Re: FA synthesis, lipids

[Guest guest]

>>>

From: " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

Date: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:40 pm

Subject: Re: FA synthesis, lipids

Thanks, Tony,

I'd venture the fat % is between 20 and 30%, but what about FA's? I

tend to think that CR will control lipids, excepting maybe the rally

high TC's, but I don't know for sure. My wife is high but she don't

exactly eat CR. We try to eat as little as possible, but my interest

is the adipose fat that hangs on. I think safflower had a small effect

on that - not sure yet.

Regards.

>>>

JW,

You say " I tend to think that CR will control lipids " .

Not necessarily. I have seen messages in the other group from people

who restrict calories substantially, but have high cholesterol levels.

The body's biochemical machinery is so complicated that there are no

easy answers (see the reference at the bottom). We just discussed how

carbohydrates get converted to palmitic acid (C16:0) which increases

cholesterol. Therefore, people who eat high carb/low fat diets will

tend to have high cholesterol levels *unless* the fats that they

consume are polyunsaturated - specifically LA (C18:2). This all makes

very good sense when you consider the Hegsted equation. You can see

from the coefficients that for the carbs that get converted to

palmitic acid, you are going to have to consume an equal amount of LA

to keep your cholesterol level constant.

The Hegsted equation:

DeltaTC = + 8.45 Delta C14:0 + 2.12 DeltaC16:0 - 1.87 DeltaC18:2 +

5.64 DeltaDietaryCholesterol - 6.24

With regard to the safflower oil, make sure that it is not the high

oleic kind. CHECK TO MAKE SURE that the grams of polyunsaturated fat

per serving are at least 3 times the grams of monounsaturated fat. If

this is not the case, you are just getting extra calories with no

benefit of cholesterol reduction.

Here is an anecdote with a good ending. Last November, I was

discussing nutrition with a neighbor and his wife and the topic of

high cholesterol came up because the husband had had a couple of heart

attacks and the wife had high cholesterol. I mentioned how bad trans

fats were, and soon I heard an alarmed report from him that his wife

had thrown out all the products in the pantry that had hydrogenated

fats. I said " well done " , and for Christmas I gave him a bottle of

grape seed oil, which is high in LA, and instructed him to consume

about 2 tablespoons per day instead of the olive oil they were using.

These people are not low calorie eaters by any stretch of the

imagination.

This morning I called to say good morning and he told me that his wife

had had a blood exam last week, and when she was asked to call the

doctor for the results she was too afraid to call so she asked the

husband to call. The doctor said that all her tests had come back

normal, and remarked that for some reason unknown to him, her

cholesterol values had decreased substantially and were now normal.

I feel that you can have normal cholesterol values even if you are not

on caloric restriction. You have to eat the right proportion of

carbs, protein, and fat, AND the carbs have to be complex, AND the

protein has to be complete, AND the fats have to have the right amount

of polyunsaturated fatty acids (LA, DHA, EPA). Caloric restriction

can give you additional health advantages once you have learned

Optimal Nutrition.

Good health is not for dummies.

Tony

===

http://www.library.csi.cuny.edu/~davis/Biochem_3521/lect21/lect21.html

Figure 9 shows the chemical conversion of carbohydrate to fat

(lipogenesis).

[Guest guest]

Thanks for the link.

I found this today:http://www.whfreeman.com/stryerbiochem5/con_index.htm?22

The book is found in Pubmed "books"

Showing the formation of palmitate, I think.

But it wouldn't be stored if it's burned, right? Surely a low intake should result in burning all the carbos and the ingested fat. But lipids are formed in the liver, and the liver seems in some cases, to do what it wants.

I guess I thought CR lowered it because of the WUSTL study. We don't really know what they started out with?

Regards.

----- Original Message -----

From: citpeks

Sent: Saturday, February 19, 2005 2:48 PM

Subject: [ ] Re: FA synthesis, lipids

>>>From: "jwwright" <jwwright@e...>Date: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:40 pmSubject: Re: FA synthesis, lipidsThanks, Tony,I'd venture the fat % is between 20 and 30%, but what about FA's? Itend to think that CR will control lipids, excepting maybe the rallyhigh TC's, but I don't know for sure. My wife is high but she don'texactly eat CR. We try to eat as little as possible, but my interestis the adipose fat that hangs on. I think safflower had a small effecton that - not sure yet. Regards.>>>JW,You say "I tend to think that CR will control lipids".Not necessarily. I have seen messages in the other group from peoplewho restrict calories substantially, but have high cholesterol levels.The body's biochemical machinery is so complicated that there are noeasy answers (see the reference at the bottom). We just discussed howcarbohydrates get converted to palmitic acid (C16:0) which increasescholesterol. Therefore, people who eat high carb/low fat diets willtend to have high cholesterol levels *unless* the fats that theyconsume are polyunsaturated - specifically LA (C18:2). This all makesvery good sense when you consider the Hegsted equation. You can seefrom the coefficients that for the carbs that get converted topalmitic acid, you are going to have to consume an equal amount of LAto keep your cholesterol level constant.The Hegsted equation:DeltaTC = + 8.45 Delta C14:0 + 2.12 DeltaC16:0 - 1.87 DeltaC18:2 +5.64 DeltaDietaryCholesterol - 6.24With regard to the safflower oil, make sure that it is not the higholeic kind. CHECK TO MAKE SURE that the grams of polyunsaturated fatper serving are at least 3 times the grams of monounsaturated fat. Ifthis is not the case, you are just getting extra calories with nobenefit of cholesterol reduction.Here is an anecdote with a good ending. Last November, I wasdiscussing nutrition with a neighbor and his wife and the topic ofhigh cholesterol came up because the husband had had a couple of heartattacks and the wife had high cholesterol. I mentioned how bad transfats were, and soon I heard an alarmed report from him that his wifehad thrown out all the products in the pantry that had hydrogenatedfats. I said "well done", and for Christmas I gave him a bottle ofgrape seed oil, which is high in LA, and instructed him to consumeabout 2 tablespoons per day instead of the olive oil they were using.These people are not low calorie eaters by any stretch of theimagination.This morning I called to say good morning and he told me that his wifehad had a blood exam last week, and when she was asked to call thedoctor for the results she was too afraid to call so she asked thehusband to call. The doctor said that all her tests had come backnormal, and remarked that for some reason unknown to him, hercholesterol values had decreased substantially and were now normal.I feel that you can have normal cholesterol values even if you are noton caloric restriction. You have to eat the right proportion ofcarbs, protein, and fat, AND the carbs have to be complex, AND theprotein has to be complete, AND the fats have to have the right amountof polyunsaturated fatty acids (LA, DHA, EPA). Caloric restrictioncan give you additional health advantages once you have learnedOptimal Nutrition.Good health is not for dummies.Tony===http://www.library.csi.cuny.edu/~davis/Biochem_3521/lect21/lect21.htmlFigure 9 shows the chemical conversion of carbohydrate to fat(lipogenesis).