Re: ASP and BM issues

August 6, 2009

Please don't punish your son for these issues. Our daughter had very similar problems, in terms of the BMs and the tantrums, for years. More than a few GI doctors told us that her inability to have BMs was compulsive holding (one told us that her patients with autism had "buns of steel"), and her accidents, usually during major tantrums (now we know, because the increase in abdominal pressure from the screaming was causing the defecation), were just behavioral. Our kids have more gut issues, no matter what the Mayo's anecdotal study may say, than the average NT kids. It took us 19 years, but we finally found a GI doctor willing to look into her and find out why there were such problems. She has extensive inflammation and scattered lesions throughout her GI system. Even mild inflammation is enough to cause pain and tantrums and not allow even soft stool to be evacuated. Our daughter is verbally apraxic, but if your son is trying to tell you that his BMs are stuck, I'd trust what he's trying to say and see if you can find a doctor willing to delve further into the GI/BM issue. The frustration that they must feel is heartbreaking. But at least now we know how to help both the GI issues and the resultant behaviors. I know it's terrible going through this now. Hope that you can get a chance to take a breath.

(our daughter also took a few baths a day - some parents have reported that some of our kids have BMs that have an acidic effect on the skin that just a regular "clean up" at the toilet wouldn't resolve, thus the need for bathing right afterward-)

In a message dated 8/6/2009 2:29:52 P.M. Central Daylight Time, m.snyder78@... writes:

My son is seven and has been having bowel issues for awhile now. He is ASP but also PANDAS OCD and tics. I think this has become a compulsion. He used to soil his underpants but now he tries to go and says it is stuck and uses his fingers to get it out. Then he rubs his bottom on the carpet and over the register. We have such a mess to clean up. He has made his bottom bleed. I am not sure how to punish him. I put him in his room for time out. I took away his things and his computer time. He already has anger issues and a short fuse. He is throwing things at the walls and breaking his things in his room while in time-out. I am at a loss. He is mean verbally and screams at me and won't give up. He insists on a shower after the BM everytime. What can I do with him when nothing seems to help? I have been to Dr's many times and I just can't get this resolved.

August 7, 2009

I agree. This problem is definately a GI problem which is creating behavioral problems because of not being resolved. If he desires a shower afterward, allow it. My ASP son goes in the shower when he is about to have a meltdown now (something about the water from the shower on his skin). He is 13 and we accidently discovered the shower calms him (my husband told him to go take a shower in self defense to preserve peace and life while I was gone one day. When he came out, it was like nothing happened before (weird)). So we use it. He has now asked to take a shower when he feels a meltdown, and it avoids the meltdown. It also takes care of the self care issue that many ASPs have in there teen years. Sometimes he takes two a day. Then I also know he is stressed, and can plan my acitivities and issue conflicts around him.

My typical son had a problem with stools, and would not go for a week (between birth and 5yrs old). A doctor put him on one tablespoon of mineral oil daily (he took it straight, said it didn't have any taste, but you could mix it with anything). This lubricated the colon. It worked after about a week. We continued it for about 6 months to a year, and as his body grew or matured, the problem disappeared. He gets constipated sometimes now (21 years old), but he regulates it with more water and a better diet.

But I totally agree that it is a GI issue. Perhaps he has hemrrodes (?) or something else in the track.

Discipline would probably work better if it were a rewarding the postive, like a privilege or reward (even a sticker on a chart) if he went in the toilet, took a shower and had no other behaviors. Also try to notice the time of day that his body tries to go. Make that a regular schedule. Work with his body schedule for a while and then adjust to the needed schedule when possible.

We empathize!

Carol

August 7, 2009

I highly recommend a full GI workup for your son. I heard some good things

about Dr. Taxman in Cleveland Heights but not all positives. My son does

similar things and I have no doubt in my mind that he has difficulty passing

stool, and this is absolutely not a behavior, thus nothing to punish. I see my

son posture, press his belly into hard surfaces, etc. b/c he needs pressure to

be able to go and I see him tantrum and seize at times b/c of the pain of the

BMs.

My decision was to take him to the best of the best - Dr. Arthur Krigsman at the

Thoughtful House. We are still not all set to go, still many tests must be

completed prior to the visit but I think we will get to him before the end of

the year, and scoped and all.

Here's more info:

www.thoughtfulhouse.com

If you wonder about funding, I ythink most of it will be covered by our health

insurance plan (we do have out of network benefits) , but for whatever wont be

covered, I am taking out a loan from this organization: lend4health.org.

I have a very good video about this, I am willing to show it again though I can

not loan it at this time. I am working on obtaining extra copies and then I

could loan it out. Its about exactly these issues that you are describing.

HTH

>

> My son is seven and has been having bowel issues for awhile now. He is ASP but

also PANDAS OCD and tics. I think this has become a compulsion. He used to soil

his underpants but now he tries to go and says it is stuck and uses his fingers

to get it out. Then he rubs his bottom on the carpet and over the register. We

have such a mess to clean up. He has made his bottom bleed. I am not sure how to

punish him. I put him in his room for time out. I took away his things and his

computer time. He already has anger issues and a short fuse. He is throwing

things at the walls and breaking his things in his room while in time-out. I am

at a loss. He is mean verbally and screams at me and won't give up. He insists

on a shower after the BM everytime. What can I do with him when nothing seems to

help? I have been to Dr's many times and I just can't get this resolved.

>

August 7, 2009

Here is the thing. I took him to Dr. Cunningham a psychologist specializing in

encopresis. She had me make a poop chart and record stool diary. Okay that

helped with the encopresis at first then this started up again with the smearing

on the carpet. We did have this happen before with him rubbing his bottom over

the register. Yesterday I found BM in the register. Plus smeared BM on the

carpet for the third time in a day. My family is saying this is behavioral and

he is doing this for attention. My family says he wants to irritate me and is

pushing all my buttons that he wouldn't have put BM in the registers if it was

an accident. That at age seven he is manipulating me. Today he has pooped 6

times small soft amounts in the toilet and in his underwear twice. He has

showered 6 times. This is out of control and I am going to have a nervous

breakdown very soon. Dr's don't return my calls or emails. What the heck should

I do? If the meds are irritating his stomach and making his behaviors worse I

want him off of them. What is the best Dr. to go to because I am sick of Dr's.

We have seen over fourteen Dr's since this kid became sick at age 13 months. Why

can't I find one that sticks by us and wants to help us figure this all out?

> >

> > My son is seven and has been having bowel issues for awhile now. He is ASP

but also PANDAS OCD and tics. I think this has become a compulsion. He used to

soil his underpants but now he tries to go and says it is stuck and uses his

fingers to get it out. Then he rubs his bottom on the carpet and over the

register. We have such a mess to clean up. He has made his bottom bleed. I am

not sure how to punish him. I put him in his room for time out. I took away his

things and his computer time. He already has anger issues and a short fuse. He

is throwing things at the walls and breaking his things in his room while in

time-out. I am at a loss. He is mean verbally and screams at me and won't give

up. He insists on a shower after the BM everytime. What can I do with him when

nothing seems to help? I have been to Dr's many times and I just can't get this

resolved.

> >

>

September 5, 2009

The only time my son EVER displayed fecal smearing was while ON an

anti-anxiety/anti-depressant medication. We removed the medication and stopped

the problem.

We got rid of his bowel problems by making him gluten and dairy free at age 3.

At the age of 8 we thought we would try medication to help him with his anxiety.

It did help, but the fecal smearing was not worth it.

A friend of mine went through this pooping thing with her 7 year old for several

years. She finally just let him have control of it including the cleaning up

after himself and the cleaning of whatever he soiled. It took a few months

before he stopped. You might try that (with following it up with a more

thorough job of course when he is not looking).

Other than changing his diet (which people will say won't work, but in our case

my son had an allergy to these foods) and making him clean up after himself, I

don't have much more to offer.

I agree that it feels like the traditional medical field has abandoned us. I

believe it is because with an autism label the insurance companies don't have to

pay.

>

> Here is the thing. I took him to Dr. Cunningham a psychologist specializing in