Re: fertility question

[Guest guest]

Hello Sally and welcome J

's average temperature in the first half of her cycle is 36.2 C or 97.2 F. (fairly low, am I correct?!) Additionally, her TSH in February was 3.09 with all other bloods normal. Though doesn't have any overt hypothyroid symptoms (energy good, sleep fine, hair and skin in good condition, generally cheerful), I'm now wondering if the missing piece in her infertility could be due to a thyroid issue???

Well spotted, Sally. Yes, you are very likely correct – might not have overt Hypothyroidism yet, but it looks like she is `on her way'..... and this is the most likely reason why she can't conceive at present.

Many roads lead to Rome, but my suggestion would be to first address the thyroid situation before trying to conceive again. There is a much higher risk of losing the baby when thyroid hormone in the body is low, even if she did conceive. If she can afford to see Dr. Peatfield (I think a consultation with him is around £ 150) I would suggest for her to do that, but at least she should get a private urinary 24 hour thyroid test to see what her thyroid status really is. A urinary thyroid test will not be recognized by any NHS doctor, even though it is the most accurate test there is; it measures the thyroid hormone levels over 24 hours in her cells. A blood test is only a snapshot in time and will only measure the levels in her blood. Here are the instructions for ordering private tests from Genova:

Genova Diagnostics have been kind enough to arrange a discount for members of Thyroid Patient Advocacy- UK for the following Thyroid and Adrenal Tests:

In order to receive your discount, please DO NOT order direct from their web site. Instead, order direct from kitorders@... or telephone 020 8336 7754

When you complete your order, please remember to quote `Thyroid Patient Advocacy UK as `PRACTITIONER', or you will not be given the discount.

Please be assured that Genova will send your results direct to you and not to TPA as we have a special arrangement with them.

DISCOUNTS ON THE FOLLOWING TESTS

Test RRP Members Price

Thyroid Screen £99.00 £74.25

Thyroid Hormones - T3 & T4 £104.00 £88.40 (24hr urinary)

Adrenal Stress Profile £75.00 £64.29

Candida Antibody Profile £73.00 £62.57

Reverse T3 £62.00 £51.57

should also ask her GP to do the following blood tests – thyroid autoantibodies: TPO, TgAB and TSI. She might have to insist on at least TPO and TgAB (normally the lab only does TPO). If either of those two were positive, that alone would be diagnostic for Hashimoto's disease (autoimmune thyroiditis) regardless of what the other thyroid parameters show. The TSI is an autoantibody for Graves – it `takes over' the TSH and falsifies the readings. A patient can have positive TSI antibodies and not be overt hyperthyroid. So it is prudent to check for TSI, although if the appearance of a patient suggests that hyperthyroidism is unlikely then it is probably less important for the time being. (hypo and hyper can 'run' concurrently without the patient realizing at first).

Other blood parameters to check are : Ferritin, Folate, Zinc, Copper, Magnesium, Vit B12 and D3... all of those should be brought up to at the top of their respective ref ranges (this will help thyroid hormone to get inside the cells).

Further tip – ask to switch to a gluten-free diet.... but she should NOT do this until she has had the blood check for thyroid autoantibodies. AAs go up and down and a gluten-free diet will bring them down – so first check if she has positive numbers, thereafter start gluten-free. (no matter if test for celiac is negative – she will do better on gluten-free even if not celiac).

If can see Dr. Peatfield – great – but if money is tight, I would at least do the 25 hour urinary test and certainly ask the GP for the above tests. She can post all the results here and somebody will be along to help interpret. If her thyroid results are low, either she could self treat with natural dissociated thyroid (Armour, Erfa, Naturethroid etc) which are all available without prescription from the US, Canada or Thailand) or she can twist her doctors arm and insist on being treated.

Good luck,

[Guest guest]

Hello Sally

Sadly, we hear of such similar tales all too often. Doctors get

the results of thyroid function tests and have no idea how to interpret them as

they are never taught. So, as long as the results come back within the

reference range doctors tell their patient " your results are " normal,

therefore you do not have a thyroid problem " . What should do is to

ask her GP to provide her with the numbers for each thyroid test she has had

done together with the reference range and to get as many of these as she has

had done. A doctor cannot withhold the results of any tests and has a

right to these under the Freedom of Information Act.

As you will be aware, untreated or under-treated thyroid disease

can interfere with the process of getting pregnant. Infertility can occur

because this disease can cause problems with ovulation and irregular

menstruation. Sometimes, with hypothyroidism and infertility, there is not

enough time between ovulation and menstruation for conception to occur. The

goal of any treatment program (for both men and women) is to provide the body

with sufficient thyroid hormone to effectively increase the body functions.

Changes in oestrogen levels can affect the thyroid function and this is one of

the key reasons why treatment is required. I personally feel could be

experiencing thyroid problems with her low temperature and raised TSH, in which

case she needs to start on some form of thyroid hormone replacement. For those already

diagnosed and on thyroid hormone replacement, the dosages may need to be

changed during pregnancy and can cause a period of hormonal fluctuation for up

to six weeks. Hypothyroidism and infertility doesn't have to be a problem. I

hope somebody is able to provide you with the name of a good doctor in this

area. Check out this link: http://fertility.amuchbetterway.com/hypothyroidism-infertility-and-iodine

With a TSH of 3.09 - this is far too high. If lived in

Germany, Belgium, Sweden or the US she would have been given a diagnosis of

hypothyroidism with such a result. Their TSH ref. range is 0.3 to 2.5 (for

Germany, Belgium and Sweden) and 0.3 to 3.0 (for the US). I would recommend

that she asks her doctor for a FULL thyroid function test to include TSH, free

T4, free T3 and tests to see whether she has antibodies to her thyroid. These

are TPO and TgAb.

She should also ask her GP to test her levels of ferritin,

vitamin B12, vitamin D3, magnesium, folate, copper and zinc to see whether any

of these are low in the reference range. If her doctor tells her there is no

need to test these if she has a good diet, then ask to print off the

attached document to take to her GP to show of the connection between low

levels and the thyroid.

I have also attached our document " Why thyroxine stops

working " . This is not only for those taking thyroid hormone replacement

but for others who's own thyroid hormone may not be getting properly utilised

at the cellular level. It might be a good idea before any money is spent on

private testing for her to do the three questionnaires (see our FILES section

under 'Medical Questionnaires') to see how she scores, and whether there might,

or might not be a problem there.

We have had members who have been unable to conceive or had

miscarriages or still-births when either being denied a diagnosis because their

thyroid function test results were considered " normal " , or who were

on thyroxine-only (often insufficient), who became pregnant and had a healthy,

bouncing baby once they were started on the correct dose of thyroid hormone

(most often natural desiccated porcine thyroid extract). Natural thyroid

extracts contains T4,T3, T2, T1 plus calcitonin.

It is difficult to give the best course of action for

without first knowing the results of a full thyroid function test or the

results of her vitamins/minerals, or the results of the questionnaires.

If needs supplements, if she joins our support group, as

a TPA member she can get up to 33% off Nutri Ltd products and if she needs

private testing, which, as far as her thyroid is concerned I think important,

because the 24 hour urine tests shows the level of T4 and T3 that has been used

by the cells - which is what we need to know. The NHS blood tests ONLY show the

level of thyroid hormone being secreted by the thyroid gland and do not tell

the doctor whether that amount of hormone is getting into the cells.

We have a list of thyroid hormone replacements that can be

bought from reputable Internet Pharmacies without prescription in our FILES

section. The brands Erfa 'Thyroid' (available from www.valuepharmaceuticals.com ),

Nature Throid, Westhroid and Armour Thyroid can be prescribed by those NHS

doctors who are willing to give their patients a trial of it according to the

MHRA. However, doctors have to take full responsibility for prescribing NDT

because natural thyroid extract remains unlicensed in the UK.

Again in the FILES section, check the folder entitled 'All

natural Thyroid Extract' where you will find a document " How to Use

Natural Thyroid Extract " , plus lots of other very useful information that

may help you.

Luv - Sheila

For the last 10 months, has been religiously charting her monthly basal

body temperatures, noting the temp. spike at ovulation, and determining cervical

mucus quality so that we can understand her hormonal patterns as well as

anything that may be preventing pregnancy. has consistently had a

shortened luteal (2nd) phase of her cycle, which, in additon to estrogen

dominence, I have read can be caused by thyroid problems. Also, it has

only dawned on me recently (having flipped back through several months of

temperatures) that 's average temperature in the first half of her cycle

is 36.2 C or 97.2 F. (fairly low, am I correct?!) Additionally, her TSH

in February was 3.09 with all other bloods normal. Though doesn't

have any overt hypothyroid symptoms (energy good, sleep fine, hair and skin in

good condition, generally cheerful), I'm now wondering if the missing piece in

her infertility could be due to a thyroid issue???

The other thought I had was to give the dessicated thyroid gladular from

Nutri or TG100 by Allergy Research, though I'm not sure how much of a posiitve

impact it will make. If anyone has any other thoughts rg. 's situation,

we (she's given me permission to write in to the group!) would be ever so

grateful.

Thanks,

Sally

2 of 2 File(s)

LOW MINERALS AND VITAMINS AND THE THYROID CONNECTION.doc

Why thyroid hormone stops working (2).doc

[Guest guest]

hi Sally

can PCOS affect fertility, if so has that been ruled out? Just a thought

Chris

>

> Hello everyone! I've only just joined this group in the last couple of

> weeks and wow, have I learned a lot from you all- thanks so much!

>

[Guest guest]

An absent Achilles reflex could also be an indicator of adrenal problems. A saliva test to check adrenal function could be of help e.g. the Adrenocortex Stress Profile http://www.gdx.net/product/10102

Hazel.

www.oneagleswings.me.uk http://oneagleswingsme.blogspot.com/

From: Sally Horrobin

Sent: Tuesday, May 24, 2011 9:57 AM

thyroid treatment

Subject: fertility question

Sallyps- I forgot to say that I did the achilles reflex test on . Her reflex response was simply ABSENT on both legs. I've done this test on several others and myself with positive reflexes, so I know what it should look like....another tick for hypothyroidism?!

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[Guest guest]

Hi Sally

A slow Achilles tendon reflex is one of the ONLY signs

apparently that is specific to hypothyroidism, so I would make a point of

telling the doctor about this. It can be quite difficult in deciding whether a

reflex is 'normal' or slow bout Dr Peatfield told me that doctors experienced

in doing such a test know instantly.

Luv - Sheila

Sally

ps- I forgot to say that I did the achilles reflex test on . Her

reflex response was simply ABSENT on both legs. I've done this test on

several others and myself with positive reflexes, so I know what it should look

like....another tick for hypothyroidism?!

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clean.

Virus Database (VPS): 110524-0, 24/05/2011

Tested on: 24/05/2011 12:36:44

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[Guest guest]

Hi Sally,

Just a bit of good news - I have Hashimoto's (autoimmune hypo) and self treated

with NDT after seeing Dr Peatfield. I became pregnant in 2008, self treated

throughout my pregnancy (much to the dismay of the maternity endo at the

hospital) and had a trouble free pregnancy and have a beautiful 2 1/2 year old

now who drain me totally each day - but I'm not complaining.

There is a document in the file section on hypothyroid in pregnancy that

reiterates the importance of increasing thyroid dose in first 8-10 weeks of

pregnancy that you might find interesting too and reference for the future.

Nadia