adrenals/alternative to hydrocortisone?

[Guest guest]

Vicky,

Have you tryed DHEA! I would steer clear of Steroids, if at all possible.

I had steroids with my Cancer treatment, and it made a lovely mess of me. UGH! I

am terrified they will put me on steroids.

Big Hugs

Dianne

adrenals/alternative to hydrocortisone?

Hi all

Recent tests have shown that my adrenals are not working at all well.

My doctor wants me to take low dose hydrocortisone but I'm very nervous

about taking a steroid (and other people have actually advised me

strongly against taking any steroids whatsoever).

Does anyone know if there is an effective alternative to hydrocortisone

with regard to helping the adrenals? I won't bore you with the details

but my doctor won't allow me to continue with a particular treatment

regime I am on unless I take the hydrocortisone and get my adrenals

working more efficiently. He's very concerned about the adrenal

exhaustion I am suffering from and thinks this could get even worse.

I'd like to be able to give him some evidence of a viable alternative to

hydrocortisone so that I can avoid taking a steroid. Any suggestions???

Also does anyone have any experience of a supplement called Cordyceps or

know whether this could be an effective alternative to hydrocortisone?

Alternatively has anyone here had really good success with

hydrocortisone for their adrenals and without side effects?

Many thanks for any help

Best wishes

Vicky

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

Vicky!

Which tests have shown that you have problems with your adrenals?Could you

give more detail?

Alternative to hydrocortisone is natural adrenal cortex hormones. ACE.

Alternative health care practicioners use it. One of them is Dr. Poesnecker.

www.chronicfatigue.org

Thanks.

Nil

adrenals/alternative to hydrocortisone?

| Hi all

|

| Recent tests have shown that my adrenals are not working at all well.

| My doctor wants me to take low dose hydrocortisone but I'm very nervous

| about taking a steroid (and other people have actually advised me

| strongly against taking any steroids whatsoever).

|

| Does anyone know if there is an effective alternative to hydrocortisone

| with regard to helping the adrenals? I won't bore you with the details

| but my doctor won't allow me to continue with a particular treatment

| regime I am on unless I take the hydrocortisone and get my adrenals

| working more efficiently. He's very concerned about the adrenal

| exhaustion I am suffering from and thinks this could get even worse.

|

| I'd like to be able to give him some evidence of a viable alternative to

| hydrocortisone so that I can avoid taking a steroid. Any suggestions???

|

| Also does anyone have any experience of a supplement called Cordyceps or

| know whether this could be an effective alternative to hydrocortisone?

|

| Alternatively has anyone here had really good success with

| hydrocortisone for their adrenals and without side effects?

|

| Many thanks for any help

|

| Best wishes

|

| Vicky

|

|

|

|

| This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

|

|

[Guest guest]

--- In @y..., " Di and Darryl Black "

Hi Vicky,

There are other things you can take besides hydrocortisone to

encourage your adrenals to produce more cortisol assuming you have

primary adrenal insuffficiency (weak adrenals) rather than a

secondary pituitary signaling issue (insufficient ACTH). They

include:

Cortisol Precursors

1) Vitamin C is significant dose througout the day 5-10gm to

tolerance. This supports cortisol production.

2) Vitamin B5 used in the production of cortisol 4gm/day.

3) Cholestrol from a food source: eggs or other dairy products.

Cholestrol is the raw material from which hormones including cortisol

are made. As a first step in the hormonal cascade, cholestrol is

converted to pregnenolone.

4) Pregnenolone 50-100mg, becomes cortisol or another hormone.

5) Sufficient niacin, B6, magnesium and B12.

General Adaptogens

1) Ashwaganda, Korean or Siberian Ginseng are believed to have a

normalizing effect on Adrenals. Ginger root, gingko and astragalus

are also supposed to be helpful. Cordyceps which you mentioned is

also recommended by some sources.

Cortisol/Hormonal Supplementation

1) Licorice reduces reupdate of cortisol by the liver and also has

some glutocorticoid properties. Hence it increases cortisol in your

system. There is a case of a woman with s disease (zero

cortisol production) who survived by self medicating with licorice.

The downside is that the licorice tends to raise blood pressure. You

will get headaches if this occurs.

2) Adrenal Cortex Extract from bovine source. This comes in capsule

and sublingual forms. The sublingual is much more costly and better

absorbed. ACE provides actual cortisol in very small amounts. If

you take enough it is equivalent to hydrocortisone. The main goal of

ACE is to provide the nutrient base to assist the adrenals in healing.

3) DHEA supplementation can in theory remove some of the workload

from your adrenals, but you should really test your DHEA levels

before supplementing. Side effects such as facial hair in women and

irritability can occur with too much DHEA.

I tested in January with very low adrenal function based on a 24 hour

ZRT saliva test. For 6 months I tried all of the above with no

effect on my tested cortisol levels or symptoms.

Then about 3 months ago I started low dose hydrocortisone. After

researching I learned that there is no risk of losing adrenal

function as long as you keep to a low dose and don't stay on for over

2 years, and you go off gradually. The reports of lost adrenal

function were based on usage of well over the replacement dose of

20mg/day. (See " Safe Uses of Cortisol " by Jeffries.)

I started on 10mg Cortef per day with quick relief of several

symptoms. I continued to take all the supplements (except licorice

that gave me headaches) above plus made some stress reducing

lifestyle changes.

I gradually reduced to 2.5mg daily without a return of symptoms, so I

have gotten some serious improvement thanks to the cortisol that

allowed my adrenals to rest and let my body function normally. My

understanding is that most often using cortisol along with good

supplementation you can get off the cortisol in from 6 months - 2

years.

I am not suggesting that anyone start with hydrocortisone, that

should only be necessary if you have very low cortisol levels. But

when the simpler interventions fail it is well worth researching. I

suggest " Adrenal Fatigure: The 21st Century Stress Syndrome " by

available at amazon.com as a good reference.

> adrenals/alternative to

hydrocortisone?

>

>

> Hi all

>

> Recent tests have shown that my adrenals are not working at all

well.

> My doctor wants me to take low dose hydrocortisone but I'm very

nervous

> about taking a steroid (and other people have actually advised me

> strongly against taking any steroids whatsoever).

>

> Does anyone know if there is an effective alternative to

hydrocortisone

> with regard to helping the adrenals? I won't bore you with the

details

> but my doctor won't allow me to continue with a particular

treatment

> regime I am on unless I take the hydrocortisone and get my

adrenals

> working more efficiently. He's very concerned about the adrenal

> exhaustion I am suffering from and thinks this could get even

worse.

>

> I'd like to be able to give him some evidence of a viable

alternative to

> hydrocortisone so that I can avoid taking a steroid. Any

suggestions???

>

> Also does anyone have any experience of a supplement called

Cordyceps or

> know whether this could be an effective alternative to

hydrocortisone?

>

> Alternatively has anyone here had really good success with

> hydrocortisone for their adrenals and without side effects?

>

> Many thanks for any help

>

> Best wishes

>

> Vicky

>

>

>

> This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences

with each other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested

in any treatment discussed here, please consult your doctor.

>

>

[Guest guest]

,

Thanks for detailed outlining of your protocol.I have couple of questions to

ask if you have time.

What was the level of your adrenal exhaustion when you started this

protocol.If your saliva test gives the stages,which stage you were in?

| 5) Sufficient niacin, B6, magnesium and B12.

Can you give an idea n what is the sufficient dosage of Niacin,b6,magnesium

and B12 to rebuilt the adrenals?

| 1) Ashwaganda, Korean or Siberian Ginseng are believed to have a

| normalizing effect on Adrenals. Ginger root, gingko and astragalus

| are also supposed to be helpful. Cordyceps which you mentioned is

| also recommended by some sources.

Is it safe using adaptogens together with ACE?

|

| Cortisol/Hormonal Supplementation

| 1) Licorice reduces reupdate of cortisol by the liver and also has

| some glutocorticoid properties. Hence it increases cortisol in your

| system. There is a case of a woman with s disease (zero

| cortisol production) who survived by self medicating with licorice.

| The downside is that the licorice tends to raise blood pressure. You

| will get headaches if this occurs.

Is it safe to use Licorice together with ACE?

|

| I tested in January with very low adrenal function based on a 24 hour

| ZRT saliva test. For 6 months I tried all of the above with no

| effect on my tested cortisol levels or symptoms.

|

| Then about 3 months ago I started low dose hydrocortisone. After

| researching I learned that there is no risk of losing adrenal

| function as long as you keep to a low dose and don't stay on for over

| 2 years, and you go off gradually. The reports of lost adrenal

| function were based on usage of well over the replacement dose of

| 20mg/day. (See " Safe Uses of Cortisol " by Jeffries.)

|

| I started on 10mg Cortef per day with quick relief of several

| symptoms. I continued to take all the supplements (except licorice

| that gave me headaches) above plus made some stress reducing

| lifestyle changes.

Why do you think hydrocortisone worked for you and ACE did not. Was that a

dosage problem or do you think something in ACE was not good for you?

Have you ever thought of taking raw adrenal glandular. If you did not prefer

taking it, what was the reason?

Thank you ..

Nil

[Guest guest]

Hi Nil,

I responded to your questions below.

> Thanks for detailed outlining of your protocol.I have couple of

questions to ask if you have time.

> What was the level of your adrenal exhaustion when you started this

> protocol.If your saliva test gives the stages,which stage you were

in?

[i don't know about my phase, but I tested with 1.5 ng/ml with a

normal test reference range of 3ng/ml - 8 ng/ml. I estimate that

translates to my adrenal making 5mg cortisol per day vs. 20mg

normal. This was sufficient to give me like symptoms beyond

fatigue: vertical lines across the stomach, unable to hold pupil

dilation when light shined into eyes, flank pain that was worse under

stress. At this point those symptoms are almost gone but I am still

working on exercise tolerance.]

> | 5) Sufficient niacin, B6, magnesium and B12.

> Can you give an idea n what is the sufficient dosage of

Niacin,b6,magnesium

> and B12 to rebuilt the adrenals?

>

[The point is to make sure that you have plenty of everything the

adrenals need so they don't have to work too hard. So for example I

took C, B5, and ACE 4 times per day to keep blood levels up. Minimum

dosages are 400mg magnesium, 125 mg B3, 400mcg B12, 50 mg niacin. I

took 2-3 times this recommended amount.]

> | 1) Ashwaganda, Korean or Siberian Ginseng are believed to have a

> | normalizing effect on Adrenals. Ginger root, gingko and

astragalus

> | are also supposed to be helpful. Cordyceps which you mentioned is

> | also recommended by some sources.

>

> Is it safe using adaptogens together with ACE?

> |

[Yes, inasmuch as they were recommended by the references I used.

Ginseng or Ashwaganda can be overstimulating (some people get

increased blood pressure on Ginseng) and Astragalus should be avoided

with a fever. I found I needed to keep to a fairly low dose of

Ginseng to prevent headaches.]

> | Cortisol/Hormonal Supplementation

> | 1) Licorice reduces reuptake of cortisol by the liver and also has

> | some glutocorticoid properties. Hence it increases cortisol in

your

> | system. There is a case of a woman with s disease (zero

> | cortisol production) who survived by self medicating with

licorice.

> | The downside is that the licorice tends to raise blood pressure.

You

> | will get headaches if this occurs.

>

> Is it safe to use Licorice together with ACE?

[Yes, but keep in mind the effects are additive. Licorice will

increase circulating cortisol, although from my experience the

duration is limited. ACE also increases cortisol to a more limited

degree. Midway through the process I tried ACE with Licorice. It

was OK but I got a continuous headache from high blood pressure after

a few days so eventually I quit the Licorice.]

> |

> | I tested in January with very low adrenal function based on a 24

hour

> | ZRT saliva test. For 6 months I tried all of the above with no

> | effect on my tested cortisol levels or symptoms.

> |

> | Then about 3 months ago I started low dose hydrocortisone. After

> | researching I learned that there is no risk of losing adrenal

> | function as long as you keep to a low dose and don't stay on for

over

> | 2 years, and you go off gradually. The reports of lost adrenal

> | function were based on usage of well over the replacement dose of

> | 20mg/day. (See " Safe Uses of Cortisol " by Jeffries.)

> |

> | I started on 10mg Cortef per day with quick relief of several

> | symptoms. I continued to take all the supplements (except

licorice

> | that gave me headaches) above plus made some stress reducing

> | lifestyle changes.

>

> Why do you think hydrocortisone worked for you and ACE did not. Was

that a

> dosage problem or do you think something in ACE was not good for

you?

[My adrenals were wiped out performing at 25% capacity throughout the

24 hour testing period. ACE is a good supportive supplement

providing the materials the adrenals need to heal and a very small

amount of the cortical hormones to make up for small dysfunction.

But without the rest that a near replacement dose of hydrocortisone

provide, my adrenals were struggling most of the time trying to

produce the cortisol that ACTH signalled was needed. I know this

because it hurt. When I took the cortisol it stopped hurting right

away, and after 2 months of hydrocortisone induced rest I started

improving.

I have taken ACE the whole time. By itself it provided only very

minor short term relief, but in a milder case it is often sufficient

by itself.]

> Have you ever thought of taking raw adrenal glandular. If you did

not prefer

> taking it, what was the reason?

[My admittedly vague understanding is that adrenal glandular is

produced from whole bovine adrenal while ACE is produced from the

Adrenal Cortex only where cortisol is produced. I did not feel I

needed to supplement the Adrenal Medula portions which relate to

adrenaline production.]

> Thank you ..

> Nil

[You're welcome. I know you have been working on this problem for a

while as I have. One caveat is that as long as you have a serious

toxic or pathogen burden, you adrenals may not heal because burdens

cause the adrenals to overwork. I used hyperbaric to kill infections

or at least to drive them into latency and NDF to detox mercury. I

did these detoxes well before I switched to hydrocortisone so for me

that stronger intervention was needed to start adrenal healing.

- ]

[Guest guest]

Vicky!

Thanks,I wonder why my endocrinologist did not wnat me to take these tests.

I have been telling him that I have adrenal exhaustion and he doesnot accept

that .

If your DHEA level is high that means you are either at stage 2 or 5 of

adrenal exhaustion and should be treated accordingly.Yes,you can not take

DHEA and Pregnenolone. You can find more info on these stages at Dr.

Poesnecker's site.

Good Luck!Nil

Re: Ynt: adrenals/alternative to

hydrocortisone?

| Hi Nil

|

| >Which tests have shown that you have problems with your adrenals?Could

you

| >give more detail?

| >Alternative to hydrocortisone is natural adrenal cortex hormones. ACE.

| >Alternative health care practicioners use it. One of them is Dr.

Poesnecker.

| >www.chronicfatigue.org

|

| The adrenal test I had recently was a 24 hr urinalysis carried out at a

| laboratory called The European Laboratory of Nutrients in the

| Netherlands. As far as I can tell they are affiliated to a lab called

| Vitamin Diagnostics in NJ. I'll print their contact details below.

|

| I don't know exactly which tests my doctor ordered (ie the name or names

| of these particular tests - there are no names as such on the report)

| but the results showed some abnormalities including very low levels of

| Aldosteron and Total 17-OH-steroids and low levels in some other things.

| My doctor tells me that these findings show that my adrenals are not

| functioning correctly and are under a lot of stress.

|

| Things are complicated by the fact that I cannot take DHEA as my DHEA

| levels are actually far too high.

|

| I've heard of Dr Poesnecker and will check out the website, many thanks.

|

| Vicky

|

| European Laboratory of Nutrients

| Regulierenring 9

| 3981 LA Bunnik

| The Netherlands

| Phone: (+31) 30-2871492

| Fax: (+31) 30-2802688

| Email : eln-eur@...

|

| Vitamin Diagnostics Inc.

| Rt.35 & Industrial Drive

| Cliffwood Beach, NJ 07735

| Phone : (732) 583-7773

| Fax : (732) 583-7774

| Email : eln-us@...

|

|

|

|

|

| This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

|

|

[Guest guest]

Oh dear Vicky,

It is all a trial and error, I feel. DHEA didn't do me any good, just made my

brain so alert, that my eyes wouldn't close. So in other words it lifted that,

but the body contined to struggle. I was on Dexamethesone (Steroid) which caused

no end of problems, like eyes, oh and the weight has been huge. I have now been

referred to a Dietician. Unbelievable Vicky. I was 8 stone, 2 years ago and I am

now 14 stone. Doctor says it is dangerously high for me. Strange thing is I

hardly eat now.

I go to the Obese clinic tomorrow. I am never sure what I am suffering from,

after having had Invasive Breast Cancer, stage 3,now ME/CMV/Toxoplasmosis, just

so many symptoms. UGH!

Good luck Vicky,

Big ((((((Hugs)))))

Dianne

Re: adrenals/alternative to hydrocortisone?

Hi Dianne

Sadly my DHEA levels are already too high - I wish it could be that

simple for me!

I'm really sorry to hear about your cancer, I do hope you're doing ok.

Hugs back to you :-)

Vicky

In message <005901c268cd$b9a703b0$68464fcb@diannes>, Di and Darryl Black

<dianne.darryl@...> writes

>Vicky,

>

>Have you tryed DHEA! I would steer clear of Steroids, if at all possible.

>

>I had steroids with my Cancer treatment, and it made a lovely mess of me.

UGH! I

>am terrified they will put me on steroids.

>

>Big Hugs

>Dianne

[Guest guest]

s, that is good that there is a product out now that is guaranteed to

be free of the mad-cow prions. I wonder if it is guaranteed or your money

back, haha. There is also products from Nutricology that seem like they

might be good but that is interesting Thorne mixes in Licorice into the

product so all you have to do is pop them in the morning and be good to go.

I wouldn't mind trying the Thorne or Nutricology products myself right now

but I am going to stick with the BVT which shouldn't be used with

hyrdocortisone so I suspect glandulars would be the same rule. I did try

Poesnecker's recommended brand of glandulars but never noticed any difference

with them either--Mil Adregen.

[Guest guest]

I have also had messed up adrenals. At night or before a nap, when I layed down

to rest, I would feel what I called adrenal zings in the area of the adrenals.

It was like a little electrical thrill over the adrenals. Having no $ or

confidence to run the medical gauntlet, I was left to pray and look for answers.

My question was, is my nervous system messed up because my adrenals are messed

up or are my adrenals messed up because my nervous system is messed up. Raw

adrenal did not seem to help. It seemed to weaken me. So I tried to address

the nervous system and found out that essential fatty acids were 'essential' for

the nervous system. I began taking fish oils and the adrenal zings stopped.

And I have been strengthened in general. Not totally healed, but greatly

strengthened.

I take carlsons fish oils. one in a.m. and one in p.m. Along with a few other

items. Not much.

Donna

Re: adrenals/alternative to hydrocortisone?

My adrenal function is low, and I get a great deal of

improvement in energy, stamina, and coping with stress when

I take a Thorne product called Cortrex. It contains adrenal

extract, adrenal cortical extract, and licorice root - and

they guarantee that it is free of " mad cow disease " prions.

I take two capsules at breakfast, and it lasts me pretty

much all day. Only contraindication I know of is if you

have high blood pressure, you need to be careful with

licorice root.

--

el (andrea@...) Nevada City, CA, USA

" ...wake now! Discover that you are the song

that the morning brings... "

" One is taught by experience to put a premium

on those few people who can appreciate you

for what you are. " - Gail Godwin

This list is intended for patients to share personal experiences with each

other, not to give medical advice. If you are interested in any treatment

discussed here, please consult your doctor.

[Guest guest]

polkadot@... wrote:

> ----- Original Message -----

> From: " el " <andrea@...>

>

> > My adrenal function is low, and I get a great deal of

> > improvement in energy, stamina, and coping with stress when

> > I take a Thorne product called Cortrex. It contains adrenal

> > extract, adrenal cortical extract, and licorice root - and

> > they guarantee that it is free of " mad cow disease " prions.

>

> -

>

> I am a big fan of Thorne products...what lab results have you seen?

>

> Kathy

>

Sorry, I have no lab results. My a.m. cortisol reading was normal, and I

haven't gotten around to doing ASI or 24-hour cortisol.

I was concerned about a rise in intraocular pressure found on my latest eye

exam, and decided to try dropping a number of supplements and adding a few

others to see if I could affect it. After 2

months without Cortrex, I was a wreck. After a follow-up exam showed no change

in IOP, I went back to the Cortrex (2 caps in a.m.), and within a few days

noticed a BIG difference. I can verify

this by checking my daily notebook for symptoms and level of activity, but not

by lab tests.

--

el (andrea@...) Nevada City, CA, USA

" ...wake now! Discover that you are the song

that the morning brings... "

" One is taught by experience to put a premium

on those few people who can appreciate you

for what you are. " - Gail Godwin

[Guest guest]

,

I received Dr. 's book. I have couple of questions to ask you. Please

answer if you have time.

He is mentioning of Adrenal cell extracts. Is this adrenal cortex extract?

If he means adrenal cortex extract than I did not understand this part.He is

saying that Adrenal cell extracts wouldn't suppress the adrenal glands but

any form of natural or synthetic hydrocortisone would. I could not

understand this.Adrenal cortex extract would also suppress the glands if

taken in large doses.Wouldn't it?

Also what is natural hydrocortisone? I was thinking that only form of

natural cortisone was in ACE.

Thanks so much. Best regards.

nil