Re: Are vaccines ever appropriate?

[Guest guest]

I would say very rarely are they necessary. They certainly shouldn't be

routine. I have six children. The youngest three have never had antibiotics

or vaccines. They are very healthy. This is of course my just my . 02

cents. Kimme

[Guest guest]

I have a question along those lines. If you were going to a third world

country that you knew did not have the hygiene standards of US, would you

consider vax's appropriate?

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/22/00 9:18:15 PM Central Daylight Time, snakken@...

writes:

<<

No, and I do go to third world countries.

I >>

How do you think the problems with disease and death should be handled in

third world countries? People have asked me this and I never know what to

say. Many people living in these countries are not healthy enough to survive

many of the diseases that we can.

[Guest guest]

At 08:41 PM 07/22/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>I have a question along those lines. If you were going to a third world

>country that you knew did not have the hygiene standards of US, would you

>consider vax's appropriate?

>

No, and I do go to third world countries.

I still trust my body and don't fear disease bugs running around attacking

me. I also have homeopathy to assist me if I become ill and my body isn't

able to handle it and get over it without outside assistance. I can only

speak for myself. I just don't believe vaccines work, are the right

approach to health, represent how I see health and disease and it wouldn't

matter where I went or what I did, vaccinations are just not something I

would do.

Sheri

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

At 11:00 PM 07/22/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>In a message dated 7/22/00 9:18:15 PM Central Daylight Time,

snakken@...

>writes:

>

><<

> No, and I do go to third world countries.

> I >>

>How do you think the problems with disease and death should be handled in

>third world countries? People have asked me this and I never know what to

>say. Many people living in these countries are not healthy enough to survive

>many of the diseases that we can.

Help them be healthy. Spend the money on helping them to improve.

Read about the World Bank, the IMF, the World Trade Organization, WHO, the

UN - all raping the 3rd world. Corporations allowed to take what they want

including their water.

Read about Vandana Shiva in INdia and the women tree sitters there and on

and on.

They would be healthy if the above didn't make them sick. The above are to

blame.

It would take very little to clean up their water, help them farm again the

way they did before the corporations (and missionaries) messed things up.

Its about food and water and clean air. Not about vaccines and drugs.

Time to hold them accountable.

I believe it is mass genocide for unlimited access to resources (especially

Africa - minerals and all).

If you would like links to this info, email me.

Sheri

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

Jcannand@... wrote:

> In a message dated 7/22/00 9:18:15 PM Central Daylight Time, snakken@...

> writes:

>

> <<

> No, and I do go to third world countries.

> I >>

> How do you think the problems with disease and death should be handled in

> third world countries?

Are you talking about people who live in less developed countries? Or people

who

visit them? If it's the former, feed them (this world has way more than enough

food in it to feed everyone), stop polluting them with our drugs and industrial

waste, stop appropriating their natural resources, stop experimenting on them

(if

anyone out there is enjoying the convenience of certain birth control products

and many other drugs, you can thank third world women for being forcably

experimented on), etc, etc, etc...The answer is really quite simple, but no one

is interested in doing it because money truly is the root of all evil. Just my

opinion.

> People have asked me this and I never know what to

> say. Many people living in these countries are not healthy enough to survive

> many of the diseases that we can.

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

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[Guest guest]

--- Jcannand@... wrote:

> Just curious? Does anyone feel that vaccines and

> antibiotics are ever

> appropriate?

With antibiotics, yes I do think they are sometimes

appropriate, they can save lives, but we're losing

that ability to help in severe situations with

antibiotics because they've been so incredibly

over-used in inappropriate situations. It really

makes me mad, they're a resource that's been

squandered, and pretty soon they'll be useless because

of it.

With vaccines, I'm really not sure. The more I learn,

the more I doubt their usefullness at all, but I'm not

quite ready to say they're never approriate.

Certainly I think it's NOT appropriate to use them

routinely and universally.

Aubin

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

On Sat, 22 Jul 2000 20:30:12 -0700, you wrote:

>At 11:00 PM 07/22/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>>In a message dated 7/22/00 9:18:15 PM Central Daylight Time,

>snakken@...

>>writes:

>>

>><<

>> No, and I do go to third world countries.

>> I >>

>>How do you think the problems with disease and death should be handled in

>>third world countries? People have asked me this and I never know what to

>>say. Many people living in these countries are not healthy enough to survive

>>many of the diseases that we can.

>

>Help them be healthy. Spend the money on helping them to improve.

>Read about the World Bank, the IMF, the World Trade Organization, WHO, the

>UN - all raping the 3rd world. Corporations allowed to take what they want

>including their water.

>Read about Vandana Shiva in INdia and the women tree sitters there and on

>and on.

>

>They would be healthy if the above didn't make them sick. The above are to

>blame.

>It would take very little to clean up their water, help them farm again the

>way they did before the corporations (and missionaries) messed things up.

>Its about food and water and clean air. Not about vaccines and drugs.

>

Good response, Sheri!

db

>Time to hold them accountable.

>I believe it is mass genocide for unlimited access to resources (especially

>Africa - minerals and all).

>

>If you would like links to this info, email me.

>Sheri

>--------------------------------------------------------

>Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

>Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

>http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

>ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

>DECISION TO

> VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

>Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

>http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

>International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

> Education, Homeopathic Education

>KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

>CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

>

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>

[Guest guest]

I would, if the risk for disease outweighs the risk of reaction I would. I

bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

to get themselves and their children the shot.

I believe vaccines work but not without a risk sometimes it seems a huge

risk....

[Guest guest]

after learning what i know now, i do not feel there will ever be any instance

in which i would ever vaccinate myself or my boys. jmo.

brigit

[Guest guest]

At 04:38 PM 07/23/2000 -0400, you wrote:

>I would, if the risk for disease outweighs the risk of reaction I would. I

>bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

>to get themselves and their children the shot.

>

>I believe vaccines work but not without a risk sometimes it seems a huge

>risk....

>

>

No, I wouldn't be going for the shot.

An inordinate amount of fear about most of the diseases has been instilled

in people. Polio certainly was a serious one, but there are many

extenuating factors that I know that are part of the whole picture and the

vaccine is not the saving vaccine that you have been lead to believe.

Sheri

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/23/00 5:44:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

tomnrachel@... writes:

> I

> bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

> to get themselves and their children the shot.

No, I wouldn't. Since being on the list, I have learned some

fairly obscure things concerning polio (ie, disease incidence, actual

symptoms, treatments, causes, misdiagnoses, CDC manipulating polio stats,

etc..) that leads me to believe I would not give my children or myself this

shot should an epidemic occur. Yes, even though " polio is only a plane ride

away " ! LOL

Cheryl

[Guest guest]

At 11:46 PM 07/23/2000 EDT, you wrote:

>In a message dated 7/23/00 5:44:14 PM Eastern Daylight Time,

>tomnrachel@... writes:

>

>> I

>> bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

>> to get themselves and their children the shot.

>

> No, I wouldn't. Since being on the list, I have learned some

>fairly obscure things concerning polio (ie, disease incidence, actual

>symptoms, treatments, causes, misdiagnoses, CDC manipulating polio stats,

>etc..) that leads me to believe I would not give my children or myself this

>shot should an epidemic occur. Yes, even though " polio is only a plane ride

>away " ! LOL

>

>Cheryl

>

Well, the plane ride away is pretty questionable too. A while back I did

research as to incidence of polio in other countries and the stats were not

even good math.

I'll send those to you.

Sheri

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 16:38:30 -0400, you wrote:

>I would, if the risk for disease outweighs the risk of reaction I would. I

>bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

>to get themselves and their children the shot.

>

>I believe vaccines work but not without a risk sometimes it seems a huge

>risk....

>

>

>

>

Hello and All,

You might want to spend some time at:

http://www6.bcity.com/harpub/

There are some interesting graphs and articles there, that might make you want

to rethink the whole polio epidemic story.

db

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[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/22/00 10:26:52 PM Central Daylight Time,

snakken@... writes:

<< If you would like links to this info, email me.

Sheri

>>

Please send it to me.

Thanks,

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 7/23/00 5:16:37 PM Central Daylight Time, snakken@...

writes:

<< No, I wouldn't be going for the shot.

An inordinate amount of fear about most of the diseases has been instilled

in people. Polio certainly was a serious one, but there are many

extenuating factors that I know that are part of the whole picture and the

vaccine is not the saving vaccine that you have been lead to believe.

>>

What about smallpox?

[Guest guest]

RE: Are vaccines ever appropriate?

> I would, if the risk for disease outweighs the risk of reaction I would. I

> bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

> to get themselves and their children the shot.

>

Are you kidding? http://www.whaleto.freeserve.co.uk/Vaccines/polio.html

> I believe vaccines work but not without a risk sometimes it seems a huge

> risk....

>

>

>

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

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>

[Guest guest]

Plus, only about 10% (I think - maybe lower) of polio infections are anything

more than a flu-like illness. If my kid's chances of getting polio (or

whatever they are calling it nowadays - does anyone remember what the other

name is for it now - the name they use because they don't want anyone to know

people are still getting it? Is it encephalomyelitis? I forget) are just as

high from getting the true disease as they are from getting the vaccine, why

would I put her at risk?

Sheri Nakken wrote:

> At 04:38 PM 07/23/2000 -0400, you wrote:

> >I would, if the risk for disease outweighs the risk of reaction I would. I

> >bet if there were an outbreak of polio people on this board would be going

> >to get themselves and their children the shot.

> >

> >I believe vaccines work but not without a risk sometimes it seems a huge

> >risk....

> >

> >

>

> No, I wouldn't be going for the shot.

> An inordinate amount of fear about most of the diseases has been instilled

> in people. Polio certainly was a serious one, but there are many

> extenuating factors that I know that are part of the whole picture and the

> vaccine is not the saving vaccine that you have been lead to believe.

> Sheri

> --------------------------------------------------------

> Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

> Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

> http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

> ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

> DECISION TO

> VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

> Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

> http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

> International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

> Education, Homeopathic Education

> KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

> CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

>

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------

> Best friends, most artistic, class clown Find 'em here:

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[Guest guest]

No actually I am not kidding.. I have a lot of reservations about

vaccinating but I would also never say never. I responded to a person who

was asking what she should do knowing she was going to be exposed to these

diseases and that was the response I gave her.

Are you saying you would go Africa where tick fever, malaria, and Hep A is,

and not protect yourself?? Those diseases run rampid there. If your answer

is yes, well that is your decision. I happen to believe there have been a

lot of deaths because of some of these diseases. The medical industry is

certainly not God, but if I have a situation you bet I will be there for

their help, nothing is perfect or completely healthy or risk free.

Are you so healthy you wouldn't wear a condom if you were with a prostitute?

Yes an extreme example and I hope I did not offend you. But my point is

then, the chances of you getting AIDS or HEP B goes up greatly.

I appreciate everyone's input,

[Guest guest]

I was using polio as an example. I know people who grew up during that time

and were not allowed outside to play in fear of getting the disease.

Unfortunately she new of 2 people who were forever crippled by the disease.

I do also know most never suffered like these unfortunate few.

[Guest guest]

At 12:16 PM 07/24/2000 -0400, you wrote:

>No actually I am not kidding.. I have a lot of reservations about

>vaccinating but I would also never say never. I responded to a person who

>was asking what she should do knowing she was going to be exposed to these

>diseases and that was the response I gave her.

>

>Are you saying you would go Africa where tick fever, malaria, and Hep A is,

>and not protect yourself??

First there is no vaccine for malaria - all in testing right now. I'm not

sure what tick fever is. Hepatitis A comes from contaminated food because

someone who prepared it didn't wash their hands. I also know that we run

into hep a ALL the time and most of us don't come down with Hepatitis. I

DO travel to Egypt which is part of Africa and am careful about what I eat.

Don't eat unpeeled fruit, don't drink the water, etc. I do all I can to

avoid the problem, but would NEVER vaccinate for Hepatitis A and anything

else.

You, of course have to decide for yourself. But again getting a vaccine is

no guarantee that you won't get a disease and certainly is a risk for

vaccine side effects and damage. You can't vaccinate against everything on

the planet that is dangerous.

>

>Are you so healthy you wouldn't wear a condom if you were with a prostitute?

>Yes an extreme example and I hope I did not offend you. But my point is

>then, the chances of you getting AIDS or HEP B goes up greatly.

Hardly the same thing - wearing a condom is not getting a vaccine. There

are things you can do to cut down your risk of getting a disease without

vaccinating. And prositutes, by the way, in Africa, don't seem to be

getting AIDS and they don't wear condoms - wonder why that is???

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

But what about the risks of you getting those diseases you mention thru the vaccine? I would think if you got the disease/side effect from the vaccine it would be much harder for your body to heal than thru getting it thru non-vax ways???

Sindeahttp://www.geocities.com/camerasindea/HURFamily.html

www.hurphotography.com

Are you saying you would go Africa where tick fever, malaria, and Hep A is,and not protect yourself?? Those diseases run rampid there. If your answeris yes, well that is your decision. I happen to believe there have been alot of deaths because of some of these diseases. The medical industry iscertainly not God, but if I have a situation you bet I will be there fortheir help, nothing is perfect or completely healthy or risk free.Are you so healthy you wouldn't wear a condom if you were with a prostitute?Yes an extreme example and I hope I did not offend you. But my point isthen, the chances of you getting AIDS or HEP B goes up greatly.I appreciate everyone's input,

[Guest guest]

----- Original Message -----

From: Sheri Nakken <snakken@...>

> Hardly the same thing - wearing a condom is not getting a vaccine. There

> are things you can do to cut down your risk of getting a disease without

> vaccinating. And prositutes, by the way, in Africa, don't seem to be

> getting AIDS and they don't wear condoms - wonder why that is???

I think it was Dr Day who said the HIV virus can pass through a condom,

assuming you want believe the HIV story. Prostitutes here don't get aids

either I believe.

[Guest guest]

At 10:07 PM 07/24/2000 +0100, you wrote:

>

>----- Original Message -----

>From: Sheri Nakken <snakken@...>

>

>

>> Hardly the same thing - wearing a condom is not getting a vaccine. There

>> are things you can do to cut down your risk of getting a disease without

>> vaccinating. And prositutes, by the way, in Africa, don't seem to be

>> getting AIDS and they don't wear condoms - wonder why that is???

>

>I think it was Dr Day who said the HIV virus can pass through a condom,

>assuming you want believe the HIV story. Prostitutes here don't get aids

>either I believe.

>

>

Yes, had heard that also. Don't buy the HIV aids story anyway.

Sheri

>

>

>

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--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA 95959

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE

DECISION TO

VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

Well Within's Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin

International Tours, Homestudy Courses, ANTHRAX & OTHER Vaccine Dangers

Education, Homeopathic Education

KVMR Broadcaster/Programmer/Investigative Reporter, Nevada City CA

CEU's for nurses, Books & Multi-Pure Water Filters

[Guest guest]

Well what is really interesting is I don't think anyone is totally sure.

When they first started doing Aids tests they could only detect in blood.

Now they swab your mouth and it is a done deal. I don't buy the whole it is

difficult to contract. In theory all you would need is to kiss someone and

have flossed to hard in the morning causing a small lesion on the gum line.