ST question

[Guest guest]

Hi Tia,

I am a SLP. I teach Speech Pathology to

undergraduates. I appreciate your rejection of the

modus operandi of your therapist. Science is organised

common sense. What your common sense tells you is very

much right. You can request for alternate therapist.

Prof.Satya Mahapatra

--- and Knell <knells@...> wrote:

> Hi all,

> We just had our first ST session today. At the end

> of it, the ST told

> me that after today, she will be buckling in

> a chair with a tray

> for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want "

> and " More " . Those

> are the only two words we will work on until he gets

> them. After the

> first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high

> chair. She made no

> mention of using sign, even though he's starting to

> learn signs and has

> been signing both " want " and " more " for months.

> Right now we are

> scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We

> are supposed to be

> going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

>

> Is this a typical set up for ST? Being a ST novice,

> I don't really know

> what to expect, but this isn't it (if that makes

> sense). Is it the norm

> to buckle kids down like this and work across a

> tray? To my uneducated

> eye, it seems that this would make my son the

> passive recipient of what

> should be an active learning session. I also see

> that this could create

> an environment where she could easily invade his

> space and be

> disrespectful to his cues because he can't get away.

> I don't like this

> blatant statement of power over him, I guess. Are

> my fears unfounded?

>

> BTW, is 22 months old, completely

> non-verbal, no receptive delays.

>

> TIA,

>

> >

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

I have a very active 4 year old son who also has severe apraxia and

Sensory seeking behaviors ( diagnosed with SID) I have changed SLP many

times because just wasn't making progress. I am not a big fan of

strapping a 2, 3 or 4 year old or any child into a chair to work with them. I

agree

that it can frighten them and make them withdraw from therapy. My son's

extremely expensive therapist did this to him and he cried for most of the

$245.00 an hour session( she claimed she could work miracles) anyway, we got

rid

of her and found a lovely certified PROMPT therapist who generally work on the

floor with him. She will play games, use animals and toys to get him to

make the sounds she is focusing on. She does do some table time with him, but

she puts him into a chair she does not strap him in. He loves to go to speech

and gets upset if he misses. My son is very active and to strap him down

would be detrimental to his learning. He needs to be an active participant in

speech in order to succeed. I think you should go with your gut instinct and

look elsewhere for services. Good Luck, Dana in NJ

[Guest guest]

Our son is now four, and has apraxia and autism.

I am not a fan of the restraining chair, but others may tell you

differently. The first SLP we ever went to used one, and it did not help

at all. He was very resistant to it. I was also a novice, but my

instinct told me to find another SLP, and through talking with other parents

found a wonderful practice using primarily floortime/Greenspan and PROMPT

techniques, and it has been very successful for him. One thing I've learned

on this journey -- never ignore your parental instincts.

I'll be interested to hear how other parents and professionals respond about

these chairs.

Best,

Pam O'Connor

[ ] ST question

Hi all,

We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the ST told

me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair with a tray

for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want " and " More " . Those

are the only two words we will work on until he gets them. After the

first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She made no

mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs and has

been signing both " want " and " more " for months. Right now we are

scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We are supposed to be

going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

Is this a typical set up for ST? Being a ST novice, I don't really know

what to expect, but this isn't it (if that makes sense). Is it the norm

to buckle kids down like this and work across a tray? To my uneducated

eye, it seems that this would make my son the passive recipient of what

should be an active learning session. I also see that this could create

an environment where she could easily invade his space and be

disrespectful to his cues because he can't get away. I don't like this

blatant statement of power over him, I guess. Are my fears unfounded?

BTW, is 22 months old, completely non-verbal, no receptive delays.

TIA,

>

[Guest guest]

Hi,

It doesn't sound right to me. One of the things I learned from the program

More than Words from the Hanen Center is that you should engage language with

kids in things that interested him. I was doing it all wrong before, teaching

him to say mama/papa/more/milk/...etc. When I tried the Hanen approach, I

succeeded. The first word said is actually " pass gas " .(excuse me, he's a

very gasy baby!) I made this yucky expression and exclaimed " pass gas! "

and he was really happy. After a few takes, he got it. Just like that!

Strapping him to the high chair and just making your son say things he

doesn't need at that moment doesn't make sense to him and will definitely

anatongise the language experience.

Trust your instincts,

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

YIKES

I am no expert on the topic but seems like there has to be a better way. My

son would never tolerate that approach and the time would be both traumatic and

wasted. I would definately look into alternate therapies and another SLP. This

therapy method may have it's time and place but you know your son better than

anyone so trust your instincs. If it isn't right, it isn't right....period.

Good Luck

Martha

---------------------------------

New Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big.

[Guest guest]

I would tell anyone who suggested that, Thank You, we will not need

your services anymore! Thats sounds like a HORRIBLE way to get

results!! My 4dd had some great ST who worked calmly with toys and

oral stuff not force! they should suggest signing first to ease his

frustration. MOre is the EASIEST sign to learn and thye pick up soooo

fast. please tell anyone who would do that to your child to take a

hike and reevalutate how they deal with a child who is not even 2years

old yet!!!!!!!

[Guest guest]

I'm sure will have a comment on this as well, but it sounds like a bit

of a turture session for the apraxic child - who so WANTS to say those

words, but just can't. A speech therapist with apraxia experience makes all

the difference. It should be as much " play " as possible. My son doesn't even

realize he is having a " session " and thinks his therapist is his playdate.

She has been working with him through 60 minute sessions (starting at 20

months), and its intense but in a way that he doesn't even realize how hard

he's working. I would keep looking. We had talked about putting together a

list of good ST for apraxia - maybe ask from this list if anyone knows

someone good in your area.

My son actually does spend quite a bit of his session time in the high

chair - but that is to bring him up to the table's height where they play

games etc. But he was never forced to say any specific word, and they move

on very quickly when he can't say something - to what he can say, and work

from there. My son still uses quite a bit of sign with his words - and it

helps us understand him and work with clarity/articulation. My

understanding is that its best to let these children lead the " conversation "

and follow their lead to get the most speech out of them, and praise them

for words or attempts at approximations. -

Re: [ ] ST question

Hi Tia,

I am a SLP. I teach Speech Pathology to

undergraduates. I appreciate your rejection of the

modus operandi of your therapist. Science is organised

common sense. What your common sense tells you is very

much right. You can request for alternate therapist.

Prof.Satya Mahapatra

--- and Knell <knells@...> wrote:

> Hi all,

> We just had our first ST session today. At the end

> of it, the ST told

> me that after today, she will be buckling in

> a chair with a tray

> for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want "

> and " More " . Those

> are the only two words we will work on until he gets

> them. After the

> first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high

> chair. She made no

> mention of using sign, even though he's starting to

> learn signs and has

> been signing both " want " and " more " for months.

> Right now we are

> scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We

> are supposed to be

> going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

>

> Is this a typical set up for ST? Being a ST novice,

> I don't really know

> what to expect, but this isn't it (if that makes

> sense). Is it the norm

> to buckle kids down like this and work across a

> tray? To my uneducated

> eye, it seems that this would make my son the

> passive recipient of what

> should be an active learning session. I also see

> that this could create

> an environment where she could easily invade his

> space and be

> disrespectful to his cues because he can't get away.

> I don't like this

> blatant statement of power over him, I guess. Are

> my fears unfounded?

>

> BTW, is 22 months old, completely

> non-verbal, no receptive delays.

>

> TIA,

>

> >

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Did she say why she thought this would work for your child?

My son started ST at 20 months. The first few sessions he would not

get off my lap if he did he would run around and did very little

with the ST. He has a dx of PDD-NOS on the autism spectrum.

Our ST did put my son in a chair with a tray. He was not strapped in

but could not get out. He was not thrilled. She calmed him down and

got some work out of him. First with cards and puzzles and only for

a few minutes. Then he got out and they did other work with bubbles

etc.

It was only a few weeks (once a week visits) and he was running in

the room and jumping in the chair. His attention span got better and

better and his speech got better.

I was not sure about this at first and asked many questions and in

the end I trusted my ST and my gut. The reasons were right for my

child.

Ask a lot of questions. Best wishes.

>

> Hi all,

> We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the ST

told

> me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair with

a tray

> for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want " and " More " .

Those

> are the only two words we will work on until he gets them. After

the

> first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She

made no

> mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs

and has

> been signing both " want " and " more " for months. Right now we are

> scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We are supposed to

be

> going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

>

> Is this a typical set up for ST? Being a ST novice, I don't

really know

> what to expect, but this isn't it (if that makes sense). Is it

the norm

> to buckle kids down like this and work across a tray? To my

uneducated

> eye, it seems that this would make my son the passive recipient of

what

> should be an active learning session. I also see that this could

create

> an environment where she could easily invade his space and be

> disrespectful to his cues because he can't get away. I don't like

this

> blatant statement of power over him, I guess. Are my fears

unfounded?

>

> BTW, is 22 months old, completely non-verbal, no receptive

delays.

>

> TIA,

>

> >

>

[Guest guest]

I haven't read the other responses but I don't like that

approach at all. If your not okay with that let her know. Most

speech therapist we know mix it up and start out working on

imitating sounds not words. good luck.

In , " " <gpintar@...> wrote:

>

>

> Did she say why she thought this would work for your child?

>

> My son started ST at 20 months. The first few sessions he would

not

> get off my lap if he did he would run around and did very little

> with the ST. He has a dx of PDD-NOS on the autism spectrum.

>

> Our ST did put my son in a chair with a tray. He was not strapped

in

> but could not get out. He was not thrilled. She calmed him down

and

> got some work out of him. First with cards and puzzles and only

for

> a few minutes. Then he got out and they did other work with

bubbles

> etc.

>

> It was only a few weeks (once a week visits) and he was running in

> the room and jumping in the chair. His attention span got better

and

> better and his speech got better.

>

> I was not sure about this at first and asked many questions and in

> the end I trusted my ST and my gut. The reasons were right for my

> child.

>

> Ask a lot of questions. Best wishes.

>

>

>

> >

> > Hi all,

> > We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the

ST

> told

> > me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair

with

> a tray

> > for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want "

and " More " .

> Those

> > are the only two words we will work on until he gets them.

After

> the

> > first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She

> made no

> > mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs

> and has

> > been signing both " want " and " more " for months. Right now we

are

> > scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We are supposed

to

> be

> > going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

> >

[Guest guest]

I just read a lot of the responses and I have to say I agree with

everyone else. I don't like the sound of it one bit! I thought I

read that to force an apraxic child to say a word was torture for

him because the pressure makes it even harder for to do. When my ST

comes, my 24 mo old sits in my lap or hers or on the stability

ball. We let him take run-around breaks between exercises.

Sometimes he gets frustrated when we keep him in place but it isn't

for long ( " Put one more puzzle piece in and we're all done " or " Show

me 'all done' and we'll be all done! " and before he could do the

sign for all done by himself we would do it for him using his

hands). By the way, my son learned more when we used it in

play: " Do you want more bubbles, more tickle, more hide-and-seek? "

>

> Hi all,

> We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the ST

told

> me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair with

a tray

> for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want " and " More " .

Those

> are the only two words we will work on until he gets them. After

the

> first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She

made no

> mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs

and has

> been signing both " want " and " more " for months.

[Guest guest]

I don't have enough time to wade through all the posts here, but I

have to tell you that strapping your son into a rifton (or is it

rifkin?) chair will NOT create an excellent learning environment,

nor will it further to develop a good relationship between your son

and the therapist. Tell her that your son will NOT be restrained in

no uncertain terms. He's TWO!!!!

If I were you, I'd find a different therapist. If this is private

therapy, COMPLAIN LOUDLY to the director that strapping in a 2 year

old is ridiculous and borders on the abusive. And she clearly

doesn't understand apraxia. You deserve someone else.

In a word: run.

> >

> > Hi all,

> > We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the

ST

> told

> > me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair

with

> a tray

> > for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want "

and " More " .

> Those

> > are the only two words we will work on until he gets them.

After

> the

> > first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She

> made no

> > mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs

> and has

> > been signing both " want " and " more " for months.

>

[Guest guest]

When we went to our first ST, she would aks that I or our babysitter

stay in the room during ST. But my son was MUCH less cooperative

about therapy when i was in the room, as opposed to our babysitter.

You know kids always behave worse with their parents than anyone

else! Then we switched STs to a place where it's just the ST and

child in the room, and parent/caregiver waits outside. I'm told he is

very cooperative and happy to be there, and he has made much greater

strides in his speech.

I think you have one issue as to whether you even want to stay with

an ST who would propose restraining your child after one visit. That

says a lot about her, I think. If you switch STs to someone you like

and your child is still having trouble focusing, you might want to

try not being in the room and see if that helps. It might be

difficult for him the first time or two, but he might be better after

he adjusts.

> > >

> > > Hi all,

> > > We just had our first ST session today. At the end of it, the

> ST

> > told

> > > me that after today, she will be buckling in a chair

> with

> > a tray

> > > for 15 minutes and working with him on saying " Want "

> and " More " .

> > Those

> > > are the only two words we will work on until he gets them.

> After

> > the

> > > first 15 minutes, she will let him out of the high chair. She

> > made no

> > > mention of using sign, even though he's starting to learn signs

> > and has

> > > been signing both " want " and " more " for months. Right now we

> are

> > > scheduled for 1/2 hour per week, for 16 weeks. We are supposed

> to

> > be

> > > going 2x/week, but they don't have openings.

> > >

>

[Guest guest]

I don't post here much, but I have a dilemma about my two year old

with ASD.

Brendon is now in a Toddler Class through EI, right? They have speech

and OT as a group, every other week. Brendon WAS having speech at

Easter Seals every week (1/2 hour a week), but the EI folks said it's

one or the other. The teachers in the class also work on it, too, and

he goes from 10 to 4 on Thursdays and Fridays. (With an hour and a

half or two hours for nap, and the teacher told me on Friday that pick

up is actually around 3:30.)

What should I do? Go back to ST at Easter Seals, or look for something

like Aqua Therapy (I get Family Resource money, so I could do either

or, but I'd need to see where the water therapy is and get him in,

etc., etc., etc.)

How much ST does a non verbal 2 year old with ASD need? Is there a

goal to keep in mind? Like with ABA - anything under 25 hours a week

isn't that helpful. Does ST have a similar floor? Brendon makes TONS

of noises all the time, so he IS trying. And what do I do at home? I

feel SO helpless, especially now that my daughter is at the age to

" repeat " stuff - like I say " banana " and she says " ba " .

I feel like everyone is throwing a million ideas at me and I just want

to say STOP! Which ones work? Where does he need help and where can I

just let him be two? How much harm will " wait and see " REALLY do, if I

still half suspect this is Einstein Syndrome? I mean really? If I let

him go to class and play with him and love him, but let time pass

until he's 4, and if nothing changes, THEN I jump in and get

intensive, will it really hurt him? Doesn't he deserve the chance to

be a toddler and develop on his own track?

Or is that a copout? Should I be mondo intense about it to try to

" save " him, and to give him the chance to have friends? I am so LOST!

And it doesn't help that he needs a schedule for everything and I

don't know how to give him one! He's even started to go to bed super

late because he can't wind down. And naps? HAH! I'll be lucky if he

EVER takes a nap in school - he's been going down for naps around 4

lately! (Which might also explain the late nights. But how do you

FORCE a kid to SLEEP?)

I still have new mom cluelessness, and it's making me feel like a

total failure because he has SN, and that means I have to be ON TOP OF

MY GAME. HELP!!!!!!!!!