Acute vs Gradual

[Guest guest]

When Ramsay and other ME experts (and this is before CFS was

invented) described the onset it was usually acute.

That is the person was completely well one day and then had either

severe flu like symptoms or in a few cases (much less) an attack of

vertigo was the first sign.

So for an acute onset we need to be totally well, and then a definite

and sudden viral trigger or vertigo. Then the person is never the

same.

A gradual onset would be months of different triggers or symtoms with

the person going gradually down-hill.

Now I now everything isn't black and white. It needs a good clinician

to diagnose ME and sadly, most of our good M.E. doctors in the world

have died or retired.

It would also take a good clinican to seperate people into acute and

gradual. We are not all clear cut.

Maybe we need

1. Acute - well one day and very sick since then (and always very

sick). No great emotional stress or other events at the time.

2. Acute - viral symptoms but in a time of emotional turmoil or an

extreme physical challange such as a marathon run.

3. Gradual with a series of events over months. Maybe an operation,

then a divorce, then training for a marathon

4. Gradual - over a number of years

etc etc

I'm not talking about CFS or the Canadian guidelines. I'm talking

about ME as it was before CFS.

I have had ME and seen ME consultants before CFS and this is what I

have been told by them.

I'm not trying to denigrate people with CFS or CF. I'm also not

trying to say that acute is somewhow better.

Some people may not like what I am saying here but this was my

experince with ME before CFS.

If people want to use the term ME they should be aware of the history

and the descriptions/books and research by the people who invented

the term. ME and CFS are no always interchangable.

Kindest regards,

Annette

[Guest guest]

All good points but you did miss one subset that Dr. Chia (an infectious disease

specialist)  sees; an infection that is resolved and then a second different

infection that turns into CFS. There is also study evidence suggesting an

increased round of colds before the big event occurs.

Ramsey and the rest were also studying epidemic type outbreaks I believe -

something that would lend itself to acute style illnesses. As I said

cannot define his neuro-immune subset - which seems to me very much like

treatment resistant ME (the 25% group) - using acute vs gradual; both fit in

there.

There is also increasing evidence of a mood disorder subset in the disease from

Natelon, Gudrun Lange and now Kondo out of Japan; they have different findings

but a similar clincal presentation.

Cort

Cort

From: annettebarc <annettebarc@...>

Subject: Acute vs Gradual

Date: Thursday, July 3, 2008, 4:41 AM

When Ramsay and other ME experts (and this is before CFS was

invented) described the onset it was usually acute.

That is the person was completely well one day and then had either

severe flu like symptoms or in a few cases (much less) an attack of

vertigo was the first sign.

So for an acute onset we need to be totally well, and then a definite

and sudden viral trigger or vertigo. Then the person is never the

same.

A gradual onset would be months of different triggers or symtoms with

the person going gradually down-hill.

Now I now everything isn't black and white. It needs a good clinician

to diagnose ME and sadly, most of our good M.E. doctors in the world

have died or retired.

It would also take a good clinican to seperate people into acute and

gradual. We are not all clear cut.

Maybe we need

1. Acute - well one day and very sick since then (and always very

sick). No great emotional stress or other events at the time.

2. Acute - viral symptoms but in a time of emotional turmoil or an

extreme physical challange such as a marathon run.

3. Gradual with a series of events over months. Maybe an operation,

then a divorce, then training for a marathon

4. Gradual - over a number of years

etc etc

I'm not talking about CFS or the Canadian guidelines. I'm talking

about ME as it was before CFS.

I have had ME and seen ME consultants before CFS and this is what I

have been told by them.

I'm not trying to denigrate people with CFS or CF. I'm also not

trying to say that acute is somewhow better.

Some people may not like what I am saying here but this was my

experince with ME before CFS.

If people want to use the term ME they should be aware of the history

and the descriptions/ books and research by the people who invented

the term. ME and CFS are no always interchangable.

Kindest regards,

Annette