question

February 17, 2004

I think you'll find a lot of Doctors not vaccinating their kids, but just not

saying anything about it. (Or vaccinating on their own schedule - delaying vax

ect......)

Like OB's who should get the Rubella shot to " protect " their pregnant

patients...... I bet there are very few who actually get it.

Chelly

RE: question

<<YOu are not alone . Even those of us who are nurses are bowled

over by them, even with as much as I know. I don't even try anymore.

They will only wake up when one of their own is damaged and not even

then sometimes due to the denial>>

Thanks, Sheri. Brings up an interesting story...a girl in one of my

classes is an ABA therapist with special school district here...she was

encouraging me to apply for a position, because the " rich " areas here in

town are desperate for therapists, " All but one of my students are

children of doctors. "

I found that so interesting...does autism follow any socioeconomic or

occupational patterns, does anyone know? It would make sense, if

vaccines are a risk factor, that doctors would have more autistic

children...just curious.

M

February 17, 2004

Perhaps additional exposure to toxins??? The " rich " live in huge homes on

large lots which are often sprayed routinely with lawn chemicals/herbicides.

God forbid there be a dandelion - I heard that some neighborhoods have

restrictions that actually require herbicide treatment to prevent

dandelions- is this true?

RE: question

> <<YOu are not alone . Even those of us who are nurses are bowled

> over by them, even with as much as I know. I don't even try anymore.

> They will only wake up when one of their own is damaged and not even

> then sometimes due to the denial>>

>

> Thanks, Sheri. Brings up an interesting story...a girl in one of my

> classes is an ABA therapist with special school district here...she was

> encouraging me to apply for a position, because the " rich " areas here in

> town are desperate for therapists, " All but one of my students are

> children of doctors. "

>

> I found that so interesting...does autism follow any socioeconomic or

> occupational patterns, does anyone know? It would make sense, if

> vaccines are a risk factor, that doctors would have more autistic

> children...just curious.

>

> M

>

March 23, 2004

I was induced with my first because I had preeclampsia and the

placenta was failing. The baby's heart rate was in the 70s and they

actually prepared to do an emergency c-section before it came back

up. They induced labor instead.

With my second, I don't know why they did it...I had had preterm

contractions, and was having labor pains and dilated to 3 when I

went to the hospital ON the baby's due date. The contractions

subsided, so I guess instead of sending me home, they broke my water

and gave me pitocin.

With the third...again, I don't know what the rush was. My water had

broken when I got to the hospital, I was contracting, but apparently

not progressing fast enough...my water broke about 4 in the morning,

we got to the hospital at 5:30 and I was not quite dilated to 2. Two

hours later I hadn't dilated any more, so they gave me Pitocin.

What, did the doctor have an important golf game later??? That

bugged me because I still think I would have eventually progressed

if I wasn't strapped to the damn monitors, flat on my back.

If I didn't have so many other medical conditions, and so many BAD

deliveries with major complications, I would strongly consider

avoiding hospitals for any future births. As it is, I'm just

strongly avoiding future births! ; )

M

> I'm sorry to ask this since it isn't vaccination related, but I'm

wondering

> why it is

> that so many doctors induce labor on patients before their due

date.

> I hear of it with everyone I talk to. Could it have something to

do with

> c-sections?

March 23, 2004

I have a friend who is due March 31 and they have told her if she didn't go

before Friday

(this Friday) they were going to induce. Everything is going smoothly with

her pregnancy

no complications. I just wonder why the rush??

At 05:04 PM 3/23/2004 +0000, you wrote:

>I was induced with my first because I had preeclampsia and the

>placenta was failing. The baby's heart rate was in the 70s and they

>actually prepared to do an emergency c-section before it came back

>up. They induced labor instead.

>

>With my second, I don't know why they did it...I had had preterm

>contractions, and was having labor pains and dilated to 3 when I

>went to the hospital ON the baby's due date. The contractions

>subsided, so I guess instead of sending me home, they broke my water

>and gave me pitocin.

>

>With the third...again, I don't know what the rush was. My water had

>broken when I got to the hospital, I was contracting, but apparently

>not progressing fast enough...my water broke about 4 in the morning,

>we got to the hospital at 5:30 and I was not quite dilated to 2. Two

>hours later I hadn't dilated any more, so they gave me Pitocin.

>What, did the doctor have an important golf game later??? That

>bugged me because I still think I would have eventually progressed

>if I wasn't strapped to the damn monitors, flat on my back.

>

>If I didn't have so many other medical conditions, and so many BAD

>deliveries with major complications, I would strongly consider

>avoiding hospitals for any future births. As it is, I'm just

>strongly avoiding future births! ; )

>

>M

>

> > I'm sorry to ask this since it isn't vaccination related, but I'm

>wondering

> > why it is

> > that so many doctors induce labor on patients before their due

>date.

> > I hear of it with everyone I talk to. Could it have something to

>do with

> > c-sections?

>

March 23, 2004

Its for money, convenience and so they don't get sued for complications.

Hope your friend stands up for herself and her baby

Sheri

At 11:08 AM 03/23/2004 -0800, you wrote:

>I have a friend who is due March 31 and they have told her if she didn't go

>before Friday

>(this Friday) they were going to induce. Everything is going smoothly with

>her pregnancy

>no complications. I just wonder why the rush??

>

>At 05:04 PM 3/23/2004 +0000, you wrote:

>>I was induced with my first because I had preeclampsia and the

>>placenta was failing. The baby's heart rate was in the 70s and they

>>actually prepared to do an emergency c-section before it came back

>>up. They induced labor instead.

>>

>>With my second, I don't know why they did it...I had had preterm

>>contractions, and was having labor pains and dilated to 3 when I

>>went to the hospital ON the baby's due date. The contractions

>>subsided, so I guess instead of sending me home, they broke my water

>>and gave me pitocin.

>>

>>With the third...again, I don't know what the rush was. My water had

>>broken when I got to the hospital, I was contracting, but apparently

>>not progressing fast enough...my water broke about 4 in the morning,

>>we got to the hospital at 5:30 and I was not quite dilated to 2. Two

>>hours later I hadn't dilated any more, so they gave me Pitocin.

>>What, did the doctor have an important golf game later??? That

>>bugged me because I still think I would have eventually progressed

>>if I wasn't strapped to the damn monitors, flat on my back.

>>

>>If I didn't have so many other medical conditions, and so many BAD

>>deliveries with major complications, I would strongly consider

>>avoiding hospitals for any future births. As it is, I'm just

>>strongly avoiding future births! ; )

>>

>>M

>>

>> > I'm sorry to ask this since it isn't vaccination related, but I'm

>>wondering

>> > why it is

>> > that so many doctors induce labor on patients before their due

>>date.

>> > I hear of it with everyone I talk to. Could it have something to

>>do with

>> > c-sections?

>>

February 2, 2005

<<My question is if she is around these children just after they receive

a shot does that put her at risk for contracting the disease? I had

heard that it was a possibility.>>

Yes, the vaxxed children can expose your daughter to whatever they were

vaxxed for from the live vaccines. Can't remember which ones offhand, I

know the flu shot and chicken pox shot and there are others. Also, an

equally large concern is the risk that you are putting yourself in, if

these children come to your home after receiving a vaccine and then have

an adverse reaction you could be accused of abuse or SBS. There are a

number of home daycare providers that have been successfully prosecuted

for shaking a baby to death when it was in fact an adverse reaction to

the vaccine. You might consider asking the parents to make other

arrangements for their children for at least the first 24 hours after

they receive any shots. It will at least lower the risk of them having

an adverse reaction at your house. If you can get them to arrange their

children's shots on Fridays it would help tremendously. The diseases

used in live vaccines can be shed for 30 days after injection. I

realize it is difficult to find anyone that would make other

arrangements for their children for 30 days. I have a set of twins and

their older sister that I only watch about once a week now, I was doing

full time care for a while. I've been there. :-/ It's a tough spot!

Is there anything else you can do at home to help make money? I'm

working on finding some office work that I can do at home. I'd be

willing to share notes with how I'm going about that if you are

interested.

Ohio

)0(~~~)0(~~~)0(

Mom to Brittany, born 8/31/93, dx'd-IDDM 5/28/01; , born 6/28/97;

and Shayna, born 6/1/00.

Vaccine free since 1999! See our site at http://www.loonatics-fringe.com

February 3, 2005

That'd be really interesting if you could lmk too , have

never had any data on it or specifics.

Thanks

In Vaccinations , " Mum2mishka " <mum2mishka@t...>

wrote:

> , I have also been told from more than one source, and

read, that the

> measles can be shed from the mmr vax for up to 3 months.

>

> Sue

>

> > RE: Question

> >

> > i fully second jessica's concern on abuse/sbs danger.

> > also, i wanna point out the following:

> > jessica wrote:

> > > The diseases

> > > used in live vaccines can be shed for 30 days after

> > > injection.

> > actually, that was my belief, too, until this

> > afternoon. but i've had an e-mail from a most reliable

> > source that said that mmr and v can shed between 2 and

> > 12 weeks! and apparently for pertussis it's unknown.

> > i'm going to follow it up to see if i can get some

> > medical references for that and will fwd any response.

> > claudia

> >

April 19, 2005

Does he mean Hib? If the child is breastfed the chances of getting HiB

are nil.. We all carry HiB in our noses.. so if unvaxed children died if

they " got " HiB, we'd have X(20?) percent of US children keeling over as

we speak. In reality there are like 30 cases a year and a handful of

fatalities. I betcha anything they are in poorer parts of the country

and not breastfed. Sheri has a lot of info on her website about HiB.I

don't have the URL handy but you can get it from her sig.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

, 8 months old

See him at <http://www.tabulas.com/~wanderings/gallery/43809/>

http://www.tabulas.com/~wanderings/gallery/43809/

QUESTION

OK...my friend (also not vaxing her 8 month old) went to the

pediatrician

and he said he would never push vax on her...but did recommend that she

give

her baby the meningitis vaccination when she is older b/c its the only

disease

they vax for that she could potentially die from if she got it and

wasn't

vaccinated....and he said if she waited until the baby was 15 months,

she would

just need the one vaccine.

Please advise...

thanks in advance,

Amy

April 20, 2005

Every doctor has a vaccine they will push. If you give one vaccine used to

prevent meningitis you will change natural flora, and there will be more need to

give the other.Right now it is just HIB and Prevnar,but there is a vaccine study

going on giving kids an experimental menigocal(sp) vaccine. So that will be

another *meningitis * vaccine to give. The list of things that cause meningitis

is quite numerous. She shoud read the vaccine inserts(and read up on diseases)

and weigh the risks.Yes,the doses required are less as a child ages,but then so

is the risk of contracting a bacterial illness that might cause meningitis. It

is her call which I recommend not based on the doctors recommendation. You can

die from ANY illness given the right circumstances.

National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act: http://www.hrsa.gov/osp/vicp/INDEX.HTM

U.S. circumcision rates continue to fall. Find out why at:

http://www.circumstitions.com/USA.html

__________________________________________________

April 20, 2005

Ditto, to this. My doctor said the same thing about

prevnar. I still refused. she gave me a story about

parents in her grief group whose child passed away

before the prevnar vaccine came out. she said that it

could have saved his life. My question is why is she

not part of a group that grieve children who have been

adversely affected by this and other vaccines?

The other thing is that she admitted to not knowing

what is in the vaccines. I would challenge anyone to

ask their doctor to get the labels and sit down and

read it to them. Most don't know they only think

about the " greater good " " survival of the fitess "

you know?

If you in this group because you are on the fence, I

would ask your doctor to read and explain the labels

to you. I bet you he #1 would not have time for that

and #2 will buy you some more time to think about it.

# Every time he brings it up in the future you can

pull out the labels.

Sounds funny at first, but I think he/she will get the

point.

--- Sara in Brunswick <sarana921@...> wrote:

> Every doctor has a vaccine they will push. If you

> give one vaccine used to prevent meningitis you will

> change natural flora, and there will be more need to

> give the other.Right now it is just HIB and

> Prevnar,but there is a vaccine study going on giving

> kids an experimental menigocal(sp) vaccine. So that

> will be another *meningitis * vaccine to give. The

> list of things that cause meningitis is quite

> numerous. She shoud read the vaccine inserts(and

> read up on diseases) and weigh the risks.Yes,the

> doses required are less as a child ages,but then so

> is the risk of contracting a bacterial illness that

> might cause meningitis. It is her call which I

> recommend not based on the doctors recommendation.

> You can die from ANY illness given the right

> circumstances.

>

> National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act:

> http://www.hrsa.gov/osp/vicp/INDEX.HTM

>

> U.S. circumcision rates continue to fall. Find out

> why at: http://www.circumstitions.com/USA.html

>

> __________________________________________________

>

April 20, 2005

At 11:09 PM 4/19/2005 EDT, you wrote:

>

>OK...my friend (also not vaxing her 8 month old) went to the pediatrician

>and he said he would never push vax on her...but did recommend that she

give

>her baby the meningitis vaccination when she is older b/c its the only

disease

>they vax for that she could potentially die from if she got it and wasn't

>vaccinated....and he said if she waited until the baby was 15 months, she

would

>just need the one vaccine.

>Please advise...

>

>thanks in advance,

>Amy

>

Amy,

I encourage you to start with my webpages and read each page carefully

Also take my class.

There are NO SAFE vaccines

Peditricians are clueless.

You can potentially die from anything.

Any vaccine can kill and injure

Sheri>

--------------------------------------------------------

Sheri Nakken, R.N., MA, Classical Homeopath

Vaccination Information & Choice Network, Nevada City CA & Wales UK

$$ Donations to help in the work - accepted by Paypal account

vaccineinfo@... voicemail US 530-740-0561

(go to http://www.paypal.com) or by mail

Vaccines - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccine.htm

Vaccine Dangers On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/vaccineclass.htm

Homeopathy On-Line course - http://www.nccn.net/~wwithin/homeo.htm

ANY INFO OBTAINED HERE NOT TO BE CONSTRUED AS MEDICAL

OR LEGAL ADVICE. THE DECISION TO VACCINATE IS YOURS AND YOURS ALONE.

******

" Just look at us. Everything is backwards; everything is upside down.

Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy

knowledge, governments destroy freedom, the major media destroy information

and religions destroy spirituality " .... Ellner

May 12, 2005

Sorry, that is Lyme-Literate MD. People with Lyme are very careful

about MDs. Good LLMDs are quite prized.

We could do the same thing with CFS, calling good docs CLMDs

(CFS-Literate MD). A simple way to communicate that some doctors 'get

it' about CFS and others don't.

--Kurt

question

What does LLMD stand for?

thanks,

Helen

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with

each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any

treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

_____

August 18, 2005

Hi Audry,

What do you need to know, specifically?

You can check it out on the web at www.TOPS.org. That should give you

a lot of general information.

In a nutshell - it is cheaper than WW - non-profit, and I think that

if you put a lot into it, you'll get a lot out of it.

Laurie

> Does anyone know anything about TOPS?

>

> Thanks

> Audry

August 22, 2005

In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:18:22 PM Central Standard Time,

KPhilpot@... writes:

I would have kept her out of school until her mother's letter arrived!

There is never a good reason to damage the immune system with vaccines! This

poor girl!!

Not sure what you mean by giving a " generous serving of charcoal. " But

unfortunately the only way to not get the toxic effects of vaccines are by not

getting them in the first place.

I would get her under a homeopath's care asap!

Kay,

None of the above are options. She is an international exchange student

whose parents are assumably pro vaccine as she had all the other vaccines

including a Hep. Her parents are not going to write the letter. They do not

realize that vaccines can be optional.

The closest homeopath is 4 + hours away.. and I cannot afford to take myself

or my own children much less someone else's child.

Thanks for the feedback.

Kim

August 22, 2005

In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:23:24 PM Central Standard Time,

Vaccinefree@... writes:

You would think they would reqire parental consent to ADMINISTER the shot in

the first place........... who signs for that? The can't be " treating " kids

like that unless its an emergency!

I don't understand that at all!!!!!! so they can simply give shots out to

all and sundry without consent???

Chelly,

I totally agree.. but.. my hands are tied. Yes, they can do pretty much

what they want.

Kim

August 22, 2005

In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:25:25 PM Central Standard Time,

Vaccinefree@... writes:

If her parents are pro-vaccine - then whats the problem? you can't be

making a decision like that for them? right?

Sadly true.. that is why to lessen the effects on her.. as much as I could..

I gave her the charcoal.

August 22, 2005

Dear ??? (please sign your posts),

I would have kept her out of school until her mother's letter arrived! There is

never a good reason to damage the immune system with vaccines! This poor girl!!

Not sure what you mean by giving a " generous serving of charcoal. " But

unfortunately the only way to not get the toxic effects of vaccines are by not

getting them in the first place.

I would get her under a homeopath's care asap!

kay

Question

Exchange student, age 15, had to have MMR and Dt to attend public school.

There was no way to opt out without having her mother in Mongolia write a

letter, until which time, she could not attend school. So.. after I gave her

a

generous serving of charcoal. Any other suggestions?

Thanks in Advance!

August 22, 2005

You would think they would reqire parental consent to ADMINISTER the shot in the

first place........... who signs for that? The can't be " treating " kids like

that unless its an emergency!

I don't understand that at all!!!!!! so they can simply give shots out to all

and sundry without consent???

Chelly

Owner of:

http://www.hug-a-bum.com

Cloth Training pants & Pull-ups.

Question

Exchange student, age 15, had to have MMR and Dt to attend public school.

There was no way to opt out without having her mother in Mongolia write a

letter, until which time, she could not attend school. So.. after I gave her

a

generous serving of charcoal. Any other suggestions?

Thanks in Advance!

August 22, 2005

If her parents are pro-vaccine - then whats the problem? you can't be making a

decision like that for them? right?

Chelly

Owner of:

http://www.hug-a-bum.com

Cloth Training pants & Pull-ups.

Re: Question

In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:18:22 PM Central Standard Time,

KPhilpot@... writes:

I would have kept her out of school until her mother's letter arrived!

There is never a good reason to damage the immune system with vaccines! This

poor girl!!

Not sure what you mean by giving a " generous serving of charcoal. " But

unfortunately the only way to not get the toxic effects of vaccines are by not

getting them in the first place.

I would get her under a homeopath's care asap!

Kay,

None of the above are options. She is an international exchange student

whose parents are assumably pro vaccine as she had all the other vaccines

including a Hep. Her parents are not going to write the letter. They do not

realize that vaccines can be optional.

The closest homeopath is 4 + hours away.. and I cannot afford to take myself

or my own children much less someone else's child.

Thanks for the feedback.

Kim

August 22, 2005

I totally agree.. but.. my hands are tied. Yes, they can do pretty much

what they want.

If someone vaccinated my child without consent - they would be charged with

asault - no questions asked.

Chelly

Owner of:

http://www.hug-a-bum.com

Cloth Training pants & Pull-ups.

Re: Question

In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:23:24 PM Central Standard Time,

Vaccinefree@... writes:

August 22, 2005

You say they're " assumably pro vaccine " but you don't know for sure, right? I

would have tried to communicate the seriousness of these vaccines first.

Perhaps they've never considered how dangerous they are. You don't know for

sure that they wouldn't have written a letter of exemption if they've never been

asked.

And my homeopath is 3 states away. One doesn't have to see them in person for

them to work with you. Phone or email consults are very common because there

are so few classical homeopaths to be found.

Kay

************************

None of the above are options. She is an international exchange student

whose parents are assumably pro vaccine as she had all the other vaccines

including a Hep. Her parents are not going to write the letter. They do not

realize that vaccines can be optional.

The closest homeopath is 4 + hours away.. and I cannot afford to take myself

or my own children much less someone else's child.

Thanks for the feedback.

Kim

August 22, 2005

Is this in the US? I thought they could only do that

if it was an epidemic... I did not know they could vax

without consent especially at a school?

I thought that they took that right away from the

public schools years ago.

Jackie B

--- MomSchumm@... wrote:

> In a message dated 8/22/2005 at 4:23:24 PM Central

> Standard Time,

> Vaccinefree@... writes:

>

> You would think they would reqire parental consent

> to ADMINISTER the shot in

> the first place........... who signs for that? The

> can't be " treating " kids

> like that unless its an emergency!

> I don't understand that at all!!!!!! so they can

> simply give shots out to

> all and sundry without consent???

>

> Chelly,

>

> I totally agree.. but.. my hands are tied. Yes,

> they can do pretty much

> what they want.

>

> Kim

>

> [Non-text portions of this message have been

> removed]

>

" When we give government

the power to make medical decisions

for us, we, in essence, accept that

the state owns our bodies. "

~U.S.Representative Ron , MD

The Nuremberg Code (to which NZ is a signatory) describes Informed Choice as:

- A choice made on the basis of adequate information concerning research and all

available alternatives.

- A choice made without controlling influences such as force, fraud, deceit,

duress, over-reaching or other forms of constraint or coercion.

Does this not apply to us?

__________________________________________________

November 6, 2005

In a message dated 11/6/2005 3:30:16 PM Eastern Standard Time,

vaccineinfo@... writes:

Those who are the sickest don't ever or rarely become ill.

YIKES!!

I thought I was doing great as I or my children rarely get sick. Are you

saying I am actually unhealthy because I don't generally get sick?

Beth -GA

November 6, 2005

You are assuming vaccines help. They do not. They only do incredible damage

to the immune system. With all the great work you're doing keeping your family

healthy, all that could be completely wiped out if you allowed even one

vaccination.

The best defense against ANY illness, even a pandemic one, is a healthy immune

system. You are not " sure to get some pandemic. " It's all about susceptibility

and the strength of the immune system.

We have a classical homeopath on board for our family for illnesses that come

that we need help dealing with.

I highly recommend you find a classical homeopath for such occasions.

Kay

question

Maybe someone can answer this question. We are a extremely healthy family.

We eat only organic food, RO water, get good rest and have a great faith.

However, our family still gets the occasional cold once in a while. I know

that stress, etc can have a lot to do with it but if we can get a simple

cold than who is to say that we can not get the actual diseases. I would

consider our families immune system to be GREAT! But if we can get these

little things than we are sure to get some pandemic (f and when) it should

occur. Should be just wait until then and then consider vaccines?? Or

should be NEVER, NEVER give them? What should we do??

We are not and will not do the routine childhood vaccines for our children.

But if we can get the occasional cold, etc than what do we do if the big one

hits??

jen c

November 6, 2005

A healthy immune system reacts to whatever comes along. Change in blood

pressure or temperature, a swelling and even the common cold is the immune

system's way of dealing with a problem. Why the immune system deals in this way,

I don't know.

The medical experts don't care; but artificially containing a cold, lowering the

blood pressure, bringing down a swelling, just adds another problem to burden

carried by the immune system.

Tonsilitis is good example. The job of the tonsils is to protect us from

disease. When they are inflamed, they are doing their job. Wasn't it absurd to

remove them simply because they were doing what they were originally meant to

do?

Bob Catalano