RE: Info needed re adrenal function, cortisol, etc

[Guest guest]

Judith,

I am beginner at the adrenal piece, but one of my nutritionists said that my

adrenal problems are due to too much sulfur in my body which is disrupting my

entire metabolism. I don't know much about it yet, don't have the full report. I

can't find much on the web about sulfur toxicity or allergy, but it is

mentioned, just not explained.

He says eliminate sulfur containing foods like chicken, fish, diary, oinion,

and take Serine to get the sulfur out. I can't explain more, you know, there is

never enough time to ask questions. Also, NADH for the brain and metabolism.

Walnuts are for adrenals too. A symptom of sulfur toxicity is yellowish skin. I

have that.

I can't answer all your questions, but let me know if you find out anything

about sulfur problems.

I apologize for taking more from the list than giving, but as I mentioned

recently there is so much pressing down on me that I'm having to cut out

things I want to and need to do to comply with stupidities of two needed

resources for me: the health care (non) system and the welfare (cruel and

unreasonable) system.

Yet I really very much need/want some info that a few of you (I shan't

embarrass or put you on the spot by naming you) have exhibited knowledge

and understanding of, which for me to have a chance of getting myself

(I've tried a bit) would take more than I have.

Mostly it's to get some concrete understanding of matters that I think

are very pertinent to some current symptoms I MUST get help with and that

are I think very deeply rooted in the pathophysiology of this illness.

(Forgive revelations by these questions of ignorance. I'm flying on not

too many motors about all this.)

1. What is " adrenal insufficiency " (AI) in conventional medical terms.

E.g., I saw an abstract of an article on MEDLINE about AI (not

" artificial intelligence " !) in AIDs but didn't have the full text. I'd

like to know of course what the adrenals do (what sufficiency is). I'd

also know what prompts them to do that. I assume but am not sure that

the pituitary gland puts out a hormone (can't think of its name) that

stimulates the adrenals. Is it, in fact, corticotropin releasing

hormone, or is that something else?

2.I will look and report back what one abstract said about the cortroysyn

(sp?) test (ACTH stim test) but I do know it said it isn't as sensitive

as a test wherein they inject a chemical that starts with " m " (something

like " myo--). But I don't know and when I read that abstract again I'll

know (I think) sensitive with respect to what.

3. What gland produces cortisol? I think someone said that cortisol is

the same as adrenalin. I never thought that was the case. Is it?

4. From my own subjective experience of that very annoying set of

symptoms that feels like an uncontrolled adrenalin rush that I and others

I think often refer to as hyper, though " hyper " refers to behavior and

often it's an " internal " hyper by which I mean you feel revved up inside

but don't act it out, but it's so uncomfortable. For me it can be

triggered by fun, lots of sensory input at one time (like a supermarket

where the lights are bright, there's lots of ambient noise, many products

you need and want, you don't always know where what you need is and are

therefore having to look around and try to organize the chaos of their

system of product display, etc. What's interesting is that sometimes

this is more harrassing to me than other times but I don't know why.

Surely when I'm sleep deprived it is, but that's not the only " host "

condition that contributes to increased vulnerability. Interestingly

some supermarkets are worse than others in this respect and I often which

I could design one for I know that my sensitivies would help me make it

better (no one has asked me to!!!!).

Long intense even though fun and interesting phone conversations will do

this to me, making it hard to relax after it and often worse--making my

heart pound strongly so badly I cannot stand it. A fast heartbeat can

be, in my experience, far more easily controlled than a strong one.

Interestingly, calcium contributes, in me, to strong heartbeating. But

the concern I have is over this internal uncontrolled revved up feeling.

What bugs me, besides the experience, is the fact that I remember from I

think an undergraduate pschology course or something like that a bit of

information (I don't know if believed to be true now) that in

schizophrenics one of their problems was not being able to modulate

sensory input!!!

I/we are not schizophrenic. But maybe the mechanism for that symptom is

similar. Who knows?

When I told my avant garde CFS/ME whatever doctor about this last visit

(we were rushed--we're always rushed) he recommended (and I spoke of this

on the list) lith orotate (manic depressives are given lith carbonate).

I didn't get info on the rationale for that. Ordered it. Then after I

think Nil worried over it for me I did some research and I too didn't

like the idea even though I'd already ordered and paid for it, for even

though the dose is way lower than that given for manic d I found that the

orotate form, though they claim it has way fewer undesirable side effects

has a FAR longer half-life, which I think is why you can take a lower

dose, no?

I am not willing to try Seriphos.

First, I must get some better understanding of adrenalin and cortisol and

corticotropin releasing hormone. And also whether the thyroid is in any

way, shape, or form connected (my endo said no but I don't believe him

and am thinking of trying another endo but hate the idea of yet another

doctor).

I'd so appreciate some help with this stuff. I have been under

INCREDIBLE nuts-making stress and I think whatever that did

physiologically has made me much worse re this internal hyperness and

thus intolerance not of exercise of the physical nature but social

interaction or even sensory input, and that makes me have to function at

a vegetative state too often for the needs of my life!!!!!! Plus I'm

really suffering physically from the internal hypers. Last night my

heart was pounding so strongly (not fast) it was horrendous. Couldn't

sleep. Massaged my sternum (very sore when this happens, btw) lots even

though I was actually too tired to do that. Took some benzos. Took some

more mag via injection. Felt like I'd never settle down. Finally did

but it was hell and I want to fix this, and I know others of you go thru

this.

Do we know that the docs realize this to be a big issue with us? I

haven't read all the abstracts from Sydney (is there a website as I hate

opening up all of Jan's Help Me Circle Co-Cure things without knowing the

topic) to see if any address this.

Sorry for length. Any help you can give me re the understanding of

what's going on re normal and abnormal functioning here and testing would

be much appreciated. Right now I'm not about to introduce treatments til

I get a better hold on the mechanism model.

Judith Wisdom-

________________________________________________________________

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[Guest guest]

Hi ,

>but one of my nutritionists said that my adrenal problems are due to too

much sulfur in my body which is disrupting my entire metabolism.

> He says eliminate sulfur containing foods like chicken, fish, diary,

oinion, and take Serine to get the sulfur out. I can't explain more,

>NADH for the brain and metabolism. Walnuts are for adrenals too.

---------------

> A symptom of sulfur toxicity is yellowish skin. I have that.

-------------

I have also adrenal exhaustion (less cortisol in the morning that in the

evening and very low cortisol , in general) ( 8 at am, and 10 at pm), I

also have yellowish skin ( in my hands) and I eat a lot of fish ( because of

the good fats).

I was taking some months ago alpha lipoic acid which contains sulfur also

you say that you were told to take Serine, what's that and where do you buy

it

I am very interested in yr experience and what yr nutritionist told you,

could you pls tell us a little more about your case, do you also have low

cortical and inversed circadian rhythm?

thank you very much and happy new year for everybody

Elena

Re: Info needed re adrenal function, cortisol,

etc

>

> Judith,

>

> I am beginner at the adrenal piece I don't know much about it yet, don't

have the full report. I can't find much on the web about sulfur toxicity or

allergy, but it is mentioned, just not explained.

you know, there is never enough time to ask questions. Also, NADH for the

brain and metabolism. Walnuts are for adrenals too. A symptom of sulfur

toxicity is yellowish skin. I have that.

>

> I can't answer all your questions, but let me know if you find out

anything about sulfur problems.

>

>

>

>

>

> I apologize for taking more from the list than giving, but as I

mentioned

> recently there is so much pressing down on me that I'm having to cut out

> things I want to and need to do to comply with stupidities of two needed

> resources for me: the health care (non) system and the welfare (cruel

and

> unreasonable) system.

>

> Yet I really very much need/want some info that a few of you (I shan't

> embarrass or put you on the spot by naming you) have exhibited knowledge

> and understanding of, which for me to have a chance of getting myself

> (I've tried a bit) would take more than I have.

>

> Mostly it's to get some concrete understanding of matters that I think

> are very pertinent to some current symptoms I MUST get help with and

that

> are I think very deeply rooted in the pathophysiology of this illness.

>

> (Forgive revelations by these questions of ignorance. I'm flying on not

> too many motors about all this.)

>

> 1. What is " adrenal insufficiency " (AI) in conventional medical terms.

> E.g., I saw an abstract of an article on MEDLINE about AI (not

> " artificial intelligence " !) in AIDs but didn't have the full text. I'd

> like to know of course what the adrenals do (what sufficiency is). I'd

> also know what prompts them to do that. I assume but am not sure that

> the pituitary gland puts out a hormone (can't think of its name) that

> stimulates the adrenals. Is it, in fact, corticotropin releasing

> hormone, or is that something else?

>

> 2.I will look and report back what one abstract said about the

cortroysyn

> (sp?) test (ACTH stim test) but I do know it said it isn't as sensitive

> as a test wherein they inject a chemical that starts with " m " (something

> like " myo--). But I don't know and when I read that abstract again I'll

> know (I think) sensitive with respect to what.

>

> 3. What gland produces cortisol? I think someone said that cortisol is

> the same as adrenalin. I never thought that was the case. Is it?

>

> 4. From my own subjective experience of that very annoying set of

> symptoms that feels like an uncontrolled adrenalin rush that I and

others

> I think often refer to as hyper, though " hyper " refers to behavior and

> often it's an " internal " hyper by which I mean you feel revved up inside

> but don't act it out, but it's so uncomfortable. For me it can be

> triggered by fun, lots of sensory input at one time (like a supermarket

> where the lights are bright, there's lots of ambient noise, many

products

> you need and want, you don't always know where what you need is and are

> therefore having to look around and try to organize the chaos of their

> system of product display, etc. What's interesting is that sometimes

> this is more harrassing to me than other times but I don't know why.

> Surely when I'm sleep deprived it is, but that's not the only " host "

> condition that contributes to increased vulnerability. Interestingly

> some supermarkets are worse than others in this respect and I often

which

> I could design one for I know that my sensitivies would help me make it

> better (no one has asked me to!!!!).

>

> Long intense even though fun and interesting phone conversations will do

> this to me, making it hard to relax after it and often worse--making my

> heart pound strongly so badly I cannot stand it. A fast heartbeat can

> be, in my experience, far more easily controlled than a strong one.

> Interestingly, calcium contributes, in me, to strong heartbeating. But

> the concern I have is over this internal uncontrolled revved up feeling.

>

> What bugs me, besides the experience, is the fact that I remember from I

> think an undergraduate pschology course or something like that a bit of

> information (I don't know if believed to be true now) that in

> schizophrenics one of their problems was not being able to modulate

> sensory input!!!

>

> I/we are not schizophrenic. But maybe the mechanism for that symptom is

> similar. Who knows?

>

> When I told my avant garde CFS/ME whatever doctor about this last visit

> (we were rushed--we're always rushed) he recommended (and I spoke of

this

> on the list) lith orotate (manic depressives are given lith carbonate).

> I didn't get info on the rationale for that. Ordered it. Then after I

> think Nil worried over it for me I did some research and I too didn't

> like the idea even though I'd already ordered and paid for it, for even

> though the dose is way lower than that given for manic d I found that

the

> orotate form, though they claim it has way fewer undesirable side

effects

> has a FAR longer half-life, which I think is why you can take a lower

> dose, no?

>

> I am not willing to try Seriphos.

>

> First, I must get some better understanding of adrenalin and cortisol

and

> corticotropin releasing hormone. And also whether the thyroid is in any

> way, shape, or form connected (my endo said no but I don't believe him

> and am thinking of trying another endo but hate the idea of yet another

> doctor).

>

> I'd so appreciate some help with this stuff. I have been under

> INCREDIBLE nuts-making stress and I think whatever that did

> physiologically has made me much worse re this internal hyperness and

> thus intolerance not of exercise of the physical nature but social

> interaction or even sensory input, and that makes me have to function at

> a vegetative state too often for the needs of my life!!!!!! Plus I'm

> really suffering physically from the internal hypers. Last night my

> heart was pounding so strongly (not fast) it was horrendous. Couldn't

> sleep. Massaged my sternum (very sore when this happens, btw) lots even

> though I was actually too tired to do that. Took some benzos. Took

some

> more mag via injection. Felt like I'd never settle down. Finally did

> but it was hell and I want to fix this, and I know others of you go thru

> this.

>

> Do we know that the docs realize this to be a big issue with us? I

> haven't read all the abstracts from Sydney (is there a website as I hate

> opening up all of Jan's Help Me Circle Co-Cure things without knowing

the

> topic) to see if any address this.

>

> Sorry for length. Any help you can give me re the understanding of

> what's going on re normal and abnormal functioning here and testing

would

> be much appreciated. Right now I'm not about to introduce treatments

til

> I get a better hold on the mechanism model.

>

> Judith Wisdom-

> ________________________________________________________________

> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!

> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!

> Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:

> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Judith,

I'm going to refer you to a few websites that will help you. One on

the endocrine system that I found very helpful as well as one with

reference to studies that have been done concerning the HPA axis:

http://arbl.cvmbs.colostate.edu/hbooks/pathphys/endocrine/index.html

http://mcb.berkeley.edu/courses/mcb135e/adrenal.html (basic info on

the adrenal gland)

http://www.cfs.inform.dk/HPA/eng.hpa.html (HPA axis research)

http://www.pituitarycenter.com/html/article3.html (article on AI)

Note: " poorly functioning adrenals " is not a commonly accepted

disease state. 's/ AI is. Of course, years ago

hypothyroidism was not considered a disease state either. And it is

still more complicated than just checking a few hormones in the blood

and prescribing synthroid!

Regards, Mark

P.S. I should mention that the symptoms you mention are the very same

that my wife also experienced several years ago prior to her

significant progress. She is not fully well, but functioning about

80% and working part-time. And her two page list of symptoms is down

to a handful (yeah!). And I should also mention that I changed

careers to learn from Dr. Poesnecker and assist him in his work. His

primary focus is on reviving and supporting the adrenals in CFS, as

you already know.

> I apologize for taking more from the list than giving, but as I

mentioned

> recently there is so much pressing down on me that I'm having to

cut out

> things I want to and need to do to comply with stupidities of two

needed

> resources for me: the health care (non) system and the welfare

(cruel and

> unreasonable) system.

>

> Yet I really very much need/want some info that a few of you (I

shan't

> embarrass or put you on the spot by naming you) have exhibited

knowledge

> and understanding of, which for me to have a chance of getting

myself

> (I've tried a bit) would take more than I have.

>

> Mostly it's to get some concrete understanding of matters that I

think

> are very pertinent to some current symptoms I MUST get help with

and that

> are I think very deeply rooted in the pathophysiology of this

illness.

>

> (Forgive revelations by these questions of ignorance. I'm flying

on not

> too many motors about all this.)

>

> 1. What is " adrenal insufficiency " (AI) in conventional medical

terms.

> E.g., I saw an abstract of an article on MEDLINE about AI (not

> " artificial intelligence " !) in AIDs but didn't have the full text.

I'd

> like to know of course what the adrenals do (what sufficiency is).

I'd

> also know what prompts them to do that. I assume but am not sure

that

> the pituitary gland puts out a hormone (can't think of its name)

that

> stimulates the adrenals. Is it, in fact, corticotropin releasing

> hormone, or is that something else?

>

> 2.I will look and report back what one abstract said about the

cortroysyn

> (sp?) test (ACTH stim test) but I do know it said it isn't as

sensitive

> as a test wherein they inject a chemical that starts with " m "

(something

> like " myo--). But I don't know and when I read that abstract again

I'll

> know (I think) sensitive with respect to what.

>

> 3. What gland produces cortisol? I think someone said that

cortisol is

> the same as adrenalin. I never thought that was the case. Is it?

>

> 4. From my own subjective experience of that very annoying set of

> symptoms that feels like an uncontrolled adrenalin rush that I and

others

> I think often refer to as hyper, though " hyper " refers to behavior

and

> often it's an " internal " hyper by which I mean you feel revved up

inside

> but don't act it out, but it's so uncomfortable. For me it can be

> triggered by fun, lots of sensory input at one time (like a

supermarket

> where the lights are bright, there's lots of ambient noise, many

products

> you need and want, you don't always know where what you need is and

are

> therefore having to look around and try to organize the chaos of

their

> system of product display, etc. What's interesting is that

sometimes

> this is more harrassing to me than other times but I don't know

why.

> Surely when I'm sleep deprived it is, but that's not the only " host "

> condition that contributes to increased vulnerability.

Interestingly

> some supermarkets are worse than others in this respect and I often

which

> I could design one for I know that my sensitivies would help me

make it

> better (no one has asked me to!!!!).

>

> Long intense even though fun and interesting phone conversations

will do

> this to me, making it hard to relax after it and often worse--

making my

> heart pound strongly so badly I cannot stand it. A fast heartbeat

can

> be, in my experience, far more easily controlled than a strong one.

> Interestingly, calcium contributes, in me, to strong heartbeating.

But

> the concern I have is over this internal uncontrolled revved up

feeling.

>

> What bugs me, besides the experience, is the fact that I remember

from I

> think an undergraduate pschology course or something like that a

bit of

> information (I don't know if believed to be true now) that in

> schizophrenics one of their problems was not being able to modulate

> sensory input!!!

>

> I/we are not schizophrenic. But maybe the mechanism for that

symptom is

> similar. Who knows?

>

> When I told my avant garde CFS/ME whatever doctor about this last

visit

> (we were rushed--we're always rushed) he recommended (and I spoke

of this

> on the list) lith orotate (manic depressives are given lith

carbonate).

> I didn't get info on the rationale for that. Ordered it. Then

after I

> think Nil worried over it for me I did some research and I too

didn't

> like the idea even though I'd already ordered and paid for it, for

even

> though the dose is way lower than that given for manic d I found

that the

> orotate form, though they claim it has way fewer undesirable side

effects

> has a FAR longer half-life, which I think is why you can take a

lower

> dose, no?

>

> I am not willing to try Seriphos.

>

> First, I must get some better understanding of adrenalin and

cortisol and

> corticotropin releasing hormone. And also whether the thyroid is

in any

> way, shape, or form connected (my endo said no but I don't believe

him

> and am thinking of trying another endo but hate the idea of yet

another

> doctor).

>

> I'd so appreciate some help with this stuff. I have been under

> INCREDIBLE nuts-making stress and I think whatever that did

> physiologically has made me much worse re this internal hyperness

and

> thus intolerance not of exercise of the physical nature but social

> interaction or even sensory input, and that makes me have to

function at

> a vegetative state too often for the needs of my life!!!!!! Plus

I'm

> really suffering physically from the internal hypers. Last night my

> heart was pounding so strongly (not fast) it was horrendous.

Couldn't

> sleep. Massaged my sternum (very sore when this happens, btw) lots

even

> though I was actually too tired to do that. Took some benzos.

Took some

> more mag via injection. Felt like I'd never settle down. Finally

did

> but it was hell and I want to fix this, and I know others of you go

thru

> this.

>

> Do we know that the docs realize this to be a big issue with us? I

> haven't read all the abstracts from Sydney (is there a website as I

hate

> opening up all of Jan's Help Me Circle Co-Cure things without

knowing the

> topic) to see if any address this.

>

> Sorry for length. Any help you can give me re the understanding of

> what's going on re normal and abnormal functioning here and testing

would

> be much appreciated. Right now I'm not about to introduce

treatments til

> I get a better hold on the mechanism model.

>

> Judith Wisdom-

> ________________________________________________________________

> GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!

> Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!

> Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit:

> http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.