Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Hi Simon, that type of opportunity is few and far between in my own experience having been in the offshore Industry for ten years. The cost of the medics course/survival course/accommodation/Food is closer to 3500, I have had an NHS female nurse friend of mine just go through the above in February/March of this year. Every now and then when there is a shortage of medics you will find a company that does this. Once you get into the offshore industry you can either go through one of the main Offshore Medical Companies who emply on behalf of the Major Oil Companies, when or ticket comes up for renewal, they pay for your course etc. The other way is to go through one of the many agencies, with them it is hit or miss whether they or you pay for your refresher course, they will certainly expect a new start to have their tickets already. Regards Neil Poole FSU Soorena Medic RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Hi Simon, Northlandic.nl had an advert on their website saying they were willing to pay for people with the right qualifications to do the relevant courses. A word of warning though: the companies that initially pay for courses (usually in excess of 3000 quid) are normally the ones paying the lowest salaries and as such struggle to recruit/hold on to experienced hands. Serving a two year 'sentence' with such a company would be like a noose around your neck, some of them pay a good 10 or 15 grand a year less than the more reputable companies. Best regards, Bill RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Talking of which Neil, Mick the guy coming out to your place next week is a mate of mine he did the same last year, self funded and then found it a struggle to get work, lets hope Atlantic can keep him busy..... Look after the wee bairn... :-) Best Wishes Ian Listowner RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Hi Simon, Unfortunately I don't know of anyone sponsoring guys through courses at present, but as is normal for our industry it is feast or famine. That having been said you are at least in the right forum to pose the question and someone may be able to help There are also a few underlying points to ponder over, NMM are in reality and agency concerned primarily with oil field support shipping, pipe layers, survey boats etc etc with some rig work thrown in for good measure. As such the practice of sponsoring people through courses when they need them is entirely normal for this kind of operation however when they don't need people they hold off, but keep getting you to phone back at your expense " just in case " Sometimes you get lucky sometimes not. Its basically a reactive industry, an oil company contracts a boat, it doesn't have a medic, NMM contract a medic.... etc etc I think this also follows on from two other factors, the first is that 2002 has not met predictions for exploration (according to Bassoe Consultants) which means if not as many rigs are working there isn't as many jobs to go around hence the small but perceptible slump in the offshore medic job market. Add into the equation the factor of the training organisations themselves, last year saw a peak of work and the training centres were turning out new starts like it was going out of fashion, flooding and already competitive market with an extra burden. Often this was based on empty promises of work etc. I know of at least one guy who took his course in the middle of last summer and has only had 2 spells offshore since, with nothing since Christmas. Unfortunately the training orgs are in it for one thing, money, i.e. taking your two grand off of you, they are concerned with neither the quality of people being turned out nor the volume, or for that matter the effect they have on the industry as a whole. I think this was also backed up by one of the organisations last year interpreting the HSE guideline to their own gain and (anecdotally I admit) training guys who weren't really suitable. Unfortunately all these factors have a far more reaching effect than people initially believe, and will effect recruitment across the board not just by NMM. I like you had to self fund through my first medic course and on the whole I'm glad I did, but like many others I had a pretty tense few weeks where I had no job to go to at all, but at least as RGN if you do go for it you'll have a fall back of doing bank work when the oil industry has one of its periodic slumps. I luck at present as I now work for one of the more reputable medical provision companies but still get twitchy when contract time comes up, its couple of months here and a couple of months there, despite my employers good reputation I am under no illusion that they would drop me like a brick if the client decided they didn't need us. Unfortunately our business is a bit mercenary and loyalty is certainly not rewarded. Like the rest of the job market the medic industry has more bodies than it has places to fill. Some manage to stay working some don't. Not much help to you with your present dilemma, but certainly some points for thought for everyone..... Best Wishes Ian Listowner RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 No Problems, he has missed the fun, an Iranian chopper went down about 20 miles North of us this morning, 1 Survivor found and 2 dead, do not know how many still missing Neil RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Contact or Graeme at the following or got to the wed site Tony M T e l e p h o n e : + 4 4 (0) 1 7 7 2 8 6 2 9 9 9 F a c s i m i l e : + 4 4 (0) 1 7 7 2 8 6 3 1 1 3 E - m a i l : a d m i n @ o i l f i e l d m e d i c s . c o m W e b s i t e : w w w . o i l f i e l d m e d i c s . c o m Owner@... wrote: Talking of which Neil, Mick the guy coming out to your place next week is a mate of mine he did the same last year, self funded and then found it a struggle to get work, lets hope Atlantic can keep him busy..... Look after the wee bairn... :-) Best Wishes Ian Listowner RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Dear Ian, Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't make the grade. The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than consideration of the best candidate for the role. As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar costly outlays. Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for a Training Organisation I wonder!? Regards Alan Hurry RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Just on a side note here, but has anyone ever attended an Offshore medics course and had a classmate fail ???. I have not heard of any !! Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via London 020 74878100 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > Dear Ian, > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > make the grade. > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > costly outlays. > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > Regards > Alan Hurry > > RE work offshore > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > employ > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > and > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > the > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money > back. > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > decided > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > earnings I > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > step at > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > ticket. > > Any advice gratefully received, > > Thanks in advance, > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > FAW > Instructor. > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > Post message: egroups > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 , not for a long time, but there have been people who have failed in the past. Finally getting to go home on Tuesday after 7 weeks Neil Poole FSU Soorena Medic Re: RE work offshore > > Dear Ian, > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > make the grade. > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > costly outlays. > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > Regards > Alan Hurry > > RE work offshore > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > employ > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > and > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > the > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money > back. > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > decided > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > earnings I > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > step at > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > ticket. > > Any advice gratefully received, > > Thanks in advance, > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > FAW > Instructor. > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > Post message: egroups > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Neil, Congratulations, How is Nick doing will he be back out there ??. Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via London 020 74878100 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > > > Dear Ian, > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the > money! > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision > of > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > > make the grade. > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are > required > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is > contained > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we > know > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would > be > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your > colleagues > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > > costly outlays. > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see > marked > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one > of > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working > for > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > Regards > > Alan Hurry > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with > a > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > employ > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > and > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > the > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > > back. > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > decided > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > earnings I > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > step at > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > ticket. > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > FAW > > Instructor. > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > Post message: egroups > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Hi Alan, Thank you for your comments and I'm sorry if you take exception to my post but without wishing to appear rude, Its got to be said that money is the main motivator for the particular organisations I am speaking of it is certainly not for any other reason. As you quite rightly say we are ALL in it for the money in one way or another. While we are discussing it though my comments were actually aimed at those companies providing HSE Offshore Medic Training Courses, the ones that cost upwards of two grand a shot. Without naming and shaming there was one last year who was found to be a little bit too flexible in interpreting the HSE guidelines on who should or should not be accepted for training. Hence turning out guys to go offshore who were in no way prepared for what to expect and are somewhat unsuited for their new career. Another example is a recent refresher course where the candidates were not even examined.... I may not be the brightest bulb in the pack but to me both these practices seemed concerned with money rather than quality........ On a personal note, I have no knowledge of your particular training organisation or even which company you manage. I am though heartened by your statement that some candidates do not make the grade, if only all the other trainers followed your example. You being closely involved in training I'm sure you know one or two who are not necessarily as conscientious as you. The examples are unfortunately numerous and I have many more but would end up rambling all day, It is yet another sad fact that until the offshore medic becomes an profession in its own right with a regulating body made up of people who a) care about what we do and know slightly more than one iota about the industry this is going to always be the situation we will find ourselves in. Any kind of professional body needs representatives from those that do the job on a daily basis. You are however, correct in your assumption that I don't work for free, aside from when I am out on the lifeboat (RNLI Volunteer crew) or community responding, (Again voluntary) yes I am handsomely paid for what I do, but the important factor here is that I care about the quality of my work hence spending well in excess of 2.5 K in the last 12 months on personal development and training, and that's excluding the impact on my family time or the cost of numerous books, travel and attachments etc, or for that matter the time and effort I put into our website and discussion group. You are correct I am in for the money but I like to think I also put a little back. I do however stand by my original comments, yes I was probably wrong to make a blanket statement as I am well aware there are good and bad training providers out there, but I would rather make that blanket statement than name individual companies and list their faults, for the obvious reasons. I admit most of my <cynical> views are through the eyes of the student but I have also been on the other side of the fence, It wasn't many years ago I was on the teaching staff of one of the Aberdeen based companies, and I realise how constrained you sometimes are, but those constraints are not an excuse for a) accepting candidates who are not suitable in the first place and not weeding out those who don't make the grade, it is a sad but true statement that these are both real life examples of recent practices by two separate companies. Which leads me back to what I said earlier, maybe more of them should follow the example set by your company...... With regard for your motives for joining the site, let me say they are indeed admirable and I hope you continue to express your opinions, as far as I am aware you are the only representative of any of the offshore training providers on the list at all. I have on numerous occasions tried to recruit the senior instructors of those from the two big companies but so far to no avail. We have a lot of good people on the list and a wide variety of opinions, and it is good to see them being expressed, debate and interaction are two of the primary reasons I devote so much time to keep the list and the website going. An offshore / remote medic can be a lonely position and this forum gives us the opportunity to air our thoughts and grievances even if mine are sometimes of a slightly cynical nature, those members on the list that know me well will tell you that is just the way I am, (Mr. Eglin don't say a word!!!) but speaking the truth I care a great deal about my profession and I find it somewhat frustrating when I perceive what can only be described as undermining our professionalism. Finally I will leave Simon to voice his own opinion on working for one of the companies as a trainer but as the RTO for one of the busier rescue boats in this country I would suspect he's already been there done that and probably got the t-shirt! Best Wishes Ian Listowner --------------------- Ian Sharpe ISOS Paramedic Tel. + 44 (0)705 0044 385 Re: RE work offshore Dear Ian, Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't make the grade. The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than consideration of the best candidate for the role. As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar costly outlays. Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for a Training Organisation I wonder!? Regards Alan Hurry RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Hopefully in six weeks time, he will be ready to come back Neil Re: RE work offshore > > > > Dear Ian, > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the > money! > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision > of > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > > make the grade. > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are > required > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is > contained > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we > know > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would > be > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your > colleagues > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > > costly outlays. > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see > marked > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one > of > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working > for > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > Regards > > Alan Hurry > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with > a > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > employ > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > and > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > the > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > > back. > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > decided > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > earnings I > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > step at > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > ticket. > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > FAW > > Instructor. > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > Post message: egroups > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Ian, I am astounded to hear that personnel are not been tested on courses, I have just recently gone through my refresher training in Aberdeen (March)and was definetly examined on three accounts. 1. Written ATLS Paper 2. ATLS Practical 3. 45 minute questioning by a doctor. Like you I am a believer in increasing and maintaining my medical skills, in the past 18 months I have spent nearly 4K trying to be the best professional medical provider that I can, yet sometimes I wonder if it is worth while the way we are in general treated. My heart got pumping this morning when I was informed that an Iranian owned chopper had ditched some 20 Miles North of us into the Arabian Gulf. The news is not good, so far 1 survivor, 2 dead and an unknown number unaccounted for. The survivor was lucky that an American Warship was close by and was able to help. Regards Neil Poole FSU Soorena Arabian Gulf Re: RE work offshore Dear Ian, Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't make the grade. The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than consideration of the best candidate for the role. As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar costly outlays. Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for a Training Organisation I wonder!? Regards Alan Hurry RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Alan, If I May be so bold, can I ask which company it is you are with? Feel free to decline if you'd rather but there was a discussion back in March (before you joined) that relates to the Standby industry and you may find it interesting. IIRC Rice started the thread but I'd need to check the archives to go back and find exactly what it was about but IIRC it was something to do with fluids and shock. By the way for anyone that is interested all group messages are archived at /messages Should anyone ever want to read the old posting..... Best Wishes Ian Re: RE work offshore Dear Ian, Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't make the grade. The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than consideration of the best candidate for the role. As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar costly outlays. Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for a Training Organisation I wonder!? Regards Alan Hurry RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 What mail order brides now, wed site? With a grin JC RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 I regularly teach and assess on medics courses. I know of a couple of people recently who have recieved certificates of attendance only. I can't vouch for other agencies but our standards seem to be more than adequate. As an assessor I am more than happy to give people second and even third chances, but have no hesitation in failing someone if they don't come up to scratch. I don't fail them outright at first, I refer them to another assessor for a second opinion and then following a discussion about their performance will procede from there. I have no hesitation in failing candidates if they can't give safe, promp and effective treatment to the casualty and indeed I have failed people in the past. It's not very nice and the candidate is naturally not very happy but they always have the option of resitting at a later date. What I always keep in mind is, if it was someone close to me would I be happy with the treatment being given. At the end of the day not everyone is a superstar during assessment, I certainly wasn't, but I've worked really hard to hone my skills. You don't have to be the best but you have to be competent at least. So overall in answer to your question, yes people do fail but you won't find out unless they tell you. Would you be happy to tell a load of strangers that you had failed! By the way some of them are resits not first timers. Regards Arlene " Brash, \\ Lines, Gavin (amed2) " <amed2@...> wrote: Just on a side note here, but has anyone ever attended an Offshore medics course and had a classmate fail ???. I have not heard of any !! Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via London 020 74878100 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > Dear Ian, > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the money! > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision of > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > make the grade. > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are required > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is contained > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we know > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would be > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your colleagues > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > costly outlays. > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see marked > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one of > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > Regards > Alan Hurry > > RE work offshore > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > employ > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > and > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > the > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money > back. > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > decided > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > earnings I > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > step at > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > ticket. > > Any advice gratefully received, > > Thanks in advance, > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > FAW > Instructor. > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > Post message: egroups > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 11, 2002 Report Share Posted May 11, 2002 Arlene, Point taken, but I think you are assessing for one of the more reputable companies, having taken the full course at both Aberdeen ( this year) and others in England in the past I can tell you that they are not all of the same ILK..., Passing with some is a formality. Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via London 020 74878100 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > > > Dear Ian, > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the > money! > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision > of > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > > make the grade. > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are > required > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is > contained > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we > know > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would > be > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your > colleagues > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > > costly outlays. > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see > marked > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one > of > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > Regards > > Alan Hurry > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > employ > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > and > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > the > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money > > back. > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > decided > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > earnings I > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > step at > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > ticket. > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > FAW > > Instructor. > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > Post message: egroups > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2002 Report Share Posted May 12, 2002 Hi Arlene glad you took up the reins with this as I was about to! How are you doing? Kim >From: Arlene McDermott <arlenemcd@...> >Reply- > >Subject: RE: RE work offshore >Date: Sat, 11 May 2002 21:06:56 +0100 (BST) > > > >I regularly teach and assess on medics courses. I know of a couple of >people recently who have recieved certificates of attendance only. I can't >vouch for other agencies but our standards seem to be more than adequate. >As an assessor I am more than happy to give people second and even third >chances, but have no hesitation in failing someone if they don't come up to >scratch. I don't fail them outright at first, I refer them to another >assessor for a second opinion and then following a discussion about their >performance will procede from there. >I have no hesitation in failing candidates if they can't give safe, promp >and effective treatment to the casualty and indeed I have failed people in >the past. It's not very nice and the candidate is naturally not very happy >but they always have the option of resitting at a later date. What I always >keep in mind is, if it was someone close to me would I be happy with the >treatment being given. >At the end of the day not everyone is a superstar during assessment, I >certainly wasn't, but I've worked really hard to hone my skills. You don't >have to be the best but you have to be competent at least. >So overall in answer to your question, yes people do fail but you won't >find out unless they tell you. Would you be happy to tell a load of >strangers that you had failed! By the way some of them are resits not first >timers. > >Regards >Arlene > > > " Brash, \\ Lines, Gavin (amed2) " <amed2@...> wrote: >Just on a side note here, but has anyone ever attended an Offshore medics >course and had a classmate fail ???. I have not heard of any !! > > > > Brash >Senior Nurse Supervisor >International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company >e-mail: Amed2@... >Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 >Via London 020 74878100 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > > > Re: RE work offshore > > > > Dear Ian, > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the >money! > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision >of > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who don't > > make the grade. > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are >required > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence etc. > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is >contained > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we >know > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid process > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would >be > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our profit > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your >colleagues > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur similar > > costly outlays. > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see >marked > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one >of > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet as > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working for > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > Regards > > Alan Hurry > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > employ > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > and > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > the > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money > > back. > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > decided > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > earnings I > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > step at > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > ticket. > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > FAW > > Instructor. > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > Post message: egroups > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2002 Report Share Posted May 12, 2002 I have obviously hit a raw nerve. It might be interesting if you ladies would take your refreshers at another training establishment and judge for yourself. Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via Aberdeen 01224 334000 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > > > > > Dear Ian, > > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the > >money! > > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision > > >of > > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who > don't > > > make the grade. > > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are > >required > > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence > etc. > > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is > >contained > > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we > >know > > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid > process > > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would > > >be > > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our > profit > > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your > >colleagues > > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur > similar > > > costly outlays. > > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see > >marked > > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one > > >of > > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet > as > > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working > for > > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > > Regards > > > Alan Hurry > > > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > > employ > > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > > and > > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > > the > > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > > > back. > > > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > > decided > > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > > earnings I > > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > > step at > > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > > ticket. > > > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > > FAW > > > Instructor. > > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > > > Post message: egroups > > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 12, 2002 Report Share Posted May 12, 2002 No , not a raw nerve. I'm relatively new to the offshore world and I don't have any experience with other companies. From what some of our candidates tell us though I can well believe you are perfectly correct. I have heard some horror stories. In fact, I wonder how some people that come to us from other companies ever passed first time around! No names mentioned.(No name, no pack drill! Am I getting the terminology right.) Arlene " Brash, \\ Lines, Gavin (amed2) " <amed2@...> wrote: I have obviously hit a raw nerve. It might be interesting if you ladies would take your refreshers at another training establishment and judge for yourself. Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via Aberdeen 01224 334000 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > > > > > Dear Ian, > > > Sorry, but as the Managing Director of a Training Organisation, I take > > > exception at your blanket viewpoint that we are only in it for the > >money! > > > Whilst we do not train to Medic level we are involved in the provision > > >of > > > Advanced First Aid skills for the Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel > > > industry and can assure you that there are numerous candidates who > don't > > > make the grade. > > > The standards of training required are set by Industry and we are > >required > > > to adhere to those levels when conducting assessment of competence > etc. > > > As a training provider we have very little influence on what is > >contained > > > within those standards and at times are obliged to go against what we > >know > > > to be appropriate but still make a concerted effort to lobby those in > > > authority at every opportunity. I would agree that a more rigid > process > > > of selection based on generalities such as aptitude and attitude would > > >be > > > preferable but it is, as you say, more often the case that a position > > > needs to be filled in order to satisfy a contract rather than > > > consideration of the best candidate for the role. > > > As regards the money that we make for our services I assume that you > > > aren't working for free either! A considerable proportion of our > profit > > > margin is allocated to staff development and like you and your > >colleagues > > > our RGN's are required to enhance and update skills which incur > similar > > > costly outlays. > > > Believe it or not there are Training organisations who wish to see > >marked > > > improvements in the level of safety and service offshore which was one > > >of > > > the reasons that I subscribed to this site in the first place! > > > I hope that Simon is successful in his goal and given his range of > > > qualifications I'm sure he will be regardless of the competition. Even > > > after numerous indications to the contrary in my career, I'm not yet > as > > > cynical to think that there aren't still some companies out there who > > > employ on the basis of quality. Would Simon be interested in working > for > > > a Training Organisation I wonder!? > > > Regards > > > Alan Hurry > > > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a > > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > > > employ > > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > > > and > > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > > > the > > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > > > back. > > > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > > > decided > > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > > earnings I > > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > > > step at > > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > > > ticket. > > > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > > > FAW > > > Instructor. > > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > > > Post message: egroups > > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Ian, Please be as bold as you wish and thank you for the information about the discussions held back in March. We are that company - Maritime Rescue International in Stonehaven that it appears most everyone has little or no respect for given those communications I have managed to read so far! Once I have had the opportunity to read them all through I will no doubt have more to say in our defence! To be going on with however, has neglected to mention a few things about the situation which I would hope might shed new light on the argument and perhaps put our viewpoint into perspective. No member of MRI advocated or called for the removal of 14g & 16g Canulae from SBV's. We raised an ethical concern over the suggested usage of these items by relatively untrained personnel onboard vessels in potentially less than favourable conditions. The fact remains that SBV Advanced " First Aiders " are no more than that. Their total training amounts to 5 days basic training followed by 5 days of Advanced skills of which we can devote approximately 2 hrs to cannulation training on a prosthetic arm in a classroom environment. This is governed by the present training standards which we as a Training centre have called into question with the Industry Association and are actively seeking a review of. What was put forward as an ethical concern was not plucked from the experiences of a " Geriatric nurse " but rather through consultation with discipline experts such as Dr Steggles, Chairman of the Faculty of Pre-Hospital Care, Edinburgh who wholly concurred with our viewpoint and also cited the latest Faculty consensus paper published in November of last year which I'm sure most of you are already aware of. We are fully appreciative of the benefits of large bore cannula provided those benefits can be administered by TRAINED personnel with practical hands on experience. We could not and will not condone the use of such large bore cannula (and have difficulty in advocating use of 18g) given the clearly comprehensive guidelines set by JRCALC etc. The fact remains that AMA's onboard SBV's are not equipped with this level of skill under the current training regime and might exacerbate a situation rather than benefit it if required to do so. I would be interested to hear if any of the previous participants to the discussion would still recommend that the procedure is freely advocated for AMA's onboard SBV's? Hell, lets have them doing cut downs as well ! I reckon we can cover that aspect of training in about an hour! (NOT) What's a little pain when you are dying after all? Hold on though ...aren't the medical profession expected to ease unnecessary pain and suffering!? Might I finally add for the time being that all of my staff have actually cannulated casualties at some point in their career and appreciate the difficulties associated. I know for a fact that a certain gentleman who contributes to this site has no practical experience whatsoever in this respect and relies heavily on his extensive reference material to justify credence. I'm sure that once I have read all of the communications (I'll take the week off maybe!) I'll have more to say. Rest assured there is more to come! Very interesting to hear about the alleged demise of the BAEMT by the way. We were actually instrumental in having the SBV standards amended to ensure that all EMT's associated with training & assessment were as a minimum registered with them as it was found to be the case that First Aiders calling themselves " EMT's " with little or no training in this respect were doing so. This was also looked at within the Merchant Navy Training Board standards also. If there is no BAEMT however, they will have to readdress the problem. I'm all for setting standards in training but the one thing that is sadly lacking in our industry is definition. Everyting it seems is down to interpretation by the provider. I would agree that some are more conscientious than others in this respect. Look forward to the replies! (Honest) Regards Alan Hurry Managing Director MRI Ltd. (and Supervisor!) RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Alan, I was one of the chaps who lambasted the thought of scrapping 18G needles, However as it was reported on this site I was under the impression that it was qualified medics that where taught this, I did however if you see my posting mention that 18g is better than NOWT. I do however stand by my statement that in trauma the bigger the better. Like most things an absolute contraindication of any procedure is lack of operator \ Medic skill experience and knowledge. . PS what does MRI stand for, I know South Africa has an MRI ( Medical Rescue International). Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via Aberdeen 01224 334000 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > Ian, > > Please be as bold as you wish and thank you for the information about the > discussions held back in March. > > We are that company - Maritime Rescue International in Stonehaven that it > appears most everyone has little or no respect for given those > communications I have managed to read so far! Once I have had the > opportunity to read them all through I will no doubt have more to say in > our defence! > > To be going on with however, has neglected to mention a few things > about the situation which I would hope might shed new light on the > argument and perhaps put our viewpoint into perspective. > > No member of MRI advocated or called for the removal of 14g & 16g Canulae > from SBV's. We raised an ethical concern over the suggested usage of > these items by relatively untrained personnel onboard vessels in > potentially less than favourable conditions. The fact remains that SBV > Advanced " First Aiders " are no more than that. Their total training > amounts to 5 days basic training followed by 5 days of Advanced skills of > which we can devote approximately 2 hrs to cannulation training on a > prosthetic arm in a classroom environment. This is governed by the > present training standards which we as a Training centre have called into > question with the Industry Association and are actively seeking a review > of. > > What was put forward as an ethical concern was not plucked from the > experiences of a " Geriatric nurse " but rather through consultation with > discipline experts such as Dr Steggles, Chairman of the Faculty of > Pre-Hospital Care, Edinburgh who wholly concurred with our viewpoint and > also cited the latest Faculty consensus paper published in November of > last year which I'm sure most of you are already aware of. > > We are fully appreciative of the benefits of large bore cannula provided > those benefits can be administered by TRAINED personnel with practical > hands on experience. We could not and will not condone the use of such > large bore cannula (and have difficulty in advocating use of 18g) given > the clearly comprehensive guidelines set by JRCALC etc. The fact remains > that AMA's onboard SBV's are not equipped with this level of skill under > the current training regime and might exacerbate a situation rather than > benefit it if required to do so. > > I would be interested to hear if any of the previous participants to the > discussion would still recommend that the procedure is freely advocated > for AMA's onboard SBV's? Hell, lets have them doing cut downs as well ! > I reckon we can cover that aspect of training in about an hour! (NOT) > What's a little pain when you are dying after all? Hold on though > ...aren't the medical profession expected to ease unnecessary pain and > suffering!? > > Might I finally add for the time being that all of my staff have actually > cannulated casualties at some point in their career and appreciate the > difficulties associated. I know for a fact that a certain gentleman who > contributes to this site has no practical experience whatsoever in this > respect and relies heavily on his extensive reference material to justify > credence. > > I'm sure that once I have read all of the communications (I'll take the > week off maybe!) I'll have more to say. Rest assured there is more to > come! > > Very interesting to hear about the alleged demise of the BAEMT by the way. > We were actually instrumental in having the SBV standards amended to > ensure that all EMT's associated with training & assessment were as a > minimum registered with them as it was found to be the case that First > Aiders calling themselves " EMT's " with little or no training in this > respect were doing so. This was also looked at within the Merchant Navy > Training Board standards also. If there is no BAEMT however, they will > have to readdress the problem. I'm all for setting standards in training > but the one thing that is sadly lacking in our industry is definition. > Everyting it seems is down to interpretation by the provider. I would > agree that some are more conscientious than others in this respect. > > Look forward to the replies! (Honest) > > Regards > Alan Hurry > Managing Director MRI Ltd. > (and Supervisor!) > > > > RE work offshore > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with > a > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > employ > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > and > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > the > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > back. > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > decided > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > earnings > I > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > step > at > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > ticket. > > Any advice gratefully received, > > Thanks in advance, > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > FAW > Instructor. > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > Post message: egroups > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 , We have never had and unless justified otherwise, will never have a problem with SUITABLY trained and QUALIFIED personnel inserting large bore cannula. Our viewpoint has been pretty much the same as yours - that if the AMA's have to do it an 18g is better than nothing - they have a greater chance of success - there is less risk of compromising sites for future use by life support teams - and also less pressure on the AMA concerned who in even a minor incident will be under a considerable strain to cope. I'm still working through the comments with my staff and will doubtless have more to say on the subject. Have certainly noted those who suggested that we be given the opportunity to state our case and are welcoming the opportunity to do so. I am surprised that the invitation wasn't extended/forwarded at the time by though! As regards some concerns over notification to UKOOA etc, the meeting at which my Nurse voiced her ethical concern was attended by ALL factions of Industry (UKOOA, ERRVA, OPITO, HSE, Training Provider) The subject was not in fact " Blocked " but set aside for debate in an appropriate forum such as the UKOOA Medical Aid Committee meeting. This has been further pursued by our company through direct conversation with SBV companies, the new Chairman of their association ERRVA (Emergency Response & Rescue Vessel Association) and Project Leaders within OPITO. This is one of a number of issues we wish to address to bring things into perspective at least. What is expected or being asked of some AMA's is in our view getting out of hand and should be left to the professionals. Regards Alan Hurry P.S. M.R.I. - I hope that you are more observant during Primary Surveys than with communications! (Read the second line of my last message) Nothing to do with our African Colleagues! From: Brash, \ Lines, Gavin (amed2) ' ' Sent: Monday, May 13, 2002 3:26 PM Subject: RE: RE work offshore Alan, I was one of the chaps who lambasted the thought of scrapping 18G needles, However as it was reported on this site I was under the impression that it was qualified medics that where taught this, I did however if you see my posting mention that 18g is better than NOWT. I do however stand by my statement that in trauma the bigger the better. Like most things an absolute contraindication of any procedure is lack of operator \ Medic skill experience and knowledge. . PS what does MRI stand for, I know South Africa has an MRI ( Medical Rescue International). Brash Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via Aberdeen 01224 334000 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > Ian, > > Please be as bold as you wish and thank you for the information about the > discussions held back in March. > > We are that company - Maritime Rescue International in Stonehaven that it > appears most everyone has little or no respect for given those > communications I have managed to read so far! Once I have had the > opportunity to read them all through I will no doubt have more to say in > our defence! > > To be going on with however, has neglected to mention a few things > about the situation which I would hope might shed new light on the > argument and perhaps put our viewpoint into perspective. > > No member of MRI advocated or called for the removal of 14g & 16g Canulae > from SBV's. We raised an ethical concern over the suggested usage of > these items by relatively untrained personnel onboard vessels in > potentially less than favourable conditions. The fact remains that SBV > Advanced " First Aiders " are no more than that. Their total training > amounts to 5 days basic training followed by 5 days of Advanced skills of > which we can devote approximately 2 hrs to cannulation training on a > prosthetic arm in a classroom environment. This is governed by the > present training standards which we as a Training centre have called into > question with the Industry Association and are actively seeking a review > of. > > What was put forward as an ethical concern was not plucked from the > experiences of a " Geriatric nurse " but rather through consultation with > discipline experts such as Dr Steggles, Chairman of the Faculty of > Pre-Hospital Care, Edinburgh who wholly concurred with our viewpoint and > also cited the latest Faculty consensus paper published in November of > last year which I'm sure most of you are already aware of. > > We are fully appreciative of the benefits of large bore cannula provided > those benefits can be administered by TRAINED personnel with practical > hands on experience. We could not and will not condone the use of such > large bore cannula (and have difficulty in advocating use of 18g) given > the clearly comprehensive guidelines set by JRCALC etc. The fact remains > that AMA's onboard SBV's are not equipped with this level of skill under > the current training regime and might exacerbate a situation rather than > benefit it if required to do so. > > I would be interested to hear if any of the previous participants to the > discussion would still recommend that the procedure is freely advocated > for AMA's onboard SBV's? Hell, lets have them doing cut downs as well ! > I reckon we can cover that aspect of training in about an hour! (NOT) > What's a little pain when you are dying after all? Hold on though > ...aren't the medical profession expected to ease unnecessary pain and > suffering!? > > Might I finally add for the time being that all of my staff have actually > cannulated casualties at some point in their career and appreciate the > difficulties associated. I know for a fact that a certain gentleman who > contributes to this site has no practical experience whatsoever in this > respect and relies heavily on his extensive reference material to justify > credence. > > I'm sure that once I have read all of the communications (I'll take the > week off maybe!) I'll have more to say. Rest assured there is more to > come! > > Very interesting to hear about the alleged demise of the BAEMT by the way. > We were actually instrumental in having the SBV standards amended to > ensure that all EMT's associated with training & assessment were as a > minimum registered with them as it was found to be the case that First > Aiders calling themselves " EMT's " with little or no training in this > respect were doing so. This was also looked at within the Merchant Navy > Training Board standards also. If there is no BAEMT however, they will > have to readdress the problem. I'm all for setting standards in training > but the one thing that is sadly lacking in our industry is definition. > Everyting it seems is down to interpretation by the provider. I would > agree that some are more conscientious than others in this respect. > > Look forward to the replies! (Honest) > > Regards > Alan Hurry > Managing Director MRI Ltd. > (and Supervisor!) > > > > RE work offshore > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with > a > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did > employ > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications > and > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with > the > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > money > back. > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > being > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and > decided > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > earnings > I > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this > step > at > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > might > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore > ticket. > > Any advice gratefully received, > > Thanks in advance, > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and > FAW > Instructor. > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > Member Information: > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > Post message: egroups > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Alan, Noted.... Clear as ABC Brash \ Gavin Lines Senior Nurse Supervisor International SOS \ Cabinda Gulf Oil Company e-mail: Amed2@... Telephone: CTN. 8 345 2696 Via Aberdeen 01224 334000 Cabinda Ext. 2696 > Re: RE work offshore > > > > Ian, > > > > Please be as bold as you wish and thank you for the information about > the > > discussions held back in March. > > > > We are that company - Maritime Rescue International in Stonehaven that > it > > appears most everyone has little or no respect for given those > > communications I have managed to read so far! Once I have had the > > opportunity to read them all through I will no doubt have more to say > in > > our defence! > > > > To be going on with however, has neglected to mention a few > things > > about the situation which I would hope might shed new light on the > > argument and perhaps put our viewpoint into perspective. > > > > No member of MRI advocated or called for the removal of 14g & 16g > Canulae > > from SBV's. We raised an ethical concern over the suggested usage of > > these items by relatively untrained personnel onboard vessels in > > potentially less than favourable conditions. The fact remains that > SBV > > Advanced " First Aiders " are no more than that. Their total training > > amounts to 5 days basic training followed by 5 days of Advanced skills > of > > which we can devote approximately 2 hrs to cannulation training on a > > prosthetic arm in a classroom environment. This is governed by the > > present training standards which we as a Training centre have called > into > > question with the Industry Association and are actively seeking a > review > > of. > > > > What was put forward as an ethical concern was not plucked from the > > experiences of a " Geriatric nurse " but rather through consultation > with > > discipline experts such as Dr Steggles, Chairman of the Faculty > of > > Pre-Hospital Care, Edinburgh who wholly concurred with our viewpoint > and > > also cited the latest Faculty consensus paper published in November of > > last year which I'm sure most of you are already aware of. > > > > We are fully appreciative of the benefits of large bore cannula > provided > > those benefits can be administered by TRAINED personnel with practical > > hands on experience. We could not and will not condone the use of > such > > large bore cannula (and have difficulty in advocating use of 18g) > given > > the clearly comprehensive guidelines set by JRCALC etc. The fact > remains > > that AMA's onboard SBV's are not equipped with this level of skill > under > > the current training regime and might exacerbate a situation rather > than > > benefit it if required to do so. > > > > I would be interested to hear if any of the previous participants to > the > > discussion would still recommend that the procedure is freely > advocated > > for AMA's onboard SBV's? Hell, lets have them doing cut downs as > well ! > > I reckon we can cover that aspect of training in about an hour! (NOT) > > What's a little pain when you are dying after all? Hold on though > > ...aren't the medical profession expected to ease unnecessary pain and > > suffering!? > > > > Might I finally add for the time being that all of my staff have > actually > > cannulated casualties at some point in their career and appreciate the > > difficulties associated. I know for a fact that a certain gentleman > who > > contributes to this site has no practical experience whatsoever in > this > > respect and relies heavily on his extensive reference material to > justify > > credence. > > > > I'm sure that once I have read all of the communications (I'll take > the > > week off maybe!) I'll have more to say. Rest assured there is more to > > come! > > > > Very interesting to hear about the alleged demise of the BAEMT by the > way. > > We were actually instrumental in having the SBV standards amended to > > ensure that all EMT's associated with training & assessment were as a > > minimum registered with them as it was found to be the case that First > > Aiders calling themselves " EMT's " with little or no training in this > > respect were doing so. This was also looked at within the Merchant > Navy > > Training Board standards also. If there is no BAEMT however, they > will > > have to readdress the problem. I'm all for setting standards in > training > > but the one thing that is sadly lacking in our industry is definition. > > Everyting it seems is down to interpretation by the provider. I would > > agree that some are more conscientious than others in this respect. > > > > Look forward to the replies! (Honest) > > > > Regards > > Alan Hurry > > Managing Director MRI Ltd. > > (and Supervisor!) > > > > > > > > RE work offshore > > > > > > Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote > Support > > Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. > > > > Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered > with > > a > > company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They > did > > employ > > two of my close colleagues with similar experience and > qualifications > > and > > put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) > with > > the > > proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the > > money > > back. > > > > I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response > > being > > that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep > phoning. > > > > Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up > and > > decided > > to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of > > earnings > > I > > believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate > this > > step > > at > > the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that > > might > > sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their > offshore > > ticket. > > > > Any advice gratefully received, > > > > Thanks in advance, > > > > Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider > and > > FAW > > Instructor. > > RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. > > > > > > > > Member Information: > > > > List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... > > Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... > > > > Post message: egroups > > Subscribe: -subscribeegroups > > Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups > > > > Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 13, 2002 Report Share Posted May 13, 2002 Alan, Surely this boils down then to the fact that you should now be going back to the sbv industry regulators and discussing the matter with them. At the end of the day it is a completely pointless exercise teaching people to cannulate who may or may not use the skill in the next 10 years! Regardless of the size of the cannula it is still an invasive technique that needs to carried out by both skilled and practised personnel. There is absolutely no point in teaching students to cannulate on an artificial arm and not follow it through with practical building of the skill on live patients, and then turn around and say the guy is not skilled and won't use it but if he does then ok use a smaller cannula then because it is less barbaric. IMHO it makes no odds, if an organisation is teaching a skill they are teaching it because it is expected to be used, if it is then going to be used it should be taught, attained and practised regularly...... the size of the cannula in this discussion is irrelevant, the question really is should the skill be taught to these guys on the basis it might be used. I appreciate you are following the guidelines laid down by the industry on what should be taught but if you have identified the problem it is you duty to go back to the regulators and make the case for its removal from the syllabus. Best Wishes Ian Re: RE work offshore Ian, Please be as bold as you wish and thank you for the information about the discussions held back in March. We are that company - Maritime Rescue International in Stonehaven that it appears most everyone has little or no respect for given those communications I have managed to read so far! Once I have had the opportunity to read them all through I will no doubt have more to say in our defence! To be going on with however, has neglected to mention a few things about the situation which I would hope might shed new light on the argument and perhaps put our viewpoint into perspective. No member of MRI advocated or called for the removal of 14g & 16g Canulae from SBV's. We raised an ethical concern over the suggested usage of these items by relatively untrained personnel onboard vessels in potentially less than favourable conditions. The fact remains that SBV Advanced " First Aiders " are no more than that. Their total training amounts to 5 days basic training followed by 5 days of Advanced skills of which we can devote approximately 2 hrs to cannulation training on a prosthetic arm in a classroom environment. This is governed by the present training standards which we as a Training centre have called into question with the Industry Association and are actively seeking a review of. What was put forward as an ethical concern was not plucked from the experiences of a " Geriatric nurse " but rather through consultation with discipline experts such as Dr Steggles, Chairman of the Faculty of Pre-Hospital Care, Edinburgh who wholly concurred with our viewpoint and also cited the latest Faculty consensus paper published in November of last year which I'm sure most of you are already aware of. We are fully appreciative of the benefits of large bore cannula provided those benefits can be administered by TRAINED personnel with practical hands on experience. We could not and will not condone the use of such large bore cannula (and have difficulty in advocating use of 18g) given the clearly comprehensive guidelines set by JRCALC etc. The fact remains that AMA's onboard SBV's are not equipped with this level of skill under the current training regime and might exacerbate a situation rather than benefit it if required to do so. I would be interested to hear if any of the previous participants to the discussion would still recommend that the procedure is freely advocated for AMA's onboard SBV's? Hell, lets have them doing cut downs as well ! I reckon we can cover that aspect of training in about an hour! (NOT) What's a little pain when you are dying after all? Hold on though ...aren't the medical profession expected to ease unnecessary pain and suffering!? Might I finally add for the time being that all of my staff have actually cannulated casualties at some point in their career and appreciate the difficulties associated. I know for a fact that a certain gentleman who contributes to this site has no practical experience whatsoever in this respect and relies heavily on his extensive reference material to justify credence. I'm sure that once I have read all of the communications (I'll take the week off maybe!) I'll have more to say. Rest assured there is more to come! Very interesting to hear about the alleged demise of the BAEMT by the way. We were actually instrumental in having the SBV standards amended to ensure that all EMT's associated with training & assessment were as a minimum registered with them as it was found to be the case that First Aiders calling themselves " EMT's " with little or no training in this respect were doing so. This was also looked at within the Merchant Navy Training Board standards also. If there is no BAEMT however, they will have to readdress the problem. I'm all for setting standards in training but the one thing that is sadly lacking in our industry is definition. Everyting it seems is down to interpretation by the provider. I would agree that some are more conscientious than others in this respect. Look forward to the replies! (Honest) Regards Alan Hurry Managing Director MRI Ltd. (and Supervisor!) RE work offshore Firstly thanks to Ian sharpe for forwarding my intro to Remote Support Medics which I mistakenly sent to him off-line. Secondly, can anyone help with a query ? I have been registered with a company called Northern Marine for around six months now. They did employ two of my close colleagues with similar experience and qualifications and put them through their medics ticket (including survival course) with the proviso that they serve a minimum contract of two years or pay the money back. I have been phoning them on a monthly basis with the only response being that no further recruitment is on the horizon yet but to keep phoning. Another colleague who has been doing the same has now got fed up and decided to pay for their own course (around £ 2000 not to mention loss of earnings I believe). As an impoverished NHS nurse I could not contemplate this step at the moment and wondered if any of you knew of other companies that might sponsor well-qualified and experienced medics through their offshore ticket. Any advice gratefully received, Thanks in advance, Simon Furmage, B.Sc. RGN. Diploma in Health Science, ALS provider and FAW Instructor. RTO. Loch Lomond Rescue Boat. Member Information: List owner: Ian Sharpe Owner@... Editor: Ross Boardman Editor@... Post message: egroups Subscribe: -subscribeegroups Unsubscribe: -unsubscribeegroups Thank you for supporting Remote Medics Online. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You are posting as a guest. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.