Re: Lazarus article in GP Pulse

[Guest guest]

Hello Lou, missed you on the board as you have not been around

for a long time.

Many thanks for this, it makes my blood boil that these so

called 'experts' come up with the same pathetic excuses every time and never

move forward to find the true facts as to why so many NHS patients are turning

to Internet Thyroid Support Forums to find answers to their many questions- to

get back their optimal health when the NHS has let them down so very badly. They

treat us like morons - HOW DARE THEY! I will find time to respond to Dr

Lazarus, and hope others will too, especially and Bob. We must not allow

these ostriches to keep their head buried in the sand. They are causing harm to

their patients and this has to stop. For non-members of Pulse, I have attached

what he has written in Pulse Magazine.

Looking on the positive side of all this, the BTA are obviously

noticing what we are doing and don't like it, and are pathetically trying to

hold their corner - but they won't succeed. Pathetically, Professor Lazarus has

managed to cite just one reference to back the following - now, why are we surprised.

I think we can do much better than that.

" 3. What is the rationale behind some thyroid patient groups’ requests

for treatment with T3 or animal thyroid extract? Is there any evidence to

support this?

T4 is a pro-hormone which is deiodinated – an iodine atom is

removed from the molecule – in the periphery to produce the active hormone T3.

In humans, the normal thyroid gland produces all of the body’s T4 and some T3.

A few patient groups feel that levothyroxine replacement is not able to mimic

normal physiology since a diseased thyroid gland may not produce adequate T3.

In addition, it is speculated that some patients may not be able to convert

levothyroxine to T3 in the tissues.

There was one study that compared levothyroxine therapy alone

with levothyroxine/T3 combined therapy in 33 hypothyroid patients, and

concluded that the combined therapy led to an improvement in mood and

neuropsychological function.

But this study was not representative of general hypothyroid

patients, as more than half of the recruited participants had been on

replacement for treated thyroid cancer.

Subsequently, nine randomised controlled trials have failed to validate these

results in patients with primary hypothyroidism.2

Luv - Sheila

From: thyroid treatment

[mailto:thyroid treatment ] On Behalf Of Lou

Sent: 26 May 2011 13:12

thyroid treatment

Subject: Lazarus article in GP Pulse

Hi Sheila

Just saw this new article in GP pulse magazine with Lazarus trying to diss

patient groups who ask for T3 and dessicated thyroid.

Thought you might be interested.

http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=50 & storycode=4129600 & c=1

Case one

A 43-year-old lady was diagnosed with hypothyroidism six months ago.

She attends for review and you note her biochemical thyroid parameters are

satisfactory. ‘But I feel no better, doctor,’ she says. She goes on to say that

she has joined a thyroid sufferers’ forum via the internet and wonders if you

could give her T3 hormone or animal thyroid extract.

1. Are most hypothyroid patients likely to notice an improvement in

wellbeing when they start thyroid treatment? How should this be broached prior

to starting levothyroxine?

The majority of patients with hypothyroidism start to feel back to normal on

levothyroxine therapy.1 But this may take some time and it is likely

that blood tests would normalise before the symptoms do. On the other hand,

hypothyroid symptoms – such as weight gain and fatigue – are quite

non-specific, and some of these may not be related to hypothyroidism in the

first place. So patients being started on levothyroxine replacement therapy

should be advised that improvement in symptoms may take a few months and that

some symptoms may not improve.

2. What range of thyroxine (T4) and thyroid-stimulating hormone

(TSH) reflects satisfactory thyroid replacement?

In people with normal pituitary function and primary hypothyroidism, the

best marker of adequate levothyroxine replacement is a serum TSH within the

normal reference range. In some patients, it may be necessary to aim for a

serum TSH towards the lower limit of the reference range for optimal feeling of

well-being. This does not apply to people with secondary hypothyroidism

(pituitary disease), who should usually be managed by a specialist.

3. What is the rationale behind some thyroid patient groups’ requests

for treatment with T3 or animal thyroid extract? Is there any evidence to

support this?

T4 is a pro-hormone which is deiodinated – an iodine atom is removed from

the molecule – in the periphery to produce the active hormone T3. In humans,

the normal thyroid gland produces all of the body’s T4 and some T3. A few

patient groups feel that levothyroxine replacement is not able to mimic normal

physiology since a diseased thyroid gland may not produce adequate T3. In

addition, it is speculated that some patients may not be able to convert

levothyroxine to T3 in the tissues.

There was one study that compared levothyroxine therapy alone with

levothyroxine/T3 combined therapy in 33 hypothyroid patients, and concluded

that the combined therapy led to an improvement in mood and neuropsychological

function.

But this study was not representative of general hypothyroid patients, as

more than half of the recruited participants had been on replacement for

treated thyroid cancer.

Subsequently, nine randomised controlled trials have failed to validate these

results in patients with primary hypothyroidism.2

1 of 1 File(s)

Pulse Magazine Article.doc

[Guest guest]

Can anybody help me in finding the 'comments' written to the

article published here http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=50 & storycode=4129600 & c=1

please.

Luv - Sheila

[Guest guest]

Yes, but you have to take into account the fact they are being funded by the

drug companies!! Hopefully the patent on levothyroxine will run out and that

will mean less pressure.

Also remember that the results of their 'clinical studies' are nothing but

opinion fueled by the drug companies again.

ALL clinical trials results are dictated by what they EXPECT to find anyway.

Oh for a return of the days when doctors actually listened to their patients!!

[Guest guest]

"But this study was not representative of general hypothyroid patients, as more than half of the recruited participants had been on replacement for treated thyroid cancer <http://www.pulsetod ay.co.uk/ index.asp? navcode=996>

.. Subsequently, nine randomised controlled trials have failed to validate these results in patients with primary hypothyroidism. 2"So he's trying to say that T3 does not work? ?Well why are they giving it to thyroid cancer patients then? Sue x

[Guest guest]

Exactly!

Luv - Sheila

" But this study was not representative of general hypothyroid

patients, as more than half of the recruited participants had been on

replacement for treated thyroid cancer <http://www.pulsetod

ay.co.uk/ index.asp? navcode=996> . Subsequently, nine randomised

controlled trials have failed to validate these results in patients with

primary hypothyroidism. 2 "

So he's trying to say that T3 does not work? ?

Well why are they giving it to thyroid cancer patients then?

Sue x

[Guest guest]

Hi all,

What a shame someone with such a wonderful name (Lazurus was brought back from the dead after 4 days by Jesus) - shame he couldn't help us all by giving us what we need - in around 4 days we would start to get our life back too - given the meds we need for our thyroid. Shame on him..........

Best wishes

Mandy

[Guest guest]

Methinks the use of the name Lazarus is a deliberate ploy to promote belief in

this madman!!

Glynis

> Hi all,

>

> What a shame someone with such a wonderful name (Lazurus was brought back

> from the dead after 4 days by Jesus) - shame he couldn't help us all by

> giving us what we need - in around 4 days we would start to get our life

> back too - given the meds we need for our thyroid. Shame on him..........

>

> Best wishes

>

> Mandy

>

[Guest guest]

Remember that results of 'clinical trials' are opinions based on what the drug

comapnies want the results to be........

Glynis

> " But this study was not representative of general hypothyroid patients,

> as more than half of the recruited participants had been on replacement

> for treated thyroid cancer <http://www.pulsetod ay.co.uk/ index.asp?

navcode=996> . Subsequently, nine randomised controlled trials have failed to

> validate these results in patients with primary hypothyroidism. 2 "

>

> So he's trying to say that T3 does not work? ?

>

> Well why are they giving it to thyroid cancer patients then? 

>

>

> Sue x

>

[Guest guest]

I came across this article in Pulse by Dr Lazaurs which he wrote some time back re internet forums whilst searching the forum. The study he refers to was done on cancer patients and was an incorrect representation. It looks like he was clutching at straws! The article is no longer available to view but is below. He seems to be suggesting that a GP would know if a patient has pituitary disease by measuring TSH serum only - he makes no mention of fT4 and fT3 in diagnosing pituitary disease, so a patient continues to remain ill because a complete thyroid panel has not been done. And then they suffer further by being sent to psychiatrists and put on antidepressants because GPs have no knowledge of classic thyroid disease symptoms and so inevitably will not run further tests. He and the lot of them are totally bonkers!LoveJacquie >> Hi Sheila> > Just saw this new article in GP pulse magazine with Lazarus trying to diss > patient groups who ask for T3 and dessicated thyroid. > > > Thought you might be interested.> >

[Ed]

[Guest guest]

Hi Lou

Are most hypothyroid patients likely to notice an improvement in wellbeing when they start thyroid treatment? How should this be broached prior to starting levothyroxine?

The majority of patients with hypothyroidism start to feel back to normal on levothyroxine therapy.1 But this may take some time and it is likely that blood tests would normalise before the symptoms do. On the other hand, hypothyroid symptoms â€" such as weight gain and fatigue â€" are quite non-specific, and some of these may not be related to hypothyroidism in the first place. So patients being started on levothyroxine replacement therapy should be advised that improvement in symptoms may take a few months and that some symptoms may not improve.

But see:-

A single autoimmune T cell receptor recognizes more than a million different peptides ~ in paper here:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22102287

http://www.jbc.org/content/287/2/1168.full.pdf+html

Background: How does a limited pool of _10^8 T cell receptors (TCRs) provide immunity to _10^15 antigens?

Results: A single TCR can respond to > one million different decamer peptides.

Conclusion: This unprecedented level of receptor promiscuity explains how the naïve TCR repertoire achieves effective immunity.

Significance: TCR degeneracy has enormous potential to be the root cause of autoimmune disease

Work done at Cardiff University (and known to Prof J Lazarus) publ: Jan 6th 2012 in JBChem

read the paper; implications are stunning.

see also OMIM 123890 refers to CTLA4

Cytotoxic T-lymphocyte-associated serine esterase-4 : yeilding ~

{Celiac disease, susceptibility to, 3}

{Diabetes mellitus, insulin-dependent, susceptibility to}

{Graves disease, susceptibility to, 4}

{Hypothyroidism, autoimmune}

>> Hi Sheila> > Just saw this new article in GP pulse magazine with Lazarus trying to diss > patient groups who ask for T3 and dessicated thyroid. > > > Thought you might be interested.> > > http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=50 & storycode=4129600 & c=1>

[Guest guest]

Hi Bob -really interesting but not being a biochemist i'll keep to the abstract

.. Maybe Wales will eventually dig us out of this mess. I don't think my thyroid

problem is autoimmune . One of the few useful things I was told was that there

were no antibodies [despite awful brain fog I seem to have taken most things in]

Hence this seems to confirm the suspicion of an enviromental cause . Any recent

research on enviroment ? Please can somebody replay the Pulse link -my computer

did not seem to like the last one .best wishes