Re: Advise on adrenal problems and having dental work carried out

[Guest guest]

Alison,

Without the reference ranges, we can't make any sense of the cortisol results,

we don't know if your're too high, too low and if so, by how much..... can you

repost them showing the ranges please.

I've had massive dental problems for years (abcesses) and have had sedation, and

both competent and incompetent dentists..... I used to dread the dentist and

a visit would wipe me out for at least the day, no matter what procedure I had

done, I had to go home and go to bed...

Then I had an adrenal test and started on cortisone when I had test results

which showed low cortisol at midday and 4pm. Since then (about 18months)

I've found going to the dentist much much easier. I take a double dose of

cortisone (10 mcg) before I go and last monday I had two teeth drilled for

crowns with no anasthetic..... it was fine. You could try cortisone cream

rubbed into the skin before the dental appointment. a 1 cm blob is thought to

be about 10 mcg (it's a lot to rub in)... or a couple of cortisone tablets?

There is some talk of having anesthetic with no adrenalin, but it's supposed to

be less effective, I'm such a wimp I wouldn't risk it.

My dentist told me to double up the cortisone on the days I have treatment.

Having crowns is no where near as bad as having fillings, you'll be fine....

x

>

to doctor level (not sure quite what that means) but she

> offers sedation. I'm trying to arrange to see her on Monday. However I'm

> really worried about having crown work done, when physically I am in

> quite a frail state and I don't know how my adrenals will stand up to

> it. I know you're supposed to have non- adrenaline based injections if

> you have m.e.

>

[Guest guest]

Thanks for this . It's just reassuring to know someone else has gone thru this. And I do get so wiped out by the smallest thing - even travelling to the dentist will be hard work for me.The cream sounds like a good halfway house - can you get that over the counter? I guess I could also up the dose of nutri adrenal extras on the day - as I know I have no side effects from them.Sorry about forgetting all the reference ranges. Brain not working and I didn't see them first time round. Here they are:Sample 1. outside range 5.3 (ref range 12-22)Sample 2. outside range 1.8 (ref range 5.0 - 9.0 )Sample 3. outside range 1.9 (ref range 3.0 - 7.0)Sample 4. outside range 0.9 (ref range 1.0 - 3.0)Total daily cortisol 9.9 (range 21-41)DHEA: Cortisol ratio 4.09 (ref range 0.6 - 3.0)On the form it says 'adrenal fatigue - non-adapted response. This generally indicates falling levels of both cortisol and DHEA from excessive stimulation/secretion over long periods of time' - which is certainly true as I've always had quite a high- energy life. Also I know from visiting a mercury free dentist that mercury can cause problems with adrenal receptors.Many thanks for your help and best wishes, Alison>> Alison,> > Without the reference ranges, we can't make any sense of the cortisol results, we don't know if your're too high, too low and if so, by how much..... can you repost them showing the ranges please.>

[Guest guest]

My dentist switched to using anaesthetic with no adrenaline as soon as I told

him I had thyroid and adrenal issues - it's standard practice with him, though

maybe not with other dentists. It doesn't seem to be any less effective to me,

but I think it takes slightly longer to work, i.e. reach full numbness, but

we're only talking a couple of minutes extra.

I also up my dosage of hydrocortisone when having work done.

I agree with - crowns are definitely better than fillings!

(the one in Kent)

>

> There is some talk of having anesthetic with no adrenalin, but it's supposed

to be less effective, I'm such a wimp I wouldn't risk it.

>

> My dentist told me to double up the cortisone on the days I have treatment.

>

> Having crowns is no where near as bad as having fillings, you'll be fine....

>

> x

>

[Guest guest]

Alison,

Oh dear, you're in a sorry state... My adrenals were no where that bad, but I

went over to the adrenals forum and got a hc dosing schedule. It's taken me 18

months but am now so much better, today I've had 5 mcg and am fine.

The adrenals forum is at

NaturalThyroidHormonesADRENALS

You can only buy cortisone tablets on the net, but cortisone cream is readily

available at any pharmacy. If they ask what it's for I just mumble something

about psoriasis, which I did have, but it's now gone...

The nutri adrenal extra is good but it takes a long time... I wanted a faster

result so I did the hc and the NAX.

x

>

It's just reassuring to know someone else has

> gone thru this. And I do get so wiped out by the smallest thing - even

> travelling to the dentist will be hard work for me.The cream sounds like

> a good halfway house - can you get that over the counter?

[Guest guest]

Yes - I am in a pretty bad way. Life is pretty miserable at the mo - not being able to do a thing!As I've started with Dr P, I'll wait to see what he advises but I'm guessing I may eventually have to try hc so thanks for the link .All the best, Alison>> Alison,> > Oh dear, you're in a sorry state... My adrenals were no where that bad, but I went over to the adrenals forum and got a hc dosing schedule. It's taken me 18 months but am now so much better, today I've had 5 mcg and am fine.>

[Guest guest]

Thanks , will definitely ask for the non- adrenaline anaesthetic.

(I never used to be so scared of dentists until I had all these health probs).

Will let you know what happens!

Best wishes, Alison

>

>

>

> My dentist switched to using anaesthetic with no adrenaline as soon as I told

him I had thyroid and adrenal issues - it's standard practice with him, though

maybe not with other

[Guest guest]

Dear Alison

From your cortisol and DHEA results, I think it quite likely you

are borderline 's if not 's already. Write to your GP and ask for

a referral to the hospital as soon as possible to get the short Synacthen test so

they can check this out. I think you probably need a short course of cortisol

to get your adrenals functioning better rather than Nutri Adrenal Extra, but

meanwhile, you could help your adrenals by increasing your dose to 5 NAX and

then in 7 to 10 days, increasing by another tablet. I would take 3 with

breakfast and 3 with lunch and see if that helps. You should also be taking

high doses of vitamin C (4/5000mgs daily) to help with absorption, Siberian

Ginseng and possibly liquorice tincture. Your adrenals are number one priority

at the moment so you must concentrate on getting them functioning more normally.

I would ask Dr Peatfield also if you can start on natural

thyroid extract as your thyroid test results are VERY low for both free T4 and

free T3 - both being right at the bottom of the reference range and you need to

replace both of these hormones. It might be that you need synthetic T3 only,

but wait and see what he says. Has Dr Peatfield actually seen your thyroid test

results? Go to the FILES section on this forums web site home page (in the

Menu) thyroid treatment

and scroll down the alphabetical FOLDERS you see listed to 'Internet

Pharmacies' and you will see all the places where you can buy thyroid

supplements without the need for a prescription.

Many of our members who have previously been given a diagnosis

of ME. Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (CFS), fibromyalgia (FM) have found that when

they started using the active thyroid hormone T3, their symptoms were mitigated

or completely left them. Most given such a diagnosis have an underlying thyroid

hormone deficiency, but most thyroid function test results come back within the

so called 'normal' reference range, so doctors believe you do not have a

problem and then go fishing to find another diagnosis that fits your symptoms.

Many decide that you are suffering from a somatoform disorder - meaning - it's

all in your head. We have to fight for our rights in getting a correct

diagnosis and the right treatment that will give us back our optimal health.

This is why TPA is here.

I see that has gone through your dental problem with you

- she has a lot of experience in this field, so follow carefully what she says.

Luv - Sheila

A

bit about myself - I was diagnosed with m.e. a year ago. I'm 54. Long story

short, I came across TPA, arranged a phone appointment with Dr P 6 weeks ago; I

had adrenal and thyroid tests done at Genova and it appears I have very low

cortisol levels (Dr P said that s was on the horizon if I wasn't

careful) and lowish thyroid uptake. The exact levels I've included below. I'm

currently on 4 NAX and 4 nutri thyroid, also COQ10 and vitamin C. This has made

me feel less 'ill'. But I still have to be very careful and cannot take any

stress without becoming quite ill - dehydrated, nauseous. As it is I'm in bed a

lot of the day and can just about manage to do a little gardening for about 20

minutes max. I'm due to speak to Dr P again in 2 weeks.

ThyroidT3: 608

(range 592-1850)

T4:

376 (range 347 -1994)

Many

thanks, Alison

[Guest guest]

Many thanks for this Sheila. It's all quite a lot to take on board for me at the moment and I'm just trying to work out what order to do things in. Dr P has seen my thyroid and adrenal results. He has said that it will take a while for me to improve as I have been very ill like this for a year (and tired for a good 3 years beforehand). So I have the impression that I will need some patience. The trouble is I've had to be patient for so long, I really have no idea what to expect.I'm speaking to Dr P in 10 days time so I'm wondering if I should start both the natural thyroid and the cortisol once I've spoken with him. The trouble with that is that (assuming I don't get a hospital appointment for a few weeks) I would then be self medicating before I go for the Synacthen test and would have to come clean with my GP. I want to keep her on side - although I don't think she's clued up on adrenals/thyroids, she has supported me a lot and is helping me this week apply for an early ill health pension. So it all gets a bit complicated!So my options seem to be  - either wait for several weeks to have the  Synacthen test and then start HC and Natural thyroid?- or start HC next week as soon as I've spoken with Dr P, book the Synacthen test and come clean with GP about self-medicating, shortly before I have the test?I suppose one of the problems I have is that I don't know how urgent it is dealing with what may be s - given that I've been managing with it for the past year already?Also, could you remind me, are you supposed to not be taking hc if you have a Synacthen test?Normally, I wouldn't have a problem working this out - but I seem to have become a bit of a wimp at the moment.Oh btw. yes, I am taking extra vit c, and siberian ginseng, also COQ10.Sorry for this rather long ramble and will very much appreciate your views.Best wishes, Alison>> Dear Alison> > From your cortisol and DHEA results, I think it quite likely you are> borderline 's if not 's already. Write to your GP and ask for> > > Many thanks, Alison>

[Guest guest]

Good morning Alison

We have to learn in this game to take one baby step at a time

and not try to take in too much at one lesson - one of the worst aspects of

this disease (at least for me) was the loss of my brain - having extremely

short term memory and brain fog - and yet, it was the very first thing that

came back to me once I had found the treatment my body craved.

The first thing that you need to concentrate on right now is

boosting your adrenals - your adrenals control everything going on in your body

and so therefore are number one priority and no, I personally would not delay

treatment having to wait probably weeks to get an appointment to have the short

synacthen test. However, what I would do is to talk to my GP and tell him/her

of my concerns regarding the possible consequences of you waiting and doing

nothing and ask her/him if there was any way s/he could push to get you tested

as an emergency. After all, if you are suffering with 's disease, you

need to be properly diagnosed and treatment started immediately. I would come

clean with your GP right from the start and I would tell her that I was

seriously considering your need to boost your adrenals by starting on a course

of HC, and that you would like her to monitor you. You can tell her that this

would only be on the recommendation of a private doctor who has well over 40

years experience in the field of treating hypothyroidism and low adrenal reserve.

As you say your GP knows little about the thyroid/adrenal

connection, then copy out the information here and ask her to read it, as this

will help her enormously http://www.tpa-uk.org.uk/thyroid_adrenal_dysfunction.pdf

If having the synacthen test, you need to be off cortisol for 6

weeks and 2 weeks off adrenal supplements such as Nutri Adrenal Extra - so it

is best not to start on these at all if it is possible to get your synacthen

test done in the very near future. However, you must not wait indefinitely as

you are suffering badly right now.

If I was in your position and considering you are speaking with Dr

Peatfield in (now 9) days, I would not start on the cortisol and wait and

see what he recommends regarding dosage. However, I would NOT delay starting

Nutri Adrenal Extra (NAE), which you should take with your breakfast,

increasing by another tablet in 7 to 10 days and taking that tablet with lunch.

Should you get an appointment for the SST, they are going to

give you a few days notice, so you can stop taking these as appropriate.

You should NOT start any natural desiccated thyroid (NDT) until

you have been taking NAE for at least 7 days, and then start NDT by taking half

a grain (30mgs) only and staying on that dose for 7 days, and after that,

follow the instructions to the letter that is in the FILE 'All Natural Thyroid

Extract' and open the document 'How to Use Natural Thyroid Extract. If you are

unable to get out and about, ask somebody to buy you in a large jar of Vitamin

C 1000mgs and Siberian Ginseng (Siberian is the best) and start to take 1

tablet of that, plus 4/5000mgs Vit C immediately. These will start to

help your adrenals to 'heal'.

It will not be long now before you speak with Dr Peatfield so please

be patient - there really IS light at the end of the tunnel as many of our

members will tell you.

Luv - Sheila

So my options seem to be - either wait for

several weeks to have the Synacthen test and then start HC and Natural

thyroid?

- or start HC next week as soon as I've spoken with Dr P,

book the Synacthen test and come clean with GP about self-medicating,

shortly before I have the test?

I suppose one of the problems I have is that I don't know

how urgent it is dealing with what may be 's - given that I've been

managing with it for the past year already?

Also, could you remind me, are you supposed to not be taking

hc if you have a Synacthen test?

[Guest guest]

Good morning Sheila and thank you for the words of wisdom. I shallcertainly take on board 'just doing one step at a time'. Though patiencehas never been my forte! But needs must.I'm feeling a bit calmer thismorning though still pretty rough after the worries of the weekend. Ithink if I come clean with my gp, that will be one less stress. I'llarrange to see her asap.And will let you know how it goes. Thanks againfor your advice and have a good day.Best wishes, Alison