RE: Oral B12 instead of injections - question about doses

[Guest guest]

Hi,

I know that I need to take 2000mcg daily initially and then 1000mcg daily,1000mcg weekly and finally 1000mcg monthly. My question is, does anyone knowfor how long I start with the initial dose? He's told me to come back forbloods in 7-8 weeks. I know that I can't overdose on B12; if all else fails,I'll stick to 2000mcg till the blood test. I've got the Solgar Liquid B12winging its way to me now.

I have not heard about the initial, daily, weekly and finally monthly protocol on B12, but I can tell you about my own experience. I take Solgar's B12 nuggets sublingually and they work. My initial level was around 350, which my GP thought to be fine, I thought to be too low. So I started supplementing with the above, starting with 2000 iu per day, reducing to 1000 iu daily after 3 months or so. Several months later, at a re-check, my B12 level was 2000. So I stopped the B12 three months ago, but I am now starting up again with 1000 iu per day. I honestly can't imagine that 1000 iu per week or once a month will do much to raise or keep the level up, but I don't really know.

On the basis that B12 is easily destroyed by stomach acid the most effective way to take it is either by injection, sublingually or via a plaster through the skin. Sublingually is the easiest. I take this –

http://www.solgar.co.uk/product/vitamin-b-12-1000ug-nuggets-250-E3230.html

The TSH level he was looking at was 10.8 and FT4 3.06 (sorry, off the top of myhead, I can't remember the values on the end!) which he said were.... "normal".

You probably have mixed up the TSH and FT4 figures – but even so.... a TSH of 3.06 is still too high (it should be ideally below 1) and and FT4 of 10.8 is very much too low. Most FT4 ref ranges start with a figure of 9 or 10.... your FT4 should be at the top of the ref range, not the bottom. If you are staying on Levo, you should up your dosage to 150 mcg and re-test in 4 weeks time. You are not there yet – quite a way to go.....

Best wishes,

[Guest guest]

Hi

Lu

I

believe has responded to the question about vitamin B12, however,

regarding the doctor who is not a fan of alternative treatments who tries to

scare you with dangerous T3/Armour stories. Is he by any chance on my list of

'recommended doctors' who will prescribe T3/natural thyroid extract. What scary

stories is he telling you? Ask him to show you some research/studies to back up

his tales, and tell him you can send him bundles of research to show why T3

either in addition with T4, T3 alone or natural thyroid extracts works better

than the mainly inactive T4. Challenge him, don't let him get away with it. As

long as we don't say anything, they will carry on down this road.

The

correct definition of hypothyroidism is associated with insufficient secretion

by the thyroid, the pituitary or the hypothalamus gland, thereby reducing the

mainly inactive thyroxine (T4) available for conversion, to the active

hormone Triodothyronine (T3) to energise the body. In the majority of

cases, hypothyroidism may be corrected by using levothyroxine (T4-only)

replacement.

Hypothyroidism

should not be used to describe conditions caused by deficiencies in the

peripheral conversion of T4 to T3, the subsequent reception of T3, and the use

of T3 by the body's cells. This condition has yet to be recognised by

mainstream medicine, but already is in epidemic proportions. This condition

should be called 'Euthyroid Hypometabolism', This condition can be corrected by

T3 hormone replacement therapy - and not by T4-only therapy.

Luv

- Sheila

following my appointment with the private

consultant - not so sure about him, whilst charming and seemingly willing to

help, he is NOT a fan of alternative treatments and great at trying to scare

you with dangerous T3/Armour stories! We'll wait and see...

Meanwhile, he's taken me off the pill (Yasmin) and upped my thyroxine

( " the only safe thyroid medication " ) to 125mcg daily. He thinks the

pill is raising my cortisol (this is in direct response to my GPs referal

letter about my mentioning adrenals). Will only do a plasma cortisol test so

I'll do the saliva test myself, but going to wait now till the pill has cleared

out of my system.

The TSH level he was looking at was 10.8 and FT4 3.06 (sorry, off the top of my

head, I can't remember the values on the end!) which he said were....

" normal " .

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

Thanks so much for reply. First, yes, sorry, I got my results back to front -

one of those days! Before Christmas my TSH was much better (1.19) and my FT4

11.8 but I have a history of very variable TSH readings and my FT4 has slowly

dropped. By the time we got to this we'd had a few " exchanges " and I was tired

with a long drive home ahead of me. Next time.

Back to the B12, the levels I quoted were the ones from the study (sorry, I

really wasn't that clear this afternoon was I?). I too couldn't see how the

last two figures would work, but that was the only info I could find in any of

the studies about dosages. I will stay on the 2000mcg until the bloodtests,

thank you.

Best wishes,

Lucy

>

> I have not heard about the initial, daily, weekly and finally monthly

> protocol on B12, but I can tell you about my own experience. I take

> Solgar's B12 nuggets sublingually and they work. My initial level

> was around 350, which my GP thought to be fine, I thought to be too low.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Shelia,

I'm guessing he's not! I'll have a look for the list. He is a referral from my

GP.

In fairness to the man, he has patients on both T3 and Armour (all came to him

self-medicating) and although he has talked some of them back onto T4 only, he

still works with the others. That said, he was very specific about just how

dangerous T3 treatments are, " all people on T3 are thyrotoxic and addicted to

the feeling of it. Fine for now, but what will they be like in 20-30years and

how much damage will they have done to themselves by then. You're only young

with a family, in all good conscience can you choose to poison myself " etc etc.

More amusingly, his main objections to Armour (apart from that it contains T3,

repeat of first lecture) were that it had to be ordered from the US and

sometimes they run out of stock. He stopped short when I happily pointed out

that I was fairly certain that a) Armour wasn't the only option and I am old

enough to order my own meds effectively.

He most bothered me when I showed him my symptoms list and he commented that if

the list is long enough you can find anything wrong with you. That and a

comment about how lots of people look fine and feel awful, as if it was ok for

me to be the same. I commented that I hoped then that they had a good Dr. I

was very careful to qualify the list as suggested, make it factual rather than

emotive and I had a diary of last week, which was a particularly bad one, to

show him the daily effect. He at least took them and read them, more than my GP

has done.

We had a few exchanges but, as I said to , it was late and I had a long

drive home. I let him get away with a lot, I know, but I'll keep reading and

bugging you guys with questions (he likes patients that educate themselves

apparently!) and expect him to listen to my information as much as I do his.

Thank you again

I tried to keep up with the online clinic posts/saga too (too out of it to do

much else I'm afraid) and just wanted to say that I think you , and the other

people posting, did a great job! The forum in December is a great coup as well.

I wish I'd found out about TPA earlier, you are doing wonderful work and helping

so many people. It's extraordinary, Lu x

>

> Hi Lu

>

> I believe has responded to the question about vitamin B12,

> however, regarding the doctor who is not a fan of alternative treatments who

> tries to scare you with dangerous T3/Armour stories. Is he by any chance on

> my list of 'recommended doctors' who will prescribe T3/natural thyroid

> extract. What scary stories is he telling you?

[Guest guest]

Hi Lu,

Can I go off on a tangent with a question here? Can you tell me abot the

pill-cortisol connection? My adrenals seem to be all over the pace accordng the

smptom cheklist and in recent blood tests my cortisol was high (though I realise

the blodd tests is not a great indicator). I have been on Yasmin for years as

it's the ony think that remotely controls my period pains. Is this a notion of

the doctor you saw or is def not a good idea to take the pill if you have

adrenal issues?

Would love to know if this would help me!

Thanks,

> Meanwhile, he's taken me off the pill (Yasmin) and upped my thyroxine ( " the

> only safe thyroid medication " ) to 125mcg daily. He thinks the pill is

> raising my cortisol (this is in direct response to my GPs referal letter

> about my mentioning adrenals). Will only do a plasma cortisol test so I'll

> do the saliva test myself, but going to wait now till the pill has cleared

> out of my system.

[Guest guest]

i'm curious where he is based? Please don't mention his name, but is he in the

midlands region (ish)?

chris

>

>

>

> Hi Shelia,

>

> I'm guessing he's not! I'll have a look for the list. He is a referral from

my GP.

[Guest guest]

Re the Pill, I've been on Yasmin for many years and I have LOW cortisol. They

make it up as they go along!

>

> following my appointment with the private consultant - not so sure about him,

whilst charming and seemingly willing to help, he is NOT a fan of alternative

treatments and great at trying to scare you with dangerous T3/Armour stories!

We'll wait and see...

[Ed]

[Guest guest]

I've also been on Yasmin for years. My cortisol has mainly been too low. Last 24hr urine test showed it at the bottom of the range. So if he's saying it's raising cortisol then I would say it certainly hasn't done so to mine!

From: "funkyboots@..." <funkyboots@...>thyroid treatment Sent: Wednesday, February 1, 2012 11:17 PMSubject: Re: Oral B12 instead of injections - question about doses

Hi Lu,Can I go off on a tangent with a question here? Can you tell me abot the pill-cortisol connection? My adrenals seem to be all over the pace accordng the smptom cheklist and in recent blood tests my cortisol was high (though I realise the blodd tests is not a great indicator).

[Ed]

[Guest guest]

Hi ,

We seem to be in similar boats! I would go far as to say I was upset at stopping

the pill, I rely on it to keep me and as far as my periods go! And I too show

signs of adrenal stress but have a very high blood plasma count (991). His

argument is that cortisol binds to something in the Yasmin formulation and

artificially elevates the count. I dont agree, but I'm doing it for the two

months to see what happens. I'll let you know! Ps, I've always had huge issues

with my periods, it'll be interesting to see how I am without the hormonal help.

Best wishes, Lu

>

> Hi Lu,

> Can I go off on a tangent with a question here? Can you tell me abot the

pill-cortisol connection? My adrenals seem to be all over the pace accordng the

smptom cheklist and in recent blood tests my cortisol was high (though I realise

the blodd tests is not a great indicator). I have been on Yasmin for years as

it's the ony think that remotely controls my period pains. Is this a notion of

the doctor you saw or is def not a good idea to take the pill if you have

adrenal issues?

> Would love to know if this would help me!

> Thanks,

>

>

> > Meanwhile, he's taken me off the pill (Yasmin) and upped my thyroxine ( " the

> > only safe thyroid medication " ) to 125mcg daily. He thinks the pill is

> > raising my cortisol (this is in direct response to my GPs referal letter

> > about my mentioning adrenals). Will only do a plasma cortisol test so I'll

> > do the saliva test myself, but going to wait now till the pill has cleared

> > out of my system.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi

He's not, I live in the South East.

Lu

> >

> >

>

> >

> > Hi Shelia,

> >

> > I'm guessing he's not! I'll have a look for the list. He is a referral

from my GP.

>