Re: Fish Stock Simmering Time

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/23/02 2:09:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

djxprice@... writes:

> Hi all. In previous posts, many comment on the very long time that

> NT fish stocks simmer. I plan t omake some stock today, and I was

> wondering if anybody had additional thoughts or further information.

> Every other recipe I've seen has the stock simmer for up to an hour,

> never as long as 24! Thanks.

I didn't catch your earlier post, but by all means go the full time to

simmer. I've never seen stock recipes for an hour or less, but most I've

seen are only a couple hours. There's no reason for this except convenience

or laziness (or safety, if you're afraid of leaving the house with it on).

I've never made fish stock, but I've made chicken and beef stock, and the

stock always comes out much better if I go the full amount of time-- that is,

24 hours for chicken and 72 hours for beef-- rather than a smaller amount of

time. I think you'll have a very hard time trying to get stock that gels if

you only simmer it for an hour. You will have better taste as well as much

superior nutritional value, I think.

Chris

____

" What can one say of a soul, of a heart, filled with compassion? It is a

heart which burns with love for every creature: for human beings, birds, and

animals, for serpents and for demons. The thought of them and the sight of

them make the tears of the saint flow. And this immense and intense

compassion, which flows from the heart of the saints, makes them unable to

bear the sight of the smallest, most insignificant wound in any creature.

Thus they pray ceaselessly, with tears, even for animals, for enemies of the

truth, and for those who do them wrong. "

--Saint Isaac the Syrian

[Guest guest]

Hi, I am new to this group but I just wanted to mention that I have seen quite a

few fish stock recipes that said only cook about an hour, but I can't remember

the reason. This was only with fish stock though. I will look through my many

cookbooks to see why. SheilaN

----- Original Message -----

From: ChrisMasterjohn@...

Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2002 1:52 PM

Subject: Re: Fish Stock Simmering Time

In a message dated 11/23/02 2:09:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

djxprice@... writes:

> Hi all. In previous posts, many comment on the very long time that

> NT fish stocks simmer. I plan t omake some stock today, and I was

> wondering if anybody had additional thoughts or further information.

> Every other recipe I've seen has the stock simmer for up to an hour,

> never as long as 24! Thanks.

I didn't catch your earlier post, but by all means go the full time to

simmer. I've never seen stock recipes for an hour or less, but most I've

seen are only a couple hours. There's no reason for this except convenience

or laziness (or safety, if you're afraid of leaving the house with it on).

I've never made fish stock, but I've made chicken and beef stock, and the

stock always comes out much better if I go the full amount of time-- that is,

24 hours for chicken and 72 hours for beef-- rather than a smaller amount of

time. I think you'll have a very hard time trying to get stock that gels if

you only simmer it for an hour. You will have better taste as well as much

superior nutritional value, I think.

Chris

____

" What can one say of a soul, of a heart, filled with compassion? It is a

heart which burns with love for every creature: for human beings, birds, and

animals, for serpents and for demons. The thought of them and the sight of

them make the tears of the saint flow. And this immense and intense

compassion, which flows from the heart of the saints, makes them unable to

bear the sight of the smallest, most insignificant wound in any creature.

Thus they pray ceaselessly, with tears, even for animals, for enemies of the

truth, and for those who do them wrong. "

--Saint Isaac the Syrian

[Guest guest]

> In a message dated 11/23/02 2:09:31 PM Eastern Standard Time,

> djxprice@y... writes:

>

> > Hi all. In previous posts, many comment on the very long time

that

> > NT fish stocks simmer. I plan t omake some stock today, and I

was

> > wondering if anybody had additional thoughts or further

information.

> > Every other recipe I've seen has the stock simmer for up to an

hour,

> > never as long as 24! Thanks.

>

> I didn't catch your earlier post, but by all means go the full time

to

> simmer. I've never seen stock recipes for an hour or less, but

most I've

> seen are only a couple hours. There's no reason for this except

convenience

> or laziness (or safety, if you're afraid of leaving the house with

it on).

> I've never made fish stock, but I've made chicken and beef stock,

and the

> stock always comes out much better if I go the full amount of time--

that is,

> 24 hours for chicken and 72 hours for beef-- rather than a smaller

amount of

> time. I think you'll have a very hard time trying to get stock

that gels if

> you only simmer it for an hour. You will have better taste as well

as much

> superior nutritional value, I think.

>

> Chris

>

Hi,

On the contrary. The oils in fish are much less stable than chicken

or beef and cooking should be stopped after an hour at most. I'm an

NT devotee and simmer my beef stock 24 hours+ but I've made fish

stock a few times and it can start to develop an off taste after 2

hours even if you are skimming. To me true taste is one of the best

judges: if it tastes off and rancid, it probably is, and is not good

to eat even if there are extra minerals from the bones. Good luck.

[Guest guest]

I compromised and " only " let it simmer about 8 hours. It tastes

much better than the 24 hour stock I made previously, but it's still

pretty strong. It did congeal when refrigerated, but not to the

firmness of my former batch. In the future, I think I'll try an hour

and see if I can get it to set. Thanks for all the advice.

DJ

[Guest guest]

> I compromised and " only " let it simmer about 8 hours. It tastes

> much better than the 24 hour stock I made previously, but it's

still

> pretty strong. It did congeal when refrigerated, but not to the

> firmness of my former batch. In the future, I think I'll try an

hour

> and see if I can get it to set. Thanks for all the advice.

>

> DJ

Hi,

Keep in mind that in traditional European cooking fish stock is not

really used as a gelling agent or in reduction sauces. It is actually

called a 'fumet' which literally translates as scent of fish. Usually

fumets are used in fish soups where they are not reduced. If you want

gelatin, go for poultry or beef. If fish fumet is used for a sauce,

it is thickened or combined with other ingredients instead of being

reduced.

Cheers,

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 11/24/02 3:27:02 PM Eastern Standard Time,

jonathang@... writes:

> On the contrary. The oils in fish are much less stable than chicken

> or beef and cooking should be stopped after an hour at most. I'm an

> NT devotee and simmer my beef stock 24 hours+ but I've made fish

> stock a few times and it can start to develop an off taste after 2

> hours even if you are skimming. To me true taste is one of the best

> judges: if it tastes off and rancid, it probably is, and is not good

> to eat even if there are extra minerals from the bones. Good luck.

I agree with that, i have just never made fish stock yet. What kind of fish

do you use? Sally recommends using a less oily one for that reason. The

fats don't congeal to remove? I suppose it's probably because they are

polyunsaturated that they won't congeal.

Sorry for the misinformation,

Chris

____

" What can one say of a soul, of a heart, filled with compassion? It is a

heart which burns with love for every creature: for human beings, birds, and

animals, for serpents and for demons. The thought of them and the sight of

them make the tears of the saint flow. And this immense and intense

compassion, which flows from the heart of the saints, makes them unable to

bear the sight of the smallest, most insignificant wound in any creature.

Thus they pray ceaselessly, with tears, even for animals, for enemies of the

truth, and for those who do them wrong. "

--Saint Isaac the Syrian

[Guest guest]

> I agree with that, i have just never made fish stock yet. What

kind of fish

> do you use? Sally recommends using a less oily one for that

reason. The

> fats don't congeal to remove? I suppose it's probably because they

are

> polyunsaturated that they won't congeal.

>

> Sorry for the misinformation,

> Chris

>

Hi,

I can get deep sea halibut frames from Whole Foods so I just use

them. Clean flavor. Once I made stock from salmon heads the NT way

and after 6 hours my apartment was reeking - never again. Most

cookbooks advise using a white fish with a clean smell like halibut,

sole or bass.

Cheers,