Teenager with a possible Underactive Thyroid

[Guest guest]

Hi,

My 14 yr old son has suffered with anxiety, lethargy, scaly dry scalp, unable to

deal with stress and rapid weight gain.

A blood test revealed normal TS4 but 13.4 TSH, elevated liver enzymes and high

triglycerides.

A second blood test 2 weeks later TSH was 7.

A hospital appointment with a paediatric endrocrinolgist was awful, with her

saying theres nothing wrong with your son hes fat and a couch potato.(and

worse).

I have asked for a second opinion at Brightons Children Hospital.

Another blood test at the doctor revealed low vitamin D. Urine tests were OK for

Cortisol and createnine. Awaiting blood results for Thyroid anti-bodies and

liver scan results.

Doctor said doesn't think anythings wrong? Sent Jak to a nutritionist who told

us to lose wight by eating less and exercise!( Oh I didnt

realise!)

Doctor also said anti-depressants would help with the anxiety! With regards to

jak not been able to sleep to buy melatonin over the internet.

Now awaiting hospital app for second opinion. Any advise would be welcome -

please!

[Guest guest]

Hello *****, do you

have a name we can call you please?

My 14 yr old son has suffered with anxiety, lethargy, scaly dry scalp, unable

to deal with stress and rapid weight gain.

A blood test revealed normal TS4 but 13.4 TSH, elevated liver enzymes and high

triglycerides.

A second blood test 2 weeks later TSH was 7.

It's always best to show the reference range for any tests done,

so we can see whether the results are at the bottom, the middle or the top of

the range, or even outside of the reference range. Am I correct in assuming

that the TS4 you wrote was meant to be free T4 (fT4). We need to know what the

actual figure was for fT4 and the ref. range. Doctors have a habit of telling

their patients that their results are 2normal " if they appear ANYWHERE

within the reference range. We need to know whether they were at the bottom,

the middle or the top of the range as this really, really matters. Your doctor

cannot withhold any information from you that is in your son's medical records,

so telephone to find out what these actual numbers were. It would be good also

to know what his level of free T3 (the ACTIVE thyroid hormone) is and also, to

find out whether he has antibodies to his thyroid (Hashimoto's disease). Do

you, or any other member of your family have a thyroid or autoimmune disease?

If so, the doctor should be informed of this.

Can you also let us know what his test results were that showed

elevated liver enzymes and high triglycerides? These could be raised because of

high carbohydrates intake and the nutritionist would be of great help here, or

there are other conditions that cause these to be raised. See http://www.elevatedliverenzymes.net/causes.php

A hospital appointment with a paediatric

endrocrinolgist was awful, with her saying theres nothing wrong with your son

hes fat and a couch potato.(and worse). I

have asked for a second opinion at Brightons Children Hospital.

That female paediatric endoprat needs sacking. That is appalling.

Let us know how you get on at the appointment at the Children's Hospital.

Another blood test at the doctor revealed low

vitamin D. Urine tests were OK for Cortisol and createnine. Awaiting blood

results for Thyroid anti-bodies and liver scan results.

Remember to get the results for all of these tests and do not

put up with being told they are " normal " because they are within the

reference range. Is your son taking anything for his low level of Vitamin D? He

should also be tested to check his level of iron, transferrin saturation%,

ferritin, vitamin B12, magnesium, folate, copper and zinc to see whether any of

these are low in the range.

Doctor said doesn't think anythings wrong? Sent

Jak to a nutritionist who told us to lose wight by eating less and exercise!(

Oh I didnt

realise!)

With his high triglycerides and liver enzymes, this would be a

good idea.

Doctor also said anti-depressants would help

with the anxiety! With regards to jak not been able to sleep to buy melatonin

over the internet.

Now awaiting hospital app for second opinion. Any advise would be welcome -

please!

I would not start Jak on anti-depressants at this stage. If he

is suffering with symptoms of hypothyroidism or adrenal fatigue, depression is

a symptom and once he starts the correct treatment, the depression naturally

lifts.

Go to our FILES SECTION http://health./group.thyroid treatment/files/

and scroll down to the 'MEDICAL QUESTIONNAIRES' folder, and ask Jak to answer

the questions in all of those and see how he scores. Ask him also to take his

temperature according to Dr Rind's recommendations http://www.drrind.com/therapies/metabolic-temperature-graph

to find out whether his problems are thyroid or adrenal. It might also be a

good idea to get the 24 h our salivary adrenal profile done to check his level

of cortisol and DHEA at four specific times during the day, i.e. 8.00a.m. - 12

noon - 4.00p.m. and again at midnight, especially as he cannot sleep at night.

This most certainly could be adrenal related. The NHS test for cortisol levels

first thing in a morning shows only a snapshot of what is happening at that

particular time and is really pretty useless. You will find information about

these test again in the FILES. Scroll down to 'Discounts on Tests and

Supplements' and open this folder. Open the one entitled 'Genova Diagnostics'

and there you will see the details of how to order this test and get a discount

by being a TPA member. The NHS do not test for adrenal fatigue, and this is

causing harm to patients. Thyroid hormone, not even your own, can be properly

utilised in the cells if you are suffering adrenal fatigue.

Hope this helps.

Luv - Sheila

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[Guest guest]

MODERATED TO REMOVE MOST OF PREVIOUS MESSAGE ALREADY READ.Please will you do

this before clicking 'Send' and leave just a small portion of what you are

responding to. Many thanks. Luv - Sheila

_________________________________________________________

Hi sheila, My name is Danuta and my son is jak, you kindly sent me an email

before i joined the TPA i now have some more results:

03 january:

Thyroid function test:

TSH level - 13.14 mu/L (ref:0.27-4.2)- High

Free T4 level - 12 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0)

Serum lipid levels:

Triglyceride levels - 2.4 mmol/L (ref:0.0-1.7)- High

23 january:

Thyroid funtion test:

TSH level - 7.09mu/L (ref:0.27-4.2)- High

Fre T4 level - 12 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0)

27 February:

Vitamin D2 and D3 level - 27 nmol/L (ref:50.0-140.0)- Low

Free T4 level - 13 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0)

Vitamin B12 level - 543pg/mL (ref:191.0-663.0)

Folate level - 15.3 ng/mL (ref:4.6-18.7)

Ferritin level - 51 ng/mL (ref:30.0-400.0)

05 March:

Thyroid Peroxidase - 238 iu/mL (ref: Normal < 50 IU/ml

Borderline 51-75 IU/mL

Elevated > 76 IU/mL)

Ps. I had to do this for my mum (She is a bit of a techno-phobe)so sorry if i

missed out any results i tried to find all the tests

mentioned in the previous reply but theres alot of different test sheets printed

out that i had to sort my way through i tried to put the results in an Organised

fashion as much as i could =),

Thanks! jak

> It's always best to show the reference range for any tests done, so we can

> see whether the results are at the bottom, the middle or the top of the

> range, or even outside of the reference range. Am I correct in assuming that

> the TS4 you wrote was meant to be free T4 (fT4). We need to know what the

> actual figure was for fT4 and the ref. range. Doctors have a habit of

> telling their patients that their results are 2normal " if they appear

> ANYWHERE within the reference range. We need to know whether they were at

> the bottom, the middle or the top of the range as this really, really

> matters.

[Guest guest]

Hello Danuta, and welcome to our forum where I

hope you will get all the support and help you need.

03 january:

Thyroid function test:

TSH level - 13.14 mu/L (ref:0.27-4.2)- High - Yes,

that IS high. For normal function, it should be around 1.0

Free T4 level - 12 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0) - for

anybody not taking any form of thyroid hormone replacement, their free T4

should be just above the middle of the reference range, so your free T4 should

be around 17/18,

Serum lipid levels:

Triglyceride levels - 2.4 mmol/L (ref:0.0-1.7)- High.

Too true. Read about high Triglycerides here http://www.webmd.com/cholesterol-management/tc/high-triglycerides-overview

This explains what they are and what to do about them.

23 january:

Thyroid funtion test:

TSH level - 7.09mu/L (ref:0.27-4.2)- High

Fre T4 level - 12 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0) - not much

change from the previous one's but TSH has come down a bit, though still too

high.

27 February:

Vitamin D2 and D3 level - 27 nmol/L (ref:50.0-140.0)- Low. Did your GP suggest giving you vitamin D3? You need 4/5000

mgs daily prescribed, but some would argue you need much higher doses. It is

vital you build up your vitamin D3 level. You can buy this at your local health

food store, but your GP should prescribe this.

Vitamin B12 level - 543pg/mL (ref:191.0-663.0).

That's not too bad but better right at the top of the range. I have not seen

this particular reference range for B12 before. Usually, it is around 175 to

800.

Folate level - 15.3 ng/mL (ref:4.6-18.7) - That's

fine.

Ferritin level - 51 ng/mL (ref:30.0-400.0) - I

think they have given you the reference range for a male. Female ref. range is

normally around 20 to 200. However, to feel good, ferritin level needs to be

around 90 to 130. You can buy sublingual B12 (Solgar) and take 1000mcgs daily

to help lift your level. All of these are vital, because thyroid hormone cannot

be properly utilised at the cellular level until whatever is low has been

properly supplemented.

05 March:

Thyroid Peroxidase - 238 iu/mL (ref: Normal < 50 IU/ml - This result shows that you have Hashimoto's disease. This

means you have thyroid antibodies. TPO antibodies see your thyroid gland as

public enemy number one and set about its complete destruction. This can take

years, but as the thyroid gland becomes more and more destroyed, the less

thyroid hormone it is able to secrete and once you start on thyroid hormone

replacement you have to take this for the rest of your life, in the same way if

any other gland is not producing the hormone that it should, you have to

replace that hormone. You cannot make this better with vit./min. supplements on

their own, as some people believe.

Well done Jak, these are mainly the results we

need.

Luv - Sheila

Ps. I had to do this for my mum (She is a bit of a techno-phobe)so sorry if i

missed out any results i tried to find all the tests

mentioned in the previous reply but theres alot of different test sheets

printed out that i had to sort my way through i tried to put the results in an

Organised fashion as much as i could =),

Thanks! jak

[Guest guest]

Hi Sheila,

we are still waiting for an appointment at the birghton's childrens hospital.

Meanwhile jak has got much worse, not getting to sleep till about 3 in the

morning, unable to wake him in the mornings

and general exhuastion, Can anyone suggest anything i can give him to help him

sleep?

Also the upper abdomin showed appearance of fatty infiltration in the liver, we

are still waiting to be advised whether he needs a further at UCHL.

I have tried to get jak the NHS 2 week referal, but as they don't think there is

anything wrong with him this has proved to be impossible, please offer any

advice

Kind Regards,

Danuta

>

> Hello Danuta, and welcome to our forum where I hope you will get all the

> support and help you need.

> 03 january:

> Thyroid function test:

> TSH level - 13.14 mu/L (ref:0.27-4.2)- High - Yes, that IS high. For normal

> function, it should be around 1.0

> Free T4 level - 12 pmol/L (ref:10.0-24.0) - for anybody not taking any form

> of thyroid hormone replacement, their free T4 should be just above the

> middle of the reference range, so your free T4 should be around 17/18,

> Serum lipid levels:

> Triglyceride levels - 2.4 mmol/L (ref:0.0-1.7)- High. Too true.

[Guest guest]

Have you tried any of the rescue remedy products, they do one for night time,

too?

How old is Jak?

C

>

>

>

> Hi Sheila,

> we are still waiting for an appointment at the birghton's childrens hospital.

Meanwhile jak has got much worse, not getting to sleep till about 3 in the

morning, unable to wake him in the mornings

[Guest guest]

Hi

Jak is 14 yrs old. The doctor has said make him get up even if he's exhausted,

or get some melatonin supplements on the internet?

I also heard Magnesiun could help, but will certainly buy some Rescue

Remedy. I'm open to any suggestions to help,

Thanks,

Danuta

>

> Have you tried any of the rescue remedy products, they do one for night time,

too?

[Guest guest]

Did the doctor recommend melatonin? If so, this may help you: I was told to

take BIotonin, which you put under your tongue and it dissolves, it's good.

http://www.eurohealthproject.com/hormones/biotonin.html i take 0.2mg, i'm age

33.

I'm wary of recommending anything to anyone Jak's age, especially as i'm not

qualified....

dawn simulator lamps can simulate sunset and sunrise, and may help regulate

circadian rhythyms?

is there any news as to when Jak will be seen?

Chris

>

>

>

> Hi

> Jak is 14 yrs old. The doctor has said make him get up even if he's exhausted,

or get some melatonin supplements on the internet?

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Danuta

If the Rescue Remedy doesn't work and you are considering buying melatonin to

help him sleep, here is a website you can buy from

http://www.eurohealthproject.com/hormones/biotonin.html .

Love

Jacquie

-

> Hi

> Jak is 14 yrs old. The doctor has said make him get up even if he's exhausted,

or get some melatonin supplements on the internet?

>

> I also heard Magnesiun could help, but will certainly buy some

[Guest guest]

hi there, melatonin is used sometimes to get to sleep. the lowest dose is about 0.5-0.7 i think , but do some searching on line to find out more and were to buy. Angel.

[Guest guest]

Hi Danuta

Just a thought but have you considered the adrenals.

We have a 16 year old girl in the family recently diagnosed with 's

disease and her main symptoms were extreme tiredness, weight loss (due to never

feeling hungry) and very dark thoughts/moods.

Hope Jak is diagnosed soon and starts to improve.

Take care

Jackie x

I'm open to any suggestions to help,

> Thanks,

> Danuta

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Jackie,

Jak has actually put on lots of weight, is exhuasted and is progresively getting

worse. He also suffers with anxiety and is unable to deal with stress, so i dont

think he has what your family member had because of the weight gain, although

jak does get depressed sometimes.

Thanks for all the other replies too i will try rescue remedy but im a bit

worried about giving BioTonin/Melatonin to jak as he is only 14,

Thanks,

Danuta =)

>

> Hi Danuta

>

> Just a thought but have you considered the adrenals.

> We have a 16 year old girl in the family recently diagnosed with

[Guest guest]

Hi Danuta

Maybe it's Cushing's disease then. This presents with tiredness and weight gain,

muscle weakness etc.

Jackie x

> Hi Jackie,

> Jak has actually put on lots of weight, is exhuasted and is progresively

getting worse. He also suffers with anxiety and is unable to deal with stress,

so i dont think he has what your family member had because of the weight gain,

although jak does get depressed sometimes.

> Thanks,

> Danuta =)

>

> >

> > Hi Danuta

> >

> > Just a thought but have you considered the adrenals.

> > We have a 16 year old girl in the family recently diagnosed with

>

[Guest guest]

But Danuta's already told us the results, which indicate thyroid problems,

possibly other things?

" A blood test revealed normal TS4 but 13.4 TSH, elevated liver enzymes and high

triglycerides.

A second blood test 2 weeks later TSH was 7. "

>

> Hi Danuta

> Maybe it's Cushing's disease then. This presents with tiredness and weight

gain, muscle weakness etc.

>

> Jackie x

>

[Guest guest]

A blood test revealed normal TS4 but 13.4 TSH, elevated liver enzymes and high triglycerides. A second blood test 2 weeks later TSH was 7.

A hospital appointment with a paediatric endrocrinolgist was awful, with hersaying theres nothing wrong with your son hes fat and a couch potato.(andworse). I have asked for a second opinion at Brightons Children Hospital.

Hello Danuta,

Your son is clearly hypothyroid and I can't begin to comprehend the various comments his doctor(s) made. Let's get at least ONE thing clear here.... with rare exceptions (see below), an elevated TSH is diagnostic for hypothyroidism – period! And if the TSH were not enough evidence, Jak has got positive numbers of TPO autoantibodies (238 iu/mL) ... and that alone is diagnostic for Hashimoto's disease.

Never mind Jak's other TFT results, which were low , btw. But the Total T's - as well as the Free T's - can be influenced by just about anything.... non-thyroidal illness, medication, autoantibodies – you name it. Not so the TSH. An elevated TSH (nearly) always* ....

*bar a few of extremely rare conditions - like hypothalamic or pituitary tumours - or drug induced medication that suppresses the thyroid function - or a TSH in newborn babies (none of which applies to Jak)

.....means low thyroid hormone inside the cells.... Whatever level of hormone is circulating in the bloodstream might be another matter, and that is irrelevant to the argument. In an untreated patient – with the exception of the above mentioned - there is only ONE condition that will elevate a TSH above the limit – Hypothyroidism! There is any number of conditions that can make the TSH look "normal" or even "low".... there is any number of conditions that will make FT's look normal, high or low.... but I repeat: with the exception of the above mentioned, there is only ONE condition that will elevate the TSH !

http://www.livestrong.com/article/186560-what-are-the-causes-of-increased-tsh-levels/

...... and I for one am sick and tired about our doctors being so blatantly blasé about that fact and are misleading patients. Surely, if we as patients can grasp the concept, then doctors should be able to do the same.

All of the signs and symptoms you mention, Danuta, are classic for Hashimoto's disease from weight gain to insomina. Your son suffers from Hashimoto's or autoimmune thyroiditis . There is no mystery about it. And of course he gets depressed – who wouldn't under the circumstances ?! - So what is the problem? – why does Jak not get diagnosed and treated ??? I don't get it! But I do know one thing. If anyone in my family presented with such classic signs and symptoms and a TFT to boot, I would treat them, come hell or high water – with or without the doctor's blessing.

However – don't forget the supplements.... his iron is too low and needs supplementing, his D3 is too low and needs supplementing and he needs a lot of pure Vitamin C and 180-200 iu of Selenium per day ... all of that in addition to thyroid hormone, this goes without saying.

As for the high triglyceride and elevated liver enzymes - hopefully thyroid hormone will bring those levels down, but both needs to be monitored. I would try him on a course of Milk Thistle for a couple of months (any healthfood shop). It is excellent for detoxing the liver.

You mentioned that Jak's cortisol levels were "ok" .... have you got the actual figures, please? I would imagine that he can't sleep well, because his circadian rhythm is out of whack. His adrenals probably produce cortisol in the evenings and not in the early hours of the mornings when they should get to work and make the stuff for the day. To shift the circadian rhythm back to where it should be will not be easy... some iron rules need to be applied in order to get it back:

- Bed-time is 10 pm – no exceptions! No big meals after 18.00, no coffee, tea or stimulation drinks in the evenings. No, or very little, processed sugar in any shape or form. No watching TV or playing with the computer after 22.00. Bedroom needs to be pitch black (this stimulates the pineal gland into producing melatonin) . A little extra melatonin or valerian might help in the beginning. Other than that – reduce stress levels to a minimum and some light exercise like a daily walk, about half an hour per day or so.... nothing more strenuous, because you do not want to exhausts the adrenals, you want to preserve energy and slowly build-up stamina . A regular walk of 30 – 60 minutes per day is a great way to stimulate the adrenals.

Difficult rules to follow, I know – sorry -, but nobody said getting your health back was easy . To make the adrenals toe the line, iron discipline is needed. You need to get the natural bio-rhythm back – it is vital.... for thyroid hormone to work properly you need the adrenals to work as they are supposed to do. If Jak's overall cortisol production were low, then he would need some additional adrenal support in form of NAX (nutri adrenal extra) for example, but if his rhythm has just shifted (and I assume that this is the case) then he needs iron discipline to pull it back into line.

But first of all – get your lad diagnosed and put onto thyroid medication.

With very best wishes