Lugols for Breast Nodule....w/Hashimoto's

February 18, 2011

Forgot to add, most breast cancers are not genetic.

Posted by: "Kira" kirashrem@... kirashrem@...

Fri Feb 18, 2011 3:53 pm (PST)

Hi lovely women of the Iodine Forum, Kira in Oregon here; it's been a long time since I've read and posted. Unfortunately, since the last time I was on, I've developed a breast situation, in addition to long-standing well-developed Hashimoto's. My story is explained articulately below, and I would love some quick advice from those of you on here who know a lot. If you don't want to read my whole story (it's articulate but a little long.....)please just read the next two paragraphs and advise if you can. My essential question: Re: Iodoral and Lugols, what's the best way to straddle the delicate balance between using Iodoral orally + Lugol's painted on breasts for nodules and FBD, WHILE NOT overstimulating my thyroid? I have well-documented Hashimoto's w/goiter. The last time I took more than 1 Iodoral @ 12.5 mg., my TPO Antibody levels crept up and up slowly, indicating increasing inflammation. I now have a worrisome breast nodule and want to increase my iodine consumption and paint Lugols on the girls. Any ideas? Any threads to point me to for a good discussion on this? I need to disappear the nodule (and my other breast lumps) w/out freaking out my thyroid. I've been on Iodoral for two years with no problem. I've read a ton, a ton, so speaking in shorthand and cutting right to the chase is great. I'm not a newbie with this.Lynne at breastcancerchoices.org ordered me to write to all of you before I use iodine for long, so I am.Thanks for any help and suggestions! Full story below!KiraAs briefly as possible for a long and complex story, here goes: I'm a 49 yo woman at-menopause, with FBD and many cysts, and periodic mastitis.Being an Ashkenazi Jew, with a grandmother who had BC w/lumpectomy and radiation at 66 yo, I've been concerned about BC because of my FBD and my bioidentical hormone use. I saw a genetic counselor several months ago, and she ran three tests. Not the entire BRCA1 and BRCA2 panel, but three tests specific to Jews. I was negative for all three mutations. So it looks like I'm at the same high risk the rest of us are.I have a 1.1 cm breast solid hypoechoic breast nodule, and have some chronic mild mastitis/pain associated with it. I'm on BHRT---the lowest estradiol patch (.025 mg.), + compounded progesterone (still have uterus, ovaries), and small splashes of compounded estriol, testosterone creams. All are keeping me happy and sane in my life and in coping a very demanding and stressful job.I've had two thermograms---both studies noted the nodule and noted vascular normal flow to the area; thermogram rated TH3. Followup ultrasounds immediately after both thermograms, in Aug. 2010 and Dec. 2010, noted several simple and complex cysts, and saw the same solid hypoechoic nodule. Mammogram two years ago saw "distorted breast architecture" and 2nd follow-up mammo said, "no, summation shadow, not true mass," but looking back, I now think the mammo was picking up presence of the nodule.The worrisome nodule---a 1.1 cm solid hypoechoic nodule, "probably benign," BI-RADS 3. Radiologist both times recommended watch and wait, six month followup, and said "probably fibroadenoma".After second ultrasound, the FNP who does my hormones recommended I see a breast surgeon. I saw him, we looked at both ultrasounds, and he disagreed w/radiologist's watch and wait idea. He said there's a certain kind of papillary neoplasm that is slow-growing that looks similar to what I have---and he also said that it probably is a fibroadenoma, like the radiologist said.He said "core needle biopsy" as soon as I could---but also said if I had to wait three weeks to get in it was okay and was "not an emergency".The nodule, from what he said and from the reading I've since done, has some characteristics of possibly malignant nodules and also, of possibly benign ones. It's larger than 1 cm., it's casting a shadow, it has a few irregular edges (not totally oval), and so on, but it didn't grow in the four months from August 2010 to December 2010 (the two times I had an ultrasound/thermography combo). I scheduled the biopsy, and then talked to my naturopath, who specializes in oncology. After conversations with naturopath about excisional vs. core biopsy, I emailed the surgeon. I asked him:#1. What best and worst possible outcomes if I defer the biopsy a bit longer and wait until June, my next six month ultrasound + thermogram combo?#2. Would he do an excisional biopsy rather than CNB?His answers: #1.) Re: My decision to defer biopsy for a little while---there's the usual statistical 80%/20% chance that this is a benign nodule, so it depends on how much risk I'm comfortable with; and #2.) He doesn't do excisionals. My plan for the moment, subject to change: First, I am going to see the naturopath in two weeks and try to get the name of a 2nd opinion breast surgeon, although I really do like this guy and he has a good reputation as the best breast surgeon in this area. Secondly, Lugols. I've been on Iodoral for two years, and am currently taking 12.5 mg. daily. I have a goiter and well-documented bad Hashimoto's. I'm loathe to take more Iodoral, because when I went up to 2 and 3 tabs daily my TPO antibody levels started creeping up. I bought a bottle of Lugols and for the past week have been painting both 6 drops, enough to total 50 mg. daily with the combination of both Lugols and Iodoral. This is my best thinking at this point, with all this fear and chattering of teeth. I want to buy myself some time. I'm doing all the right thingsâ€¦â€¦â€¦.taking I3C, DIM, Iodoral, exercising, etc., but I'm still freaked as to whether or not I'm doing myself harm by waiting a few more months, to see if one more round of imaging reveals any changes or not. Sorry all----this was anything but brief. Any additional thoughts to add to everything in my brain?Thanks for any help! Kira

February 18, 2011

Hi lovely women of the Iodine Forum,

Kira in Oregon here; it's been a long time since I've read and posted.

Unfortunately, since the last time I was on, I've developed a breast situation,

in addition to long-standing well-developed Hashimoto's. My story is explained

articulately below, and I would love some quick advice from those of you on here

who know a lot. If you don't want to read my whole story (it's articulate but a

little long.....)please just read the next two paragraphs and advise if you can.

My essential question: Re: Iodoral and Lugols, what's the best way to straddle

the delicate balance between using Iodoral orally + Lugol's painted on breasts

for nodules and FBD, WHILE NOT overstimulating my thyroid? I have

well-documented Hashimoto's w/goiter.

The last time I took more than 1 Iodoral @ 12.5 mg., my TPO Antibody levels

crept up and up slowly, indicating increasing inflammation. I now have a

worrisome breast nodule and want to increase my iodine consumption and paint

Lugols on the girls. Any ideas? Any threads to point me to for a good discussion

on this? I need to disappear the nodule (and my other breast lumps) w/out

freaking out my thyroid. I've been on Iodoral for two years with no problem.

I've read a ton, a ton, so speaking in shorthand and cutting right to the chase

is great. I'm not a newbie with this.Lynne at breastcancerchoices.org ordered

me to write to all of you before I use iodine for long, so I am.

Thanks for any help and suggestions! Full story below!

Kira

As briefly as possible for a long and complex story, here goes: I'm a 49 yo

woman at-menopause, with FBD and many cysts, and periodic mastitis.

Being an Ashkenazi Jew, with a grandmother who had BC w/lumpectomy and radiation

at 66 yo, I've been concerned about BC because of my FBD and my bioidentical

hormone use. I saw a genetic counselor several months ago, and she ran three

tests. Not the entire BRCA1 and BRCA2 panel, but three tests specific to Jews. I

was negative for all three mutations. So it looks like I'm at the same high risk

the rest of us are.

I have a 1.1 cm breast solid hypoechoic breast nodule, and have some chronic

mild mastitis/pain associated with it. I'm on BHRT---the lowest estradiol patch

(.025 mg.), + compounded progesterone (still have uterus, ovaries), and small

splashes of compounded estriol, testosterone creams. All are keeping me happy

and sane in my life and in coping a very demanding and stressful job.

I've had two thermograms---both studies noted the nodule and noted vascular

normal flow to the area; thermogram rated TH3. Followup ultrasounds immediately

after both thermograms, in Aug. 2010 and Dec. 2010, noted several simple and

complex cysts, and saw the same solid hypoechoic nodule.

Mammogram two years ago saw " distorted breast architecture " and 2nd follow-up

mammo said, " no, summation shadow, not true mass, " but looking back, I now think

the mammo was picking up presence of the nodule.

The worrisome nodule---a 1.1 cm solid hypoechoic nodule, " probably benign, "

BI-RADS 3. Radiologist both times recommended watch and wait, six month

followup, and said " probably fibroadenoma " .

After second ultrasound, the FNP who does my hormones recommended I see a breast

surgeon. I saw him, we looked at both ultrasounds, and he disagreed

w/radiologist's watch and wait idea. He said there's a certain kind of papillary

neoplasm that is slow-growing that looks similar to what I have---and he also

said that it probably is a fibroadenoma, like the radiologist said.He said " core

needle biopsy " as soon as I could---but also said if I had to wait three weeks

to get in it was okay and was " not an emergency " .

The nodule, from what he said and from the reading I've since done, has some

characteristics of possibly malignant nodules and also, of possibly benign ones.

It's larger than 1 cm., it's casting a shadow, it has a few irregular edges (not

totally oval), and so on, but it didn't grow in the four months from August 2010

to December 2010 (the two times I had an ultrasound/thermography combo).

I scheduled the biopsy, and then talked to my naturopath, who specializes in

oncology. After conversations with naturopath about excisional vs. core biopsy,

I emailed the surgeon. I asked him:

#1. What best and worst possible outcomes if I defer the biopsy a bit longer and

wait until June, my next six month ultrasound + thermogram combo?

#2. Would he do an excisional biopsy rather than CNB?

His answers: #1.) Re: My decision to defer biopsy for a little while---there's

the usual statistical 80%/20% chance that this is a benign nodule, so it depends

on how much risk I'm comfortable with; and #2.) He doesn't do excisionals.

My plan for the moment, subject to change:

First, I am going to see the naturopath in two weeks and try to get the name of

a 2nd opinion breast surgeon, although I really do like this guy and he has a

good reputation as the best breast surgeon in this area.

Secondly, Lugols. I've been on Iodoral for two years, and am currently taking

12.5 mg. daily. I have a goiter and well-documented bad Hashimoto's. I'm loathe

to take more Iodoral, because when I went up to 2 and 3 tabs daily my TPO

antibody levels started creeping up. I bought a bottle of Lugols and for the

past week have been painting both 6 drops, enough to total 50 mg. daily with the

combination of both Lugols and Iodoral.

This is my best thinking at this point, with all this fear and chattering of

teeth. I want to buy myself some time. I'm doing all the right things……….taking

I3C, DIM, Iodoral, exercising, etc., but I'm still freaked as to whether or not

I'm doing myself harm by waiting a few more months, to see if one more round of

imaging reveals any changes or not.

Sorry all----this was anything but brief. Any additional thoughts to add to

everything in my brain?

Thanks for any help! Kira

February 18, 2011

Kira,Has anyone recommended that you take DIM, TMG, DMG, calcium -d-glucarate? Those help to decrease excess estrogen which tends to bring down the rating to even better numbers. Liver work seems to always help in these situations. Seems like you are doing right things. I live in Oregon too. My best dr having baby in March so mostly email for month or two around then. She treats you toward health. Pam

On Fri, Feb 18, 2011 at 3:27 PM, Kira <kirashrem@...> wrote:

Hi lovely women of the Iodine Forum,

Kira in Oregon here; it's been a long time since I've read and posted. Unfortunately, since the last time I was on, I've developed a breast situation, in addition to long-standing well-developed Hashimoto's. My story is explained articulately below, and I would love some quick advice from those of you on here who know a lot. If you don't want to read my whole story (it's articulate but a little long.....)please just read the next two paragraphs and advise if you can.

My essential question: Re: Iodoral and Lugols, what's the best way to straddle the delicate balance between using Iodoral orally + Lugol's painted on breasts for nodules and FBD, WHILE NOT overstimulating my thyroid? I have well-documented Hashimoto's w/goiter.

The last time I took more than 1 Iodoral @ 12.5 mg., my TPO Antibody levels crept up and up slowly, indicating increasing inflammation. I now have a worrisome breast nodule and want to increase my iodine consumption and paint Lugols on the girls. Any ideas? Any threads to point me to for a good discussion on this? I need to disappear the nodule (and my other breast lumps) w/out freaking out my thyroid. I've been on Iodoral for two years with no problem. I've read a ton, a ton, so speaking in shorthand and cutting right to the chase is great. I'm not a newbie with this.Lynne at breastcancerchoices.org ordered me to write to all of you before I use iodine for long, so I am.

Thanks for any help and suggestions! Full story below!

Kira

As briefly as possible for a long and complex story, here goes: I'm a 49 yo woman at-menopause, with FBD and many cysts, and periodic mastitis.

Being an Ashkenazi Jew, with a grandmother who had BC w/lumpectomy and radiation at 66 yo, I've been concerned about BC because of my FBD and my bioidentical hormone use. I saw a genetic counselor several months ago, and she ran three tests. Not the entire BRCA1 and BRCA2 panel, but three tests specific to Jews. I was negative for all three mutations. So it looks like I'm at the same high risk the rest of us are.

I have a 1.1 cm breast solid hypoechoic breast nodule, and have some chronic mild mastitis/pain associated with it. I'm on BHRT---the lowest estradiol patch (.025 mg.), + compounded progesterone (still have uterus, ovaries), and small splashes of compounded estriol, testosterone creams. All are keeping me happy and sane in my life and in coping a very demanding and stressful job.

I've had two thermograms---both studies noted the nodule and noted vascular normal flow to the area; thermogram rated TH3. Followup ultrasounds immediately after both thermograms, in Aug. 2010 and Dec. 2010, noted several simple and complex cysts, and saw the same solid hypoechoic nodule.

Mammogram two years ago saw " distorted breast architecture " and 2nd follow-up mammo said, " no, summation shadow, not true mass, " but looking back, I now think the mammo was picking up presence of the nodule.

The worrisome nodule---a 1.1 cm solid hypoechoic nodule, " probably benign, " BI-RADS 3. Radiologist both times recommended watch and wait, six month followup, and said " probably fibroadenoma " .

After second ultrasound, the FNP who does my hormones recommended I see a breast surgeon. I saw him, we looked at both ultrasounds, and he disagreed w/radiologist's watch and wait idea. He said there's a certain kind of papillary neoplasm that is slow-growing that looks similar to what I have---and he also said that it probably is a fibroadenoma, like the radiologist said.He said " core needle biopsy " as soon as I could---but also said if I had to wait three weeks to get in it was okay and was " not an emergency " .

The nodule, from what he said and from the reading I've since done, has some characteristics of possibly malignant nodules and also, of possibly benign ones. It's larger than 1 cm., it's casting a shadow, it has a few irregular edges (not totally oval), and so on, but it didn't grow in the four months from August 2010 to December 2010 (the two times I had an ultrasound/thermography combo).

I scheduled the biopsy, and then talked to my naturopath, who specializes in oncology. After conversations with naturopath about excisional vs. core biopsy, I emailed the surgeon. I asked him:

#1. What best and worst possible outcomes if I defer the biopsy a bit longer and wait until June, my next six month ultrasound + thermogram combo?

#2. Would he do an excisional biopsy rather than CNB?

His answers: #1.) Re: My decision to defer biopsy for a little while---there's the usual statistical 80%/20% chance that this is a benign nodule, so it depends on how much risk I'm comfortable with; and #2.) He doesn't do excisionals.

My plan for the moment, subject to change:

First, I am going to see the naturopath in two weeks and try to get the name of a 2nd opinion breast surgeon, although I really do like this guy and he has a good reputation as the best breast surgeon in this area.

Secondly, Lugols. I've been on Iodoral for two years, and am currently taking 12.5 mg. daily. I have a goiter and well-documented bad Hashimoto's. I'm loathe to take more Iodoral, because when I went up to 2 and 3 tabs daily my TPO antibody levels started creeping up. I bought a bottle of Lugols and for the past week have been painting both 6 drops, enough to total 50 mg. daily with the combination of both Lugols and Iodoral.

This is my best thinking at this point, with all this fear and chattering of teeth. I want to buy myself some time. I'm doing all the right things……….taking I3C, DIM, Iodoral, exercising, etc., but I'm still freaked as to whether or not I'm doing myself harm by waiting a few more months, to see if one more round of imaging reveals any changes or not.

Sorry all----this was anything but brief. Any additional thoughts to add to everything in my brain?

Thanks for any help! Kira

February 18, 2011

Personally, I’d go with a second opinion from a breast surgeon, and consider the excisional biopsy. If there is a history of breast cancer, I don’t see the point of waiting around in agony. Just my opinion. 2 years ago I had a couple of MRI biopsies done, which were inconclusive, so the docs thought a wait and see approach could be ok. Finally, a different doc said to go excisional, even though the chances of cancer on this type of area was very low. It came back with cancer....after goofing around for about 8 months. It was found super early, which means I had plenty of options in front of me. I have few regrets through the process, except wishing they’d have just done the excisional sooner and gotten a good look sooner. Biopsies do get bits and pieces, but can miss the central area which is a problem. Excisional attempts to take out the entire area in question and then look at it more carefully. I did not have the same type of lesion as you have, so maybe my opinion is not applicable.

February 28, 2011

Hi Kira,

How much iodoral did you take each day for the past two years?

Jen

>

> Hi lovely women of the Iodine Forum,

> Kira in Oregon here; it's been a long time since I've read and posted.