Re: Advice for a newbie?

[Guest guest]

Welcome to the group.

A requirement of this group is to read " Beyond the 120 Year Diet " by Dr.

Walford. It can be found in most public libraries if you don't want to buy

it, and will explain CRON and how to get started.

Also, we have a file called : " Beginning CRON " in our " files " section. You

should have received an automatic e-mail upon joining the group told you to

go there. Please read all the messages you received upon joining which help

explain where to start.

on 5/2/2005 2:43 PM, Gay e at @... wrote:

> I have heard of CR and found it interesting, then a friend reminded

> me so here I am.

>

> My question is, where do I go from here?

>

> Any advice would be very welcome.

>

> Regards, Gay

>

[Guest guest]

I would not be in such a hurry to lose the weight quickly. As long as you are

steadily losing weight your metrics should be improving. Sometimes if you lose

weight

too quickly you lose muscles you wish you kept, and increase the load on the

body

to dispose of undesirables stored in the adipose.

I would also remain very focused on getting full nutrition. Nutrition first,

then

CR. You might consider running the numbers for your husband to see if he's

getting

adequate nutrition.

Good luck

JR

-----Original Message-----

From:

[mailto: ]On Behalf Of Gay e

Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 1:44 PM

Subject: [ ] Advice for a newbie?

Hi everyone

I've had a look at the recent posts and the files but it's still all

a bit bewildering.

I am on a calories restricted diet at the moment, since mid

February. I have made some big lifestyle changes in order to come

off BP meds after 30 years. My cholesterol meds went in the bin

shortly after and my figures are looking good although I need to

improve my HDL.

I tried for 1000 calories a day but decided that was a bit too low

and now aim for 1200-1300. I have lost 20lb since Christmas, from

166lb to 146lb. I am 53 and married. My husband is doing well too

although whilst my approach is healthy eating and logging everything

in Fitday, his is simply not to eat apart from one meal in the

evening. Very unscientific but it works for him Grrrrrrr.

I don't worry when I'm on holiday or have a night out but try

to `recover' the situation after. I have a target of 1lb a week

overall until I get to 126lb.

I have heard of CR and found it interesting, then a friend reminded

me so here I am.

My question is, where do I go from here?

Any advice would be very welcome.

Regards, Gay

[Guest guest]

Hi Francesca

I did look at the files but unfortunately I am in the UK and the

book is not available in Amazon uk nor in our libraries.

I will try and find more information on the web.

I want to try and find out what I should cut my calories to.

Regards, Gay

> Welcome to the group.

>

> A requirement of this group is to read " Beyond the 120 Year Diet "

by Dr.

> Walford. It can be found in most public libraries if you don't

want to buy

> it, and will explain CRON and how to get started.

>

> Also, we have a file called : " Beginning CRON " in our " files "

section. You

> should have received an automatic e-mail upon joining the group

told you to

> go there. Please read all the messages you received upon joining

which help

> explain where to start.

[Guest guest]

try:

http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?bx=off & sts=t & ds=30 & bi=0 & an=walford & tn=beyond+the+120 & sortby=2

used books.

----- Original Message -----

From: Gay e

Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 1:43 PM

Subject: [ ] Advice for a newbie?

Hi everyoneI've had a look at the recent posts and the files but it's still all a bit bewildering.I am on a calories restricted diet at the moment, since mid February. I have made some big lifestyle changes in order to come off BP meds after 30 years. My cholesterol meds went in the bin shortly after and my figures are looking good although I need to improve my HDL.I tried for 1000 calories a day but decided that was a bit too low and now aim for 1200-1300. I have lost 20lb since Christmas, from 166lb to 146lb. I am 53 and married. My husband is doing well too although whilst my approach is healthy eating and logging everything in Fitday, his is simply not to eat apart from one meal in the evening. Very unscientific but it works for him Grrrrrrr.I don't worry when I'm on holiday or have a night out but try to `recover' the situation after. I have a target of 1lb a week overall until I get to 126lb.I have heard of CR and found it interesting, then a friend reminded me so here I am.My question is, where do I go from here?Any advice would be very welcome.Regards, Gay

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jack. I've ordered it.

I guess what I'm stuggling with is since I've switched to my new

lifestyle, healthy eating, calories 1200 calories, am I pretty much in

the right direction anyway?

Gay

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

wrote:

> try:

> http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?

bx=off & sts=t & ds=30 & bi=0 & an=walford & tn=beyond+the+120 & sortby=2

>

> used books.

[Guest guest]

Hi Gay:

It sounds to me that you are well launched in the right direction.

You do need to be sure you are getting at least the recommended

amounts of all the micronutrients - which is not so easy on 1200

calories daily. (I think you mentioned you use Fitday). The best

way to do that may be to incorporate plenty of a variety of leafy

green vegetables into your diet ......... romaine, bok choy,

broccoli, kale .......... . Of all foods they are the best way to

get many of the micronutrients you need on the smallest number of

calories. If necessary take supplements to make up any nutrient

shortfalls.

Also include plant sources that have proven health benefits

(including anti-oxidant capacity) beyond the best-known

micronutrients - cruciferous vegetables, tomatoes, prunes,

pomegranate, grapes, nuts, fish ........

Also a *modest* amount of lean meat is considered here to be

appropriate for the nutrients you can only get from meat sources.

I also drink a little wine, meditate, exercise moderately (probably

less than is optimal), own a couple of pets (but not birds), and make

sure I have lots of things to look forward to .................

( " Happiness is having something to look forward to " ).

Best not to lose weight too quickly also.

Just a few thoughts there.

Welcome.

Rodney.

> > try:

> > http://dogbert.abebooks.com/servlet/SearchResults?

> bx=off & sts=t & ds=30 & bi=0 & an=walford & tn=beyond+the+120 & sortby=2

> >

> > used books.

[Guest guest]

Thanks everyone

I think the biggest thing I am going to get my head round is that I

might be losing weight too quickly. I am all geared up to the idea

of losing 1lb a week, half from exercise and half from calorie

restriction.

I guess I could slow down a bit now I'm half way to my target. I

can't wait for the book to arrive so I can work out my set point.

I'm guessing it's about 136 lb which will give a BMI of 22 but I may

be missing something. I'm 10lb over that at the moment.

I think my bottom line may be about 1300 calories which I would have

no trouble with. I was quite happy on a 1000 but I was worried that

was too low so I increased it.

At the moment my only regret is that I don't really like fish. I

eat it once a week under protest and also have prawns. I am amazed

that I've begun to like yogurt, muesli (which I add flaxseed to) and

beans. I am eating more fruit too although I could do to increase

the green vegetables. At the moment I am tending to eat most things

raw apart from the beans, salads rather than a cooked meal etc.. I

grow wheat grass sometimes and juice it.

I take a cal-mag supplement since I don't like drinking milk and

there is quite a bit of salt in it which puts my BP up. Maybe I

ought to work on the calcium angle a bit harder. I love cheese but

the salt and saturated fats are a problem. I have small amounts of

half fat cheese.

I think I will go to the supermarket and get something green for tea

<grin>

How close to a 30% reduction do most people get, by the way?

Gay

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

> Hi Gay:

>

> It sounds to me that you are well launched in the right direction.

>

> You do need to be sure you are getting at least the recommended

> amounts of all the micronutrients - which is not so easy on 1200

> calories daily. (I think you mentioned you use Fitday). The best

> way to do that may be to incorporate plenty of a variety of leafy

> green vegetables into your diet ......... romaine, bok choy,

> broccoli, kale .......... . Of all foods they are the best way

to

> get many of the micronutrients you need on the smallest number of

> calories. If necessary take supplements to make up any nutrient

> shortfalls.

>

> Also include plant sources that have proven health benefits

> (including anti-oxidant capacity) beyond the best-known

> micronutrients - cruciferous vegetables, tomatoes, prunes,

> pomegranate, grapes, nuts, fish ........

>

> Also a *modest* amount of lean meat is considered here to be

> appropriate for the nutrients you can only get from meat sources.

>

> I also drink a little wine, meditate, exercise moderately

(probably

> less than is optimal), own a couple of pets (but not birds), and

make

> sure I have lots of things to look forward to .................

> ( " Happiness is having something to look forward to " ).

>

> Best not to lose weight too quickly also.

>

> Just a few thoughts there.

>

> Welcome.

>

> Rodney.

[Guest guest]

You " had " to select fries?? LOL You would be better off fasting at

that particular time than eating fries.

> Another thing you can do is search the two books at amazon.

> My impression of CR is that each has to learn for himself, the least

he can eat, stay healthy, accomplish work, feel good.

> Most Americans can easily feel better eating less of the fast foods,

for sure.

> Don't know what you have in the UK, but people here are so busy,

fast food is a necessity. One day downtown Houston, in a Hospital, I

had to select just Mac's fries as a vegetarian food and I got it

without salt. Didn't have tome for breakfast. I can't eat the greasy

sauces, etc.

> The trick is to know how many calories to eat and control calories.

> Gradually I'll get to 155/165# maybe, but I'm not in a hurry.

>

> Regards.

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Gay e

>

> Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 4:40 AM

> Subject: [ ] Re: Advice for a newbie?

>

>

> Thanks Jack. I've ordered it.

>

> I guess what I'm stuggling with is since I've switched to my new

> lifestyle, healthy eating, calories 1200 calories, am I pretty

much in

> the right direction anyway?

>

> Gay

[Guest guest]

That really is amazing.

Do you suppose you would gain weight if you tried to increase your

calories again?

Gay

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...>

wrote:

> Reduction in calories versus reduction in weight is the issue. I

needed to lose weight, and had no idea what intake level I needed.

The insurance table is just a goal, IMO.

> So I dropped from 3200 to 3000 kcals and nothing happened. Then to

maybe 2700 and nothing happened. Then to 2300, then 2000 spaced 2 to

6 months. I was surprised how little I could eat and stay active and

not get hungry. The key to hunger was choosing the right foods.

Finally I ended up at 1800 kcals and I still maintain 175 -180#

(down from 234#), for 5 yrs. It's amazing.

>

> So do I judge the reduction by calories or by body weight?

> That's the big unknown.

>

> Regards.

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Gay e

>

> Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 7:53 AM

> Subject: [ ] Re: Advice for a newbie?

>

>

> Thanks everyone

>

> I think the biggest thing I am going to get my head round is

that I

> might be losing weight too quickly. I am all geared up to the

idea

> of losing 1lb a week, half from exercise and half from calorie

> restriction.

>

> I guess I could slow down a bit now I'm half way to my target.

I

> can't wait for the book to arrive so I can work out my set

point.

> I'm guessing it's about 136 lb which will give a BMI of 22 but I

may

> be missing something. I'm 10lb over that at the moment.

>

> I think my bottom line may be about 1300 calories which I would

have

> no trouble with. I was quite happy on a 1000 but I was worried

that

> was too low so I increased it.

>

> At the moment my only regret is that I don't really like fish.

I

> eat it once a week under protest and also have prawns. I am

amazed

> that I've begun to like yogurt, muesli (which I add flaxseed to)

and

> beans. I am eating more fruit too although I could do to

increase

> the green vegetables. At the moment I am tending to eat most

things

> raw apart from the beans, salads rather than a cooked meal

etc.. I

> grow wheat grass sometimes and juice it.

>

> I take a cal-mag supplement since I don't like drinking milk and

> there is quite a bit of salt in it which puts my BP up. Maybe I

> ought to work on the calcium angle a bit harder. I love cheese

but

> the salt and saturated fats are a problem. I have small amounts

of

> half fat cheese.

>

> I think I will go to the supermarket and get something green for

tea

> <grin>

>

> How close to a 30% reduction do most people get, by the way?

>

> Gay

[Guest guest]

Hi Lorri:

Can you tell us more about this please? How is it done? And

approximately how much does it cost? ty.

Rodney.

> I would recommend you have your resting metabolic rate measured to

know

> exactly how many calories your body is burning without exercise or

activity (to

> stay alive). You should also have it remeasured periodically as you

reduce body

> weight and reduce calories.

>

> Lorri

[Guest guest]

Hi Lorri

I wonder if that is similar to the test that my Polar Heart Rate

monitor does. It produces an index after 5 or 6 minutes of rest by

monitoring the heart rate. The index lowers as you get fitter and

your resting heart rate drops and becomes more stable.

It uses it to work out exercise zones and calorie burning.

I have a feeling it's going to be difficult to work mine out with me

having CFIDS. I have some real extremes. One day I could do

something for 10 minutes and burn 20 calories, another day the same

thing could burn 200 or even 500, often related to heart rate but

not always.

I remember once when I was doing really well with my swimming and I

was going through a phase where I thought that every good spell

meant I had beaten the CFS. I decided to have a squash lesson. I

thought I was being sensible having a lesson, the theory being that

the instructor would hit the ball to me and I wouldn't have to run

too much. This is what happened but in 30 minutes I burned 3,500

calories despite hardly moving off the spot and 2 days later I was

back to square one barely being able to get out of bed. It took me

4 months to recover. I should have taken more notice of my

monitor. On another day I maybe would have been fine.

Anyway that was a long explaination for saying I'm not sure if that

would work for me. Can you tell me a bit about how it works?

Gay

> I would recommend you have your resting metabolic rate measured to

know

> exactly how many calories your body is burning without exercise or

activity (to

> stay alive). You should also have it remeasured periodically as

you reduce body

> weight and reduce calories.

>

> Lorri

[Guest guest]

Yes test your Estrdiol levels if high this can be why your LH and FSH levels

were low.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: inc_100 <no_reply >

> Subject: Re: Advice for a Newbie?

>

> Date: Monday, October 4, 2010, 3:20 PM

> Phil,

>

> A question on your statment:

>

> " " Men with a low T level and lower levels of LH and FSH and

> having a good E2 levels say less then 30 best at 20 pg/ml.

> Need to have an MRI on there Pituitary to rule out a tumor

> it's rare to be cancer. " "

>

> When My T, LH,FSH were low my Endo ordered a Pituitary MRI

> to rule out tumor but he did not check my E2 levels. I think

> he should have checked my E2. But why would E2 go up ...

> like what reasons ?

>

> This low T started after 5 months of starting on Synthroid.

> do you think I can go back and check ? I am planning on

> seeing Dr. or atleast having my Doc talk to Dr. and

> see what's wrong.

>

> Thanks

> Joe

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> >

> > > From: cylonhippy <cylonhippy@...>

> > > Subject: Advice for a Newbie?

> > >

> > > Date: Sunday, October 3, 2010, 7:31 PM

> > > Hi everyone,

> > >

> > > I just joined the group and have been enjoying

> reading your

> > > posts.

> > >

> > > I am brand new to TRT--I just started 3 days ago

> after a

> > > diagnosis of hypogonadism.  I believe it is not

> > > " primary, " as my LH levels were low normal.

> > >

> > > I was wondering whether any of you experienced

> TRT'ers have

> > > any advice for a newbie--things you wish you

> had  known

> > > when you first started.

> > >

> > > One concern I have right off the bat is

> testicular

> > > atrophy.  I think I already notice my testicles

> > > shrinking, which I'm finding a little

> distressing.  Can

> > > anything be done at this early stage?

> > >

> > > Thanks to all,

> > > CH

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

Are you referring to ball pumping? Lol! I think that would be painful!

>

> Study HCG (which I have to study) and buy a two state cylinder pumping

> apparatus

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Phil,

Thank you for the response. I'll study those links carefully.

I'm not sure I understand everything you wrote, but I can share some of my

numbers with you. As of my most recent test (before starting TRT of any kind):

Total T: 505 ng/dL; range 300-1000

Free T: 0.65 ng/dL; range 0.95-4.30 **LOW**

SHBG: 38 nmol/L; range 9-45

Estradiol: 53.4 pg/ml; range 20-75

LH: 2.5 mIU/ml; range 1.7-11.2

FSH: 2.5 mIU/ml; range 1.7-11.2

Prolactin: 5.2 ng/ml; range 3.3 - 20.8

TSH: 1.3 uIU/ml; range 0.5-6.0

Progesterone: 0.6 ng/mL; range 0.0-0.6

I've been on TRT for 4 days using Testim, 1 tube per day. I'm generally in good

health and felt pretty well before TRT, but energy was low, intensity was low,

sex drive was low.

I am not fat. My BMI is 20% I exercise a lot but at only moderate intensity.

I feel I'm responding to TRT really quickly. My only complaint so far is that

my nuts are about 40% smaller than they were 4 days ago.

I really appreciate the response. It's great to have guys to talk to about

this!

CH

>

> > From: cylonhippy <cylonhippy@...>

> > Subject: Advice for a Newbie?

> >

> > Date: Sunday, October 3, 2010, 7:31 PM

> > Hi everyone,

> >

> > I just joined the group and have been enjoying reading your

> > posts.

> >

> > I am brand new to TRT--I just started 3 days ago after a

> > diagnosis of hypogonadism.  I believe it is not

> > " primary, " as my LH levels were low normal.

> >

> > I was wondering whether any of you experienced TRT'ers have

> > any advice for a newbie--things you wish you had  known

> > when you first started.

> >

> > One concern I have right off the bat is testicular

> > atrophy.  I think I already notice my testicles

> > shrinking, which I'm finding a little distressing.  Can

> > anything be done at this early stage?

> >

> > Thanks to all,

> > CH

> >

> >

> >

> > ------------------------------------

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Hi again Phil,

I reread your response again this morning, and I think it's starting to sink in.

You described a case where LH and FSH were low and E2 was high. I think that

describes me exactly. My E2 was 53. I don't know how it got that high with

only 20% BMI, but there it is.

I'm responding well to the T so far, but I have to wonder whether I could

address the problem more directly with an aromatase inhibitor. What do you

think? Will T supplementation tend to drive down E2 on its own?

CH

>

> Hi CH and Welcome,

>

> I tell all men make dam sure you know why your Testosterone levels are low

before going on TRT. Once you start it's dam hard to figure out what did this.

>

[Guest guest]

I don't feel you needed to go on TRT having a Total T level of 505. With an

Estradiol level this high 53.4 and you could be even higher the test for

Estradiol you did is for women. You needed to do a Estradiol Sensitive test for

men like one at Quest labs #4021 the range is 13 to 54 pg/ml.

Women have very high levels of Estradiol so when they test them they don't need

to be so sensitive are the results.

So let me go over this again when men have higher levels of Estradiol E2 there

brain sees this as high Testosterone. E2 is made from Testosterone so the brain

can't tell the diff. between them.

So when you have levels high over 30 your brain sees this as Testosterone and

slows down telling your testis to make more Testosterone.

So you end up with lower levels of LH and FSH the message that your brain sends

to your Testis that tells them to make more Testosterone.

So your testis don't work and get smaller and all you need to do it take some

Arimidex .5 mgs every other day to get this down. As your E2 comes down your

brain will see your Testosterone levels are low and send more LH and FSH to your

testis so they can make more and your levels can go up some 200 to 300 points.

This link talks about this.

http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/89/3/1174

And this link shows how taking Arimidex will lower E2 levels and bring up

Testosterone.

http://www.medibolics.com/ArimidexBoostsTestosterone.htm

Now here is the part you need to pay att. to going on one tube of Testim is 5

grams and most men going on this starting dose don't get levels as high as your

were before stating on the Testim.

So here is what can happen by 2 weeks on this your brain is going to see you

added Testosterone to your body. Now it will stop telling your Testis to make

what your base levels were at 503 and all your going to be left with is what the

starting dose of testim is going to do. And this can be lower then 503 you can

fall as low as into the 300's.

I am not a Dr. just a man that has been down a long road of seeing Dr.'s not up

on this. I talk to a lot of men everyday and hear said stories about Dr.'s

putting men on Gels and telling them to come back in 3 months. Most of them men

end up lower then they started and feel dam sick.

When men start on gels at this lower dose the Dr. needs to test them in 2 weeks

to be sure the dose is enough.

I feel you should get off the testim before you get shut down and try to get

your E2 down and redo your labs. Going on TRT is for life most men trying to

get off it don't go back to the levels they were at when they started on it.

The best levels I got on Testim doing double your dose was 550. Today on shots

I keep my levels in the upper 800's.

Your Free T is what is working in your body Free T is about 1 to 2% of your

Total T and with higher levels of E2 your SHBG goes up and your high this binds

up your Testosteone and your Free levels end up low.

So getting E2 down will fix this your SHBG will come and free up your bound

testosteone so your Free T levels will go up and you will feel better.

No one whants to be on TRT for life if they don't need to be.

I tell all men find out why your low first try to fix it then redo labs. Most

of the time men that find out what was wrong and fix it there T levels come back

up on there own.

If you try Arimidex to get your E2 levels down let me know I can tell you how to

do this so you don't go down to low.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: cylonhippy <cylonhippy@...>

> Subject: Re: Advice for a Newbie?

>

> Date: Monday, October 4, 2010, 7:46 PM

> Hi Phil,

>

> Thank you for the response. I'll study those links

> carefully.

>

> I'm not sure I understand everything you wrote, but I can

> share some of my numbers with you.  As of my most

> recent test (before starting TRT of any kind):

>

> Total T: 505 ng/dL; range 300-1000

> Free  T: 0.65 ng/dL; range 0.95-4.30  **LOW**

> SHBG: 38 nmol/L; range 9-45

>

> Estradiol: 53.4 pg/ml; range 20-75

> LH:           2.5

> mIU/ml; range 1.7-11.2

> FSH:         2.5 mIU/ml;

> range 1.7-11.2

> Prolactin: 5.2 ng/ml; range 3.3 - 20.8

> TSH:        1.3 uIU/ml; range 0.5-6.0

> Progesterone: 0.6 ng/mL; range 0.0-0.6

>

> I've been on TRT for 4 days using Testim, 1 tube per

> day.  I'm generally in good health and felt pretty well

> before TRT, but energy was low, intensity was low, sex drive

> was low.

>

> I am not fat.  My BMI is 20%  I exercise a lot

> but at only moderate intensity.

>

> I feel I'm responding to TRT really quickly.  My only

> complaint so far is that my nuts are about 40% smaller than

> they were 4 days ago.

>

> I really appreciate the response.  It's great to have

> guys to talk to about this!

>

> CH

>

>

> >

> > > From: cylonhippy <cylonhippy@...>

> > > Subject: Advice for a Newbie?

> > >

> > > Date: Sunday, October 3, 2010, 7:31 PM

> > > Hi everyone,

> > >

> > > I just joined the group and have been enjoying

> reading your

> > > posts.

> > >

> > > I am brand new to TRT--I just started 3 days ago

> after a

> > > diagnosis of hypogonadism.  I believe it is not

> > > " primary, " as my LH levels were low normal.

> > >

> > > I was wondering whether any of you experienced

> TRT'ers have

> > > any advice for a newbie--things you wish you

> had  known

> > > when you first started.

> > >

> > > One concern I have right off the bat is

> testicular

> > > atrophy.  I think I already notice my testicles

> > > shrinking, which I'm finding a little

> distressing.  Can

> > > anything be done at this early stage?

> > >

> > > Thanks to all,

> > > CH

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ------------------------------------

> > >

> > >

[Guest guest]

CH,

Adding Testosterone to your body can and dose in most men make Estradiol levels

go higher. The longer your on this testim the bigger chance your going to have

of shutting down your brain from sending any LH and FSH. All men on TRT end up

with LH and FSH at the bottom of the range your testis stop working and they get

smaller.

Talk to your Dr. about what I am saying if he will not agree he is not up on

this. You can buy Arimidex over seas from the ADC with out a script.

https://www.alldaychemist.com/75_Arimidex-1mg

I use a pill cutter to cut the small pill in half then I use a single edge razor

to cut the half part into 1/4's by standing the cut end on edge and cutting this

in half.

Here is a copy of a file I made about not going to low on Arimidex.

==================================================

How To Take Arimdex and not go down on your Estradiol to Low.

What I found is if you go to low taking arimidex, it's the length of time your

to low, if your too low say for 8 weeks it can take your body a longer time to

make more Estradiol. Bottom line is to know how not to go to low. Keep a log on

your dose and how you feel men going to low can't get it up taking Viagra. I

went to low when I first tried Arimidex and did not know about going to low or

how one feels to low, so I was low a good 8 weeks. I did not know I was low

until my next labs.

The best gage I have found to control your Estradiol levels is to gage your

night time and morning wood. At good levels or what I call the sweet spot you

get your night time and morning wood back so strong it will wake you up and you

can hang a coat on it.

Most men do good taking .25 mgs or 1/4 of a 1mg. pill, I use a pill cutter to

cut the small pill in half then I stand it on the cut end and use a single edge

razor to cut this in half. A good way to take arimidex is by how high your

levels are. I tested over 90 pg/ml so we tried doing .5 mgs every other day

after 8 weeks my next set of labs showed it did not move below 90, test said

>90. So we did .5 mgs. every day in about 2 weeks I got some strong night time

and morning wood back after not having them for many yrs.

I kept doing this dose and in 8 weeks my next set of labs said <20 back in the

day labs were like this they did not have to good labs we have today they could

not read lower the 20. My Dr. told me this looks to low to stop taking the

Arimidex. The one thing I noticed was my wood stopped and stopping the Arimidex

my wood came back in about 7 weeks my next test at 8 weeks was 24 pg/ml. So we

went back on the Arimidex but the Dr. told me to take .5 mgs every 3 days I was

on this dose not a week and lost wood. This is when I figured out going to low

you lose wood. And the longer your too low the longer it takes to get levels

back up.

I stopped the arimidex right away and got my wood back in 4 days. I then after

playing with the dose for a time found the best dose is .25mgs every 2 to 3

days.

So lets say your labs are less the 50 pg/ml if your take .5 mgs you can go down

so dam fast your miss the sweet spot of your wood and go to low. It's best with

lower levels 50 and under to do less Arimidex .25mgs every 2 days if later your

lose wood when it comes back go to every 3 days.

I have found estradiol is the hardest hormone to control, it goes up or down

from month to month some times I need .25mgs every 2 days other times I need

..25mgs everyday most of the time I do well on every 3 days.

So between wood and labs I do great and so do most of the men I have told this

to. I keep a log on how much I am taking and how I feel. Doing this and reading

back in my log I was able to tell when I was going to high or to low my Dr. lets

me dose my arimidex by how I feel.

Over the yrs. I have posted this story until I am blue in the face.

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And I feel your doing your self more harm then good going on Testim with your T

levels this high and your Estradiol levels high.

Here is a copy of a file I have on going on gels.

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Starting on Androgel or Testim.

Yes this happens a lot you start on a low starting dose 5 grams when your brain

sees the testosterone in your blood even just a little it slows down even stops

sending the LH and FSH message to your testis to make the Testosterone you were

making. So lets say your labs for Total T were 350 you add this dose of gel

your brain sees this and you lose the base level you had before the gel.

Now lets say you need more then 5 grams most do so now all your left with is

what the gel is doing so lets say it's doing 200 so you lost 150.

The reason you feel good is your levels go up that 200 the gel is doing in the

first 2 weeks so your levels go up to 550 in theory. The brain sees this and

you fall back.

Why can this happen it might be how your putting on the gel with Androgel you

need to spread it over your upper arms and shoulders and down your back as far

as you can reach this is half of your dose then do the other side. Just spread

it over the area but don't rub it in.

The other thing is it's not getting through your skin good so you need more. If

you have a thyroid problem your skin will become thicker and gels and creams

don't get through the skin and you need to switch to shots.

I tell men when they go on Gels to retest in 2 weeks because you can end up

feeling worse. Most men just need more gel. Dr.'s that tell men to go on 5

grams of gel and come back in 8 to 12 weeks for labs don't know much about the

use of gels. Dr.'s that treat a lot of men for low T on gels see this happen

and test them again in 2 weeks.

When you go to do labs get up and shower that morning go do your labs and then

put in the gel after your blood test so you don’t spike up your labs. If you

can’t do labs in the morning shower put on the gel but don’t get any gel on

the spot they take the blood from. Do your labs about 6 hrs later.

Call your Dr. and tell him this and that your not feeling good you were but fell

back.

Co-Moderator

Phil

> From: cylonhippy <cylonhippy@...>

> Subject: Re: Advice for a Newbie?

>

> Date: Tuesday, October 5, 2010, 7:54 AM

> Hi again Phil,

>

> I reread your response again this morning, and I think it's

> starting to sink in.  You described a case where LH and

> FSH were low and E2 was high.  I think that describes

> me exactly.  My E2 was 53.  I don't know how it

> got that high with only 20% BMI, but there it is.

>

> I'm responding well to the T so far, but I have to wonder

> whether I could address the problem more directly with an

> aromatase inhibitor.  What do you think?  Will T

> supplementation tend to drive down E2 on its own?

>

> CH

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hi CH and Welcome,

> >

> > I tell all men make dam sure you know why your

> Testosterone levels are low before going on TRT.  Once

> you start it's dam hard to figure out what did this.

> >

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Awesome information, Phil. Thanks.

>

> CH,

> Adding Testosterone to your body can and dose in most men make Estradiol

levels go higher. The longer your on this testim the bigger chance your going

to have of shutting down your brain from sending any LH and FSH. All men on TRT

end up with LH and FSH at the bottom of the range your testis stop working and

they get smaller.

>

> Talk to your Dr. about what I am saying if he will not agree he is not up on

this. You can buy Arimidex over seas from the ADC with out a script.

> https://www.alldaychemist.com/75_Arimidex-1mg

>

> I use a pill cutter to cut the small pill in half then I use a single edge

razor to cut the half part into 1/4's by standing the cut end on edge and

cutting this in half.

>