Re: Swimming, delayed onset of aging

[Guest guest]

Hmmm. I wonder. Strictly anecdotal of course but I have seen several avid

swimmers develop dowager's humps as they aged. Which means osteoporosis.

Swimming is not a weight bearing exercise.

It would be interesting to see some scientific evidence as to why swimming

is being claimed " the ultimate " by this magazine and how they reached that

conclusion.

on 6/30/2005 11:30 AM, Jon at HerrZiegler@... wrote:

> The January 2005 issue nominated

> swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

Francesca,

I thought I'd comment on the dowagers humps. I learned to swim at

the age of 48 having previously been so terrified of water that I

panicked in the shower.

Traditional lessons didn't help much. I learned TI style which

teaches body balance as being all important, and turned into a very

keen swimmer in next to no time. I went on to take my teaching

qualifications. Won't bore you with the details and will try not to

get on my hobby horse (do you say that in the US?)

Anyway, the point I wanted to make is that apart from the fortunate

few that learn good balance, there are two things you will see a lot

of in swimmers. One is the head up, full jewellery, don't get the

hair wet, breast-stroke - I'm sure you can see what that does for

posture. The other is the 'stronger' swimmer who either swims front

crawl and moves his head from side to side so as to keep it out of

the water, or the more fortunate swimmer that has found more of a

natural balance without being shown. Even the latter you will

frequently see stressing the neck as they get a breath in. Swimming

with your head in the water and bringing it out correctly to breath,

is something many many people don't do.

The point I'm making is that balance and technique are everything.

The fitter one is, the more danger of having problems since there is

the opportunity to put strain on joints for longer periods of time.

BTW, I've heard it said that only 2% of Americans can swim 1 mile

freestyle without stopping. That says a lot for fitness and/or

correct technique, often when breathing.

Gay

>

> > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

Could you elaborate on " TI style " ? Or recommend some other resources

on this? BTW, I think swimming fits in well with CR as does yoga and

pilates to maintain flexibility and fitness without undue strain on

the joints.

> >

> > > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

Regarding swimming ............ rather surprising to me was a study

I read in which mice forced to swim regularly had noticeably stronger

bones. This is a little weird, since the bones were not in a 'load-

bearing' mode.

I haven't come to any conclusions about what this means. But one

possibility is that it is not the loading on the bone that is the

stimulus that activates bone-strengthing activity in response to

exercise, but instead something to do with muscle contractions, or

perhaps blood flow rate.

It would be interesting to know how strong the bones of olympic

swimmers are in comparison with those of distance runners.

Rodney.

> > >

> > > > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > > > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

Hi Ron

TI stands for Total Immersion. You can find plenty on it by

searching " Total Immersion Swimming " . It's not quite what it sounds

although it does teach you to be as much IN the water as possible and

to push into the water with the chest and shoulders. It teaches fish

like swimming and good balance and posture.

With a quick apology to Francesa on the subject. I know a lot of

people think Dowagers Hump can be caused or worsened by bad posture.

Perhaps this is untrue?

The thing I like most about TI is that you can swim slowly and

gracefully. Many people use momentum and stamina to get going and

simply can't swim slowly - no balance.

For some-one like me, with CFS, or people with ailments that mean they

don't want to go hell for leather but do want a good range of

movement, I find it very helpful. That's not to say you can't go hell

for leather efficiently of course.

I understand the Shaw and methods are similar but I've no

experience of these.

I had problems with joints including frozen shoulders amongst others

and find that swimming helps a lot, more than the physio did.

I have a few .mov files that show drills if anyone would like to have

a look. There's about 10 at roughly 300kb each so you would need a

good connection and a reasonably configured machine.

I would think TI would be a very appropriate way to work out without

burning a lot of calories.

Regards, Gay

--- In , " Ron Corselli " <rcorselli@h...>

wrote:

> Could you elaborate on " TI style " ? Or recommend some other resources

> on this? BTW, I think swimming fits in well with CR as does yoga and

> pilates to maintain flexibility and fitness without undue strain on

> the joints

[Guest guest]

As a former swimmer, I can also point out that skin cancer, rotator

cuff problems, and damaged skin and hair (due to the pool chemicals as

well as the sun) were common maladies among my fellow pool-mates.

Diane

>

> > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

My endocronologist warned me that I needed to either run or walk in

order to get weight bearing, aerobic exercise. She said the

elliptical trainer with no hands was no good because there was no

" pounding " .

My physical medicine doctor (for a pulled hamstring) scoffed at this

and said that the act of contracting the muscle will build bone. Thus

he recommended that I swim, bike, use the elliptical, etc. Good news,

since the pounding I got from running and walking was definitely

hurting both my knees and my hamstring.

Diane

> > > >

> > > > > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > > > > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men and women.

[Guest guest]

Sorry to come into the discussion late.

A few years ago I was watching a documentary with my

son and there was a female marine biologist who looked

very young and the narrator gave her age and it was

about 20 years older than I thought she looked.

Another mom saw the same show and commented on this

completely independently, so it was not just me.

The woman in question spent most of her working days

diving in the ocean.

Strictly anecdotal, I know, but startling.

I'd love to find out the woman's name and what she's

up to now... Just stopped and did a search and it may

be Eugenie , the shark lady. I saw something

about her swimming with the sharks at the age of 70.

JFWIW.

--- Diane Walter <dianepwalter@...> wrote:

> My endocronologist warned me that I needed to either

> run or walk in

> order to get weight bearing, aerobic exercise. She

> said the

> elliptical trainer with no hands was no good because

> there was no

> " pounding " .

>

> My physical medicine doctor (for a pulled hamstring)

> scoffed at this

> and said that the act of contracting the muscle will

> build bone. Thus

> he recommended that I swim, bike, use the

> elliptical, etc. Good news,

> since the pounding I got from running and walking

> was definitely

> hurting both my knees and my hamstring.

>

> Diane

>

>

>

> > > > >

> > > > > > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > > > > > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men

> and women.

>

>

>

____________________________________________________

Sell on Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items.

http://auctions./

[Guest guest]

Hi Jfwiw:

I do know of one study that showed that mice forced to swim a lot had

noticeably better bone density than those that did not, which seems

to support the view that muscle contraction of any kind may be

relevant to bone density.

As for retarding aging, I would be impressed if the vast majority of

marine biologists looked twenty years younger than their

chronological age. Unfortunately, the only other one that

immediately comes to mind is Jacques Cousteau, who looked as if he

was about 80 from a very early age : ^ )))

Rodney.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > > The January 2005 issue nominated

> > > > > > > swimming as the ultimate exercise for men

> > and women.

> >

> >

> >

>

>

>

>

> ____________________________________________________

> Sell on Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items.

> http://auctions./

[Guest guest]

Hi Rodney,

Yes, it would be interesting to know if people who

spent a great deal of time under water seemed to age

differently.

JFWIW, my sense of Jaques Cousteau was that he was

more a producer than a diver and that he didn't do

that much diving without a camera... But I could

easily be wrong about that:-)

--- Rodney <perspect1111@...> wrote:

> Hi Jfwiw:

>

> I do know of one study that showed that mice forced

> to swim a lot had

> noticeably better bone density than those that did

> not, which seems

> to support the view that muscle contraction of any

> kind may be

> relevant to bone density.

>

> As for retarding aging, I would be impressed if the

> vast majority of

> marine biologists looked twenty years younger than

> their

> chronological age. Unfortunately, the only other

> one that

> immediately comes to mind is Jacques Cousteau, who

> looked as if he

> was about 80 from a very early age : ^ )))

>

> Rodney.

>

>

> > > > > > Francesca,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I thought I'd comment on the dowagers

> humps.

> > > I learned to swim

> > > > at

> > > > > > the age of 48 having previously been so

> > > terrified of water that I

> > > > > > panicked in the shower.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Traditional lessons didn't help much. I

> > > learned TI style which

> > > > > > teaches body balance as being all

> important,

> > > and turned into a

> > > > > very

> > > > > > keen swimmer in next to no time. I went

> on to

> > > take my teaching

> > > > > > qualifications. Won't bore you with the

> > > details and will try not

> > > > > to

> > > > > > get on my hobby horse (do you say that in

> the

> > > US?)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Anyway, the point I wanted to make is that

> > > apart from the

> > > > > fortunate

> > > > > > few that learn good balance, there are two

> > > things you will see a

> > > > > lot

> > > > > > of in swimmers. One is the head up, full

> > > jewellery, don't get

> > > > the

> > > > > > hair wet, breast-stroke - I'm sure you can

> see

> > > what that does for

> > > > > > posture. The other is the 'stronger'

> swimmer

> > > who either swims

> > > > > front

> > > > > > crawl and moves his head from side to side

> so

> > > as to keep it out

> > > > of

> > > > > > the water, or the more fortunate swimmer

> that

> > > has found more of a

> > > > > > natural balance without being shown. Even

> the

> > > latter you will

> > > > > > frequently see stressing the neck as they

> get

> > > a breath in.

> > > > > Swimming

> > > > > > with your head in the water and bringing

> it

> > > out correctly to

> > > > > breath,

> > > > > > is something many many people don't do.

> > > > > >

>

=== message truncated ===

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Hi Francesca:

It was probably Oil of Olay ; ^ )))

Rodney.

>

> Hi Rodney,

>

> Yes, it would be interesting to know if people who

> spent a great deal of time under water seemed to age

> differently.

>

> JFWIW, my sense of Jaques Cousteau was that he was

> more a producer than a diver and that he didn't do

> that much diving without a camera... But I could

> easily be wrong about that:-)

[Guest guest]

Just remembered another " mouse " :

Hepburn lived to 96 and especially enjoyed

swimming, and regularly took dips in the frigid waters

that fronted her bayfront Connecticut home, generally

believing that " the bitterer the medicine, the better

it was for you. " She continued her brisk swims well

into her 80's. (from Wikipedia)

--- jwwright <jwwright@...> wrote:

> Re: [ ] Re: Swimming, delayed onset of

> agingTake a look at Dr. Debakey.

> http://www.wic.org/bio/debakey.htm

>

> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/_E._DeBakey

> Ellis DeBakey, M.D. (born September 7,

> 1908), is a pioneering cardiovascular surgeon and

> researcher.

>

>

> Not too bad for 97yo. Saw him on tv about a year ago

> in WORK clothes. Looked a lot like the picture. Said

> " we don't know what causes heart disease. " Admits to

> long-lived parents. Reportedly doesn't eat much.

> His book?

>

http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/068481188X/ref=sib_rdr_ex/002-1214709-0738457?%5\

Fencoding=UTF8 & p=S00E & j=0#reader-page

>

> Regards.

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: Francesca Skelton

>

> Sent: Sunday, July 10, 2005 4:50 PM

> Subject: Re: [ ] Re: Swimming,

> delayed onset of aging

>

>

> The most remarkable person IMHO afa looking/acting

> youthful is Mike Wallace of " 60 Minutes " . Believe

> it or not, he's in his mid 80's - 84 I read not long

> ago. Of course still working full time as a tv

> reporter. The only thing I know about him is that

> he's an avid tennis player. Of course he could have

> had a face lift which is something that tv/hollywood

> personalities often do but even if he did, his body

> and carriage is that of a much, much younger man.

> If I didn't know his age I would guess that he's

> about 50. If anyone has any idea how MW achieves

> his looks, bearing etc at this age, please do post.

>

>

>

>

____________________________________________________

Sell on Auctions – no fees. Bid on great items.

http://auctions./

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

I believe the occasional missed heatbeat - one missed every couple of

minutes, say - and usually followed by a bigger one to make up for

it, is called 'ectopic heatbeat' and is no cause for concern.

Rodney.

>

>

> Just remembered another " mouse " :

>

> Hepburn lived to 96 and especially enjoyed

> swimming, and regularly took dips in the frigid waters

> that fronted her bayfront Connecticut home, generally

> believing that " the bitterer the medicine, the better

> it was for you. " She continued her brisk swims well

> into her 80's. (from Wikipedia)

[Guest guest]

Hi Francesca:

Well since you are on CRON and your mother presumably was not, you

should reasonably expect to fare better than her.

Rodney.

>

> Hi JW:

>

> I believe the occasional missed heatbeat - one missed every couple

of

> minutes, say - and usually followed by a bigger one to make up for

> it, is called 'ectopic heatbeat' and is no cause for concern.

>

> Rodney.