(No subject)

[Guest guest]

Hi .

Yes, there is an " alternative " homeopathic approach,

although if you talk to most naturopathic dr's they do

not call it an " alternative " ... protecting their own

butts. From what I understand they are effective, natural

and without any adverse side effects.

I am using them with my son (7 mo) and to date he has

had no colds, flu, ear infections, etc.

Hope this helps!

Sherri

Troy Lucas wrote:

> Does anyone know about alternative homeopathic vaccinations? I don't

> know if I am wording it correctly, but basically they are homeopathic

> remedies that give the immunity to the diseases in the same fashion

> that a vaccination would. Also, sorrya bout the 2 times I forwarded

> messags on the digest mode and everyone got the entire digest along

> with it. Embarrassing! I had no idea it would do that.

[Guest guest]

> Does anyone know about alternative homeopathic vaccinations? I

don't know if I am wording it correctly, but basically they are

homeopathic remedies that give the immunity to the diseases in the

same fashion that a vaccination would.

>

jennifer, they're called nosodes. homeopaths are generally split over

the issue, some give them, others, mostly classical homeopaths don't.

hope this helps.

claudia

==

http://homepages.infoseek.com/~lovingdolphin1/geninfo.html silly verses

http://www.freeyellow.com/members6/saraavidolphin/index.html go holistic!

http://www.freeyellow.com/members6/saraavidolphin/page1.html channelings about

atlantis and today

icq 8082968 subscribe to NATURAL_PARENT,

/subscribe.cgi/natural_parent

[Guest guest]

" Yes " is now at 42%....and I might say it took more than 35 votes to get

it to move up 1% !!!! Yes, I have better things to do with my time,

but it became a quest to see the percent look better in our favor!

>From: MeggyEm@...

>Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 13:59:23 EST

>Vaccinationsonelist, AVML@...,

onelist, via@..., Dwinkler@...,

AVNonelist

>Reply-to: Vaccinationsonelist

>Subject: (no subject)

>

>From: MeggyEm@...

>

>

>Go here and cast your votes!!!!! So far only 39% say yes.

>

><A HREF= " http://www.babycenter.com/poll/2465.html " >Do You Think

Vaccines Are

>Overused?

>http://www.babycenter.com/poll/2465.html</A>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

>Did you know that we have over 85,000 e-mail communities at Onelist?

>

>Come visit our new web site and explore a new interest

>

[Guest guest]

,

Do you have any more info. on the Church of Illumination? I may need to look

into it shortly (currently NJ only has a " religious " exemption). I am

interested in homeschooling but my husband is very much against it, (our public

school system is one of the best in the U.S. and he thinks she should have the

socialization of going to school with her neighbors and friends). He does

support my Non-vaccination stand, and agrees that even if she attends public

school, she WILL NOT be immunized.

Any info. would be helpful.

Thanks-

Alice

--

Visit http://www.ivillage.com for your FREE iVillage.com email account.

iVillage.com: The Women's Network -- Real Solutions for Busy Women.

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 3/30/99 5:00:12 PM Eastern Standard Time,

amy.floyd@... writes:

<< I have a hard time believing that breastmilk doesn't have the

perfect amount of nutrients that a baby needs, including VitK. Why

would it be lacking in one vitamin? Maybe the amounts are less than

in artificial milk, but maybe as with iron, it is enough as it may be

more bioavailable, more readily absorbed by the infants system.

Just my thoughts........Amy >>

My thoughts exactly! Breastmilk is the only truly healthy food for an infant,

and it has been proven superior to all " alternatives " , there must be a God-

given reason for the lower levels of vit K present. Just because science does

not have an answer yet, does not mean that one does not exist....we just have

not figured it out yet )

~~G

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/6/99 12:37:51 AM Eastern Daylight Time, marcy@...

writes:

<< Is it rare? Yes. Can it happen? Yes.

So again educate yourselves enough to get the best of both worlds.

Nothing is either/or the only really important outcome hopefully is a

safe baby.

Yes, birth experience matters, but I think most people would give that

up

if they had to trade it for safe outcome. And that is where the problem

lies.

Sometimes it may be better to error on the side of safety.

I felt really bad for this couple, really bad.

Marcy

>>

I must say that I am impressed by your attitude. I think that if you looked

into the possible ramifications of a negative birth experience you may alter

your position on it a bit. I am going to look for some websites that you

might be interested in perusing when you have the time. Granted, they are

not that great, but they might interest you in delving further into the

subject. Pique your curiosity, you know?

Anyway, I still disagree with your position to err on the side of safety.

Those so-called safety precautions do cause quite a few deaths of their own.

Hospitals are not safe for at least 90% of women, I am basing this opinion on

statistics...not just common sense. I do agree with you, however, that fetal

monitoring may be warranted in a substantial number of cases---but it

definitely should not be the status quo. That woman's baby may have died

anyway, even if you cut it out of her womb. Hospitals have much higher death

rates than nature would indicate---that is just a fact. With all of our

modern medicine: our drugs, our monitors, our separatist mentality, our

scapel-happy doctor's--- the United States is only ranked sixteenth for

infant mortality. SIXTEENTH!! Obviously, we are doing something very wrong.

It is quite clear that our approach to birth as something serious that

requires medical treatment, is taking innocent babies' lives.

~~G

[Guest guest]

Could someone please answer a very simple question for me.... Why do we have to

put up with ad nauseum stories on labour/delivery and fetal monitoring on a site

which is supposed to be about VACCINATIONS?

I am sick and tired of having to plow through extraneous information totally

unrelated to stated topics of interest. For those who think its cute to

splatter

unrelated topics throughout cyber-space, be aware that those of us who are busy

do not take kindly to having to scroll through 51 messages before we get to one

that actually fits the topic. Find a discussion group of like-minded people,

and

let those of us with different concerns rationalize our time to the best

advantage of others who have VACCINE questions. And... VITAMIN K is not a

vaccine. For those who want information on the subject, do what the rest of us

did - go to a medical library and find out.

sherules@...

Please Check out my Web Page at

http://www.geocities.com/HotSprings/Villa/2009/

[Guest guest]

WOW WEE!

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 4/7/99 12:10:44 AM Eastern Daylight Time,

sherules@... writes:

<< And... VITAMIN K is not a

vaccine. For those who want information on the subject, do what the rest of

us

did - go to a medical library and find out. >>

Try again! WOW WEE! K

[Guest guest]

What a pity. I don't go for X-files conspiracy theories either.

Sebastiana

At 09:13 PM 5/1/99 -0800, you wrote:

>From: dmulhall@... (Don)

>

>Regarding the article below, the author, Pattison was successful in

>getting Dr. Len Horowitz to visit Penticton, the community near my home

>town. Being a new mom (and new to this vaccination mail list) I was quite

>exicted because I'd recently been reading everything I could get my hands

>on regarding the vaccination issue. I had finally decided to give my 5

>month old son no more shots (he unfortunately has already recieved his 2 &

>4 month DPTP).

>

>My husband and I got Grandma to babysit and took off to hear Dr. Horowitz.

>We left 2 1/2 hours or so into it, very disappointed. It was such a huge

>turnout for a town our size that they had to open up another conference

>room (over 400 people showed up). He started out alright, but never really

>got to the specific vaccinations as he kept saying he would. He always

>struck us as being a bit over-zealous. We felt like we were listening to a

>televangelist instead of a well-respected doctor. By the time the

>intermission came and went, well over half the crowd had left. We stayed

>another 40 minutes or so, but it was increasingly disappointing. Dr.

>Horowitz continued to lose credibility as he told us that military

>helicopters were spraying us with diseases, that government vaccination

>programs were " not immunization but genocide " designed to kill blacks,

>Hispanics and Jews, and that his next book uncovers a bible code that is

>the key to health that monks covered up when they copied the bible. It

>just got more and more far fetched -- it could have been a script for the

>X-Files.

>

>I think that Dr. Horowitz has gotten way too caught up in his work. It's

>so unfortunate because I understand he was one of the first people

>responsible for bringing the anti-vaccination issue to light. I felt

>especially bad for the people who hadn't done any research prior to coming

>to hear Dr. Horowitz speak. I'm sure they left there all the more

>determined to continue to vaccinate! As for myself, I went BACK to the

>library to check out more books on the topic. I went to the lecture

>convinced not to vaccinate, but after hearing Dr. H., I had to renew my

>faith.

>

>

>News Talk Radio, Canada

>

>Researcher warns of dangers in vaccines

>

>Story Posted April 01, 1999 at 08:45

>

>By Pattison

>

>Penticton Herald

>

>PENTICTON, B.C. (CP) _ Vaccinations commonly given to Canadian children may

>be making them sick, says a U.S.

>researcher.

>

>Generations of North Americans have been immunized without even giving it a

>second thought, said Leonard Horowitz. But the Idaho-based researcher and

>anti-immunization crusader said he's found a link between diseases such as

>multiple sclerosis, autism, asthma, Sudden Infant Death Syndrome and

>hyperactivity and the use of vaccines.

>

>``It's imperative people research this issue before making a decision,''

>Horowitz said in a telephone interview. ``It's one of the most important

>decisions they'll ever have to make.'' Many Canadian medical officials have

>recently blamed the fall in immunization rates for an increase in childhood

>diseases but Horowitz disagrees.

>

>An explosion of auto-immune diseases, autism, attention deficit disorders,

>epilepsy and asthma has prompted researchers around the world to explore

>possible links to vaccines, he said. The Centres For Disease Control in

>Atlanta has said, 99 per cent of adverse reactions to vaccines go

>unreported, Horowitz said.

>

>The centres' figures also show more than 45,000 vaccine-induced injuries

>were reported between 1990 and 1995, he said. That means almost 4.5 million

>vaccination-related injuries annually going unreported, said Horowitz, the

>author of 11 books.

>

>The system for tracking adverse reactions is as poor in Canada as it is in

>the U.S., he said. ``It's a holocaust of vaccine.'' Horowitz believes

>medical professionals are caring professionals who want to help their

>patients, ``but these people are cult followers.''

>

>Most haven't even done any research into the effects of vaccinations, he

>said. Horowitz, who graduated from Harvard's Masters of Public Health

>program, denounces all vaccines.

>

>Dr. Bonnie Dunbar, a New Zealand doctor at the department of cell biology at

>Baylor College of Medicine in Houston, Tex., has grave concerns about the

>Hepatitis B vaccine in particular. Dunbar's research has found links between

>the vaccine and auto-immune disorders.

>

>In Canada, Grade 6 children are often vaccinated for the disease typically

>contracted sexually or through intravenous drug use. In British Columbia,

>the immunization is administered before the high risk age category to

>increase the chance of controlling the disease, said Dr. Arlene King, acting

>director of epidemiology at the B.C. Centre For Disease Control in

>Vancouver.

>

>``We have a very, very high vaccination rate in B.C.,'' King said. But

>immunization is not mandatory in British Columbia, as it is in others such

>as Ontario, she said.

>

>``The vast majority of people in Canada support vaccination _ it's important

>to note that,'' King said.

>

>

>

>------------------------------------------------------------------------

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>http://www.ONElist.com

>ONElist: The Leading e-mail list and community service on the Internet!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Better late than never, I guess......catching up on e-mail.

What is up with polio in Mexico. I thought I remembered that the only place

that has naturally occuring polio is India? Why am I confused??

Anyway, for all those awful rotten parents who refuse to " protect " their

children (I am kidding) by immunization against all those dirty and diseased

foreigners (again, I am kidding, but my point is serious!), we should have a

massive outbreak of nearly every disease on the market with UNVACCINATED

children alone. Clearly, it is just not happening. Just a thought.

Thanks

(no subject)

>From: Mom2jriver@...

>

>A friend sent me this from another list that she is on. Does anyone feel

>like giving their thoughts on it. I would like to give my friend some

>information from the other side of the issue.

>

>

><<<The advice I aways give to nonvaccinating parents is that they have

>taken on a great responsibility to educate themselves in the signs,

>symptoms and consequences of the infections thier children are

>susceptable to. These are not " scare tactics " but rather a " wide-awake "

>approach to the realities of these infections. Oddly though, I find a

> " head in the sand " attitude very often, almost like " if we don't think

>about our child getting sick, it won't happen " . I find this odd, since

>these same parents are so very concerned about damage that might be

>caused by vaccines; yet are unwilling to educate themselves on the very

>real dangers of the infections. Pertussis is a particularly tricky

>one-looks like any other sniffles for up to 2 weeks before the

> " whooping " sets in. Once the characteristic cough and respiratory

>difficulty sets in, antibiotics do no good. So an unimmunized child with

>a " cold " needs to be watched much more carefully. Pertussis is generally

>passed from an adult to a child so daycare is not the main source.

>Pertussis looks like a typical cold in the adult. Pertussis is very

>serious in children under a year usually requiring hospitalization up to

>2 weeks to keep the lungs functioning with ventilators, nebulizers,

>steroids, etc..

>I am very concerned that people who are not vaccinating are somehow not

>getting all the information they need on how to detect these illnesses

>while in the early and still manageable stages. Tetanus has no cure- it

>is a long painful death, contracted as easily as from a prick with a

>rose thorn. If one is unimmunized for tetanus and gets a cut, it takes 4

>shots to get the immunity in place and these need to be started in the

>first 48 hours. Anyway, there's alot of reasons why these illnesse were

>chosen for vaccines and others not, among which they are often fatal or

>have serious consequences, like polio (which still occurs in Mexico and

>can be carried by anyone coming in from there, healthy or not). A good

>source for info on these diseases is someone who has worked with them in

>person. Any practitioner who hasn't seen or experinced these things has

>no reason to take them seriously and may not educate his patients

>accurately/thoroughly.

>Because I have worked with people who have experienced these illnesses

>and seen the lifelong effects and lengthy hospitalizations on tiny

>children, I have a sense for the horror of both parents and children

>when they are affected by these illnesses. Please... at least educate

>yourselves on these illnesses.>>>>

>

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>

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>

[Guest guest]

Message: 17

Date: Sat, 6 Nov 1999 06:31:09 -0000

From: " " <whale@...>

Subject: Re: Antibodies and Immunity

http://www.whale.to/Vaccines/antibody.html