New member - hello and qus before I see my endo...

[Guest guest]

Hi

Suggest you have a look at the American Graves

Disease Foundation website www.ngdf.org –

they have an excellent moderated forum concerning all things Graves,

hyper, RAI, replacement etc. I think some of the symptoms you are

describing are not related to thyroxine per se but to the symptoms of

insufficiently treated Graves disease, and the

weird and wonderful hypo hyper mix that can go on with swinging levels and

carbimazole / PTU. RAI will have nuked your thyroid but you still have Graves - the problem is in your brain, which is telling

your body to produce too many antibodies which attack your thyroid. Your

immune response will currently be all over the place. Your thyroid will

also be ‘dumping’ its stored hormones as it dies off.

I’ve just had my thyroid removed due to serious

hashitoxicosis and cancer and am now walking the road you talk about –

levo or NDT - but I still felt about 90% better taking Levo – it’ll

be hard for you to know just yet what is causing what or to realise just how

very ill you’ve been with your Graves. The advantage of getting on

levo now (you will need some immediate replacement) is it will buy you some

time to get more stable and figure out what you want to do. It will also

give you ammo to prove to your doc that it doesn’t work. However, some

people do just fine on T4 – you might be one of them, and of course you wouldn’t

then need to pay for your meds. In the meantime you could educate

yourself, rule out iron and vitamin and mineral deficiencies, and deal with any

adrenal issues?

Just a thought, others here will know better than me

but I really do recommend the NDGF site, they are excellent for all things

relating to Graves and its management and of

course NDT is prescribed in the states so you’ll get a really wide range

of views and experiences.

Hope that helps

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[Guest guest]

I don't expect it was a coincidence. People can develop thyroid problems after

a bump in the car involving whiplash injury, for example.

Miriam

> I'm a new member, so hello all! About 15 months ago I came off my bike and hit

my head. I was diagnosed with concussion but was very shaky. When the shaking

didn't stop, a month later my GP got a thyroid test (FT4>50) and I had Graves.

Pure coincidence???

[Guest guest]

Yet another question folks... if I can talk my endo/GP into doing the

iron, transferrin %... (long list)...copper,zinc (maybe even adrenal)

tests on the NHS for me, should I have them done when I had RAI 3 weeks

ago? are they likely to be all over the place because of the RAI? If so,

how long should I wait before I get them done? Thanks, Cath

[Guest guest]

Forwarded this to the forum so everybody can keep up to date with what's

happening.

Luv - Sheila

Many thanks, Sheila.

My experience with the endo has been mixed - apparently blood-test

focussed when I was on the carbimazole and Eltroxin, very much " give it

time to settle " etc: then when things went wrong (I went neutropaenic)

she couldn't have been better, phoned me up several times to see how I

was, even left her home phone number with the on-call physician at the

hospital in case they needed help, spent about half and hour after the

end of her surgery talking to me about the RAI. Maybe I wasn't

interesting enough before?? Too many patients all on block and replace??

So I'm inclined to go with her and see what happens. I'm a lot stronger

emotionally at the moment (not saying much), and a lot better informed,

so that will help.

I've also got an appointment with my GP for the day after the endo, so

if things are a bit pear-shaped, I can ask her to refer me to someone

else on the list. She has always been very sympathetic, so I'm hopeful

on that front.

Thanks for the list of tests, I'll see what I can get done. I'll also

try for an adrenal test. I guess they only do the one-off blood test,

but if that's out of range I'll be somewhere. If it's in range, maybe a

saliva set of tests would be worthwhile.

Once again, thanks.

.

[Guest guest]

It is well known that whiplash injury can cause hypothyroidism.

Read the following information from Dr Lowe's web site (Questions and

Answers) http://www.drlowe.com/QandA/askdrlowe/fmshypot.htm

- in fa\ct, you will find a lot of very interesting questions and answers

there.

Luv - Sheila

February

15, 1999

Question: Two years ago a

car crashed into the back of my car and caused my neck to have a whiplash

injury. I developed fibromyalgia within a month after the accident. I talked

with my doctor about the accident maybe causing me to become hypothyroid. He

told me that my fibromyalgia may seem like hypothyroidism, but they are two

separate conditions. He doesn't believe it is necessary to order tests for

hypothyroidism. Instead, he insists that I continue my treatment with amitriptyline

for fibromyalgia. He also says that a car wreck may cause fibromyalgia but not

hypothyroidism. What bothers me is that my fibromyalgia symptoms are the same

as my mother's symptoms, but the same doctor gave her the diagnosis of

hypothyroidism. Is it possible that my whiplash caused both fibromyalgia and

hypothyroidism?

Dr. Lowe: Keep in mind that many

patients' fibromyalgia symptoms are actually the symptoms of untreated or

undertreated hypothyroidism. Your fibromyalgia may actually be hypothyroidism

your doctor has failed to diagnose and properly treat. This is certainly

possible because neck trauma often induces partial thyroid gland failure. The

gland is then incapable of making and releasing enough thyroid hormones. As a

result, the patient develops the symptoms of hypothyroidism. If the

patient is a woman and her main symptoms are widespread pain and abnormal

tenderness, she is likely to get the diagnosis of fibromyalgia. Tragically, her

doctors are likely to ignore the hypothyroidism and have her to use various

antidepressants--medications that are useless and dangerous for many

fibromyalgia patients.

Several research groups have found that trauma to the thyroid gland induces

hemorrhaging in the gland.[1][2][3] The thyroid gland

may be damaged even by a doctor examining it by touch (palpation). The

palpation may cause inflammation and structural damage of the gland. The

diagnosis of this condition is " palpatory thyroiditis. " [4]

Directly relevant to your case is a study by Sehnert and Croft. They found that

some patients develop primary hypothyroidism after whiplash injuries.[5] They studied 101

consecutive whiplash patients. The basal temperatures of 86% of the patients

were below normal. Of these patients, 30% had thyroid function test results

indicating hypothyroidism. Of the 14% of patients whose temperatures were

normal, 33% had abnormal laboratory thyroid test results. Sehnert and Croft

diagnosed 30% of the 101 patients as having post-traumatic hypothyroidism. They

concluded that whiplash can result in a form of hypothyroidism due to direct

injury to the thyroid gland.

Another study done in Israel is relevant to your case. Buskila and colleagues

found that a significant percentage of patients with neck injury develop

fibromyalgia.[6] The researchers

studied 102 patients with neck injuries and 59 patients with leg fractures.

They examined all the patients for nonarticular (soft tissue) tenderness and

the presence of fibromyalgia. None of the patients had a chronic pain syndrome

before the trauma. Of the patients with neck injuries, 21.6% met the criteria

for fibromyalgia. Only 1.7% of patients with leg fractures met the criteria.

The incidence of fibromyalgia among patients with neck injuries was 13 times

that of patients with leg fractures. Fibromyalgia developed at an average

of 3.2 months after the trauma. Virtually all fibromyalgia symptoms were more

common and severe among the 22 neck injury fibromyalgia patients. They had more

tenderness, reported a lower quality of life, and had more impaired physical

functioning than did patients without fibromyalgia.

Because it is possible that your whiplash injury damaged your thyroid gland,

you should have laboratory thyroid function tests. The results of the tests may

provide evidence that you have hypothyroidism. If your present physician

refuses to order the proper tests, I suggest you find another physician who

will. It is critical that you do; undiagnosed and untreated hypothyroidism can

have a devastating impact on one's life.

References

1.

Armstrong, W.B., Funk, G.F., and Rice, D.H.: Acute airway compromise secondary

to traumatic thyroid hemorrhage. Archives of Otolaryngology: Head and Neck

Surgery,

20(4):427-430, 1994.

2. Oertli, D. and Harder, F.: Complete traumatic transection of the thyroid

gland. Surgery, 115(4):527-529,

1994.

3. Rupprecht, H., Rumenapf, G., Braig, H., and Flesch, R.: Acute bleeding

caused by rupture of the thyroid gland following blunt neck trauma: case report. Journal of Trauma,

36(3):408-409,

1994.

4. Oertel, J.E. and LiVolsi, V.A.: Pathology of thyroid diseases. In Werner and

Ingbar's The

Thyroid: A Fundamental and Clinical Text, 6th edition. Edited by L.E. Braverman and

R.D. Utiger, New York, J.B. Lippincott Co., 1991, pp.609–610.

5. Sehnert, K.W. and Croft, A.C.: Basal metabolic temperature vs. laboratory

assessment in " posttraumatic hypothyroidism. " Journal of

Manipulative and Physiological Therapeutics, 19(1):6-12, 1996.

6. Buskila, D., Neumann, L., Vaisberg, G., Alkalay, D., and Wolfe, F.:

Increased rates of fibromyalgia following cervical spine injury. A controlled

study of 161 cases of traumatic injury. Arthritis and Rheumatism, 40(3):446-452,

1997.

Also, that is the first time anyone has commented on whiplash and thyroid - my

endo said pure coincidence on accident and onset, but its just too much of one

for me (I had whiplash in my neck from the road hitting my head)! Any idea if

this is a physical thing - is the thyroid bruised, damaged in some way, maybe

the violent squish of it sends out loads of hormones and it gets into a funny

state? or is it to do with hormones/adrenalin/shock etc?

thanks,

Cath

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