>Weetman thinks he is god <<< Ah, that explains how he can see into the future Lilian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 Maybe you have hit the nail on the head there Gill. He might be suffering from something like the narcissistic condition (cannot remember its name). I think Sheila had a list of symptoms of that disorder. I wonder if many of them fit Lilian Of course he might think he can - as a result of a somatoform disorder!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 ***I think Sheila had a list of symptoms of that disorder. I wonder if many of them fit NPD - Narcissistic Personality Disorder ...... - oh, they do fit all right - quoting : Narcissists work hard to distort our reality to make their reality feel safer..... Disordered people aren't just hurtful. They also spin our reality to make theirs less painful. They project their problems onto us, and blame us for what they do. After a while it becomes hard to distinguish what is real from what is being projected and what is being distorted. We begin to doubt our reality and question whether we're the crazy ones. What's more, disordered people hide their problems very effectively, concealing their disease from most people, causing us further confusion..... sound familiar? love, xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2008 Report Share Posted January 12, 2008 “There is a principle which is a bar against all information, which is proof against all arguments and which cannot fail to keep a man in everlasting ignorance—that principle is contempt prior to investigation.” HERBERT SPENCER Another quote which might appertain to certain doctors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 I think will have something to say about this diagnosis. Functional Somatoform disorder should be diagnosed ONLY when all other possible causes for the symptoms have been eliminated. In the case of the symptoms of hypothyroidism still being complained about by patients who have normal thyroid function tests, or they are being treated for hypothyroidism with levothyroxine only, doctors are NOT testing to find out whether the thyroid hormone being secreted by the thyroid gland (which may be normal) is actually getting into the cells. Until such tests are carried out, and it can be shown that the NHS have properly tested to show there is sufficient thyroid hormone in the tissues and cells, they should NEVER give a diagnosis of functional somatoform disorder. Where have I heard his very last suggestion before " Consider antidepressants " - there is evidence that SSRIs can be effective. It seems this is the FIRST thing NHS GP's consider if your thyroid function tests are 'normal' Sheila I saw this posted on an ME forum. It's recent advice given to NHS GPs in how to deal with patients with Somatoform Disorder (you know the one Weetman thinks we all suffer from!!). If your GP starts using any of these tactics on you, you'll know where the conversation is heading..... Managing medically unexplained symptoms 07 Apr 10 Dr Mark on how a psychological model for dealing with somatoform disorder can be used in primary care It can seem burdensome when a patient repeatedly presents with physical symptoms and requests for investigations, despite repeated negative findings and reassurances that the symptoms have no physical basis. Somatisation disorder is a form of this state of affairs where the main features are multiple, recurrent and frequently changing physical symptoms †" as opposed to hypochondriacal disorder where the essential feature is a persistent preoccupation with the possibility of having one or more serious and progressive physical disorders. Dissociative (conversion) disorder is a less common presentation, presumed to be psychogenic in origin, being associated closely in time with traumatic events, insoluble and intolerable problems, or disturbed relationships. There is little evidence-based treatment of conversion disorder. The approach The Extended Reattribution and Management Model was developed for managing somatoform disorders (1) and I have adapted the model to complement my experience as a GP. Make the patient feel heard and understood One of the most important psychological aspects of the programme is to make the patient feel heard and understood †" using the OARS approach. • Open questions †" what, where, how, why... Closed questions lead to the doctor overcontrolling the conversation. Balance open questioning with keeping focused. Such patients typically elaborate greatly on how severe an impact symptoms are having on their lives and often go off topic. • Affirmations †" such as saying: ‘Yes, clearly this has been taking its toll on your relationship, so how does . . .?’ • Reflective listening • Summarising †" such as: ‘If I have understood you correctly, you are saying...’ Working like this will reduce patient resistance to the idea there is nothing seriously wrong and that investigations and treatment are unnecessary. Explore life events, stress and other external factors Ask the patient: • What else is happening in your life in general? • How do you feel about this? • What causes you the most trouble? Ask about depression and anxiety Ask about psychosocial circumstances and relationships at the beginning, otherwise the patient may feel that you are trying to dismiss the symptoms as being ‘all in the mind’ as you cannot find anything else wrong. We need to help our patients accept that we are psychobiological in nature. They have symptoms that are real and have a need to deal with them whatever the cause. Somatisers may actually be biologically different. Research suggests that somatising patients lack a normal filter function, resulting in the patients being unable to ignore irrelevant stimuli. Be clear about the patient’s ideas, concerns and expectations. Remember to ask what the patient thinks might be going on, what they are worried about and what they think should be done and why. Brief, focused physical examination and indicated investigations For example, listening to heart sounds if the patient complains of ‘heart trouble’ †" saying: ‘Nothing in your description makes me think there may be something wrong with your heart, but I would like to listen anyway.’ This reassures the patient that they are being taken seriously and you are being careful and meticulous. Be clear about the diagnosis †" if you have one †" and that there is nothing medically serious or sinister going on. A patient is most likely to accept this if you show that you have an understanding of the condition they are worried about and have discussed the absence of related symptoms and signs. Never tell the patient there is nothing wrong with them. Acknowledge the reality of the symptoms and communicate empathic understanding of the patient’s emotional problems or statements. For example, tell the patient: ‘I can see you are very troubled by your symptoms. Fortunately, for your reassurance, I can tell you that nothing indicates a serious physical disease. Perhaps we could try together to look for other possible explanations for your pain.’ Discuss the limitations of medicine Explain we are unable to diagnose a large number of the problems people bring to the surgery. We can exclude serious pathology. Many of these undiagnosed problems then just get better. When the problem does not completely go away, it is possible to learn to manage them better. Roll with resistance You may find in the more severe cases that there is a long way to go before the patient can begin accepting that there is nothing seriously wrong. Maintain the empathic, firm-but-friendly approach. For instance: ‘I can see you are convinced you have heart trouble but I can find no signs of changes to your heart, which is why we cannot offer surgical or medical treatment that will make the symptoms go away. On the other hand, there are several things you can do to feel better, which would also be the case if you did suffer from an actual heart condition. Would it be okay to take a closer look at these?’ Address the mind-body link Try to explain that tension or mental stress is commonly accompanied by physical symptoms and/or that it may worsen existing physical symptoms. Examples you could use include: • palpitations, breathlessness, and other physical symptoms when frightened or nervous • increased sensitivity to physical symptoms when depressed • tightening of muscles when frightened or stressed. The chronic, entrenched patient It may be helpful to tell the patient: ‘Many people feel like you do. It is in no way a rare condition †" in fact we have a name for it, somatisation.’ Explain that the fundamental cause is unknown, as is also the case for many other illnesses, such as essential hypertension. Assist the patient’s understanding by using well-known examples such as when you think about fleas and lice, you start itching. Furthermore, it could also be mentioned that it can run in the family. Explain to the patient that how they act and react to symptoms is important for their future well-being. The patient must learn how to cope with illness, that is, to function as well as possible in spite of the trouble he or she is experiencing and that it is important not to become physically unfit, which will just make things worse. It is also important for the patient to understand that he or she should not expose him or herself to unnecessary tests or treatments because this may cause harm. Future involvement for the chronic, entrenched • Be proactive not reactive. • Promote continuity; become the named practitioner for the patient and inform other medical colleagues. • Book regular scheduled appointments. You may not want to see them again, but this is an investment as you will see them less and save time in the long run. • Acknowledge symptoms and their impact. • Explore provoking and relieving factors; encourage more elaboration of relieving factors and influences and summarise with emphasis on what is working. • Explore and encourage elaboration of how the patient is coping despite the symptoms. • Consider antidepressants †" there is evidence that SSRIs can be effective. http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=50 & storycode=4125656 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2803 - Release Date: 04/13/10 20:22:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 Hello Sheila, what has J.Burne written and is there a link? I missed this. Thanks, Louise. > > Most frightening though nne is that he speaks from such a high place..... > > http://www.shef.ac.uk/medicine/staff/weetman.html > > I understand also that he is on the editorial staff of every medical journal, so is in a position to decide what research should be published and what should not. He is also head of medical schools - and this is where the teaching of hypothyroidism is so appalling. Burne did us proud last Tuesday, we just have to keep up the pressure now and make changes happen. Weetman thinks he is god - he isn't. > > Luv - Sheila Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 Wow Louise, you are going back some. That was an article (double page spread) that Burne (freelance Medical Writer) wrote in the Daily Mail after Dr Skinner's Fitness to Practice Hearing at the GNC. He really told our story as it is and what we have to put up with and the reason why those failed by the NHS diagnosing and treatment protocol had no choice but to find Doctors such as Dr Skinner to get back their health. There must be a link to that somewhere, but off the top of my head I can't think where it would be. Burne also wrote another article about a year back and interviewed me for about 3 hours one evening - I felt that I had written the article in the end. presented it to the Editor of the Daily Mail who read it and promised to publish it but it never got published - somebody, somewhere put a stop to that. It is practically IMPOSSIBLE to get anything about thyroid published unless it is from famous people who had all the symptoms, went to their doctor, had the thyroid function tests, found to be outside the normal reference range, given the little white pill levothyroxine and lived happily ever after. All their stories have happy endings - unlike those who never get diagnosed because their TFT's are within the normal range, or those who have been diagnosed and cannot convert the inactive T4 to the active thyroid hormone T3. They will now not publish such stories from these folk, because the Royal College of Physicians tells the editors this is not the case, and such patients are suffering from functional somatoform disorder - meaning, its all in their head. Therefore - no story. When Editors ask Weetman to comment, he comments as HEAD OF ALL UK MEDICAL SCHOOLS and DEAN OF SHEFFIELD UNIVERSITY. So - who is the editor to believe, the patient who's symptoms are 'all in their head' or the RCP and AP? Luv - Sheila Hello Sheila, what has J.Burne written and is there a link? I missed this. Thanks, Louise. > > Most frightening though nne is that he speaks from such a high place..... > > http://www.shef.ac.uk/medicine/staff/weetman.html > > I understand also that he is on the editorial staff of every medical journal, so is in a position to decide what research should be published and what should not. He is also head of medical schools - and this is where the teaching of hypothyroidism is so appalling. Burne did us proud last Tuesday, we just have to keep up the pressure now and make changes happen. Weetman thinks he is god - he isn't. > > Luv - Sheila No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2803 - Release Date: 04/13/10 20:22:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 Hello Sheila, I think I remember this now, although I don't think I ever got to read it. I wish there was some way we could get an unbiased story, or several, published in mainstream papers/magazines but I think most of them must have been got at :0( Louise. > > Wow Louise, you are going back some. That was an article (double page > spread) that Burne (freelance Medical Writer) wrote in the Daily Mail > after Dr Skinner's Fitness to Practice Hearing at the GNC. He really told > our story as it is and what we have to put up with and the reason why those > failed by the NHS diagnosing and treatment protocol had no choice but to > find Doctors such as Dr Skinner to get back their health. There must be a > link to that somewhere, but off the top of my head I can't think where it > would be. > > Burne also wrote another article about a year back and interviewed me > for about 3 hours one evening - I felt that I had written the article in the > end. presented it to the Editor of the Daily Mail who read it and > promised to publish it but it never got published - somebody, somewhere put > a stop to that. It is practically IMPOSSIBLE to get anything about thyroid > published unless it is from famous people who had all the symptoms, went to > their doctor, had the thyroid function tests, found to be outside the normal > reference range, given the little white pill levothyroxine and lived happily > ever after. All their stories have happy endings - unlike those who never > get diagnosed because their TFT's are within the normal range, or those who > have been diagnosed and cannot convert the inactive T4 to the active thyroid > hormone T3. They will now not publish such stories from these folk, because > the Royal College of Physicians tells the editors this is not the case, and > such patients are suffering from functional somatoform disorder - meaning, > its all in their head. Therefore - no story. When Editors ask Weetman to > comment, he comments as HEAD OF ALL UK MEDICAL SCHOOLS and DEAN OF SHEFFIELD > UNIVERSITY. So - who is the editor to believe, the patient who's symptoms > are 'all in their head' or the RCP and AP? > > Luv - Sheila > > > > Hello Sheila, what has J.Burne written and is there a link? I missed this. > > Thanks, > Louise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 Was it this article? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-506717/The-wake-pill--controversial-th\ yroid-supplement-help-tiredness.html Jerome Burne, not ? > > Wow Louise, you are going back some. That was an article (double page > spread) that Burne (freelance Medical Writer) wrote in the Daily Mail > after Dr Skinner's Fitness to Practice Hearing at the GNC. [...] ********There must be a > link to that somewhere, but off the top of my head I can't think where it > would be. ***** > > Hello Sheila, what has J.Burne written and is there a link? I missed this. > > Thanks, > Louise. > > --- In thyroid treatment Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 14, 2010 Report Share Posted April 14, 2010 That's it - thanks so much for finding it. I remember how delighted I was to see Thyroid Patient Advocacy had been put as the first contact if anybody needed more information, with the British Thyroid Association behind me - Oh - how I did enjoy that ;o) Was it this article? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-506717/The-wake-pill--controversial-thyroid-supplement-help-tiredness.html Jerome Burne, not ? > > Wow Louise, you are going back some. That was an article (double page > spread) that Burne (freelance Medical Writer) wrote in the Daily Mail > after Dr Skinner's Fitness to Practice Hearing at the GNC. [...] ********There must be a > link to that somewhere, but off the top of my head I can't think where it > would be. ***** > > Hello Sheila, what has J.Burne written and is there a link? I missed this. > > Thanks, > Louise. > > --- In thyroid treatment No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.437 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/2803 - Release Date: 04/13/10 20:22:00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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