Simple question

[Guest guest]

I sadly had the superman syndrome, also. That and eleven years as a

firefighter did me in, in the knee dept.

Steve

" lvbeeralot "

....funny how

> when you`re young you never think of your knees......I`m paying

for

> it now.

[Guest guest]

Hi,If I wanted to bring my synthetic T3 down by 10mcg and wanted up my

synthetic T4 to cover it. How much extra T4 would I need to take?RegardsJas

[Guest guest]

If I wanted to bring my synthetic T3 down by 10mcg and wanted up my synthetic T4 to cover it. How much extra T4 would I need to take?

Not quite as simple a question as it appears, Jas ;o)

On the basis that T3 is approx 4 times as potent as T4, it would seem that the answer should be "40 mcg". But I have a feeling it does not quite work that way. For once the medics are not all agreeing on the `4x as potent' theory (some say 5x, some say even more potent than that), but more importantly perhaps I don't think that it's a linear conversion.

May I ask why you would want to reduce T3 in favour of T4?

[Guest guest]

What specific reason have you for wanting to increase your

thyroxine. Why are you taking T3 in the first place if T4 was converting

satisfactorily. Remember that thyroxine is a prohormone that has little

activity on its own until it has converted to the active thyroid hormone T3. It

is T3 that every cell in your body and brain needs to make them function, not

T4. If you are not happy with your present dose of T3, have you checked out

that it could be due to one of the following reasons:

There

are MANY reasons and many medical conditions associated with thyroid disease

that stop thyroid hormone from getting into the cells, where it does its work.

I mention these over and over and over again - ad nauseum - people must be

bored with the same old, same old but as each new member joins us, they need to

know.

The

main condition responsible for stopping thyroid hormone from working, is, quite

simply, a patients thyroxine dose is too low because the doctor or consultant

refuses to increase it, because the serum thyroid function test results appear

OK. Sometimes, the thyroxine dose is too high, yet patients still don't feel

well. They continue to suffer. Some reasons for this:

They

may be suffering with low adrenal reserve. The production of T4, its conversion

to T3, and the receptor uptake requires a normal amount of adrenal hormones,

notably, of course, cortisone. (Excess cortisone can shut production down,

however.) This is what happens if the adrenals are not responding properly, and

provision of cortisone usually switches it on again. But sometimes it

doesn’t. If the illness has been going on for a long time, the enzyme

seems to fail. This conversion failure (inexplicably denied by many

endocrinologists) means the thyroxine builds up, unconverted. So it doesn’t

work, and T4 toxicosis results. This makes the patient feel quite unwell,

toxic, often with palpitations and chest pain. If provision of adrenal support

doesn’t remedy the situation, the final solution is the use of the active

thyroid hormone, already converted, T3 - either synthetic or natural.

Then,

we have systemic candidiasis. This is where candida albicans, a yeast, which

causes skin infections almost anywhere in the body, invades the lining of the

lower part of the small intestine and the large intestine. Here, the candida

sets up residence in the warmth and the dark, and demands to be fed.

Loving sugars and starches, candida can make you suffer terrible sweet

cravings. Candida can produce toxins which can cause very many symptoms

of exhaustion, headache, general illness, and which interfere with the uptake

of thyroid and adrenal treatment. Sometimes the levels - which we usually

test for - can be very high, and make successful treatment difficult to achieve

until adequately treated.

Then

there is receptor resistance which could be a culprit. Being hypothyroid

for some considerable time may mean the biochemical mechanisms which permit the

binding of T3 to the receptors, is downgraded - so the T3 won’t go in.

With slow build up of T3, with full adrenal support and adequate vitamins and

minerals, the receptors do come on line again. But this can be quite a

slow process, and care has to be taken to build the dose up gradually.

And

then there are Food allergies. The most common food allergy is allergy to

gluten, the protein fraction of wheat. The antibody generated by the body, by a

process of molecular mimicry, cross reacts with the thyroperoxidase enzyme,

(which makes thyroxine) and shuts it down. So allergy to bread can make

you hypothyroid. There may be other food allergies with this kind of effect,

but information on these is scanty. Certainly allergic response to

certain foods can affect adrenal function and imperil thyroid production and

uptake.

Then

we have hormone imbalances. The whole of the endocrine system is linked; each

part of it needs the other parts to be operating normally to work

properly. An example of this we have seen already, with cortisone.

But another example is the operation of sex hormones. The imbalance that

occurs at the menopause with progesterone running down, and a relative

dominance of oestrogen is a further case in point – oestrogen dominance

downgrades production, transportation and uptake of thyroid hormones.

This is why hypothyroidism may first appear at the menopause; the symptoms

ascribed to this alone, which is then treated – often with extra oestrogen,

making the whole thing worse. Deficiency in progesterone most especially

needs to be dealt with, since it reverses oestrogen dominance, improves many

menopausal symptoms like sweats and mood swings, and reverses

osteoporosis. Happily natural progesterone cream is easily obtained: when

used it has the added benefit of helping to stabilise adrenal function.

Then,

we must never forget the possibility of mercury poisoning (through amalgam

fillings) - low levels of ferritin, vitamin B12, vitamin D3, magnesium, folate,

copper and zinc - all of which, if low, stop the thyroid hormone from being

utilised by the cells - these have to be treated.

As Dr

Peatfield says " When you have been quite unwell for a long time, all these

problems have to be dealt with; and since each may affect the other, it all has

to be done rather carefully.

Contrary to cherished beliefs by much of the medical

establishment, the correction of a thyroid deficiency state has a number of

complexities and variables, which make the treatment usually quite specific for

each person. The balancing of these variables is as much up to you as to

me – which is why a check of morning, day and evening temperatures and pulse

rates, together with symptoms, good and bad, can be so helpful.

Many of you have been ill for a long time, either because you

have not been diagnosed, or the treatment leaves you still quite unwell.

Those of you who have relatively mild hypothyroidism, and have been diagnosed

relatively quickly, may well respond to synthetic thyroxine, the standard

treatment. If the thyroxine proves satisfactory in use, it is merely a

question of dosage.

For many of you, the outstanding problem is not that the

diagnosis has not been made – although, extraordinarily, this is disgracefully

common – but that is has, and the thyroxine treatment doesn’t work. The

dose has been altered up and down, and clinical improvement is variable and

doesn’t last, in spite of blood tests, which say you are perfectly all right

(and therefore you are actually depressed and need this fine antidepressant).

The above problems must be eliminated if thyroid hormone isn't

working for you.

Luv - Sheila

Hi,

If I wanted to

bring my synthetic T3 down by 10mcg and

wanted up my synthetic T4 to cover it. How much extra T4 would I need to take?

Regards

Jas

[Guest guest]

Hi,I am hypothyroid. I started on 50mcg of T4. Tsh 25 which went down to 4.95. Still felt unwell. 8 months later Tsh rose to 12.9 and I was put up to 75mcg of T4. That pushed my Tsh

to 3.5 but still felt unwell. Dr did not believe me and sent me to Endo 13 months later. He tested me and found I was Tsh 13.3. So prescribed me 10mcg T3 rather than try

and raise my T4 up to as far as he could go. The T3 suppressed my Tsh to 0.22, my T4 to 13.5 and my T3 went up from 4.4 to 4.7.After 1 year, I have never felt quite right and became quite bad with ill health. This is when I discovered I had really flat adrenals. I went on alot of Adrenal support NAE, Compose, T convert etc. Over the last 2 years, my adrenals have built themselves up but do not seem to get there. Looking back I feel maybe if was T3 that caused some issue. As weak adrenals and T3 should not mix until they are better? So

I was thinking about stopping the T3 and increasing the T4 as far as possible to see if this will help the adrenals. As this was not tried by the doctor or the Endo. They just say your Tsh is 0.22 so your fine.regardsJas From: <christina@...>To:

thyroid treatment Sent: Thu, 11 August, 2011 15:46:45Subject: Re: Simple question

If I wanted to bring my synthetic T3 down by 10mcg and wanted up my synthetic T4 to cover it. How much extra T4 would I need to take? Not quite as simple a question as it appears, Jas ;o) On the basis that T3 is approx 4 times as potent as T4, it would seem that the answer should be "40 mcg". But I have a feeling it does not quite work that way. For once the medics are not all agreeing on the `4x as potent' theory (some say 5x, some say even more potent than that), but more importantly perhaps I don't think that it's a linear conversion. May I ask why you would want to reduce T3 in favour of T4?

[Guest guest]

Hi ,If I took a break from my Thyroid medication, 7-14 days has you suggest to fix the adrenals. I would like to know what signs I should look out for to know that the adrenals are in better condition to restart the thyroid medication again.RegardsJas

From: <christina@...> thyroid treatment Sent: Thursday, 11 August 2011, 19:08 Subject: Re: Simple question

I started on 50mcg of T4. Tsh 25 which went down to 4.95. Still felt unwell. 8 months later Tsh rose to 12.9 and I was put up to 75mcg of T4. That pushed my Tsh to 3.5 but still felt unwell. Dr did not believe me and sent me to Endo 13 months later. He tested me and found I was Tsh 13.3. So prescribed me 10mcg T3 rather than try and raise my T4 up to as far as he could go. The T3 suppressed my Tsh to 0.22, my T4 to 13.5 and my T3 went up from 4.4 to 4.7. After 1 year, I have never felt quite right and became quite bad with ill health. This is when I discovered I had really flat adrenals. I went on alot of Adrenal support NAE, Compose, T convert etc. Over the last 2 years, my adrenals have built themselves up but do not seem to get there. Looking back I feel maybe if was T3 that caused some issue. As weak adrenals and T3 should not mix until they are better? So I was thinking about stopping the T3 and increasing the T4 as far as possible to see if this will help the adrenals. As this was not tried by the doctor or the Endo. They just say your Tsh is 0.22 so your fine. Hi Jas, Aha... now I understand your motivation. But I am sorry to have to tell you that IMHO you are thinking along the wrong lines. What you are proposing won't work. I'll explain why..... Your wildly fluctuating TSH tells me that in all likelihood you suffer from autoimmune thyroiditis. So the first thing to do is a full thyroid panel (TSH, FT4 and FT3.... and this time you need your thyroid antibodies checked – TPO, TgAB and for good measure TSI. Your endo might not like that, but the minimum you need checking is TPO and TgAB to establish that you suffer indeed from autoimmune thyroiditis (Hashimoto's disease) if for no other reason you know what you are dealing with. The amount of thyroid medication you took before taking T3 does not really correspond with the wildly fluctuating TSH figures, which is very common in Hashimoto's disease. Since taking T3 your TSH is suppressed – which is what happens inevitably on T3. Now... if you have weak adrenals, then NO amount of thyroid hormone is going to work. The rule of thumb is – adrenal first, thyroid second. Until and unless you treat your weak adrenals, nothing is going to make you well. In addition it is contra-indicated to take thyroid hormones when the adrenals work insufficiently... although this is all a question of degree. There is no point in taking thyroid hormones first and then try and stabilize the adrenals – it won't work. You need to stop your thyroid meds altogether for about 7 -14 days (depending on the severity of your adrenal weakness) and THEN start with thyroid hormones from scratch – either with a combo of T4/T3 in the right ratio, or you switch to natural thyroid like Armour, Erfa, Naturethoid etc.. In addition you need to have your mineral and vitamin levels checked – namely Ferritin, Folate, Magnesium, Zinc, Copper, Vit D3 and Vit B12. If you were low in any of those – even low within the ref range, you need to rectify that by supplementing whatever is low. All of those parameters can and should be done on NHS. However, adrenal support and any supplements you may need you will have to finance yourself – I don't think any doctor will be sympathetic to the idea of adrenal fatigue – as far as they are concerned, it does not exist – you will be on your own with this one, but you probably know that already. With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

If I took a break from my Thyroid medication, 7-14 days as you suggest to fix the adrenals. I would like to know what signs I should look out for to know that the adrenals are in better condition to restart the thyroid medication again.

Hi Jas,

The last time you posted was over 6 months ago... so what has happened with you during those 6 months? Have you had all the lab tests as suggested and what were the results?

I can't answer your question above without knowing what you've been doing in the meantime, what you currently take and how you feel now.

Stopping thyroid meds for up to two weeks would not `fix' the adrenals... fixing them will take many months, perhaps even years – but a 2 week break from thyroid hormone will hopefully be enough to strengthen the adrenals sufficiently to enable your body to tolerate and utilize your thyroid meds with more success than before... but everything has to go hand in hand with the right levels of minerals and vitamins. Without knowing those levels it's all a bit hit and miss.

With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

,I have supplemented over the last 6 months. My levels are now very good and top of the range in Iron, Folate, Magnesium, Zinc, Copper, Vit D3 and Vit B12. I also take 2 Nax, 2 Na, 2 Compose, 1 nutri Thyroid, 1 Adrenomax as well as 1000mg Vit C a day. I was on 87.5mcg T4 and 10mcg (2 x 5mcg) T3. But I did not feel a 100 %. Not enough energy in the evenings etc. My temps are up to 36.5 on average during the day and basal temp is 36.2. Tsh 0.08 (0.25-3.5)FT4 15 (11 - 22)FT3 4.9 (3.1- 6.8)I have been on this amount of T3 for 4 years and although my hypo/hashi symptoms went away. I feel it introduced bad adrenal issues ie tiredness etc.. I believe I was initially badly advised about dosages and how to start T3 that led to the deterioration of the adrenal (20mcg of T3 in one dose every other day for 3 months). But I have coped and adjusted the dose over the years without fully getting better. About 1 week ago I decided to stop my T3 and have rest from it to see if there was any change in how I felt. I stayed on 87.5mcg T4 otherwise I would not be able get out of bed.After a week, I have noticed the following. The main issue is the source of energy the T3 provided is hard cope without. However, I seem to have a more levelled day. No ups and downs in energy and no tired periods through out the day, therefore no laying down for 20 mins just to get some energy. No feeling of hunger I use to get after taking T3. The dark lines under my eyes are disappearing. My average temp has gone up from 36.5 to 36.7 during the day and basal temp from 36.2 to now 36.4. Most noticeable, is when having a photograph taken with a flash, I don't have that drowsy drunk eye look that I had while on T3. I have full open bright eyes. I can also spend hours on the Pc without feeling tired now.

The buzzing noises in my ear like tinnitus has reduced.I do want add the T3 back in to get my energy levels back up at some stage. But at 2.5 mcg every few days to get back to 10mcg. So the reason for my question was how do I know when is the best time to introduce it? With hashi does TSh need to suppressed? and what level of suppression does the thyroid stop functioning?jas From: <christina@...> thyroid treatment Sent: Sunday, 19 February 2012, 19:03 Subject: Re: Simple question

If I took a break from my Thyroid medication, 7-14 days as you suggest to fix the adrenals. I would like to know what signs I should look out for to know that the adrenals are in better condition to restart the thyroid medication again. Hi Jas, The last time you posted was over 6 months ago... so what has happened with you during those 6 months? Have you had all the lab tests as suggested and what were the results? I can't answer your question above without knowing what you've been doing in the meantime, what you currently take and how you feel now. Stopping thyroid meds for up to two weeks would not `fix' the adrenals... fixing them will take many months, perhaps even years – but a 2 week break from thyroid hormone will hopefully be enough to strengthen the adrenals sufficiently to enable your body to tolerate and utilize your thyroid meds with more success than before... but everything has to go hand in hand with the right levels of minerals and vitamins. Without knowing those levels it's all a bit hit and miss. With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

Posted for Jas (Supercoolio)

Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2012 21:52:12 +0000 (GMT)

Subject: Re: Re: Simple question

Hi ,

I have been introducing the T3 back. I am up to 7.5 mcg and I am going to hold

it at this level for a week. I feel more energy but not loads. Still get very

tired by evening.

The question I want to ask is that I was on 87.5 mcg of T4 and 10 mcg (2x5) of

T3. Now if I were to switch over to all T4 how much would body be able to take.

( 12st Male)? Maybe I could take more T4 and get higher figures?

Please answer with these assumptions in mind. Firstly on I started the 10mcg of

T3 whilst on 75mcg of T4. I slowly increased it to 87.5 mcg. As I did felt

better and more energy with every 6mcg increase. But when I went to 93.75 mcg of

T4 I felt more energized and could stay up later but started to get swollen

hands and loose bowels. My basal temperature started to get very erratic

although average daily temp stayed the same. So does this mean I don't have any

T4 conversion issues? As the reason I was put on T3 was because I was not

converting T3 enough. My results at the time were

Tsh 13 (0.35-5.5)

FT4 13.4 (10.3-22)

FT3 4.4 (3.55-6)

Also whilst I was on 87.5mcg of T4 and 10 mcg of T3. I tried increasing the T3

by 2.5mcg in the morning dose. I felt a little better but got palps and swollen

hands and loose bowels.

I really want to be at top of the ranges for Ft4 and Ft3 even if means dropping

T3 to do it. I don't know if more T4 push to the limit of the range would

provide me with more energy than I current get with just 10mcg T3. As my energy

levels as not very good as one day activity means a few bad days afterwards. So

I keep questioning myself will being at the top range help me?

Regards

jas

From: <christina@...>

thyroid treatment

Sent: Monday, 20 February 2012, 22:15

Subject: Re: Simple question

Hello Jas,

After a week, I have noticed the following. The main issue is the source of

energy the T3 provided is hard cope without. However, I seem to have a more

levelled day. No ups and downs in energy and no tired periods through out the

day, therefore no laying down for 20 mins just to get some energy. No feeling of

hunger I use to get after taking T3. The dark lines under my eyes are

disappearing.

[Ed]

[Guest guest]

So I keep questioning myself will being at the top range help me?

Hi Jas,

It seems to me that you are looking at the problem from the wrong angle. Having figures at the top does by no means guarantee wellbeing. Figures are guidelines – nothing more. Blood figures are snapshots in time, and levels are constantly changing anyway. You need to go first and foremost by what your body tells you. And a report like this ...

....my energy levels as not very good as one day activity means a few bad days afterwards....

....indicates that a large part of your problem is still weak adrenal function. I know you take adrenal support and you say all your minerals and vitamins are in optimal positions, but you still expect too much, too soon. To rectify weak adrenal takes at best many months, at worst many years. I am on my 4th year of adrenal support and although feeling very well in general, my adrenals are still cr*p and won't take much pressure. Medicine is not an exact science like engineering. You can't predict what will definitely happen when you do or take x, y or z. Everybody is an individual and everybody's body will react differently. But one thing is for certain - for as long as the adrenals are weak, you need to go easy on the thyroid meds, whatever you take. Weak adrenals simply cannot handle much thyroid hormone. You need to significantly reduce your stress levels and give your adrenals a lot of TLC and support them.

My basal temperature started to get very erratic although average daily temp stayed the same. So does this mean I don't have any T4 conversion issues? As the reason I was put on T3 was because I was not converting T3 enough. My results at the time wereTsh 13 (0.35-5.5)FT4 13.4 (10.3-22)FT3 4.4 (3.55-6)

I do not know if one can identify a T4 to T3 conversion problem by erratic temps. I haven't looked into that; but I do know that erratic temps mean weak adrenals. Your FT4 and FT3 figures above do not indicate a conversion problem to me, but then they wouldn't ... since you were on T3 at the time of testing those figures are meaningless as a guide for conversion problems. What those figures do indicate, however, is that hardly any thyroid hormone has been getting inside your cells because your TSH was 13 and your cells are crying out for the active thyroid hormone T3. So you might have a cell receptor problem.... and this is what Dr. Peatfield recommends for cell receptor resistance:Then there is receptor resistance which could be a culprit. Being hypothyroid for some considerable time may mean the biochemical mechanisms which permit the binding of T3 to the receptors, is downgraded - so the T3 won't go in. With slow build up of T3, with full adrenal support and adequate vitamins and minerals, the receptors do come on line again. But this can be quite a slow process, and care has to be taken to build the dose up gradually.

I am not a doctor and I can't diagnose or recommend treatment, but if I were in your situation, I would consider the above and – if possible – go and see Dr. Peatfield, or – if your endo were willing and agreed that receptor resistance is likely – try a T3-only therapy under his supervision. And this would have to be done, as Dr. P. suggests, very, very slowly.If you asked me, I think it is unlikely that Levothyroxine (T4 only) is doing you any favours, but this is my personal opinion based on your clinical symptoms and the fact that you can't even take 100 mcg without getting an adverse reaction. For a male weighing 12 stone, 100 mcg T4 would be a very small dose. My impression after reading your report is that the T4 just builds up in your bloodstream and makes you thyrotoxic; even if it converts into T3, not enough T3 is getting inside the cells for some reason....

With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

Hi ,Thanks for your reply. I do respect your advice. However I don't think I made my T4 point clearly.These figures below were why they put me on T3. They are pre T3. I was actually only on 75mcg of T4. Tsh 13 (0.35-5.5)FT4 13.4 (10.3-22)FT3 4.4 (3.55-6) Instead of raising my T4 to 100mcg. They put me on 10 mcg of T3. Once on T3, I was suppress with no room for improvement (tsh 0.22). The slightest increase in T4 does get more FT3 ie 82mcg to 88mcg an increase of 3 or 4 Ft3. But I feel the T3 suppression does not allow me to go up much as at 93mcg as I feel hyper.Also I noticed the following. Tsh T4 T3 0.35-5.5 11-22 3.1-6.8

Oct-10

0.14

13.4

4.7

T3 10mcg , T4 88mcg

Dec 10

0.08

14.4

4.9

T3 10mcg , T4 88mcg

Feb 11

0.22

13.5

4.5

T3 10mcg , T4 82mcg

July

11

0.22

12.8

4.6

T3 10mcg , T4 82mcg

Sept

11

0.08

15.8

5.1

T3 10mcg , T4 88mcg

I did feel best T3 10mcg and T4 88mcg. But not ideal. Thats why I was asking if just T4 or slightly less T3 say 7.5mcg instead of 10mcg, will allow me more T4 dosage to get higher FT3 because the higher I am the better I think I will feel. regardsJas

[Guest guest]

Hi Jas,

These figures below were why they put me on T3. They are pre T3. I was actually only on 75mcg of T4.

Oh, ok...sorry, I did not realize those figures were nearly 2 years old and pre T3....

However, at the time your TSH was 13 whilst taking thyroid hormone (Levo only), which suggested a cell uptake problem. So adding T3 into the equation in order to clear any blockage, was IMHO the right thing to do at the time. It appears to have done the trick, but you optimizing your minerals and vitamins was probably helping a great deal too.

Have you got any recent figures ? September 11 was over 6 months ago, so has long been water under the bridge.

It seems to me that what you really want is to take T4 only again... and if that is what you feel best on, then why not. There are many roads leading to Rome, not just one. Speak to your endo, have a new blood test, and see what the figures indicate now.

If your body is converting (I suspect it always had) and any possible cell uptake problem has now been rectified (something I am not yet convinced of), and you take plenty of adrenal support, then perhaps you will do better on more T4 and no, or very little, T3. We are all different. I would, however, caution about being too gung-ho with any kind of thyroid hormone, because your body's response ....

But when I went to 93.75 mcg of T4 I felt more energized and could stay up later but started to get swollen hands and loose bowels. My basal temperature started to get very erratic although average daily temp stayed the same.

.....indicates that you still have a bad adrenal problem – and for as long as you do not have your adrenal fatigue under control, no amount or kind of thyroid hormone will make you 100% well.

Most of us arrive at our optimal thyroid medication via trial and error.... so experiment, but implement any changes gently and slowly. The biggest mistake to make is to rush things. Always work on the basis that it takes about 2 weeks for thyroid hormones to settle enough for you to notice any difference (except for T3, which works much faster) and bear in mind that the effects of T3 are between 4-5 times as potent as T4...

And please do keep an open mind at all times. FT figures at the very top of their respective ref ranges will not guarantee your wellbeing – I can only repeat... listen to your body. For as long as your adrenals are struggling you will not feel optimal – whatever you take and whatever your FT figures say.

With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

Hi , I am now been on my base 87.5mcg of T4 and have slowly worked up to 7.5 mcg of T3 ( although I was on 10mcg for 3 years up until last month). I just want to run some signs I am getting past

you. I don't know if they are low thyroid or low cortisol. When I do a bit activity liking walking long distance or up some flights of stairs. When I eventually stop I have a very strong heartbeat for about 30 seconds to 1 min and then it disappears. Also although my pulse is normal during the day. I now find that when I am asleep and occasionally when I turn around on my side my heart will beat very fast for a while and then slow down. The only other thing to report is that since being off the T3 and re-introducing it is that I tire more very than I use too.RegardsJas

[Guest guest]

I don't know if they are low thyroid or low cortisol. When I do a bit activity liking walking long distance or up some flights of stairs. When I eventually stop I have a very strong heartbeat for about 30 seconds to 1 min and then it disappears. Also although my pulse is normal during the day. I now find that when I am asleep and occasionally when I turn around on my side my heart will beat very fast for a while and then slow down. The only other thing to report is that since being off the T3 and re-introducing it is that I tire more very than I use too.

Hi Jas,

From personal experience (and I have exactly the same problem and have had it for years) I would guess it is down to weak adrenals.

Having said that – such symptoms could also be due to low iron or low magnesium. I had my iron checked with a full panel, and in my case it is definitely down to weak adrenals. My iron is high, almost too high, with ferritin of 140 and transferrin saturation at 45% and serum iron of 26... Strangely enough, I too get palps regularly when I go to bed, and I take my daily dose of 300 or 400 mg of Magnesium citrate as soon as the palps start. This calms the heart down within about 10 minutes and also sends me off to sleep as an added bonus.

I have had this very same problem all along. Although my adrenal profile did not look alarmingly low when all this started and Dr. P. initially thought I would need `a few months with NAX', I am now in year four with adrenal support and I still cannot exert myself physically without being exhausted within minutes. I can do anything else – work my brain 14 hours a day or do something like cooking or the ironing – whatever – and feel fine (on NDT) .... but I could not run for a full minute to save my life. I used to be physically pretty strong – now I am weak. I even tried HC for some months... it made no difference. I had my heart checked – the cardiologist (horrible man!) told me I was `wasting his time and for "every patient like me" some "real" patient had to wait longer for an appointment'.... I am – apparently – a picture of health! So I now just take things easy, pace myself and keep my stress levels down.

As for synthetic T4/T3 treatment.... I have no experience of that. To my mind NDT is the best thing since sliced bread, because the ratio of T4:T3 in natural thyroid – although T3 weighted for good reason – seems to work perfectly for most people who are on it. The trouble with taking a synthetic combination of T4 and T3 is that you have to work out by trial and error which is the right mix for you... and everybody has unique requirements. Somehow this problem does not arise as much with natural desiccated thyroid, perhaps because natural hormones are bio-identical? - I wouldn't know...

Take it easy and strengthen your adrenals, Jas ... by the sound of it, weak adrenals appear to be your main problem.

With best wishes,

[Guest guest]

hi pearlits given in details in the delivering a better oral health docu will find it attachedbest regardsebtisam From: pearltooth32 <pearltooth32@...> Sent: Saturday, 31 March 2012, 14:12 Subject: simple question

hi

i want to know others opinion about the age for flouride and other dose for eg if they ask fl dose for 3 yr whether we will include in 6 month to 3 yr or the dose will be advided for the age of 3yr to 6 yr.

i think it should be in 3-6 yr for 3 yr of age but others views will be appreciated.

thanks

pearl

1 of 1 File(s)

dh_102982.pdf

[Guest guest]

Thanks Ebtessam for your answer but i am not asking the dose i am trying to ask

if the child is 3 yr old whether you will advised the dose of fl ( where the

water content is <0.3 )

A. 250 ( 6mnts -3 yr) or

B. 500 ( 3-6yr) .

its difficult top write in but i hope you got my point. Sorry for asking the

silly question but answer will change if we do not know the cut off age wherther

3yr is in group A or B.

>

>

>

>

> hi pearl

>

> its given in details in the delivering a better oral health doc

> u will find it attached

> best regards

> ebtisam

>

> ________________________________

> From: pearltooth32 <pearltooth32@...>

>

> Sent: Saturday, 31 March 2012, 14:12

> Subject: simple question

>

>

>  

> hi

>

> i want to know others opinion about the age for flouride and other dose for eg

if they ask fl dose for 3 yr whether we will include in 6 month to 3 yr or the

dose will be advided for the age of 3yr to 6 yr.

>

> i think it should be in 3-6 yr for 3 yr of age but others views will be

appreciated.

>

> thanks

>

> pearl

>

[Guest guest]

hi pearl,u can see theme 1.14 in EMQ book (pastest)Ahmed From: pearltooth32@...Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 13:27:36 +0000Subject: Re: simple question

Thanks Ebtessam for your answer but i am not asking the dose i am trying to ask if the child is 3 yr old whether you will advised the dose of fl ( where the water content is <0.3 )

A. 250 ( 6mnts -3 yr) or

B. 500 ( 3-6yr) .

its difficult top write in but i hope you got my point. Sorry for asking the silly question but answer will change if we do not know the cut off age wherther 3yr is in group A or B.

>

>

>

>

> hi pearl

>

> its given in details in the delivering a better oral health doc

> u will find it attached

> best regards

> ebtisam

>

> ________________________________

> From: pearltooth32 <pearltooth32@...>

>

> Sent: Saturday, 31 March 2012, 14:12

> Subject: simple question

>

>

> Â

> hi

>

> i want to know others opinion about the age for flouride and other dose for eg if they ask fl dose for 3 yr whether we will include in 6 month to 3 yr or the dose will be advided for the age of 3yr to 6 yr.

>

> i think it should be in 3-6 yr for 3 yr of age but others views will be appreciated.

>

> thanks

>

> pearl

>

[Guest guest]

got it thanks

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > hi pearl

>

> >

>

> > its given in details in the delivering a better oral health doc

>

> > u will find it attached

>

> > best regards

>

> > ebtisam

>

> >

>

> > ________________________________

>

> > From: pearltooth32 <pearltooth32@>

>

> >

>

> > Sent: Saturday, 31 March 2012, 14:12

>

> > Subject: simple question

>

> >

>

> >

>

> > Â

>

> > hi

>

> >

>

> > i want to know others opinion about the age for flouride and other dose for

eg if they ask fl dose for 3 yr whether we will include in 6 month to 3 yr or

the dose will be advided for the age of 3yr to 6 yr.

>

> >

>

> > i think it should be in 3-6 yr for 3 yr of age but others views will be

appreciated.

>

> >

>

> > thanks

>

> >

>

> > pearl

>

> >

>

[Guest guest]

TrismusSent from my iPhoneOn 7 Apr 2012, at 11:29 PM, Risha Hussain <drrishahussain@...> wrote:

Hi,Can anyone please tell me what is the most common complication of surgery for impacted 3rd molars? It is trismus or dry socket?Many thanks!R

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