Re: Help ! My TSH went bananas !

January 26, 2011

Worse... my TSH was .03 and went to 18.62 !

So it wasn't 3 to start. It was .03.

>

> I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She

says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite

upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on

a scale of 7-17.

>

> TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

>

> What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even

go high on the selenium at 500/day.

>

> Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

>

> She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

>

January 26, 2011

Doctor Brownstein in his book "Iodine why you need why you can't live without it" says that it is often the case that TSH increases for a period when taking iodine in the beginning. This is because of the sodium iodine symporter and it is not dangerous if you feel OK. The same thing happened to me. I went from 0.65 to 11 in 3 months. It went back down again in time for the next test. Most doctors don't know this. She is probably frightening you for nothing.

MacGilchrist

From: <r_long@...>iodine Sent: Wed, 26 January, 2011 17:43:21Subject: Re: Help ! My TSH went bananas !

Worse... my TSH was .03 and went to 18.62 ! So it wasn't 3 to start. It was .03.>> I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on a scale of 7-17.> > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.>

January 26, 2011

,

Thank you so much for writing.

Yes, I was not thrilled at her reaction. I have 2 months until my next blood

test. Should that give me enough time for it to come down ? btw I feel fine..

normal... so thats a good sign. She wanted to increase my level of synthyroid. I

asked her to hold off until the next blood test.

I may back down to 2 or 3 mg of Iodine because if she sees my TSH is still

high she might flip again lol. This means it will take longer to get to my full

saturation I guess.

What do you think ?

> >

> > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She

> >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

quite

> >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6

on

> >a scale of 7-17.

> >

> > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> >

> > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even

> >go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> >

> > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> >

> > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> >

>

January 26, 2011

Hi ,She just doesn’t understand how the iodine is working in your body. I wouldn’t back down to make HER feel good, it is YOUR body, you are doing what you need to do to heal and feel good. If I were you, I would keep on at the level you are taking, and just wouldn’t go back for bloodwork so soon. You don’t have to agree to it. Just wait 4 to 6 months. And maybe in the meantime, get your doctor a copy of Dr. Brownstein’s books! Actually, looking at your posts, you were only taking 5 mg to begin with, which is very low. I would take at least 12.5 or more to really feed your thyroid better. The TSH may not go down on such a low amount, especially if you cut it even more. Your thyroid is responding to getting this needed nutrient, and working to readjust to having it. How you feel is much more important that bloodwork results. And have the doctor test for free T3 also. It is really the free T3 and free T4 tests that tell you the health of your body. Your free T4 was very low, most people feel best when they are in the top third of their ranges. Donna in IL ,Thank you so much for writing. Yes, I was not thrilled at her reaction. I have 2 months until my next blood test. Should that give me enough time for it to come down ? btw I feel fine.. normal... so thats a good sign. She wanted to increase my level of synthyroid. I asked her to hold off until the next blood test.I may back down to 2 or 3 mg of Iodine because if she sees my TSH is still high she might flip again lol. This means it will take longer to get to my full saturation I guess.What do you think ?> >> > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on > >a scale of 7-17.> > > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.> >>

January 26, 2011

Donna,

Thank you. I am going to take the time to consider what you have written.

Slowly my understanding of this is increasing. Docs get so bent out of shape

with thyroid issues ! Sheesh !

I was expecting a call to reduce thyroid meds because I feel an increase in

energy. I can tell the Iodine is doing something. Its encouraging to think of

where this will take me once my saturation level is achieved.

All good,

> > >

> > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She

> > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

quite

> > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is

7.6 on

> > >a scale of 7-17.

> > >

> > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> > >

> > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even

> > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> > >

> > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> > >

> > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> > >

> >

>

> ________________________________

>

January 26, 2011

,

I don't know for sure how long it will take to come down. If I remember rightly it is between 3 to 6 months usually. The important thing is how you feel. If you were having a Hashi attack you would probably feel awful. Does your doctor test your thyroid anti-bodies?

I'm not sure that backing down will make much difference at the dose you are taking. I believe that once you get into the mg range of doses (as opposed to the Âµg range) if it your TSH is affected, the difference between 2 or 5 mgs may not have much impact on it. You have to go by how you feel. If you feel bad, then reduce the dose.

Don't let your doctor push you around. Remember that you're her client.

Don't let her increase your synthroid if you feel OK on the present dose. My doctor did that and I ended up with a huge RT3 problem that it took me over a year to get rid of. I still curse myself for letting my doctor do it! You don't want it. She's just going to have to cope with a bit of anxiety until things get sorted. She's probably well paid for what you are putting her through.

MacGilchrist.

P.S. I strongly suggest that you buy Dr Brownstein's book about iodine. It has all sorts of reassuring info in it and explains in much greater detail the particular point you are worried about here.

From: <r_long@...>iodine Sent: Wed, 26 January, 2011 18:16:48Subject: Re: Help ! My TSH went bananas !

,Thank you so much for writing. Yes, I was not thrilled at her reaction. I have 2 months until my next blood test. Should that give me enough time for it to come down ? btw I feel fine.. normal... so thats a good sign. She wanted to increase my level of synthyroid. I asked her to hold off until the next blood test.I may back down to 2 or 3 mg of Iodine because if she sees my TSH is still high she might flip again lol. This means it will take longer to get to my full saturation I guess.What do you think ?> >> > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on > >a scale of 7-17.> > > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.> >>

January 26, 2011

Perfect example of what I was talking about; She says lab results make no sense

at all, but I bet it never occurred to her to QUESTION the accuracy of the lab

results;i.e. order another test, from a different lab, to confirm.

Shouldn't have told her you were taking iodine.

TSH test is a particularly cursed test.Standards are wrong.Even peoploe who

developed the test have (finally) admitted they didn't screen the individuals

they used to establish the standard, to eliminate those who were hypo.

Is mistakenly believed to be a valid test for detirmining Thyroid function; its

not.It is a highly accurate test, for what it detirmines.This is one reason

Dr.'s are taught to focus on it so much.But, it only tests whether the HPA axis

is working correctly.Not Thyroid function.

If she IS going to treat by test results, at least she could ordeer the right

tests; Free T-4 and free T-3.

And, when she gets a test result which 'Doesn't make any sense', she could

consider re0testing, to confirm.Jim

>

> I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She

says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite

upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on

a scale of 7-17.

>

> TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

>

> What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even

go high on the selenium at 500/day.

>

> Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

>

> She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

>

January 26, 2011

, Thank you,

Oh, and I just checked with a national chain bookstore and the book by Dr

Brownstein is not even in their computer. The operator even checked with the

isbn which she obtained on the internet. Its not listed. I can't find it on

Amazon.ca either. I might have to order it from Amazon US.

Yes, I will find it and read it.

Once again, thank you,

> > >

> > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She

> >

> > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

> >quite

> >

> > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is

7.6

> >on

> >

> > >a scale of 7-17.

> > >

> > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> > >

> > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even

> >

> > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> > >

> > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> > >

> > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2011

Dutch,

I thought about possible test inaccuracies. I mean from .03 to 18 is a radical

jump from Nov.. So in less than 3 months.

Then it occurred to me that the Iodine might be doing something. In hindsight, I

should not have told her I was taking Iodine. After all, Iodine is a natural

food substance, and I am trying to feed my body. My impression is that doctors

don't usually care much how you choose to feed yourself. Nutritionists do, yes,

but not doctors.. thats my impression. I could be wrong. I have brought up

nutrition before and it usually gets brushed off.

All of the best,

> >

> > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is

7.6 on a scale of 7-17.

> >

> > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> >

> > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> >

> > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> >

> > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> >

>

January 26, 2011

Did they test Free T3? It is very common to have increases in TSH up to 75 for 6 mos after starting iodine with no signs of hypothyroidism. Dr. Brownstein has addressed this either in his book or a lecture. The body is doing this to create more thyroglobulin in order to bind to the iodine to create more thyroid hormone. This is a good thing. Remember that TSH is a pituitary hormone and not a thyroid hormone and one of the many reasons why it is a bad indicator of thyroid health. That lab range for what you call Free T4 looks like a T4 range and that is also not a good indicator. It is the bound protein and not all of that is available for usage. You can see though that it is at the bottom of the range and you don't want to be there. Mid range or above is usually where people feel the best.

Here is an explination of the function http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/minerals/iodine/

What were your T4 levels before? How do you feel?

Are you only taking 5 mgs of iodine? That's nothing if you are and would not have this kind of effect. Did your doctor test for any antibodies. Because if you had a swing in hypo since your last test it may be due to increase antibodies against the thyroid. Sounds like they need to look a bit further.

This brings up the point. When mentioning iodine to a doctor they will immediately blame the issue on it. Then they stop looking. In my humble opinion it is best to let it slide and not mention it if you don't want a hassle because 99 times out of 100 they will not like it and tell you to stop.

Help ! My TSH went bananas !

I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on a scale of 7-17.TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even go high on the selenium at 500/day.Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

January 26, 2011

It is all good and you do not need permission to do what you are doing. Go by how you feel. That is the most important.

Steph

Re: Help ! My TSH went bananas !

Donna,Thank you. I am going to take the time to consider what you have written. Slowly my understanding of this is increasing. Docs get so bent out of shape with thyroid issues ! Sheesh ! I was expecting a call to reduce thyroid meds because I feel an increase in energy. I can tell the Iodine is doing something. Its encouraging to think of where this will take me once my saturation level is achieved.All good,> > >> > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She> > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite> > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on> > >a scale of 7-17.> > >> > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > >> > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even> > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > >> > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > >> > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.> > >> >> > ________________________________>

January 26, 2011

He doesn't market it in the regular system. He sells it right from his website at www.drbrownstein.com

Re: Help ! My TSH went bananas !

, Thank you, Oh, and I just checked with a national chain bookstore and the book by Dr Brownstein is not even in their computer. The operator even checked with the isbn which she obtained on the internet. Its not listed. I can't find it on Amazon.ca either. I might have to order it from Amazon US. Yes, I will find it and read it.Once again, thank you,> > >> > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She > >> > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was > >quite > >> > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 > >on > >> > >a scale of 7-17.> > > > > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > > > > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even > >> > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > > > > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > > > > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.> > >> >>

January 26, 2011

What about the production of iodolipids? Does this not block thyroglobulin and

NIS production because of the inhibition of cAMP?

>

> Did they test Free T3? It is very common to have increases in TSH up to 75

for 6 mos after starting iodine with no signs of hypothyroidism. Dr. Brownstein

has addressed this either in his book or a lecture. The body is doing this to

create more thyroglobulin in order to bind to the iodine to create more thyroid

hormone. This is a good thing. Remember that TSH is a pituitary hormone and

not a thyroid hormone and one of the many reasons why it is a bad indicator of

thyroid health. That lab range for what you call Free T4 looks like a T4 range

and that is also not a good indicator. It is the bound protein and not all of

that is available for usage. You can see though that it is at the bottom of the

range and you don't want to be there. Mid range or above is usually where

people feel the best.

>

> Here is an explination of the function

http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/minerals/iodine/

>

> What were your T4 levels before? How do you feel?

>

> Are you only taking 5 mgs of iodine? That's nothing if you are and would not

have this kind of effect. Did your doctor test for any antibodies. Because if

you had a swing in hypo since your last test it may be due to increase

antibodies against the thyroid. Sounds like they need to look a bit further.

>

> This brings up the point. When mentioning iodine to a doctor they will

immediately blame the issue on it. Then they stop looking. In my humble

opinion it is best to let it slide and not mention it if you don't want a hassle

because 99 times out of 100 they will not like it and tell you to stop.

>

> Help ! My TSH went bananas !

>

> I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is

7.6 on a scale of 7-17.

>

> TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

>

> What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even go high on the selenium at 500/day.

>

> Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

>

> She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

>

January 26, 2011

No - the body is smart. Iodolipids are used to regulate the thyroid not shut it down. When the body needs more hormones then it makes more. Iodolipids stop the oxidation process from running out of control.

Help ! My TSH went bananas !> > > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on a scale of 7-17.> > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.> > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even go high on the selenium at 500/day.> > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?> > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.>

January 26, 2011

This is one of the big problems with trying to combine mainstream allopathic treatment with alternative stuff. Docs will frequently scoff about your supplements, or become actively hostile toward them, & try to send you in a totally different direction. The frustrating part is that there are thing that docs can do for you that nobody else can do. (My recent appendicitis is a clear example. I could have died if I hadn't had my appendix out.) It is not as though you can totally turn your back on medicine. If you break your leg, you want a good doc who knows how to set it. You are throwing the baby out with the bathwater if you refuse to see a doc for those things for which they are best.But docs don't play well with others. Most of them can't accept any idea that isn't allopathic, & aren't interested in even LISTENING to ideas that don't fit their mindset.My sister (who is probably SERIOUSLY iodine deficient) found a doc once who prescribed thyroid meds for her, even though she tested "normal." This one doc was actually brave enough to treat people for their symptoms, rather than their test scores, & my sister's health improved significantly. But when my sister moved to another state, she could not find any doc who would renew her prescription, because she tested "normal." (And every doc she consulted tried to put her on anti-depressents, even though she told them all that she had been put on them before with no results.) She kept saying that the thyroid meds had made her feel much better, but the docs all insisted on telling her that she had been poisoned. So she sank back into her illness. (And no, I cannot get her on iodine, because she no longer speaks to me. She thinks *I* am nuts to take supplements...)I don't have any answer for you. I still haven't figured out how to deal with this disconnect. In may cases, it is better not to tell a doc what you are taking, so you can avoid the whole argument. But you are in a particularly awkward spot, because the iodine you are taking really does have an influence on the test score. The iodine explains the spike in your TSH which would otherwise be worrisome. But your doc is going to worry about it, no matter what you say, because she is not going to accept your explanation about iodine...Since the normal pattern is for TSH to come back down after a while, I guess that waiting might help. But since you are not going at the iodine protocol full-bore, it might take longer for your TSH to go down...Good luck.AnneOn Jan 26, 2011, at 9:16 AM, wrote: , Thank you so much for writing. Yes, I was not thrilled at her reaction. I have 2 months until my next blood test. Should that give me enough time for it to come down ? btw I feel fine.. normal... so thats a good sign. She wanted to increase my level of synthyroid. I asked her to hold off until the next blood test. I may back down to 2 or 3 mg of Iodine because if she sees my TSH is still high she might flip again lol. This means it will take longer to get to my full saturation I guess. What do you think ? > > > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 ! She > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was quite > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is 7.6 on > >a scale of 7-17. > > > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine. > > > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I even > >go high on the selenium at 500/day. > > > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ? > > > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months. > > >

January 26, 2011

Thank you Anne.

> > > >

> > > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and

> > now its 18 ! She

> > > >says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine

> > and she was quite

> > > >upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My

> > free T 4 is 7.6 on

> > > >a scale of 7-17.

> > > >

> > > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> > > >

> > > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By

> > the book. I even

> > > >go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> > > >

> > > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> > > >

> > > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> > > >

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2011

MDs are taught to treat your bloodstream, not your metabolism. They flip out

because they know you have the option of " non-compliance " . They flip out because

non-compliance often works better than compliance.

On the other side of the coin, they have to comply rigidly with protocols and

standards that do not work. Whew, talk about being caught in the middle.

> > >

> > > I just saw my doc and she flipped bc my TSH was 3 in Nov and now its 18 !

She says it makes no sense at all. I told her I was taking Iodine and she was

quite upset. Told me to stop because it was messing up my TSH . My free T 4 is

7.6 on a scale of 7-17.

> > >

> > > TSH scale is .50-4.80.. I'm at 18 after starting on Iodine.

> > >

> > > What gives ? I am taking 5 mg with all the support nutes. By the book. I

even go high on the selenium at 500/day.

> > >

> > > Will my TSH remain high like this for long ? Need I quit Iodine ?

> > >

> > > She wants a follow up blood in 2 months.

> > >

> >

>

January 26, 2011

Hello Steph,

They did not test free T3. I have the report in front of me. They test for

free T4 and TSH .. thats it.

You say TSH can go to 75.. omg.. so then 18 is not the end of the world ?

I am glad that TSH increases are normal when you begin Iodine.

I don't have any of my previous T4 level reports. I asked for a copy of

this one bc of the way she reacted and the possibility of addressing the results

here. I feel fine.

I'll never mention Iodine again with a doctor.

If there are anti-body issues I am taking 500/day of selenium and the rest

of the nutes. I asked about anti-bodies this AM and was more or less brushed

off. Maybe my doc will be better disposed to discuss anti-bodies some other

time. If there are anti-body issues the selenium is supposed to cover that right

?

I am taking the support nutes in the best forms I could find and the best

quality vites that are available locally and from Swanson who I trust for

quality.

Thank you very much for replying, be well,