Re: How much Nature-Throid

[Guest guest]

Hi Colleen,

I'm interested as to whether you just stopped all your T4 and then started your NDT, and you seem to be suggesting you are increasing at 1/2grain per week. You are obviously not suffering side effects as I think you would have mentioned them.

4grains some would say is quite high. I personally took 7grains at its peak. As you say everyone is different; that is for sure. I now take less NDT with additonal 40mcgs of T3 and that seems a big improvement.

So you can go on. I know Dr P says not many people can tolerate 6grains and so he thought 4-5 grains was maximum for most people. Obviously according to Dr P and others such as Broda , you continue increasing until you feel well again, your basal temperature resolved and stable and your symptoms are visibly disappearing before your eyes. Obviously its likely you will have blood tests again...its likely then that your TSH will be suppressed and T4 and T3 at the top of the 'normal' range, even slightly over in some cases; without the feelings of being hyper.

I would just ask have you checked and sorted any adrenal problems and yeast infection since these issues can prevent your body using the glandular as it should. Therefore to get the best from your supplement these issues must be addressed usually in advance of taking thyroid supplement.

However, well done for biting the bullett and gladd some at least of your symptoms are resolving themselves.

Sally xx

"After receiving lots of advice here I have started NDT on my own (fed up with GP etc. you all know the story!!). Am now up to taking 4 grains (2 in morning and 2 in afternoon) and wonder how much more I am able to take. Am still feeling exhausted some days and fall asleep after dinner but at least some most of the brain fog has gone (hurrah!!!) and am sleeping a bit better. As I was on 125-150mcg of T4 (not that it done much good mind you) I was wondering just what is the average dose of NDT as I know everyone is different.I just wondered what would be the maximum dose as dont want to just keep increasing by half grain every week or so."

[Guest guest]

Hello Colleen,Am now up to taking 4 grains (2 in morning and2 in afternoon) and wonder how much more I am able to take. Am still feelingexhausted some days and fall asleep after dinner but at least some most of thebrain fog has gone (hurrah!!!) and am sleeping a bit better. As I was on125-150mcg of T4 (not that it done much good mind you) I was wondering just whatis the average dose of NDT as I know everyone is different.I just wondered what would be the maximum dose as dont want to just keepincreasing by half grain every week or so.First of all - Congratulation on taking the initiative J .... Could you just clarify please – when did you start taking natural thyroid, with which dosage did you start ... and how quickly did you up the dosage?

I am asking because if you had been upping your dosage by ½ grain `every week or so', then you'd be going about it the wrong way and you are not getting the full benefit. If you start with too high a dosage and up the dosage too quickly, you will get the opposite to the desired effect. The body won't be able to cope with too much of this sudden intake of thyroid hormone and it will try to rid itself of the excess hormone as quickly as you are putting it in. Every body is different and will require different amounts of thyroid hormone, but 4 grains is already a high-ish dose. If you still feel you need more, then it is possible that your body is not utilizing the hormone as intended and one reason for that might be that you have upped the dosage too quickly (if you have)....

The correct way to go about it when you switch over from Levo is to start with ½ grain for about one week, then up to 1 grain and hold that dosage for at least 4 weeks before adding another ½ grain and each step needs to be held for about 4 weeks until you feel slightly hyper and then you'd cut back to the previous dosage and stay there.

If you have followed that procedure, and you still do not feel slightly hyper on 4 grains, then either you really do need more, or perhaps something is wrong... i.e. adrenals are not enough supported, mineral or vitamin levels are too low, conversion problems or cell-uptake is not happening, food allergies, amalgam fillings or Candida problems....all of those things could prevent the thyroid hormone from entering the cells.

If you have gone up too quickly, chances are that your body is excreting the thyroid hormone fast in an attempt to avoid thyrotoxicosis, because it can't cope with the sudden influx of thyroid hormone. In such a case you may have to reduce and start again.

Warm wishes,

[Guest guest]

This is generally the route we follow:

" You can determine your thyroid and adrenal status by following Dr. Rind with a

temperature graph. You simply take your temp 3 times a day, starting three hours

after you wake up, and every three hours after that, to equal three temps. (If

you have eaten or exercised right before it's time to take your temp, wait 20

more minutes.) Then average them for that day. Do this for AT LEAST 5 days. If

your averaged temp is fluctuating from day to day more than .2 to .3, you need

adrenal support. If it is fluctuating but overall low, you need more adrenal

support and thyroid. If it is fluctuating but averaging 98.6, you just need

adrenal support. If it is steady but low, you need more thyroid and adrenals are

likely fine. "

Once you are at 98.6 or 37.0 in the afternoons this should be a good dosage for

you. Check how you feel with the normal temperature and with a normal blood

pressure reading.

As far as the basal temps they are not always going to come up. This falls true

for me. For two years I have clocked my basals and they have never come up, they

remain about 97.2 every morning. I read in Mark Starr's book:

" Many adults' basal temperatures remain below normal despite proper treatment.

This is probably due to their increased burden of environmental toxins and

mitochondrial defects. "

So for me, I no longer worry about raising my basals because I feel fine and my

adrenals/thyroid are in good shape and being supported.

Cheers,

JOT

[Guest guest]

Thanks so much for replying Sally.

I stopped levothyroxine completely and then started half grain of NDT for 10 days, then half grain morning and afternoon for a few weeks. No difference and felt so exhausted by mid-day that I upped to one and half and then quickly to 2 which did make a difference. Am just starting 2 grains morning and afternoon this week - am most definitely a lot better but still some days get so tired by dinner time. Saying that, I do have psoriatic arthritis and take an extremely strong drug called Humira which can cause drowsiness. My rheumatologist also tells me that this disease causes exhaustion (as the blood tests show infection) so it is difficult to know. I also have hypertension and take meds for that too (caused by arthritis drugs years ago but now it is here, it wont go!!). All in all, I am proving to be difficult for all the poor docs and they do try for me. I take

my temp (it was always 35) and it is slowly increasing - lately it has been 36 or 36.5 so perhaps a step in the right direction? Maybe I should stay at 2 grains in morning and 1 and half in afternoon for another few weeks - what do you think? I have been increasing about every 8-10 days and had no side effects whatsoever - apart from feeling better that is and fog slowly clearing, sleeping better (only wake 2 or 3 times now !). I have been checked for candida infections in the past and never had it. Do you think I should get this checked and adrenals? Any advice greatly appreciated.

C x

From: Sally Jarvis <wollertonbank@...>thyroid treatment Sent: Mon, 20 June, 2011 22:19:22Subject: Re: How much Nature-Throid

Hi Colleen,

I'm interested as to whether you just stopped all your T4 and then started your NDT, and you seem to be suggesting you are increasing at 1/2grain per week. You are obviously not suffering side effects as I think you would have so."

[Guest guest]

Hi Colleen,

If it was me I would take two in the morning one at lunch time and another at night and even increase it by half a grain until your symptoms subside...that is your indicator and your temp is one of the symptoms....so yes step in the right direction but keep taking as many steps as it takes. I think you havent had side effects because you were previously taking a thyroid supplement and so your body is ok with it.

I think many of us do have candida due to the strong use of antibiotics in this country and further thyroid problems and yeast go hand in hand.

I personally yes you could get checked I happily use the glass spit test but some on here are not keen....adnd if I have any symptoms a redo the antiyeast thing again. Or ask your doc or do spit test and send it to the lab for testing but it is worth checking as you wont ever get your thyroid supplement right without ridding yourself of yeast first.

Then adrenals...Yes do get the check a 4 a day spit test is best about £70 Genova. Then again I can give you a protocol to follow if you dont already have one.

Do you know what to do to eradicate yeast?

I'm really sorry you have all these problems...its hell at times, but you can feel better than you do as you are finding out. At least that is a good thing.

Sally xx

Thanks so much for replying Sally.

I stopped levothyroxine completely and then started half grain of NDT for 10 days, then half grain morning and afternoon for a few weeks. No difference and felt so exhausted by mid-day that I upped to one and half and then quickly to 2 which did make a difference. Am just starting 2 grains morning and afternoon this week - am most definitely a lot better but still some days get so tired by dinner time. Saying that, I do have psoriatic arthritis and take an extremely strong drug called Humira which can cause drowsiness. My rheumatologist also tells me that this disease causes exhaustion (as the blood tests show infection) so it is difficult to know. I also have hypertension and take meds for that too (caused by arthritis drugs years ago but now it is here, it wont go!!). All in all, I am proving to be difficult for all the poor docs and they do try for me. I take

my temp (it was always 35) and it is slowly increasing - lately it has been 36 or 36.5 so perhaps a step in the right direction? Maybe I should stay at 2 grains in morning and 1 and half in afternoon for another few weeks - what do you think? I have been increasing about every 8-10 days and had no side effects whatsoever - apart from feeling better that is and fog slowly clearing, sleeping better (only wake 2 or 3 times now !). I have been checked for candida infections in the past and never had it. Do you think I should get this checked and adrenals? Any advice greatly appreciated.

C x

Reply to sender | Reply to group | Reply via web post | Start a New Topic Messages in this topic (5)

Recent Activity:

New Members 15

Visit Your Group

TPA is not medically qualified. Consult with a qualified medical practitioner before changing medication.

Switch to: Text-Only, Daily Digest • Unsubscribe • Terms of Use

..

[Guest guest]

Thanks Jot.

Will try the temp test 3 times daily. Sounds like an easy good way to test.

Sally suggested taking 2 grains morning, 1 afternoon and 1 evening so will try that too. Anything to get back to near normal !!!

The worse of it is I am usually always so cold - although today only have a Tshirt and fleece on!! In the winter when my temp was 35 I would have about 5 layers on and still feel cold. Hopefully that is all behind me now after starting NDT and now these tests. Not that GP cares one bit - my blood tests show I am "OK" !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thank you - and thanks to all that have suggested different things - I will try them all eventually and see which works bests for me.

Kind regards.

Colleen x

From: jitterjotter <jitterjotter@...>thyroid treatment Sent: Mon, 20 June, 2011 22:54:37Subject: Re: How much Nature-Throid

This is generally the route we follow:"You can determine your thyroid and adrenal status by following Dr. Rind with a temperature graph. You simply take your temp 3 times a day, starting three hours after you wake up, and every three hours after that, to equal three temps. (If you have eaten or exercised right before it's time to take your temp, wait 20 more minutes.) Then average them for that day. Do this for AT LEAST 5 days. If your averaged temp is fluctuating from day to day more than .2 to .3, you need adrenal support. If it is fluctuating but overall low, you need more adrenal support and thyroid. If it is fluctuating but averaging 98.6, you just need adrenal support. If it is steady but low, you need more thyroid and adrenals are likely fine."Once you are at 98.6 or 37.0 in the afternoons this should be a good dosage for you. Check how you feel with the normal temperature and with a normal blood pressure reading.As

far as the basal temps they are not always going to come up. This falls true for me. For two years I have clocked my basals and they have never come up, they remain about 97.2 every morning. I read in Mark Starr's book:"Many adults' basal temperatures remain below normal despite proper treatment.This is probably due to their increased burden of environmental toxins andmitochondrial defects."So for me, I no longer worry about raising my basals because I feel fine and my adrenals/thyroid are in good shape and being supported.Cheers,JOT

[Guest guest]

Hi

I have just started on 4 grains this week but as Sally suggested I will try taking 2 morning, 1 afternoon and 1 evening and see if that keeps me awake. Am having no side effects so could be because I was on 125-150mcg of T4 for so long.

As per my reply to Sally I am taking so much other meds that it could be those that are affecting me, or the arthritis - it is difficult to tell!!

I did start on half grain for about 3 weeks to start with but I felt awful without anything - so exhausted etc etc. so then started increasing NDT. Have had tests for minerals and vits and they are ok now as am supplementing. Jot suggested taking temps for guide to adrenals so will try that too.

As long as I can get back to some semblance of normal I will be happy. It is the constant feeling cold, brain fog, absolutely awful memory (I thought Alzheimer's for a while!!), and utter exhaustion as in falling asleep wherever that I am having trouble coping with. I can cope with the arthritis pain as long as I can get about and stay awake and remember who I said what to (and who said what to me) . Hopefully I cant be the only one who people say "but I told you that already"!!

Thanks so much for taking the time to reply it is much appreciated.

Colleen x

From: <christina@...>thyroid treatment Sent: Mon, 20 June, 2011 22:47:21Subject: Re: How much Nature-Throid

Hello Colleen,Am now up to taking 4 grains (2 in morning and2 in afternoon) and wonder how much more I am able to take. Am still feeling