RE: Progesterone Cream (everybody please read)

[Guest guest]

Hi SheilaI have an unopened tub of Serenity Cream, which I bought via a website link you kindly posted for me a few months ago. On the tub, it says the distributor is Wellsprings in Guernsey. Is this OK? It says it's manufactured in the USA.Recently, I have seen conflicting posts on forums relating to a dispute between either two distributors or manufacturers, and the quality of the creams women were receiving.Really not sure if I have the right cream here.LysaFrom: Sheila <sheila@...>thyroid treatment Sent: Fri, 14 January, 2011 18:16:39Subject: Progesterone Cream (everybody please read)

Below

is the email sent to me by Graves - Chief Clinician Health Science. Many

of you may, or may not be aware that the Progesterone cream distributed by

Wellsprings, contains harmful petro-chemicals and is formulated with the

problematic Chinese progesterone. The Original Serenity, manufactured by Health

Science, contains No Petro-chemicals (all plant based) and has always contained

U.S. manufactured progesterone. This raw material costs $800/kilo,

compared to $135/kilo for the Chinese progesterone, which has had contamination

issues in the past. Hopefully,

the information he has sent to me will be self-explanatory. If not, please contact

Graves through the contact details on their web site. http://www.progesterone.com/ http://www.progesterone.org.uk/ Luv

- Sheila ************************** 11th

January 2011 Dear

Ms. , Hello,

my name is Graves. I

am the author of the first website on the entire internet for natural

progesterone cream. I have been asked by Mrs. Bowery to contact

you for the purpose of clearing up some confusion over the Original Serenity

Progesterone Cream and helping to bring the truth to the fore for your forum

members. Below

is a transcript of the email that I just sent to Mrs. Bowery: Dear Mrs. Bowery, Thank you so much for your phone call.

It is so important that the ladies on this forum know the truth. Here is the link to the UK Trademark

Registration: http://www.ipo.gov.uk/domestic?domesticnum=2446639 If you scroll down the page you will see my

name, Graves, and Health Science as the Proprietor. Also, here is a link to the

letter from Dr. Lee to me in 1998. http://health-science.com/drlee/ Here is the very first website

that I composed in March 1995 for Natural Progesterone: http://www.polaris.net/~health And here is a site of ours that

has been live since "Creation Date: 24-Feb-1996" http://www.health-science.com/ And, here is a page we put up in 2007: http://health-science.com/deception/ So, when they say: "Since 1995",

this is patently untrue, as they did not call me on the phone until late 1996

and it was some time after that call, that they were approved sales agents for

the UK. Finally, all of Dr. Lee's books list Health

Science as the original manufacturer for Serenity Progesterone Creams. I will make an effort to contact Sheila

and give her this same information. So, thank you kindly for your support and

help. Please do not hesitate to let me know if there is anything I can do

for you. Best Regards, Kindest

Regards,

Graves Chief

Clinician Health

Science http://www.progesterone.com/ http://www.progesterone.org.uk/

[Guest guest]

Hi SheilaSorry! Brain fog hits again! Just re-read your post for the third time, and realised I do have the less desirable Serenity cream as it is from Wellness, and not Health Science. I will bin it, and re-order from the

links below.I was just about to give the cream a trial run this month, so your posting is timely!Lysa

Below

is the email sent to me by Graves - Chief Clinician Health Science. Many

of you may, or may not be aware that the Progesterone cream distributed by

Wellsprings, contains harmful petro-chemicals and is formulated with the

problematic Chinese progesterone. The Original Serenity, manufactured by Health

Science, contains No Petro-chemicals (all plant based) and has always contained

U.S. manufactured progesterone. This raw material costs $800/kilo,

compared to $135/kilo for the Chinese progesterone, which has had contamination

issues in the past.

[Guest guest]

and everybody,

please will you ensure you remove previous messages already read by others and

leave just a small portion of what you are responding to. It is very

frustrating for those reading a Daily Digest or reading from the forum web site

because they have to scroll through all these before getting to the next

message. Thanks.

I believe knows more about this and there is further

information in the Files. I was not aware of any dispute between these two

companies until this past week. I think you should read all the links in the

message I posted from before deciding. This is the reason I previously

posted links to the Wellsprings web site, but will think twice about doing that

again.

Luv - Sheila

I have an

unopened tub of Serenity Cream, which I bought via a website link you kindly

posted for me a few months ago. On the tub, it says the distributor is

Wellsprings in Guernsey. Is this OK? It says it's manufactured in the USA.

Recently, I

have seen conflicting posts on forums relating to a dispute between either two

distributors or manufacturers, and the quality of the creams women were

receiving.

_

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

I have checked the pot of Wellsprings Cream that I bought about 3 months ago and

although it has Guernsey on the label it also says that it was manufactured in

USA.

It was £17.99.

I am getting confused - Sorry I don't mean to be harsh on this but I know it

is up to individuals to research and do the best for themselves but when you

think you are doing so and then you get told other things it sort of muddies the

water a bit.

Is Wellsprings Serenity Cream that is from Guernsey and made in USA safe and if

not what is the name of the correct/safer one?

Many thanks

Stacey

[Guest guest]

Hi,

Further to my post I found in my emails the site from which I purchased my

Wellsprings Serenity and looked up the ingredients - it says this - Ingredients

Serenity Natural Progesterone Cream is manufactured in the United States of

America by the original manufacturer to the original formula under the highest

standards of Good Manufacturing Practice. Serenity does not contain cheap

low-grade Chinese progesterone as used by many manufacturers. Purity and potency

guaranteed by analysis. Advanced skin care delivery.

So I reckon I have the correct one. And for anyone who is not sure - if you

Google Serenity Cream it will come up with the site and it is £17.99 a pot.

Thanks

Stacey

>

>

> Hi ,

>

> I have checked the pot of Wellsprings Cream that I bought about 3 months ago

and although it has Guernsey on the label it also says that it was manufactured

in USA.

> It was £17.99.

[Ed]

[Guest guest]

Hi StaceyYou wrote:'"Serenity does not contain cheap low-grade Chinese progesterone as used by many manufacturers..."

So I reckon I have the correct one. And for anyone who is not sure - if you Google Serenity Cream it will come up with the site and it is £17.99 a pot.'If you Google "Serenity" as suggested, the top sponsored site is www.progesterone.co.uk, which is Wellsprings, and the one I originally bought my Serenity from. Ingredients are: "Each sealed jar of original formula Serenity Natural Progesterone Cream manufactured in the USA by the original manufacturer contains 2.1ozs (60gm/60ml) of the finest quality liposome moisturising cream with not less than 1,260 mgs of bio-identical USP Pharmaceutical grade Natural Progesterone extracted by Pfizer in the USA from plant saponins." No mention of "...does not contain cheap low-grade Chinese progesterone...."

etcAnother site is www.progesterone.org.uk, which is one of the two sites of Graves, Chief Clinician of Health Science who makes the original Serenity, which states:"1. The Original Serenity is formulated with Bio-Identical, USP Natural Progesterone, manufactured in the United States. Dr. Lee stated "It is the purest form of Pharmaceutical Progesterone found anywhere in the world". 2. No Animal by-products or Petroleum Derivatives, including Methyl-Parabens nor Propyl Parabens, found in Germaben II, are used in the Manufacturing of Serenity Creams.3. Serenity does not contain the cheap Chinese progesterone found in other creams."This is the site stated on Sheila's original posting quoting Graves email.If you look at both sites, you can see

that the artwork on the front of the tub is also slightly different. From this, I can see I definitely bought my Serenity cream from Wellsprings at www.progesterone.co.uk, and it's not the recommended one. Looks like ordering from www.progsterone.org.uk ensures higher quality., (distributor is based in Devon).This may also explain why there is such a variation in comments and reviews on forums, such as this one: http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/health-products/serenity-natural-progesterone-cream/reviewsMaybe women are randomly ordering either formulation, thinking all Serenity is identical.

[Guest guest]

Maybe women are randomly ordering either formulation, thinking all Serenity is identical.....

Thank you, Sheila, for bringing this to our attention, and thank you, Lysa, for posting the reviews link and all the others – I believe you have hit the nail on the head.

When I was alerted to this thread yesterday, I was alarmed and started googling. I had just a few days ago started with "20-1" cream from Wellness (Guernsey), which is supposedly the same as Serenity, only with a tiny bit of added Oestrogen and I feel very odd – dizzy and raised heartbeat. At first I thought I was overdosing (and I probably was and reduced the amount) but thought I should persevere as my body needs to adjust. This morning I feel most odd.... very dizzy, as if drunk, and again fast heartbeat. It could be co-incidence, as I do have middle ear issues, but the timing is such that I feel it's the cream.

Like everybody here I felt very confused and could not decide who to believe – both sides are protesting they have the real thing.... and I was thrown by Graves' claim that the raw material costs $ 800/kilo as opposed to $135/kilo for the Chinese progesterone...that being the case, why is his pot of Serenity only £ 1 more expensive than the one from Wellness? It suggests to me that either Wellness is making an unduly massive profit, or their claims to produce the `real thing' are just. – How are we to decide?

Well, for my own part, I will put my trust in the review posters – and the reviews are a very mixed bag indeed. As Lysa has pointed out – most people, myself included – were probably unaware of the two companies dispute and thought they were both the same and bought the cheaper pot... provided they even found Graves site, because that one is badly marketed and difficult to spot. It is interesting that a few posters point out that they have tried both products, and found the Wellness one useless, but liked the other product. The following review swung it for me:

http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/health-products/serenity-natural-progesterone-cream/reviews

Advantages: it was a bother having to find the original manufacturer

Disadvantages: now that I have my Serenity, None!

I have used this product for many years. My PMT was so bad before I started using this cream that I don't know why my poor husband didn't divorce me. Just recently the distributor on Guernsey changed suppliers and have sent me a pot that is just awful. My symptoms came back! and so I rung the company and they were as bitchie as I felt. After an online search I found the original Serenity progesterone cream from Health and Science in the States. I was able to order from there site, http://www.progesterone.org.uk and really love this product. I feel serenity again and my husband is happy!!! (my romantic side is back)

Summary: be careful who you deal with

I too had tried the Wellness Serenity Cream some time ago and found it ineffective for hot flushes and vaginal dryness, hence my wanting to try the 20-1, which promised to have the same properties only with a tiny bit of Oestrogen added.... – my verdict after using it for 5 days.... I do sleep better, but still have night sweats, and now feel dizzy during the day and my already fast pulse is even faster.... so I will stop that and order Serenity without Oestrogen from this www.progesterone.org.uk site. My body will just have to lump it and make its own oestrogen from the (hopefully) superior progesterone ;o)

[Guest guest]

Hi all, you can get prog cream from higher nature, that is where i used to get mine in the begining. about 15 years ago. it comes from jersey.!!!!!I now get it from the lady (details in our files) it is the cheapest i can find. Angel.

[Guest guest]

Hi there,

It does if you click on the side menu under ingredients.

Thanks

Stacey

[Guest guest]

The reason is that most people are in a state of imbalance - too much oestrogen

in relation to the progesterone. However, I am deficient in both and haven't

found any oestrogen cream. The only thing I can find it a plant based cream

that is supposed to " balance " your oestrogen, but I expect that is designed to

prevent an overdose and won't act as a supplement.

I'm sure someone on the group said their GP prescribed them natural oestrogen,

but my GP refused point blank to do that and wasn't interested in the test

showing I was deficient.

Miriam

> hi everyone

> i keep seeing this progesterone advised but what about oestrogen ? why

progesterone and not oestrogen?

> my problem is not hot sweats but vaginal atrophy/dryness.

>

> thanks

> berny

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for all that information. I am still confused because the so-called

" bad " Serenity cream has helped my sleep significantly and hasn't produced any

bad symptoms. I suppose the only thing to do is to buy some of the other one

and see whether it does anything different.

Miriam

> If you Google " Serenity " as suggested, the top sponsored site is

> www.progesterone.co.uk, which is Wellsprings, and the one I originally bought

my Serenity from.

> No mention of " ...does not contain cheap low-grade Chinese progesterone.... "

etc

>

> Another site is www.progesterone.org.uk, which is one of the two sites of

Graves, Chief Clinician of Health Science who makes the original

Serenity, which states:

>

> " 1. The Original Serenity is formulated with Bio-Identical, USP Natural

Progesterone, manufactured in the United States. Dr. Lee stated " It is the

purest form of Pharmaceutical Progesterone found anywhere in the world " .

> 2. No Animal by-products or Petroleum Derivatives, including Methyl-Parabens

nor Propyl Parabens, found in Germaben II, are used in the Manufacturing of

Serenity Creams.

> 3. Serenity does not contain the cheap Chinese progesterone found in other

creams. "

>

> This is the site stated on Sheila's original posting quoting Graves

email.

[Guest guest]

Hi MiriamYou wrote:

".... I am still confused because the so-called "bad" Serenity cream has helped my sleep significantly and hasn't produced any bad symptoms. I suppose the only thing to do is to buy some of the other one and see whether it does anything different."I don't think the Serenity Cream distributed by Wellsprings will necessarily cause adverse effects in everyone....it is the same with all hormone replacement therapy, be it T3, NAX, HC etc. From this forum, it is evident that one size doesn't fit all, and the reactions people have to not only different replacement therapies, but also supplements, can vary wildly..even to different brands of the same product.If the Serenity you are using is helping you, then that's great. The only concern, is not any noticeable side effects, but the accumulation of inferior or potentially harmful ingredients that you may be absorbing through your skin, and into your body, over a period of

time. I believe anyone could experience side effects from both the Serenity Creams; not because there is anything wrong with the cream, but because we are replacing or supplementing a hormone, and this is bound to have an effect, be it temporary or ongoing, on some users.Maybe finish off the tub, and then try a tub of the 'Green' version, which is now being advertised on Health Science's website: www.progesterone.org.ukIn the meantime, I'm glad it's working for you.

-

[Guest guest]

Hi MiriamYou wrote:'The reason is that most people are in a state of imbalance - too much oestrogen in relation to the progesterone. However, I am deficient in both and haven't found any oestrogen cream. The only thing I can find it a plant based cream that is supposed to "balance" your oestrogen, but I expect that is designed to prevent an overdose and won't act as a supplement. I'm sure someone on the group said their GP prescribed them natural oestrogen, but my GP refused point blank to do that and wasn't interested in the test showing I was deficient."I have just been watching all Suzanne Somer's Youtube conference lectures. She is a 61 year old American actress who has been an advocate for bio-identical hormone therapy for 10 yrs: from Thyroid to Adrenals to Sex hormones....she takes 'em all! She takes a cocktail of all the sex hormones she needs, according to what her blood tests show. She stresses the

necessity to see a doctor who specialises in sex hormones, and I tend to agree. I definitely know of two doctors in Harley St, London (Dr. B and Dr. M) who do this, if you want their names.Suzanne Somers also says she doesn't take the same amount of each sex hormone every day of the month; she mimics the rhythm cycle of when she was in her twenties, with more oestrogen and less progesterone at certain times. She has a chapter about this in one of her books (which I have just ordered).She also talks about having a group of specialist doctors that YOU hire, who each hone in on specific parts of the complex metabolic/endocrine puzzle and tailor your treatment program to suit your individual needs. Of course, she can afford to do this, but I get where she's coming from. Like almost everyone on this forum, she has had to educate herself, and has now taken her healthcare into her own hands. The fact that she has now made a career of it, is, at least, evidence that the hormones are working! She looks stunning, and has the energy and drive of a 20 yr old!

[Guest guest]

Thanks, that's very interesting. Yes, please do send me the names of the two

doctors in Harley Street.

Which of the Suzanne Somers books did you decide to buy, and how did you decide

which to choose? - I notice she has written quite a few.

I am thinking of doing the HCG diet first, which I expect will have a beneficial

effect on hormones in general. (Insulin is a key hormone in the body,

regulating other hormones, so if I get that right first it might sort out other

problems.) After that I would probably need to do a retest and see what the

current state of play is before deciding where to go from there.

Miriam

>

> I'm sure someone on the group said their GP prescribed them natural oestrogen,

but my GP refused point blank to do that and wasn't interested in the test

showing I was deficient. "

>

>

> I have just been watching all Suzanne Somer's Youtube conference lectures. She

is a 61 year old American actress who has been an advocate for bio-identical

hormone therapy for 10 yrs: from Thyroid to Adrenals to Sex hormones....she

takes 'em all! She takes a cocktail of all the sex hormones she needs, according

> to what her blood tests show. She stresses the necessity to see a doctor who

specialises in sex hormones, and I tend to agree. I definitely know of two

doctors in Harley St, London (Dr. B and Dr. M) who do this, if you want their

names.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi MiriamI've ordered a second hand copy of "Ageless" from Amazon as this seems to focus specifically on bio-identical hormones. It was published in 2007, I think.Good idea about trying the HCG protocol. I know from those who have tried it that despite losing weight, many have benefitted in other ways including reduction of thyroid and adrenal hormone replacement. I will private message you the Doctor's names, if that's OK.Sent using BlackBerry® from OrangeFrom: "miriam_hinch" <miriam_hinch@...>

Sender: thyroid treatment

Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2011 09:37:30 -0000<thyroid treatment >Reply thyroid treatment

Subject: Re: Progesterone Cream (everybody please read)

Thanks, that's very interesting. Yes, please do send me the names of the two doctors in Harley Street.

Which of the Suzanne Somers books did you decide to buy, and how did you decide which to choose? - I notice she has written quite a few.

I am thinking of doing the HCG diet first, which I expect will have a beneficial effect on hormones in general. (Insulin is a key hormone in the body, regulating other hormones, so if I get that right first it might sort out other problems.) After that I would probably need to do a retest and see what the current state of play is before deciding where to go from there.

Miriam

>

> I'm sure someone on the group said their GP prescribed them natural oestrogen, but my GP refused point blank to do that and wasn't interested in the test showing I was deficient. "

>

>

> I have just been watching all Suzanne Somer's Youtube conference lectures. She is a 61 year old American actress who has been an advocate for bio-identical hormone therapy for 10 yrs: from Thyroid to Adrenals to Sex hormones....she takes 'em all! She takes a cocktail of all the sex hormones she needs, according

> to what her blood tests show. She stresses the necessity to see a doctor who specialises in sex hormones, and I tend to agree. I definitely know of two doctors in Harley St, London (Dr. B and Dr. M) who do this, if you want their names.

>

[Guest guest]

I have sent the information to Dr P Miriam. I doubt he is aware

of it, otherwise he would not be recommending Wellsprings.

Luv - Sheila

Does that mean that there are two natural

progesterone creams, both called Serenity? And that one is a cheap copy of the

other? Does Dr P know about this? He recommended getting the Wellsprings cream

from Guernsey. It still seemed to help, even if it was a cheap copy, as it

improved my sleep.

Miriam

[Guest guest]

Stacey, follow the links I posted in the message I forwarded to

the group. Announcing such information is done for the benefit of our members,

we do not post such information with any intention of muddying the water.

Luv - Sheila

Hi ,

I have checked the pot of Wellsprings Cream that I bought about 3 months ago

and although it has Guernsey on the label it also says that it was manufactured

in USA.

It was £17.99.

I am getting confused - Sorry I don't mean to be harsh on this but I know it is

up to individuals to research and do the best for themselves but when you think

you are doing so and then you get told other things it sort of muddies the

water a bit.

Is Wellsprings Serenity Cream that is from Guernsey and made in USA safe and if

not what is the name of the correct/safer one?

Many thanks

Stacey

[Guest guest]

It's always best to post the url to any information from the

Internet Stacey. Can you post this so we can check the web site?

Luv - Sheila

Further to my post I found in my emails the site from which I purchased my

Wellsprings Serenity and looked up the ingredients - it says this - Ingredients

Serenity Natural Progesterone Cream is manufactured in the United States of

America by the original manufacturer to the original formula under the highest

standards of Good Manufacturing Practice. Serenity does not contain cheap

low-grade Chinese progesterone as used by many manufacturers. Purity and

potency guaranteed by analysis. Advanced skin care delivery.

,___

[Guest guest]

Yes, certainly you can send me the doctors names privately, thank you.

Miriam

>

> I've ordered a second hand copy of " Ageless " from Amazon as this seems to

focus specifically on bio-identical hormones. It was published in 2007, I think.

>

> Good idea about trying the HCG protocol. I know from those who have tried it

that despite losing weight, many have benefitted in other ways including

reduction of thyroid and adrenal hormone replacement.

>

> I will private message you the Doctor's names, if that's OK.

[Guest guest]

Suzanne Somers did a great service to the world when she wrote her first book

(the Sexy years), about bioidentical hormones. At the time that book came out,

there was a huge divorce rate in older couples, couples who had been together

for 30 years or more.

Even though bioidenticals had been out for a good time, she brought the

awareness to the general population. She also mentioned that her husband took

them too. This was important because women were divorcing their husbands right

and left. It brought attention to *male irritable syndrome* which Jed Diamond

wrote about and was quietly curing in the background.

http://www.healthyplace.com/tvshowblog/irritable-male-syndrome-more-than-a-mid-l\

ife-crisis-for-men/

Women started insisting on bios for their husbands or divorce would be the

result. For that alone, Suzanne did a great thing with her books. It changed

relationships for the better, for those men who were smart enough to jump in and

cure themselves. Since it hit the male ego hard, many men did not jump in.

Most of us at the time also read the other book, *Sex, lies and Menopause* which

we felt was a better book for information, but both remain in my library.

One of the funniest (or saddest) things about Suzanne's Book, *The Sexy Years,*

is that quite a few women wouldn't read it because of the title. They had long

stopped having sex and had no interest in doing that again. They thought if they

followed this protocol, they'd be back in a place where they didn't want to be.

Suzanne eventually changed the title of the books since she wasn't speaking

specifically about sex. :0)

Cheers,

JOT

I've ordered a second hand copy of " Ageless " from Amazon as this seems to

focus specifically on bio-identical hormones. It was published in 2007, I think.

>