Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 FWIW, an herbalist who examined me recently said I really needed probiotics. I wouldn't be surprised after all those ABX last year, though who knows, maybe I needed them before. She said the easiest and cheapest way to get massive amounts of beneficial bacteria was to drink kefir. Otherwise she was recommending literally handfuls of acidophilus/etc. capsules. ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 What percentage of us (Or URL to study find it)? Does the incidence increase with duration (which is what Nicolson finds with Mycoplasma)? ----- Original Message ----- From: Skari, M probiotics could push you further into a Th2 state. Stroptococcus thermophilus romotes Th2 cytokines (Humorally-mediated immunity) which many of us have too many of already. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 -- You might be interested to know that the acidophilus I get from my MD has 250 billion per teaspoon, and the label recommends 1-2 tsp's 3 times a day, whereas the pills I get from the health food store have 3 billion per capsule. So, I don't think handfuls of the capsules are in any way out of line. The hi-dose liquid is called a-dophilus liquid, from The Torrance Co., Portage, MI 49002. I have no financial interest in it--just posting the info from the label. in North Carolina ...SNIP >She said the easiest and cheapest way to get > massive amounts of beneficial bacteria was to drink kefir. > Otherwise she was > recommending literally handfuls of acidophilus/etc. capsules. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 , This is incredible! I thought I was doing good getting 12 billion throughout the day. Is there a phone number or web site on the bottle? Also, can you tell us what strains are in this formula? Thanks, Marty Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 , What is kefir and where can one buy it? I'm on a 6 week course of high powered antibiotic and I don't want yeast getting out of hand. Theresa From: " Scherffius " <cfids_ex@...> " She said the easiest and cheapest way to get massive amounts of beneficial bacteria was to drink kefir. Otherwise she was recommending literally handfuls of acidophilus/etc. capsules. " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 A >, > > What is kefir and where can one buy it? I'm on a 6 week course of high >powered antibiotic and I don't want yeast getting out of hand. > >Theresa > > Hi, It is cheese usually seen in the East. I have seen it in finer deli's tho... Christie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 31, 2000 Report Share Posted January 31, 2000 According to info Konlee dug up, probiotics could push you further into a Th2 state. Stroptococcus thermophilus romotes Th2 cytokines (Humorally-mediated immunity) which many of us have too many of already.I have never seen commercially available yogurt, kefir, etc, that did NOT have S.thermophilis in it. Lactobacillus Casei and L. Plantarum promote IL-12 and IFN-gamma (or CMI), but I have not seen them as a major component of any probiotic. More details at: http://www.execpc.com/~keephope/report18.html <http://www.execpc.com/~keephope/report18.html> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2000 Report Share Posted February 1, 2000 its true Kefir works really well for getting friendly bacteria in to your gut; better than anything in my case. The main problem is that its hard to find plain kefir; which is low in sugar. I usually just find flavored kefir which have tons of sugar. What worked best for me was raw kefir 1 cup each morning and evening; but they havent sold that for many months here in LA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2000 Report Share Posted February 1, 2000 In a message dated 2/1/00 3:34:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, onelist writes: << According to info Konlee dug up, probiotics could push you further into a Th2 state. >> Is this a good or bad thing? Sorry, been busy with the 'Pro' stuff. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2000 Report Share Posted February 1, 2000 Marty, No, I'm sorry, there's no more info on the bottle--I'm sitting here getting my myers IV and my nurse says she'll have to dig up the phone number, so I'll post it if I get it--but it's kind of crazy in here today, so it could be a few days til she gets back to me. She orders directly from the company. Also, unfortunately, it only has lactobacillus acidophilus, so I also use other supplements with a better variety of organisms. in North Carolina > -----Original Message----- > From: Marty Zavala [mailto:martyz@...] > > > , > This is incredible! I thought I was doing good getting 12 billion > throughout > the day. Is there a phone number or web site on the bottle? > > Also, can you tell us what strains are in this formula? > > Thanks, > Marty Z. > > > > --------------------------- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2000 Report Share Posted February 1, 2000 [Theresa] I just ordered the following:from the LEF web site: " Life Flora " : #263, 120 capsules for $20.50 + S/H Each capsule contains 2 billion organisms (in a freeze dried state at the time of manufacture) consisting of : Lactobacillus rhamnosus 55% Lactobacillus acidophilus 5% Bifidobacterium bifidum 10% Bifidobacterium breve 10% Bifidobacterium infantis 10% Bifidobacterium longum 10% Keep product refrigerated before and after opening. SUGGESTED USE: Take 1-4 capsules daily or if you want to load up on bifidobacteria, you may want to take one bottle of Bifidobacteria capsules (six capsules daily) with NUTRAFLORA in the beginning to quickly produce a healthy bacterial flora. Each capsule contains two billion friendly bifidobacteria. [Theresa] I'll let you know what happens (hopefully at least no runaway yeastie beasties will take over while I'm on the antibiotic. RE: Probiotics >From: " Crane " <ccrane@...> > >Marty, >No, I'm sorry, there's no more info on the bottle--I'm sitting here getting >my myers IV and my nurse says she'll have to dig up the phone number, so >I'll post it if I get it--but it's kind of crazy in here today, so it could >be a few days til she gets back to me. She orders directly from the company. > >Also, unfortunately, it only has lactobacillus acidophilus, so I also use >other supplements with a better variety of organisms. > > in North Carolina Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 1, 2000 Report Share Posted February 1, 2000 >From: MCamp10139@... > >In a message dated 2/1/00 3:34:56 AM Eastern Standard Time, >onelist writes: > ><< According to info Konlee dug up, probiotics could push you further into a > Th2 state. >> > >Is this a good or bad thing? Sorry, been busy with the 'Pro' stuff. My understanding (someone correct me here as I am still learning - this can get a little confusing) Your TH1/TH2 state is a marker for the state of your disease. There are 2 types of immunity - humoral (TH2) or cell-mediated(TH1). We need both in the proper balance. The cytokines (which are good chemicals) get out of whack in the immune cascade and wreak havoc with our immunities (humoral and cell-mediated). The goal is to get the cytokines back in balance therefore restoring the right balance of humoral vs cell mediated immunity. If you immune state is low TH1/high TH2 then certain probiotics would not be helpful (s. thermophilus is in most yogurt) but the other probiotics are helpful (l. acidophilus being the most common) Here's a short excerpt from Mark Konlee's site: Progressive Health News A Consumer’s Guide to Immune Restoration. A Summary of factors that induce Th1 or Th2 cytokines Vol 2, No 3 March 1, 1999 Mark Konlee This month’s issue of Progressive Health News is a Summary of factors that induce Th1 and Th2 cytokines that is excerpted from Positive Health News, Report No 18 that will be printed on March 15th and mailed out March 16th. More details will be provided in the upcoming issue of Positive Health News that you should receive within the next few days. Persons with HIV, HHV-6A, CFIDS, Multiple allergies and MCS, GWS and cancer have a predominance of Th2 cytokines and a lack of Th1’s. The shift from Th2 to Th1 will restore the ability of the immune system to eradicate intracellular infections and increase natural immunity to cancer. Note to internet readers: Positive Health News, No 18, should be online by March 15th. DIETARY FACTORS THAT SUPPORT Th1 CYTOKINES Omega 3 fatty acids (N3) found in cold water fish reduce IL-6, tumor necrosis factor and support DTH. Oleic acid, found in olive oil (cold pressed) and hazelnut oil, vitamin A and L-glutamine increases IgA and improve mucosal integrity. The use of two heat-treated strains of lactobacillus - L. Plantarum and L. Casei induces a strong IL-12 response and increases IFN-gamma and strengthen the systemic immune response against all intra-cellular infections and even cancers. The intestinal flora Bifidobacterium longum also increases IgA and improves mucosal immunity. Silica reduces excess IgG and this improves NK function and improves the integrity of the skin and mucus membranes [end of excerpt] Also, the probiotic Bifidobacterium longum is the only strain that produces acetic acid (basically vinegar) which keeps our intestines in the proper ph and keeps organisms at bay - a good thing. Marty Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 2, 2000 Report Share Posted February 2, 2000 I am a little confused by your post. Could you briefly outline your total treatment program -- it sounds different from what the average CFSer get. I have tried to follow your post but it would be nice to have a complete run down. thank so much Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 7, 2000 Report Share Posted February 7, 2000 I doubt very much that large dosages of probiologics can harm you. I was taking 3 of the Natrens Trenev trio a day plus somtimes 10 of the Jarrowdophilus. I can only afford to take the Jarrowdophilus now & take at least 10 a day sometime more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2000 Report Share Posted February 8, 2000 In a message dated 2/8/00 3:34:12 AM Eastern Standard Time, onelist writes: << If anyone takes large amounts of acidophilus; or probiotics; could you briefly tell me how much you take? Small amounts dont help me so Im moving to higher amounts; but i have no idea how much to take. Is it dangerous to take too much? also, at the suggestion of the nutritionist I got an anti-yeast/candida formula to take with it. I am naked and need advice. Thanks.. >> , put your clothes on and go get some liquid acidophilus. I got some Nature's Life lactobacillus Acidoph for $8 or so and I can feel my GI tract digesting my food shortly after I take it. If you are having constipation, maybe from the methadone, I would certainly give it a try. I got it at Whole Foods. See the post I made recently on the same subject. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 8, 2000 Report Share Posted February 8, 2000 >From: green1585@... > >Does anyone know where you can get probiotics, bifa-15, or other Jarrow >products? > I got a 3 day sample of Bifa 15 from the company itself Eden Foods - 1-800-248-0320 or www.edenfoods.com. It is 34.99 for 1 months supply. Each dose comes in a special foil wrapped tube that you empty in your mouth. Each tube contains 1 billion bifidobacterium longum plus FOS equalling 1.5 grams. This strain is the strain that produces acetic acid (vinegar) so is very helpful in getting the ph of the digestive system back in order plus parasites and viruses don't like the acidic ph. I think this is kind of expensive. I was taking capusule probiotics that had 1 billion of each of 3 strains (one of the strains was the above) for 16.99 for 100 capsules. You can get probiotics at any health food store or NEEDS. I found the liquid lactobacillus at the grocery store (in the speciality organic food section). I found the taste to be slightly tart but when I mix it with OJ or my protein shake, I don't even notice it. It was a great price $5.69 per 16 oz bottle Yogurt is not recommended due to the sugar content (feeds yeast and other bugs) and most commercial yogurt contains s. thermophilus which promotes TH2 (which most of us are already high in). Also the quantities of the probiotics in yogurt is usually not enough to repopulate the digestive system. Marty Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2000 Report Share Posted February 9, 2000 In a message dated 2/9/00 3:34:34 AM Eastern Standard Time, onelist writes: << I found the taste to be slightly tart but when I mix it with OJ or my protein shake, I don't even notice it. >> I believe you are supposed to take acidophalus/probiotics one hour or so BEFORE meals. Therefore I would suggest mixing it with the OJ, then having your protein shake in an hour or so. I have been having very good results with the liqiud acidophalus that I got. I was using laxatives 3 times a week until I started using just one dose per day of the liquid stuff. I sure hope the positive effects don't disappear eventually like the benefits of some other supplements do. Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2000 Report Share Posted February 9, 2000 Have you every tried a super high fiber cereal. I think the one I use is called uncle sams -- no need for laxative any more. steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 9, 2000 Report Share Posted February 9, 2000 >From: MCamp10139@... > >I believe you are supposed to take acidophalus/probiotics one hour or so >BEFORE meals. I have directions for 1/2 hr before meals and another bottle reads 1/2 hr after meals. I never considered a protein shake a meal but I guess they mean empty stomach. I will switch this around, thanks! >I sure hope the positive effects don't disappear eventually like the benefits of some >other supplements do. Mark Konlee describes this phenomenon: http://www.execpc.com/~keephope/v1997.html (near the bottom - here is a short little bit) Voice Mail Message - May 1, 1997 ANTI-VIRAL THERAPIES - WHY THEY FAIL PROTOCOL FAILURES MAY BE CAUSED BY IMPAIRED LIVER FUNCTION AND ANTIBODIES DIRECTED AGAINST THE MEDICATIONS Today is May 1st. This month’s subject is immune system resistance to medications (drugs or herbs etc). Many protocol failures may have been erroneously blamed on viral resistance. We have heard many reports from persons with these chronic conditions. Invariably they say that a new protocol (drug or herb) works for a while and then quits working. What causes the medicine or drug to fail? The answer may be found in impaired liver function and immune system resistance. Marty Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 15, 2000 Report Share Posted February 15, 2000 I know I'm WAY behind on the list, so I apologize if this has been answered already. Jarrow Formula's Jarro-Dophilus has both of these strains of lactobacillus. No financial interest in the company here, just a consumer. Available at health food stores. in North Carolina ***It's like wrestling a gorilla. You don't quit when you get tired. You quit when the gorilla gets tired.*** > > Lactobacillus Casei and L. Plantarum promote IL-12 and IFN-gamma (or CMI), > but I have > not seen them as a major component of any probiotic. > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 19, 2000 Report Share Posted February 19, 2000 HI ALL, i take 60-80 billion daily and suggest take at differnt times each day if possible. somish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 27, 2000 Report Share Posted February 27, 2000 They also sell a product called 'defense' that is for bringing up your glutathione levels. Includes all the precursors in moderate amounts (so no toxicity) and in the correct proportions. I haven't tried it, but if you can't tolerate the whey or find whey too expensive it may be worth a try. $25 for a 6 week supply. Regards, . Probiotics > From: Cbuf1920@... > > I have been trying all sorts of acidopholus for my chronic systemic yeast > for the last few years. > I was taking 3 Natren's Trenev trio > (extremely expensive) a day & then I tried 10 jarrodopholus a day. I tried > some other kinds also but none of them seemed to be much help. > I think I have finally found one that works though. > It is a new one out called Yeast Avenger > by CFS Nutrition. I am only taking 3 a day & it is really working. For the > first time ever. > I thought I would have to start taking some Nizerol or diflucan again But > won't have to now. > I know there are others on the list that are looking for some good > probiotics also. > They have a sale on now & you can order through their website. I find it is > worth the price as I use less than the Jarrow & It is much less expensive > than the Natren & besides it works. I was wasting a lot of $$ on the other > ones. > The website is www.CFSN.com > The toll free # is 1888 801-2376 > I ordered a lot & stocked up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 30, 2000 Report Share Posted March 30, 2000 Hi -thanks for your post on the Jarrows probiotics. I dont know enough yet to really understand the immunity issues well, but I am wondering if you would share how you were diagnosed with severe leaky gut syndrome, what treatments you have tried and how effective you think they have been. If there are tests, do you have to keep being retested to see how you are doing or can you tell by how your body reacts? Do you feel antibiotic treatments has had anyd effect on the leaky gut syndrome? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 3, 2001 Report Share Posted February 3, 2001 Interesting information about probiotics at: www.phototour.minneapolis.mn.us/candida/summary.html BB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 31, 2003 Report Share Posted August 31, 2003 Hello, My naturopath only recommends two products because she says they are the only two that stay around to colonize the intestinal area: one from Japan which is the very best but also very expensive ($40) & the other is a Jarrow Formulas product called Jarro-Dophilis, which is enteric-coated & room temperature stable ($13 for 60 capsules) and which contains eight species of Probiotic bacteria. Du Pre Website: http://www.angelfire.com/jazz/isaiah40soaringeagle/index.html " By words the mind is winged. " Aristophanes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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