Guest guest Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 What ratio is generally recommended of milk/grains? Sincerely, Kerrie Knox On Feb 29, 2012, at 9:56 PM, " " <beaner892000@...> wrote: > By what you are describing, it sounds like, to me, that you need to remove some of the grains for your next fermentation. Since your grains have grown, they are fermenting the milk too fast, which is causing the total separation. This happens to me a lot when I don't keep an eye on how much my grains have grown. I think if you either added more milk or removed some of the grains, it should be fine. > > > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > > > Lyn > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted February 29, 2012 Report Share Posted February 29, 2012 Hi I did that today. I said I have them in two jars of milk now instead of just one. But I wish I had looked at it last night before bed because that is probably when the grains exploded. I did not notice the amount having grown much when I strained the grains yesterday morning, so I just put them back into the one jar as I had been since starting out with these. But I think the night was warmer last night, so the house temp didn't drop and so the heat built under that box overnight and the grains grew real fast and they dried out by morning today. That's what they look like. All dried out and stuck together. I broke it up some to get them back into jars. I just wonder if they don't look better by morning, if I should go to the farm and ask for some heavy cream to add to the milk or something such as that. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> By what you are describing, it sounds like, to me, that you need to remove some of the grains for your next fermentation. Since your grains have grown, they are fermenting the milk too fast, which is causing the total separation. This happens to me a lot when I don't keep an eye on how much my grains have grown. I think if you either added more milk or removed some of the grains, it should be fine. > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > Lyn > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and the temp outside. That's not too hot. I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to check texture, but it appears they are recovering. This is nerve racking to me. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> I did see you had made 2 jars, but it sounds like it is fermenting too fast. Adding cream won't make a difference. You also may want to remove the heat source. You may be right that it got too warm. It being too warm can make the grains more active and ferment even faster. I just set mine into one of my cabinets on the shelf, even if my apartment is rather cold, and it always ferments fine. So, unless your house is very, very cold, I would try it without the heat source and see if that corrects it. > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > > > Lyn > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Hi Lyn, I havent been doing the Kefir thing that long (Since this past November), but in my opinion you are babying (and over thinking) your grains a little much. They are studier than you think. I use only store bought whole and 1% milk (hard to get fresh from cow/goat) and, they sit in back corner of my kitchen cabinet. This winter (if you really want to call it that), our house is never warmer than 65 degrees and my grains are kicking butt. When I went on a two week vacation, into the fridge they went. When we got back, I pulled them out, strained them and placed them in new milk and off they took off like they had never stopped. They never have slowed down. I make 2 quarts of wonderful kefir per day and have smoothies for breakfast and lunch most days. I typically split my grains every 2-3 days. Good Luck, On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 11:50 AM, <ly.ninwv@...> wrote: > I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble > and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains > since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act > any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more > viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just > learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't > expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp > and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and > the temp outside. That's not too hot. > > I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, > in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in > both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to > check texture, but it appears they are recovering. > > This is nerve racking to me. > > Lyn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: " " <beaner892000@...> > > I did see you had made 2 jars, but it sounds like it is fermenting too > fast. Adding cream won't make a difference. You also may want to remove the > heat source. You may be right that it got too warm. It being too warm can > make the grains more active and ferment even faster. I just set mine into > one of my cabinets on the shelf, even if my apartment is rather cold, and > it always ferments fine. So, unless your house is very, very cold, I would > try it without the heat source and see if that corrects it. > > > > > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my > grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been > doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called > her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. > Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated > into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar > was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. > Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would > break that mass up much. > > > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned > box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of > coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her > today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp > in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them > back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. > They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of > milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk > too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same > when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be > doing? > > > > > > Lyn > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 >I havent been doing the Kefir thing that long (Since this past November), but in my opinion you are babying (and over thinking) your grains a little much. They are studier than you think.< You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment more than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) >I use only store bought whole and 1% milk (hard to get fresh from cow/goat) and, they sit in back corner of my kitchen cabinet. This winter (if you really want to call it that), our house is never warmer than 65 degrees and my grains are kicking butt. When I went on a two week vacation, into the fridge they went. When we got back, I pulled them out, strained them and placed them in new milk and off they took off like they had never stopped. They never have slowed down.< Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be as easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for me. Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a year. I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they will be all rehydrated tomorrow. Lyn On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 11:50 AM, < ly.ninwv@... > wrote: > I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble > and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains > since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act > any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more > viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just > learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't > expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp > and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and > the temp outside. That's not too hot. > > I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, > in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in > both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to > check texture, but it appears they are recovering. > > This is nerve racking to me. > > Lyn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: " " < beaner892000@... > > > I did see you had made 2 jars, but it sounds like it is fermenting too > fast. Adding cream won't make a difference. You also may want to remove the > heat source. You may be right that it got too warm. It being too warm can > make the grains more active and ferment even faster. I just set mine into > one of my cabinets on the shelf, even if my apartment is rather cold, and > it always ferments fine. So, unless your house is very, very cold, I would > try it without the heat source and see if that corrects it. > > > > > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my > grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been > doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called > her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. > Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated > into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar > was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. > Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would > break that mass up much. > > > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned > box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of > coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her > today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp > in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them > back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. > They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of > milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk > too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same > when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be > doing? > > > > > > Lyn > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 ...It might depend on the types of yeasts and bacteria you have but my ratio is two Tsp of grains for one quart and one TBS for a half gallon and I strain every 24 hours. Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma What ratio is generally recommended of milk/grains? Sincerely, Kerrie Knox On Feb 29, 2012, at 9:56 PM, " " <beaner892000@...> wrote: > By what you are describing, it sounds like, to me, that you need to remove some of the grains for your next fermentation. Since your grains have grown, they are fermenting the milk too fast, which is causing the total separation. This happens to me a lot when I don't keep an eye on how much my grains have grown. I think if you either added more milk or removed some of the grains, it should be fine. > > > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > > > Lyn > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 I do a tablespoon of grains for 1/2 gallon and it gets me 48 hours of ferment time. Al Re: Grains dilemma I believe it's about a Tablespoon per cup of milk. Although, I do a little less...I guess my grains are super active. > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > > > > > Lyn > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 I would say that is way too warm to culture your grains unless you want to do it several times a day. My kitchen is usually about 64-66 degrees and I strain my kefir every 48 hours. Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and the temp outside. That's not too hot. I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to check texture, but it appears they are recovering. This is nerve racking to me. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> I did see you had made 2 jars, but it sounds like it is fermenting too fast. Adding cream won't make a difference. You also may want to remove the heat source. You may be right that it got too warm. It being too warm can make the grains more active and ferment even faster. I just set mine into one of my cabinets on the shelf, even if my apartment is rather cold, and it always ferments fine. So, unless your house is very, very cold, I would try it without the heat source and see if that corrects it. > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would break that mass up much. > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be doing? > > > > Lyn > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 It sounds like you have one gigantic kefir grain. Break it up into 1 TBS sections and put it into separate quart jars and add milk and see what happens...you will have lots of kefir!!! Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma >I havent been doing the Kefir thing that long (Since this past November), but in my opinion you are babying (and over thinking) your grains a little much. They are studier than you think.< You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment more than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) >I use only store bought whole and 1% milk (hard to get fresh from cow/goat) and, they sit in back corner of my kitchen cabinet. This winter (if you really want to call it that), our house is never warmer than 65 degrees and my grains are kicking butt. When I went on a two week vacation, into the fridge they went. When we got back, I pulled them out, strained them and placed them in new milk and off they took off like they had never stopped. They never have slowed down.< Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be as easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for me. Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a year. I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they will be all rehydrated tomorrow. Lyn On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 11:50 AM, < ly.ninwv@... > wrote: > I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble > and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains > since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act > any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more > viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just > learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't > expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp > and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and > the temp outside. That's not too hot. > > I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, > in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in > both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to > check texture, but it appears they are recovering. > > This is nerve racking to me. > > Lyn > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: " " < beaner892000@... > > > I did see you had made 2 jars, but it sounds like it is fermenting too > fast. Adding cream won't make a difference. You also may want to remove the > heat source. You may be right that it got too warm. It being too warm can > make the grains more active and ferment even faster. I just set mine into > one of my cabinets on the shelf, even if my apartment is rather cold, and > it always ferments fine. So, unless your house is very, very cold, I would > try it without the heat source and see if that corrects it. > > > > > > > > > > I am just trying to get more ideas to my recent dilemma with my > grains. I got these grains locally just over 2 weeks ago and they have been > doing good, according to my talk with the lady farmer yesterday. I called > her just to see how I was doing with them and she said all sounded good. > Today I was totally surprised by what they turned into. It was separated > into curds and whey the most I have seen yet. Over half the qt mason jar > was whey. But when I put my spatula in to stir, the curds were solid. > Completely solid. No amount of stirring and cutting with the spatula would > break that mass up much. > > > > > > My setup is that I have a mug warmer providing heat under an upturned > box a foot square and my mason jar is in there along with a closed jar of > coconut oil that I want to stay liquid. Dawn is her name and I called her > today and she said that probably my grains just dried out because the temp > in the house did not drop much last night. She just told me to get them > back into milk and give them a frequent stir to get them hydrated again. > They also grew overnight and I have them separated now into two jars of > milk cuz I thot maybe the massive growth that took place fermented the milk > too fast and I should have poured it off before I went to bed. > > > > > > I have stirred 3 times now since noon, but they still feel the same > when I stir. Does anyone else have any ideas as to anything else I could be > doing? > > > > > > Lyn > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Hmmmm. I don't think anyone really knows. I have been pouring mine off of these new grains every 24 hrs except for this last straining. That one was more like 30+ hrs and the milk wasn't really turned yet. Only the whey was separated. But I was happy when I saw that much. This is the best I can do with heat since I don't have a thermostatic heat source under the box. My house is in the 50ish temp range, so I have to have a heat source for my kefir (and kombucha). Lyn Re: Re: Grains dilemma I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and the temp outside. That's not too hot. I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to check texture, but it appears they are recovering. This is nerve racking to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Hi Lyn, Wasnt trying to berate you or slam what you are doing. My main meaning is that kefir is like many houseplants. If you water them ever day and move them change things up, they will die or in other words, they are killed with kindness. I look at my kefir like I do my orchids, with the exception or a little water and fertilizer, I do nothing and they look beautiful. And that's basically what I do with my kefir. I put in milk and plac eon the cabinet, strain it and a start over. No heroic measure. If I dont strain my grains after a day, I will two thirds or jar of way and a 2-4' blob on top. I take a metal spoon, stir it up and then strain. It will seem really watery when I put in the fridge, but the next morning it's great. When you say you never see a ferment more than thick milk, isnt that what kefir is? Or maybe I am not making kefir as a overly thick milk like consistancy is what I get eacha nd ever day. On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 2:49 PM, <ly.ninwv@...> wrote: > You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all > sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment more > than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past > that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they > become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) > Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be as > easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for me. > > Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a > year. > > I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I > had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they > will be all rehydrated tomorrow. > > Lyn > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Lyn ... how close is the kefir to the KT? Apparently they can cross contaminate ... also my understanding is when you see pockets of whey it is time to pull the grains. I put mine in the fridge and it thickens nicely over the next 24 plus hours. Jaxi On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 7:22 PM, <ly.ninwv@...> wrote: > Hmmmm. I don't think anyone really knows. > > I have been pouring mine off of these new grains every 24 hrs except for > this last straining. That one was more like 30+ hrs and the milk wasn't > really turned yet. Only the whey was separated. But I was happy when I saw > that much. > > This is the best I can do with heat since I don't have a thermostatic heat > source under the box. My house is in the 50ish temp range, so I have to > have a heat source for my kefir (and kombucha). > > Lyn > > Re: Re: Grains dilemma > > I'm afraid to go without heat because last winter I had alot of trouble > and then my grains eventually disappeared. This is my third set of grains > since last Feb and not even summer temps would make my second grains act > any different than my first grains. These third grains seem to be more > viable and I started them out with heat two weeks ago. I'm only just > learning to make kefir now with grains that seem viable. I just didn't > expect this wrench to be thrown into the works. I've been checking the temp > and it only gets between 80 and 85, depending on the time of day here and > the temp outside. That's not too hot. > > I've been checking and stirring often since yesterday and now I can say, > in the last hour, I now see good stuff. It is starting to separate whey in > both jars. This is since about 10:30 am. I haven't pulled out any grain to > check texture, but it appears they are recovering. > > This is nerve racking to me. > > > ------------------------------------ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 Yes I agree ... thick but still pourable. It won't get as thick as store bought stuff because I am pretty sure they add things to it to make it thicker. Gar gums or stuff like that. My kefir seems to thrive on benign neglect as well ... as do my orchids. :-) Jaxi On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 8:04 PM, on <opiewan@...> wrote: > Hi Lyn, > > Wasnt trying to berate you or slam what you are doing. My main meaning is > that kefir is like many houseplants. If you water them ever day and move > them change things up, they will die or in other words, they are killed > with kindness. I look at my kefir like I do my orchids, with the exception > or a little water and fertilizer, I do nothing and they look beautiful. > And that's basically what I do with my kefir. I put in milk and plac eon > the cabinet, strain it and a start over. No heroic measure. If I dont > strain my grains after a day, I will two thirds or jar of way and a 2-4' > blob on top. I take a metal spoon, stir it up and then strain. It will > seem really watery when I put in the fridge, but the next morning it's > great. > > When you say you never see a ferment more than thick milk, isnt that what > kefir is? Or maybe I am not making kefir as a overly thick milk like > consistancy is what I get eacha nd ever day. > > > > On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 2:49 PM, <ly.ninwv@...> wrote: > > > You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all > > sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment > more > > than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past > > that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they > > become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) > > Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be > as > > easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for > me. > > > > Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a > > year. > > > > I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I > > had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they > > will be all rehydrated tomorrow. > > > > Lyn > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 1, 2012 Report Share Posted March 1, 2012 ----- Original Message ----- From: " on " <opiewan@...> >When you say you never see a ferment more than thick milk, isnt that what kefir is? Or maybe I am not making kefir as a overly thick milk like consistancy is what I get eacha nd ever day.< My current grains have given me separated whey every day. My two sets last year only gave me curds and whey separation one time for each set of grains. The rest of the time I just had thick milk. And neither of those grains ever EVER grew or multiplied, and nobody knew why. My Tbs of grains never got bigger. Lots of people had suggestions through the year, but nothing new that I tried of anyone's suggestions changed anything. So I never got to ferment more than 2 c at a time. Now I am doing 2 qts, between yesterday and today. I still have alot of head junk to get over, too. Someone told me one day that I smelled of spoiled sour milk. My best friend criticized me continually saying things like maybe you just shouldn't be making kefir. And what are you gonna do when you find a job and your life gets busy? And compiled stuff like that. It's hard when the people closest to you think you're NUTS being on the road for my health that I am on. I'll just be somewhat of a nervous wreck for probably another month until I am inundated with grains and kefir and know for sure these will survive and thrive for me. Then I'll be stressed because I won't know what to do with all my extra grains and kefir. :-} My kombucha, which I started at the exact same time last year, has given me constant trouble, too. But I keep at this stuff because it's gotta work out sometime, right? My kefir seems to be on the right track now at the start of year two. Lyn On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 2:49 PM, < ly.ninwv@... > wrote: > You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all > sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment more > than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past > that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they > become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) > Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be as > easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for me. > > Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a > year. > > I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I > had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they > will be all rehydrated tomorrow. > > Lyn > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 The mug warmer does not sit under the kefir. It has its own place separately under the box. I put a second box inside the first one last night to see if it would build more heat and I could run that warmer less, but it doesn't seem to have done that. The temp was still only 70 this morning. And I don't have a spare cupboard. In a former life I would have, but not nearly in this one. I miss the kitchen cabinets I used to have. I take iodine and that is a challenge to get down because it is bitter. This week I tried it in kombucha in a shot glass and it was easy to take that way. Today I put iodine into my cup of kefir and mixed it in and there was no taste that way either. I wanted to share this if anyone might find it useful. I now wonder if I should try mixing my scoop of MSM into kefir. That's another thing that is hard to take. Maybe I will start out small and work up to my normal dose. ;-) Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> Maybe try setting your grains in the corner of a shelf in a cabinet and have the heat source just somewhere on the shelf rather than being under it. Maybe the heat going right up through the box you have over it and into the jar is too intense and making the temp a little bit too warm. So, maybe if you try just putting the heat source a little ways away, it will just warm that shelf of your cabinet overall, which will make it higher than the 50 degrees in your house, but not so hot that it will ferment too fast. 80-85 degrees is not too hot to make kefir, but it will make kefir ferment rather fast at that temperature. See if you can get your kefir to stay around 70 degrees or so. I know it is frustrating, but I'm sure if you keep experimenting, you will find what works for you and then, kefir making will be smooth sailing from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Lyn, You keep what you are doing to improve your health. Your friend has no idea what you feel like and your conditions. I you are on the right track and it is very much a learning process. I had someone in my in-lawful family say to me that I do all this health stuff and I am always sick and they eat whatever and are never sick. Well, they are sicker than they think. Just because they don't show symptoms doesn't mean that they are not sick. They a,so don't understand that I am trying to detox from year's worth of vaccines and a poor diet and pharmaceutical intervention. I also have 4 cavitations in my mouth from improperly removed wisdom teeth. See my post in off topics if you are not familiar. You are improving your health and and will be healthy and your friend will be sick asking for you for help in the future. I wished I could be there for my health conscious friends for help and support as I am a research fanatic. I have my specific health sources and go to them for everything. I will look elsewhere if I don't find what I am looking for or sounds weird to confirm. As far as the kefir goes, strain the kefir when you see what looks like pockets of air in the jar. That is the perfect time. When you see total separation then the grains have run out of food. Keep striving for health and don't let anyone put you down for striving to reach homeostasis. Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma ----- Original Message ----- From: " on " <opiewan@...> >When you say you never see a ferment more than thick milk, isnt that what kefir is? Or maybe I am not making kefir as a overly thick milk like consistancy is what I get eacha nd ever day.< My current grains have given me separated whey every day. My two sets last year only gave me curds and whey separation one time for each set of grains. The rest of the time I just had thick milk. And neither of those grains ever EVER grew or multiplied, and nobody knew why. My Tbs of grains never got bigger. Lots of people had suggestions through the year, but nothing new that I tried of anyone's suggestions changed anything. So I never got to ferment more than 2 c at a time. Now I am doing 2 qts, between yesterday and today. I still have alot of head junk to get over, too. Someone told me one day that I smelled of spoiled sour milk. My best friend criticized me continually saying things like maybe you just shouldn't be making kefir. And what are you gonna do when you find a job and your life gets busy? And compiled stuff like that. It's hard when the people closest to you think you're NUTS being on the road for my health that I am on. I'll just be somewhat of a nervous wreck for probably another month until I am inundated with grains and kefir and know for sure these will survive and thrive for me. Then I'll be stressed because I won't know what to do with all my extra grains and kefir. :-} My kombucha, which I started at the exact same time last year, has given me constant trouble, too. But I keep at this stuff because it's gotta work out sometime, right? My kefir seems to be on the right track now at the start of year two. Lyn On Thu, Mar 1, 2012 at 2:49 PM, < ly.ninwv@... > wrote: > You try making kefir for a year, going through two sets of grains and all > sorts of methods and never seeing grains grow, never seeing a ferment more > than thick milk, the first grains disappear and nobody could help me past > that. Then see if you don't over-think and baby the THIRD set when they > become a solid cellulose blob 3 " thick. :-) > Good for you. That appears totally normal and I've learned it should be as > easy as all that myself. But it has not even been close to that easy for me. > > Kefir - the easiest thing to ferment and I had the time of my life for a > year. > > I strained the grains and they are only half and half hydrated and dry. I > had to cut that blob up yesterday to get it out of the jar. I hope they > will be all rehydrated tomorrow. > > Lyn > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 Lyn, You might not want to mix supplements like that with your kefir as some may have the opposite effect and cancel each other out. I am currently doing the silver/aloe protocol and I was consuming a lot of kefir about an hour apart. Even though the silver is mostly absorbed by that time, I was probably canceling out some of the Silver because of consuming it too close. Now I am only drinking kefir at night until my silver /aloe protocol is finished. This will allow my body to experience the full effects of the Silver. Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma The mug warmer does not sit under the kefir. It has its own place separately under the box. I put a second box inside the first one last night to see if it would build more heat and I could run that warmer less, but it doesn't seem to have done that. The temp was still only 70 this morning. And I don't have a spare cupboard. In a former life I would have, but not nearly in this one. I miss the kitchen cabinets I used to have. I take iodine and that is a challenge to get down because it is bitter. This week I tried it in kombucha in a shot glass and it was easy to take that way. Today I put iodine into my cup of kefir and mixed it in and there was no taste that way either. I wanted to share this if anyone might find it useful. I now wonder if I should try mixing my scoop of MSM into kefir. That's another thing that is hard to take. Maybe I will start out small and work up to my normal dose. ;-) Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> Maybe try setting your grains in the corner of a shelf in a cabinet and have the heat source just somewhere on the shelf rather than being under it. Maybe the heat going right up through the box you have over it and into the jar is too intense and making the temp a little bit too warm. So, maybe if you try just putting the heat source a little ways away, it will just warm that shelf of your cabinet overall, which will make it higher than the 50 degrees in your house, but not so hot that it will ferment too fast. 80-85 degrees is not too hot to make kefir, but it will make kefir ferment rather fast at that temperature. See if you can get your kefir to stay around 70 degrees or so. I know it is frustrating, but I'm sure if you keep experimenting, you will find what works for you and then, kefir making will be smooth sailing from there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 >You keep what you are doing to improve your health. Your friend has no idea what you feel like and your conditions.< Sadly, I sure have come to know that. Even tho, she is my best friend and has always tried in her own way to understand my condition and give me advice and help. I was very sick when I started and she knew that much. But she could really only help me at the very beginning when I was having gut issues. And she had a naturopath friend she gleaned from to help me, too. So she helped me move my bowels. But, now three years later, and I know now about fermented food, I can't convince her that these things are also important. She just does not come into those conversations. I pin-holed her one day as she was trying to make me be sick yet and I wasn't sick like at the beginning anymore, so I was trying to convince her - again - that I was better. I asked her, " You don't believe I had it in me to be able to help myself, do you? " But she talked all the way around really answering that question and wouldn't answer it. But I knew what she was thinking. I had brought myself out of that depth of sickness in less than 6 months and lots of healing took place. All I was doing was drinking alkalized water and eating a clean diet. But during all that time I was healing with that regimen, she kept trying to convince me I was doing wrong. It was only because SHE would not look into the benefits of drinking alkalized water. And the things that thereafter remained wrong with me after a year of this were all because I had drank that alkalized water so long. But let me just say I have ALOT of faith in drinking healthy water! A simple thing like water. It sure convinced me that when water is in its healthiest state, it is a detoxifier. Good water will detoxify the system. She is sick herself and she has been trying to get better naturally for over 5 years and not making near the progress she should have in that time. But when I see what she eats, I know she at best, it will be a long time before she ever gets where she wants to be. Yes, this is very much a learning process and I know I am on the right track. I can't ever deny where I have come from. That's why I keep plugging away, even tho I have failures like I have been having with kefir and kombucha. They aren't really failures. They are more like false starts. Or slow starts. Or something like that. >I had someone in my in-lawful family say to me that I do all this health stuff and I am always sick and they eat whatever and are never sick.< That is what I cannot understand!!! We don't find out how utterly wrong we've been to our bodies until we start learning how to do right and then we see how horribly we have treated our bodies all our lives. I am just of a mind to believe that they ARE sick. They are just not realizing it because that's the way they have always felt so it's normal for them. >You are improving your health and and will be healthy and your friend will be sick asking for you for help in the future.< It sure would be nice if someone would take me seriously. But no one takes " this " seriously enough. Even when I got to have a conversation with someone who knows she is sick and at least started on her own journey and she thanked me for talking with her. In another conversation, she still says I am too consumed with my health. >I wished I could be there for my health conscious friends< I know what you mean. I, for one, would benefit much from some near support. The best some of us can do, tho, is join up with ! That is what I have done cuz there's no one around here that I have found yet to be friends with. >As far as the kefir goes, strain the kefir when you see what looks like pockets of air in the jar. That is the perfect time. When you see total separation then the grains have run out of food.< Hmmm. That makes sense because that would be the completion of the ferment. That is what is pretty consistent to be every 24 hours with these new grains. My grains are still " hard " and the pieces have " sharp edges " from when that cellulose blob was cut apart. But it appears to be fermenting the milk just fine so far. I still have the jars under the boxes, but I have turned the heat off. I want the ferment to go slower because I have 3 qts of kefir to use up. Now's the time I wish I had a pet. >Keep striving for health and don't let anyone put you down for striving to reach homeostasis.< Thanks for all the encouragement. It's been a really long journey and I feel really alone and under it sometimes. It helps to get lifted up by people who know how hard it really is. Even if the best we can do is text. Lyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 2, 2012 Report Share Posted March 2, 2012 >how close is the kefir to the KT? Apparently they can cross contaminate< They are at least 4' away from each other and two boxes now cover the kefir. These grains are doing just fine. I got these from a different lady and except for what happened on Tues, they are just fine. >Also my understanding is when you see pockets of whey it is time to pull the grains. I put mine in the fridge and it thickens nicely over the next 24 plus hours.< I have turned off the heat to slow the ferment because I have 3 qts of kefir to use up now. So now I will see how it ferments in cooler temps. It is 50ish in my house. Lyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 After the results I have seen just this week since getting back to using iodine, I hardly believe I am doing anything wrong. Yes, Iodine kills bacteria, but I would think that is only bad bacteria because we use it on the skin when we have wounds or rashes. So I will continue to put it into my kefir and kombucha. Lyn ----- Original Message ----- From: " " <beaner892000@...> I was going to suggest the same thing. Be careful about what you mix with your kefir. Iodine is a great antiseptic...which is great if you are wanting to kill bacteria. But, we don't want to kill the good bacteria in our kefir. I would take that at a separate time than your kefir. I know...this may seem like it is getting more complicated the more you share. I do think in time, whatever is happening will get worked out and you will figure out what works for you. I wish I had more to offer. I do know if you are getting curds and whey with no mold, your grains are probably working. It is just a matter of getting them to ferment slower. > > Lyn, > You might not want to mix supplements like that with your kefir as some may have the opposite effect and cancel each other out. I am currently doing the silver/aloe protocol and I was consuming a lot of kefir about an hour apart. Even though the silver is mostly absorbed by that time, I was probably canceling out some of the Silver because of consuming it too close. Now I am only drinking kefir at night until my silver /aloe protocol is finished. This will allow my body to experience the full effects of the Silver. > Al > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 I think they suggest at least 8 feet apart. At least from what I recall. Jaxi On Fri, Mar 2, 2012 at 9:18 PM, <ly.ninwv@...> wrote: > >how close is the kefir to the KT? Apparently they can cross > contaminate< > > They are at least 4' away from each other and two boxes now cover the > kefir. These grains are doing just fine. I got these from a different lady > and except for what happened on Tues, they are just fine. > > >Also my understanding is when you see pockets of whey it is > time to pull the grains. I put mine in the fridge and it thickens nicely > over the next 24 plus hours.< > > I have turned off the heat to slow the ferment because I have 3 qts of > kefir to use up now. So now I will see how it ferments in cooler temps. It > is 50ish in my house. > > Lyn > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 3, 2012 Report Share Posted March 3, 2012 Do you or your friend have any root canals or cavitations? That could,do be your sticking point keeping you sick. I believe I have 4 cavitations in my mouth keeping me toxic and all the detoxing in the world and perfect diet won't change that until they are removed. The healthy diet just seems to be keeping at bay. Al Re: Re: Grains dilemma >You keep what you are doing to improve your health. Your friend has no idea what you feel like and your conditions.< Sadly, I sure have come to know that. Even tho, she is my best friend and has always tried in her own way to understand my condition and give me advice and help. I was very sick when I started and she knew that much. But she could really only help me at the very beginning when I was having gut issues. And she had a naturopath friend she gleaned from to help me, too. So she helped me move my bowels. But, now three years later, and I know now about fermented food, I can't convince her that these things are also important. She just does not come into those conversations. I pin-holed her one day as she was trying to make me be sick yet and I wasn't sick like at the beginning anymore, so I was trying to convince her - again - that I was better. I asked her, " You don't believe I had it in me to be able to help myself, do you? " But she talked all the way around really answering that question and wouldn't answer it. But I knew what she was thinking. I had brought myself out of that depth of sickness in less than 6 months and lots of healing took place. All I was doing was drinking alkalized water and eating a clean diet. But during all that time I was healing with that regimen, she kept trying to convince me I was doing wrong. It was only because SHE would not look into the benefits of drinking alkalized water. And the things that thereafter remained wrong with me after a year of this were all because I had drank that alkalized water so long. But let me just say I have ALOT of faith in drinking healthy water! A simple thing like water. It sure convinced me that when water is in its healthiest state, it is a detoxifier. Good water will detoxify the system. She is sick herself and she has been trying to get better naturally for over 5 years and not making near the progress she should have in that time. But when I see what she eats, I know she at best, it will be a long time before she ever gets where she wants to be. Yes, this is very much a learning process and I know I am on the right track. I can't ever deny where I have come from. That's why I keep plugging away, even tho I have failures like I have been having with kefir and kombucha. They aren't really failures. They are more like false starts. Or slow starts. Or something like that. >I had someone in my in-lawful family say to me that I do all this health stuff and I am always sick and they eat whatever and are never sick.< That is what I cannot understand!!! We don't find out how utterly wrong we've been to our bodies until we start learning how to do right and then we see how horribly we have treated our bodies all our lives. I am just of a mind to believe that they ARE sick. They are just not realizing it because that's the way they have always felt so it's normal for them. >You are improving your health and and will be healthy and your friend will be sick asking for you for help in the future.< It sure would be nice if someone would take me seriously. But no one takes " this " seriously enough. Even when I got to have a conversation with someone who knows she is sick and at least started on her own journey and she thanked me for talking with her. In another conversation, she still says I am too consumed with my health. >I wished I could be there for my health conscious friends< I know what you mean. I, for one, would benefit much from some near support. The best some of us can do, tho, is join up with ! That is what I have done cuz there's no one around here that I have found yet to be friends with. >As far as the kefir goes, strain the kefir when you see what looks like pockets of air in the jar. That is the perfect time. When you see total separation then the grains have run out of food.< Hmmm. That makes sense because that would be the completion of the ferment. That is what is pretty consistent to be every 24 hours with these new grains. My grains are still " hard " and the pieces have " sharp edges " from when that cellulose blob was cut apart. But it appears to be fermenting the milk just fine so far. I still have the jars under the boxes, but I have turned the heat off. I want the ferment to go slower because I have 3 qts of kefir to use up. Now's the time I wish I had a pet. >Keep striving for health and don't let anyone put you down for striving to reach homeostasis.< Thanks for all the encouragement. It's been a really long journey and I feel really alone and under it sometimes. It helps to get lifted up by people who know how hard it really is. Even if the best we can do is text. Lyn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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