Re: Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE

[Guest guest]

It wouldnt be an issue.

Re: Re: Health Department contacting County

Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE

This is an area that I am very ignorant. Part of why my husband and I are

relocating is to protect our son and any subsequent children because where we

are now, not so safe if you have different views. And there are camera's

everywhere. Which is why I asked. I wouldn't even know where to start,

especially here, if they were looking. Could they put out an amber alert? Or

because it's still in " investigation " stage, would you disappearing not be an

issue?

On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:48 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

> well the child is fine, past the date he shouldn't be fine - how could they

force it then, and don't you have a right to travel at will and go where you

want without letting them know. There is no court order at present.

> Sheri

>

> At 03:28 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>

>

>> I am curious, how would you " go into hiding? " Would it be considered

fleeing? Would it cause more issues? Or if you come back and everything is okay,

does it just get swept under the rug?

>>

>> On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM

[Guest guest]

you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies

vaccine could 'take' your son in other ways..............please let

me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can help undo

any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health

otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was

he breastfed?

I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally

High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would

recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I would do that.

Sheri

At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last

>night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county

>prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take my

>child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child

>was in " imminent danger " , but he wasn't sure of the liklihood that

>they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in imminent

>danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges against me, that

>they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend

>myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county

>always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of experts

>and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to testify that

>the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's case. I

>am so upset over this whole situation and just am not willing to

>take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged

>with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we

>had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just

>finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated

>that their implied threats forced us into having the vaccine, not

>because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be receiving a

>certified letter from them stating that they had informed me of the

>rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their ability.

>They are still waiting to hear back from the county prosecutor as to

>whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child

>neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to say my

>son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,

>since we just got the 2nd dose today.

>

>Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.

>It means everything right now.

>

>Rhian

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello,

> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a baby

> raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made

> contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked

> eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I

> applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots

> appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at

> the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended

> the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the

> doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment,

> we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my

> husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of

> rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine

> initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day

> 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County

> Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we

> decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine

> dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I

> made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the

> type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid

> raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that

> good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water,

> plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing

> passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production,

> and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found)

> stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is

> achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered

> the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health

> Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to

> tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to

> Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than

> willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),

> but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she

> says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take

> weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told

> me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is

> in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health

> Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the

> fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she

> would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of

> vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the

> participants achieved many time greater titer levels than

> recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses

> given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice

> or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so

> appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an

> attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much

> time as Child Protective Se>

> > Sincerely,

> > Rhian

> > Willoughby Hills, OH

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I am curious, how would you "go into hiding?" Would it be considered fleeing? Would it cause more issues? Or if you come back and everything is okay, does it just get swept under the rug?On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies

vaccine could 'take' your son in other ways..............please let

me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can help undo

any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health

otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was

he breastfed?

I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally

High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would

recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I would do that.

Sheri

At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last

>night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county

>prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take my

>child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child

>was in "imminent danger", but he wasn't sure of the liklihood that

>they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in imminent

>danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges against me, that

>they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend

>myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county

>always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of experts

>and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to testify that

>the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's case. I

>am so upset over this whole situation and just am not willing to

>take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged

>with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we

>had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just

>finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated

>that their implied threats forced us into having the vaccine, not

>because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be receiving a

>certified letter from them stating that they had informed me of the

>rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their ability.

>They are still waiting to hear back from the county prosecutor as to

>whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child

>neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to say my

>son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,

>since we just got the 2nd dose today.

>

>Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.

>It means everything right now.

>

>Rhian

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello,

> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a baby

> raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made

> contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked

> eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I

> applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots

> appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at

> the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended

> the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the

> doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment,

> we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my

> husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of

> rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine

> initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day

> 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County

> Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we

> decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine

> dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I

> made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the

> type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid

> raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that

> good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water,

> plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing

> passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production,

> and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found)

> stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is

> achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered

> the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health

> Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to

> tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to

> Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than

> willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),

> but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she

> says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take

> weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told

> me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is

> in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health

> Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the

> fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she

> would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of

> vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the

> participants achieved many time greater titer levels than

> recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses

> given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice

> or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so

> appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an

> attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much

> time as Child Protective Se>

> > Sincerely,

> > Rhian

> > Willoughby Hills, OH

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

Here's an article explaining some - mostly relates to pets because

that is who usually get rabies vaccine

http://www.homeopathyforwellness.com/uploads/8/2/0/1/8201487/marchapril-newslett\

er_1.pdf

2 remedy possibilities but really requires a homeopath to work with you

Hopefully he is strong enough to throw this off

So awful

Sheri

[Guest guest]

well the child is fine, past the date he shouldn't be fine - how could

they force it then, and don't you have a right to travel at will and go

where you want without letting them know. There is no court order

at present.

Sheri

At 03:28 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

I am curious, how would you

" go into hiding? " Would it be considered fleeing? Would

it cause more issues? Or if you come back and everything is okay, does it

just get swept under the rug?

On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies

vaccine could 'take' your son in other ways..............please let

me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can help undo

any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health

otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was

he breastfed?

I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally

High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would

recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I would do

that.

Sheri

At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last

>night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county

>prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take my

>child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child

>was in " imminent danger " , but he wasn't sure of the

liklihood that

>they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in imminent

>danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges against me, that

>they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend

>myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county

>always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of experts

>and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to testify that

>the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's case. I

>am so upset over this whole situation and just am not willing to

>take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged

>with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we

>had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just

>finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated

>that their implied threats forced us into having the vaccine, not

>because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be receiving a

>certified letter from them stating that they had informed me of the

>rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their ability.

>They are still waiting to hear back from the county prosecutor as to

>whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child

>neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to say my

>son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,

>since we just got the 2nd dose today.

>

>Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.

>It means everything right now.

>

>Rhian

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello,

> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a

baby

> raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made

> contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked

> eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I

> applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots

> appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at

> the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended

> the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the

> doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment,

> we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my

> husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of

> rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine

> initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day

> 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County

> Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we

> decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine

> dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I

> made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the

> type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid

> raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that

> good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water,

> plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing

> passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production,

> and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found)

> stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is

> achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered

> the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health

> Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to

> tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to

> Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than

> willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),

> but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she

> says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take

> weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told

> me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is

> in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health

> Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the

> fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she

> would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of

> vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the

> participants achieved many time greater titer levels than

> recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses

> given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice

> or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so

> appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an

> attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much

> time as Child Protective Se>

> > Sincerely,

> > Rhian

> > Willoughby Hills, OH

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

This is an area that I am very ignorant. Part of why my husband and I are relocating is to protect our son and any subsequent children because where we are now, not so safe if you have different views. And there are camera's everywhere. Which is why I asked. I wouldn't even know where to start, especially here, if they were looking. Could they put out an amber alert? Or because it's still in "investigation" stage, would you disappearing not be an issue?On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:48 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

well the child is fine, past the date he shouldn't be fine - how could

they force it then, and don't you have a right to travel at will and go

where you want without letting them know. There is no court order

at present.

Sheri

At 03:28 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

I am curious, how would you

"go into hiding?" Would it be considered fleeing? Would

it cause more issues? Or if you come back and everything is okay, does it

just get swept under the rug?

On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies

vaccine could 'take' your son in other ways..............please let

me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can help undo

any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health

otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was

he breastfed?

I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally

High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would

recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I would do

that.

Sheri

At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last

>night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county

>prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take my

>child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child

>was in "imminent danger", but he wasn't sure of the

liklihood that

>they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in imminent

>danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges against me, that

>they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend

>myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county

>always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of experts

>and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to testify that

>the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's case. I

>am so upset over this whole situation and just am not willing to

>take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged

>with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we

>had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just

>finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated

>that their implied threats forced us into having the vaccine, not

>because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be receiving a

>certified letter from them stating that they had informed me of the

>rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their ability.

>They are still waiting to hear back from the county prosecutor as to

>whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child

>neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to say my

>son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,

>since we just got the 2nd dose today.

>

>Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.

>It means everything right now.

>

>Rhian

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello,

> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a

baby

> raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made

> contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked

> eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I

> applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots

> appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at

> the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended

> the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the

> doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment,

> we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my

> husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of

> rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine

> initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day

> 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County

> Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we

> decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine

> dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I

> made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the

> type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid

> raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that

> good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water,

> plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing

> passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production,

> and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found)

> stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is

> achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered

> the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health

> Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to

> tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to

> Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than

> willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),

> but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she

> says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take

> weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told

> me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is

> in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health

> Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the

> fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she

> would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of

> vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the

> participants achieved many time greater titer levels than

> recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses

> given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice

> or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so

> appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an

> attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much

> time as Child Protective Se>

> > Sincerely,

> > Rhian

> > Willoughby Hills, OH

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I would be hesitant to run myself because they do make up their own rules, and they could manufacture some excuse to retaliate. If they did end up taking the child, I'd worry that they'd update all the vaccines just because they can. So, the rabies one vs. all of them--and without me there to try to fix the damage, plus the child's fear, and for how long?

It certainly should give us all something to think about.

Winnie Re: Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATEVaccinations > well the child is fine, past the date he shouldn't be fine - how > could they force it then, and don't you have a right to travel > at > will and go where you want without letting them know. There is > no > court order at present.> Sheri> > At 03:28 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:> > > >I am curious, how would you "go into hiding?" Would it be > >considered fleeing? Would it cause more issues? Or if you come > back > >and everything is okay, does it just get swept under the rug?> >> >On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:> >> >>> >>> >>you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies> >>vaccine could 'take' your son in other > ways..............please let> >>me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can > help undo> >>any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health> >>otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was> >>he breastfed?> >>> >>I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally> >>> >>High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would> >>recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I > would do that.> >>Sheri> >>> >>At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:> >>> >> >Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last> >> >night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county> >> >prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually > take my> >> >child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child> >> >was in "imminent danger", but he wasn't sure of the > liklihood that> >> >they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in > imminent>> >danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges > against me, that> >> >they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend> >> >myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county> >> >always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of > experts>> >and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to > testify that> >> >the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's > case. I> >> >am so upset over this whole situation and just am not > willing to> >> >take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged> >> >with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my > son's) we> >> >had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. > I just> >> >finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated> >> >that their implied threats forced us into having the > vaccine, not> >> >because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be > receiving a> >> >certified letter from them stating that they had informed me > of the> >> >rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their > ability.>> >They are still waiting to hear back from the county > prosecutor as to> >> >whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child> >> >neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to > say my> >> >son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,> >> >since we just got the 2nd dose today.> >> >> >> >Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.> >> >It means everything right now.> >> >> >> >Rhian> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > > Hello,> >> > > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to > pet a baby> >> > raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The > raccoon made> >> > contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to > the naked> >> > eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. > When I> >> > applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots> >> > appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him > checked at> >> > the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended> >> > the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. > Since the> >> > doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin > treatment,>> > we declined the shots and went home to research > and discuss with my> >> > husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of> >> > rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine> >> > initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, > and Day> >> > 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County> >> > Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we> >> > decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine> >> > dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's > exposure. I> >> > made sure to get the package inserts for later review. > Based on the> >> > type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases > of rabid> >> > raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that> >> > good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap > and water,> >> > plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing> >> > passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody > production,>> > and that the package insert (as well as a few > studies I found)> >> > stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies > often is> >> > achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered> >> > the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health> >> > Department does not feel this way, and called me this > morning to> >> > tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who > may go to> >> > Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than> >> > willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day > 10 (as> >> > this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),> >> > but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and > DAY 7 she> >> > says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take> >> > weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor > has told> >> > me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his > life is> >> > in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health> >> > Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the> >> > fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even > sure she> >> > would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd > dose of> >> > vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the> >> > participants achieved many time greater titer levels than> >> > recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses> >> > given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice> >> > or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so> >> > appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an> >> > attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much> >> > time as Child Protective Se>> >> > > Sincerely,> >> > > Rhian> >> > > Willoughby Hills, OH> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >------------------------------------> >> >> >> >

[Guest guest]

"ADVISED YOU?" Creeps.

Is there still the day 10 shot left?

Winnie

Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATEVaccinations > > > > Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking > last night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county > prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take > my child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my > child was in "imminent danger", but he wasn't sure of the > liklihood that they would. He also stated that if don't feel my > son is in imminent danger, but they wanted to pursue filing > charges against me, that they would serve me with a civil suit > and I would have to defend myself in court. Unfortunately if it > goes that far, the county always has the upper hand because they > would have a panel of experts and I would have to try and find a > doctor willing to testify that the rabies vaccines were not > medically necessary in my son's case. I am so upset over this > whole situation and just am not willing to take the risk of > having my son taken away from me or being charged with child > neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we had the > 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just > finished reporting this to the County Health Department and > stated that their implied threats forced us into having the > vaccine, not because it is medically necessary. I was told I > would be receiving a certified letter from them stating that > they had informed me of the rabies disease risk and had advised > us to the best of their ability. They are still waiting to hear > back from the county prosecutor as to whether or not they will > be moving forward with charges of child neglect. So it > continues, but at least they won't be able to say my son is in > danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now, since we > just got the 2nd dose today. > > Again, thank you all for your support and helpful > recommendations. It means everything right now.> > Rhian> > > > > >> > Hello,> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a > baby raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The > raccoon made contact with my son's hand, but no marks were > apparent to the naked eye. We washed his hand with soap and > water thoroughly. When I applied iodine (antiviral) to the area > a couple of tiny spots appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-> call to go get him checked at the hospital. When we went the ER > doctor immediately recommended the rabies series without even > looking at my son's hand. Since the doctor said we had about 24-> 48 hours of window to begin treatment, we declined the shots and > went home to research and discuss with my husband who had been > out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of rabies Immunoglobulin > along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine initially, followed by 3 > doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day 14 following the first > treatment. After speaking with the County Health Department and > doing some research into the disease, we decided to get my son > the IG dose as well as the first vaccine dose. We went to the ER > within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I made sure to get the > package inserts for later review. Based on the type of exposure > (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid raccoons in > the area in the past three years (0), the fact that good wound > care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water, plus > antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing > passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody > production, and that the package insert (as well as a few > studies I found) stated that an acceptable level of circulating > antibodies often is achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt > we more than covered the possible risk of rabies. However, the > woman at the Health Department does not feel this way, and > called me this morning to tell me that she had contacted the > County Prosecutor who may go to Child Protective Services. I > told her that I would be more than willing to have my son's > antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as this is when his body > should be starting to produce antibodies), but because the CDC > recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she says there is no > time wait for blood tests that also could take weeks to get > results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told me that > they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is in > danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health > Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the > fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure > she would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd > dose of vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of > the participants achieved many time greater titer levels than > recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses > given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any > advice or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so > appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an > attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much > time as Child Protective Services can act quickly if they feel > it is necessary. > > > > Sincerely,> > Rhian> > Willoughby Hills, OH> >> > >

[Guest guest]

it isn't in any stage yet - just that hospital told them he should have

the vax

Sheri

At 03:54 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

This is an area that I am very

ignorant. Part of why my husband and I are relocating is to protect our

son and any subsequent children because where we are now, not so safe if

you have different views. And there are camera's everywhere. Which is why

I asked. I wouldn't even know where to start, especially here, if they

were looking. Could they put out an amber alert? Or because it's still in

" investigation " stage, would you disappearing not be an

issue?

On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:48 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

well the child is fine, past the date he shouldn't be fine - how could

they force it then, and don't you have a right to travel at will and go

where you want without letting them know. There is no court order

at present.

Sheri

At 03:28 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

I am curious, how would you

" go into hiding? " Would it be considered fleeing? Would

it cause more issues? Or if you come back and everything is okay, does it

just get swept under the rug?

On Jun 12, 2012, at 6:20 PM, Sheri Nakken wrote:

you were between a rock and hard place - the thing is the rabies

vaccine could 'take' your son in other ways..............please let

me know how he days and I can refer to a homeopath that can help undo

any harm, probably - never any guarantees, though. How is his health

otherwise? No vaccines? - any other past drugs in his history? Was

he breastfed?

I would have gone into hiding till the time was up, personally

High doses of sodium ascorbate Vitamin C and D3 is what I would

recommend at this point - or if you can get IV Vitamin C, I would do

that.

Sheri

At 02:52 PM 6/12/2012, you wrote:

>Thank you all for your kind words and prayers. After talking last

>night with a trusted aquaintance who used to be the county

>prosecutor, I became more fearful that they could actually take my

>child. He told me that yes, they could do it if they felt my child

>was in " imminent danger " , but he wasn't sure of the

liklihood that

>they would. He also stated that if don't feel my son is in imminent

>danger, but they wanted to pursue filing charges against me, that

>they would serve me with a civil suit and I would have to defend

>myself in court. Unfortunately if it goes that far, the county

>always has the upper hand because they would have a panel of experts

>and I would have to try and find a doctor willing to testify that

>the rabies vaccines were not medically necessary in my son's case. I

>am so upset over this whole situation and just am not willing to

>take the risk of having my son taken away from me or being charged

>with child neglect. Through many many tears (mine and my son's) we

>had the 2nd dose of the vaccine administered earlier today. I just

>finished reporting this to the County Health Department and stated

>that their implied threats forced us into having the vaccine, not

>because it is medically necessary. I was told I would be receiving a

>certified letter from them stating that they had informed me of the

>rabies disease risk and had advised us to the best of their ability.

>They are still waiting to hear back from the county prosecutor as to

>whether or not they will be moving forward with charges of child

>neglect. So it continues, but at least they won't be able to say my

>son is in danger from rabies (or his parents' neglect) for now,

>since we just got the 2nd dose today.

>

>Again, thank you all for your support and helpful recommendations.

>It means everything right now.

>

>Rhian

>

>

>

>

> >

> > Hello,

> > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a

baby

> raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made

> contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked

> eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I

> applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots

> appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at

> the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended

> the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the

> doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment,

> we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my

> husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of

> rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine

> initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day

> 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County

> Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we

> decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine

> dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I

> made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the

> type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid

> raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that

> good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water,

> plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing

> passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production,

> and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found)

> stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is

> achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered

> the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health

> Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to

> tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to

> Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than

> willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies),

> but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she

> says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take

> weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told

> me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is

> in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health

> Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the

> fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she

> would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of

> vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the

> participants achieved many time greater titer levels than

> recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses

> given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice

> or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so

> appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an

> attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much

> time as Child Protective Se>

> > Sincerely,

> > Rhian

> > Willoughby Hills, OH

> >

>

>

>

>

>------------------------------------

>

>

[Guest guest]

I am so, so sorry you're going through this. This could be any one of us in your place. I do find it curious that they would need to rewrite the policy. Are they saying their policy isn't strong enough to force you to do this now?? Can you get a copy of it?

At this point, unless this lawyer can help you, I think you would be asking for trouble not to finish the shots--the lesser of two evils. You do not want to risk them taking your child and vaccinating him with all the childhood vaccines he never got. They might be waiting to file charges if you don't go ahead with the last two. I would try giving some Ledum for the pain after the shots. Look at it as treatment for an injury, not as a vaccine. I hope something positive happens before the week is out!

Winnie

Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATEVaccinations > Right now my son is pretty emotionally traumatized. He did well > for the initial vaccine dose, but the IG shots were very > painful. So when I took him yesterday for the 2nd vaccine done > fear completely took over him and he screamed and cried > uncontrollably. I couldn't calm him for anything. So now, even > though the vaccine itself isn't all that painful of a shot, he > associates emotional trauma with it. The last thing I want to do > is to cause my child trauma of any sort, and I'm dreading the 2 > more doses we are supposed to have. I don't believe they are > necessary at all and they obviously are causing my son emotional > trauma. And at this point I believe he is at greater risk of a > vaccine reaction than rabies. None of this matters to the County > Health Department. Protocol is protocol to them and I was the > first person to ever question it in the case of a child. I was > told that they were writing new policy so this doesn't happen > again. (Great, now I made it worst for any future challengers!) > We are still waiting to see if the prosecutor's office and child > services are going to intervene... the not knowing is the worst. > Yes, we should be safe for now, since I caved and got the 2nd > vaccine dose, but what happens when it is time for the 3rd and > 4th? > > As far as my son's health history goes, he was breastfed, had > never been vaccinated, and never had any antibiotics or other > medicines before. I had given him Thuja before the first round > of shots. He had soreness at all of the injection sites, and a > small bruise due to bleeding from one of the IG shots, but no > headache or fever. I am getting some Star of Bethlehem today to > help with the emotional/phyical trauma he has endured. He hasn't > been sleeping, has been wetting the bed, and tells me many times > a day that he can't have any more shots. I'm sure some of that > is him feeling my anxiety level, but obviously he is having > residual emotional trauma. > > The next dose is ordered for Saturday...I am undecided as to > whether I will try and fight it again. I haven't been sleeping > or eating, and last night was the first time I was able to sleep > because I knew they didn't have any reason to file neglect > charges against me or take my son. I did think about going on a > "vacation", but decided that would be equally as stressful and > wouldn't help my case in the long run. I spoke with a lawyer > last night and he is on standby in case they do file charges. > > Rhian> > > > > > >> > > > Hello,> > > > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet > a baby > > > raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The > raccoon made > > > contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to > the naked > > > eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When > I > > > applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny > spots > > > appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him > checked at > > > the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately > recommended > > > the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. > Since the > > > doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin > treatment, > > > we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss > with my > > > husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose > of > > > rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine > > > initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, > and Day > > > 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the > County > > > Health Department and doing some research into the disease, > we > > > decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first > vaccine > > > dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's > exposure. I > > > made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based > on the > > > type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases > of rabid > > > raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact > that > > > good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and > water, > > > plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is > providing > > > passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody > production, > > > and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I > found) > > > stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies > often is > > > achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than > covered > > > the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the > Health > > > Department does not feel this way, and called me this > morning to > > > tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may > go to > > > Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more > than > > > willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 > (as > > > this is when his body should be starting to produce > antibodies), > > > but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY > 7 she > > > says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could > take > > > weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor > has told > > > me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his > life is > > > in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the > Health > > > Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the > > > fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even > sure she > > > would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd > dose of > > > vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the > > > participants achieved many time greater titer levels than > > > recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 > doses > > > given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any > advice > > > or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so > > > appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an > > > attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have > much > > > time as Child Protective Se>> > > > Sincerely,> > > > Rhian> > > > Willoughby Hills, OH> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >------------------------------------> > >> > >

[Guest guest]

If you have to go again for the next round, you can also give him Aconite beforehand for fear. Amy.From: Vaccinations [mailto:Vaccinations ] On Behalf Of rkzinSent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 10:24 AMVaccinations Subject: Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE Right now my son is pretty emotionally traumatized. He did well for the initial vaccine dose, but the IG shots were very painful. So when I took him yesterday for the 2nd vaccine done fear completely took over him and he screamed and cried uncontrollably. I couldn't calm him for anything. So now, even though the vaccine itself isn't all that painful of a shot, he associates emotional trauma with it. The last thing I want to do is to cause my child trauma of any sort, and I'm dreading the 2 more doses we are supposed to have. I don't believe they are necessary at all and they obviously are causing my son emotional trauma. And at this point I believe he is at greater risk of a vaccine reaction than rabies. None of this matters to the County Health Department. Protocol is protocol to them and I was the first person to ever question it in the case of a child. I was told that they were writing new policy so this doesn't happen again. (Great, now I made it worst for any future challengers!) We are still waiting to see if the prosecutor's office and child services are going to intervene... the not knowing is the worst. Yes, we should be safe for now, since I caved and got the 2nd vaccine dose, but what happens when it is time for the 3rd and 4th? As far as my son's health history goes, he was breastfed, had never been vaccinated, and never had any antibiotics or other medicines before. I had given him Thuja before the first round of shots. He had soreness at all of the injection sites, and a small bruise due to bleeding from one of the IG shots, but no headache or fever. I am getting some Star of Bethlehem today to help with the emotional/phyical trauma he has endured. He hasn't been sleeping, has been wetting the bed, and tells me many times a day that he can't have any more shots. I'm sure some of that is him feeling my anxiety level, but obviously he is having residual emotional trauma. The next dose is ordered for Saturday...I am undecided as to whether I will try and fight it again. I haven't been sleeping or eating, and last night was the first time I was able to sleep because I knew they didn't have any reason to file neglect charges against me or take my son. I did think about going on a " vacation " , but decided that would be equally as stressful and wouldn't help my case in the long run. I spoke with a lawyer last night and he is on standby in case they do file charges. Rhian> > >> > > Hello,> > > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a baby > > raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made > > contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked > > eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I > > applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots > > appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at > > the hospital. When we went the ER doctor immediately recommended > > the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the > > doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment, > > we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my > > husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of > > rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine > > initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day > > 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County > > Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we > > decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine > > dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I > > made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the > > type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed cases of rabid > > raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that > > good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water, > > plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing > > passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production, > > and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found) > > stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is > > achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered > > the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health > > Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to > > tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to > > Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than > > willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as > > this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies), > > but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she > > says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take > > weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told > > me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is > > in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health > > Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the > > fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she > > would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of > > vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the > > participants achieved many time greater titer levels than > > recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses > > given 1 month apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice > > or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so > > appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an > > attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much > > time as Child Protective Se>> > > Sincerely,> > > Rhian> > > Willoughby Hills, OH> > >> >> >> >> >> >------------------------------------> >> >

[Guest guest]

The rabies series contains a goodly amount of mercury, so give him lots of sodium ascorbate and vitamin A to clear it with lots of fluids. Maybe look into chelation later. Check the package insert. ~ Maureen R. Gradvohl ~ From: Dave & Amy Santarelli <santa6@...> Vaccinations Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 2:50 PM Subject: RE: Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE

If you have to go again for the next round, you can also give him Aconite beforehand for fear. Amy.From: Vaccinations [mailto:Vaccinations ] On Behalf Of rkzinSent: Wednesday, June 13, 2012 10:24 AMVaccinations Subject: Re: Health Department contacting County Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE Right now my son is pretty emotionally traumatized. He did well for the initial vaccine dose, but the IG shots were very painful. So when I took him yesterday for the 2nd vaccine done fear completely took over him and he screamed and cried uncontrollably. I couldn't calm him for anything. So now, even though the vaccine itself isn't all that painful of a shot, he associates emotional trauma with it. The last thing I want to do is to cause my child trauma of any sort, and I'm dreading the 2 more doses we are supposed to have. I don't believe they are necessary at all and they obviously are causing my son emotional trauma. And at this point I believe he is at greater risk of a vaccine reaction than rabies. None of this matters to the County Health Department.

Protocol is protocol to them and I was the first person to ever question it in the case of a child. I was told that they were writing new policy so this doesn't happen again. (Great, now I made it worst for any future challengers!) We are still waiting to see if the prosecutor's office and child services are going to intervene... the not knowing is the worst. Yes, we should be safe for now, since I caved and got the 2nd vaccine dose, but what happens when it is time for the 3rd and 4th? As far as my son's health history goes, he was breastfed, had never been vaccinated, and never had any antibiotics or other medicines before. I had given him Thuja before the first round of shots. He had soreness at all of the injection sites, and a small bruise due to bleeding from one of the IG shots, but no headache or fever. I am getting some Star of Bethlehem today to help with the emotional/phyical trauma he has endured. He hasn't been sleeping, has been

wetting the bed, and tells me many times a day that he can't have any more shots. I'm sure some of that is him feeling my anxiety level, but obviously he is having residual emotional trauma. The next dose is ordered for Saturday...I am undecided as to whether I will try and fight it again. I haven't been sleeping or eating, and last night was the first time I was able to sleep because I knew they didn't have any reason to file neglect charges against me or take my son. I did think about going on a "vacation", but decided that would be equally as stressful and wouldn't help my case in the long run. I spoke with a lawyer last night and he is on standby in case they do file charges. Rhian> > >> > > Hello,> > > This past Wednesday my 5 year old unvaxed son tried to pet a baby > > raccoon out at dusk. It turned tried to bite him. The raccoon made > > contact with my son's hand, but no marks were apparent to the naked > > eye. We washed his hand with soap and water thoroughly. When I > > applied iodine (antiviral) to the area a couple of tiny spots > > appeared. I was advised by a nurse-on-call to go get him checked at > > the hospital. When we went the ER

doctor immediately recommended > > the rabies series without even looking at my son's hand. Since the > > doctor said we had about 24-48 hours of window to begin treatment, > > we declined the shots and went home to research and discuss with my > > husband who had been out of town. The CDC recommends 1 dose of > > rabies Immunoglobulin along with 1 dose of rabies vaccine > > initially, followed by 3 doses of vaccine on Day 3, Day 7, and Day > > 14 following the first treatment. After speaking with the County > > Health Department and doing some research into the disease, we > > decided to get my son the IG dose as well as the first vaccine > > dose. We went to the ER within 24 hours of my son's exposure. I > > made sure to get the package inserts for later review. Based on the > > type of exposure (provoked), the number of confirmed

cases of rabid > > raccoons in the area in the past three years (0), the fact that > > good wound care is the best defense against rabies (soap and water, > > plus antiviral iodine application), that the IG dose is providing > > passive resistance while my son's body starts antibody production, > > and that the package insert (as well as a few studies I found) > > stated that an acceptable level of circulating antibodies often is > > achieved in one dose, my husband and I felt we more than covered > > the possible risk of rabies. However, the woman at the Health > > Department does not feel this way, and called me this morning to > > tell me that she had contacted the County Prosecutor who may go to > > Child Protective Services. I told her that I would be more than > > willing to have my son's antibody levels tested after Day 10 (as

> > this is when his body should be starting to produce antibodies), > > but because the CDC recommendation is doses at DAY 3 and DAY 7 she > > says there is no time wait for blood tests that also could take > > weeks to get results. A friend who was a county prosecutor has told > > me that they can take my son away from me if they feel his life is > > in danger. And the scary thing is, that the woman at the Health > > Department is acting like she is going to pursue this to the > > fullest extent of her power. At this point, I'm not even sure she > > would be satisfied if I agreed to one more dose (his 2nd dose of > > vaccine), even though the clinical trials showed 100% of the > > participants achieved many time greater titer levels than > > recommended by the World Health Organization with just 2 doses > > given 1 month

apart. Please help me protect my family! Any advice > > or names of legal advocacy groups in our area would be so > > appreciated. I had contacted NVIC and they referred me to an > > attorney familiar with vaccine rights. I don't think I have much > > time as Child Protective Se>> > > Sincerely,> > > Rhian> > > Willoughby Hills, OH> > >> >> >> >> >> >------------------------------------> >> >

[Guest guest]

Well, that's encouraging to know. Maybe eventually they'll cut it down even further.

How is your son feeling today?

Winnie Re: Health Department contacting County > Prosecutor/Child Services UPDATE> Vaccinations > > > I do have the package inserts, and the IMOVAX vaccine > > ingredients actually are pretty minimal. I don't remember > seeing > > thimerosol or aluminum, but I'll check again. Thanks!> > > > Rhian> > > > > > >> > > The rabies series contains a goodly amount of mercury, so > give > > him lots of sodium ascorbate and vitamin A to clear it with > lots > > of fluids. Â Maybe look into chelation later. Check the > package > > insert.> Â > > > ~ Maureen R. Gradvohl ~Â > > > > > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > >

[Guest guest]

Rhian,

How did it all go? Did the state back off?

Winnie

> The next dose is ordered for Saturday...I am undecided as to > whether I will try and fight it again. I haven't been sleeping > or eating, and last night was the first time I was able to sleep > because I knew they didn't have any reason to file neglect > charges against me or take my son. I did think about going on a > "vacation", but decided that would be equally as stressful and > wouldn't help my case in the long run. I spoke with a lawyer > last night and he is on standby in case they do file charges. > > Rhian