Ethics question

July 5, 2002

Becca Husbvand, can I have my device turned off if I am in serious condition

so that I can die a peaceful death.

July 5, 2002

Folks,

My husband, , is a hosp administrator at

Morehead Memorial Hosp here in Eden, NC. He

serves on the Ethics Committee which meets once a

month. Last Tuesday, a question came up involving

an ICD. A person in a hospice situation, dying

from an ailment not related to the heart, but

with an ICD, was having, what was termed a good

death, until the ICD kicked in. Things then got

kind of dicey. I do not know what happened

afterwards, as Geo did not go into much detail,

but we did talk some about what happened to me in

Feb, and the fact that I have a living will. I

thought I would throw this situation to the

group, if for nothing else, some thought. Geo

would be happy to talk to any of you who might

want to ask him more about the meeting. He lurks

here with me. Becca

--- zapduff <duffey@...> wrote:

> Awesome greeting kiddo! Thanks.

>

> (My opinion) The BEST book for you, your dad,

> and all of us with

> faulty tickers is " The No-Salt, Lowest-Sodium

> Cookbook " by A.

> Gazzaniga (who also has an ICD implant!!)

>

> You can get it via this link:

>

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312291647/worldvu/

>

__________________________________________________

July 5, 2002

All:

There is not one of us here on the who has not stared death straight

in the eye and watched that nasty old man blink, not one of us who has not

spent hours contemplating our own mortality and by extension that of

everyone else. We are a bunch of average Joes and everyday Janes who were

unfortunate enough to have major heart problems and fortunate enough to

benefit from modern medicine and AICD technology. In addition to the

extended life we now have, we also have a perspective of life that is rooted

in the reality that life is both temporal and fragile. The youngest of our

group have wisdom that most people will never acquire, and the oldest a joy

for life that teenagers cannot match. On the subject of life and death,

most specifically our own, we are the experts.

A few years back, " Death With Dignity " was a common theme for the media and

magazine crowd. More recently we have begun hearing and reading about the

administration of pain medication and the degree to which it should be

prescribed, most specifically in cases involving terminally ill patients. I

strongly suspect that each and every one of us on this forum have already

thought long and hard about these subjects, and the issue of our AICD seems

to fit snugly right in the middle of the issue.

Personally I think that my AICD is, in the final analysis, just a machine

that is there to extend my life. That it is already in place while I go

about my daily and normal activities instead of while I am on a hospital

bed, is a matter of timing and location more than one of function. When the

AICD ceases to serve my needs, I will have it disabled or removed, just as I

would want a respirator disconnected. I believe that such a decision rests

with the individual whenever and wherever he/she is capable of making such

decisions for themselves. Should such capacity no longer exist, then those

with the power to make such decisions should follow the patient's wishes, if

known, or their own compassionate in lieu of other guidance.

As to the ethics involved, I have long believed that personal morality and

ethics should be decided on a personal level and accountability resides in

the decision maker/action taker and only those who are directly affected.

Medical ethics is much more of a gray area, and has its own natural

conflicts where the business of medicine intersects with the practice of

patient care. Unlike our own individual morality and ethical standards,

medical ethics can and should be reviewed and evaluated by the general

public. Fortunately for us, we have all been well-trained and self-trained

for this ever since we were given our second chances at life.

Best.

Bill

Re: Ethics Question

> Folks,

> My husband, , is a hosp administrator at

> Morehead Memorial Hosp here in Eden, NC. He

> serves on the Ethics Committee which meets once a

> month. Last Tuesday, a question came up involving

> an ICD. A person in a hospice situation, dying

> from an ailment not related to the heart, but

> with an ICD, was having, what was termed a good

> death, until the ICD kicked in. Things then got

> kind of dicey. I do not know what happened

> afterwards, as Geo did not go into much detail,

> but we did talk some about what happened to me in

> Feb, and the fact that I have a living will. I

> thought I would throw this situation to the

> group, if for nothing else, some thought. Geo

> would be happy to talk to any of you who might

> want to ask him more about the meeting. He lurks

> here with me. Becca

> --- zapduff <duffey@...> wrote:

> > Awesome greeting kiddo! Thanks.

> >

> > (My opinion) The BEST book for you, your dad,

> > and all of us with

> > faulty tickers is " The No-Salt, Lowest-Sodium

> > Cookbook " by A.

> > Gazzaniga (who also has an ICD implant!!)

> >

> > You can get it via this link:

> >

> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312291647/worldvu/

> >

>

> __________________________________________________

>

July 5, 2002

No one could have said it better with all the sincerety which exists in this world....... Thank you

Gypsy Star aka Vicky P.

bill mahan <billandmarthamahan@...> wrote: All:There is not one of us here on the who has not stared death straightin the eye and watched that nasty old man blink, not one of us who has notspent hours contemplating our own mortality and by extension that ofeveryone else. We are a bunch of average Joes and everyday Janes who wereunfortunate enough to have major heart problems and fortunate enough tobenefit from modern medicine and AICD technology. In addition to theextended life we now have, we also have a perspective of life that is rootedin the reality that life is both temporal and fragile. The youngest of ourgroup have wisdom that most people will never acquire, and the oldest a joyfor life that teenagers cannot match. On the subject of life and death,most specifically our own, we are the experts.A few years back, "Death With Dignity" was a common theme for the media andmagazine crowd. More recently we have begun hearing and reading about theadministration of pain medication and the degree to which it should beprescribed, most specifically in cases involving terminally ill patients. Istrongly suspect that each and every one of us on this forum have alreadythought long and hard about these subjects, and the issue of our AICD seemsto fit snugly right in the middle of the issue.Personally I think that my AICD is, in the final analysis, just a machinethat is there to extend my life. That it is already in place while I goabout my daily and normal activities instead of while I am on a hospitalbed, is a matter of timing and location more than one of function. When theAICD ceases to serve my needs, I will have it disabled or removed, just as Iwould want a respirator disconnected. I believe that such a decision restswith the individual whenever and wherever he/she is capable of making suchdecisions for themselves. Should such capacity no longer exist, then thosewith the power to make such decisions should follow the patient's wishes, ifknown, or their own compassionate in lieu of other guidance.As to the ethics involved, I have long believed that personal morality andethics should be decided on a personal level and accountability resides inthe decision maker/action taker and only those who are directly affected.Medical ethics is much more of a gray area, and has its own naturalconflicts where the business of medicine intersects with the practice ofpatient care. Unlike our own individual morality and ethical standards,medical ethics can and should be reviewed and evaluated by the generalpublic. Fortunately for us, we have all been well-trained and self-trainedfor this ever since we were given our second chances at life.Best.Bill Re: Ethics Question> Folks,> My husband, , is a hosp administrator at> Morehead Memorial Hosp here in Eden, NC. He> serves on the Ethics Committee which meets once a> month. Last Tuesday, a question came up involving> an ICD. A person in a hospice situation, dying> from an ailment not related to the heart, but> with an ICD, was having, what was termed a good> death, until the ICD kicked in. Things then got> kind of dicey. I do not know what happened> afterwards, as Geo did not go into much detail,> but we did talk some about what happened to me in> Feb, and the fact that I have a living will. I> thought I would throw this situation to the> group, if for nothing else, some thought. Geo> would be happy to talk to any of you who might> want to ask him more about the meeting. He lurks> here with me. Becca> --- zapduff <duffey@...> wrote:> > Awesome greeting kiddo! Thanks.> >> > (My opinion) The BEST book for you, your dad,> > and all of us with> > faulty tickers is "The No-Salt, Lowest-Sodium> > Cookbook" by A.> > Gazzaniga (who also has an ICD implant!!)> >> > You can get it via this link:> >> >> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312291647/worldvu/> >> >>>> __________________________________________________>

July 6, 2002

Yes you can and anybody can. if you have something very serious you can sign

a release form and also tell them DNR(do not ressusitate(?) or something

like that) but since you dont have a serious condition dont worry about that

for know ok. I am 42 and i wear 50+ sunscreen everyday because of amiodrone

and everyonce in a while i get CHF too but it goes away so just remember the

positive attitude will ya granny. Again We love ya babe. TURK

>From: IIPistacio@...

>Reply-

>

>Subject: Re: Ethics Question

>Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 10:45:53 EDT

>

>Becca Husbvand, can I have my device turned off if I am in serious

>condition

>so that I can die a peaceful death.

_________________________________________________________________

Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.

http://www.hotmail.com

July 6, 2002

Of course you can - it is your body.... And most likely that is what would be

recommended by your Docs, the alternative is not a fun thing for your family to

see, as your ICD tries to save you........... I have a friend who has been

through this, however her husband elected NOT to have his ICD turned off.

~guin

IIPistacio@... wrote:

> Becca Husbvand, can I have my device turned off if I am in serious condition

> so that I can die a peaceful death.

>

> Please visit the Zapper homepage at

> http://www.ZapLife.org

>

July 6, 2002

Bill Thank you. You spoke like the champion i know you are. I think in the

world there are very few people that can word this issue with the wisdom and

serenity the way you do and and most of that few is probably in this group.

I salute you like a real Turk which is ;

Touch my stomach then touch my chest then touch my chin and touch my forhead

then give it to you, as far as what it means it's another couple of pages.

Thanks and with Love my Friend. TURK

>From: " bill mahan " <billandmarthamahan@...>

>Reply-

>< >

>Subject: Re: Ethics Question

>Date: Fri, 5 Jul 2002 09:20:33 -0700

>

>All:

>

>There is not one of us here on the who has not stared death

>straight

>in the eye and watched that nasty old man blink, not one of us who has not

>spent hours contemplating our own mortality and by extension that of

>everyone else. We are a bunch of average Joes and everyday Janes who were

>unfortunate enough to have major heart problems and fortunate enough to

>benefit from modern medicine and AICD technology. In addition to the

>extended life we now have, we also have a perspective of life that is

>rooted

>in the reality that life is both temporal and fragile. The youngest of our

>group have wisdom that most people will never acquire, and the oldest a joy

>for life that teenagers cannot match. On the subject of life and death,

>most specifically our own, we are the experts.

>

>A few years back, " Death With Dignity " was a common theme for the media and

>magazine crowd. More recently we have begun hearing and reading about the

>administration of pain medication and the degree to which it should be

>prescribed, most specifically in cases involving terminally ill patients.

>I

>strongly suspect that each and every one of us on this forum have already

>thought long and hard about these subjects, and the issue of our AICD seems

>to fit snugly right in the middle of the issue.

>

>Personally I think that my AICD is, in the final analysis, just a machine

>that is there to extend my life. That it is already in place while I go

>about my daily and normal activities instead of while I am on a hospital

>bed, is a matter of timing and location more than one of function. When

>the

>AICD ceases to serve my needs, I will have it disabled or removed, just as

>I

>would want a respirator disconnected. I believe that such a decision rests

>with the individual whenever and wherever he/she is capable of making such

>decisions for themselves. Should such capacity no longer exist, then those

>with the power to make such decisions should follow the patient's wishes,

>if

>known, or their own compassionate in lieu of other guidance.

>

>As to the ethics involved, I have long believed that personal morality and

>ethics should be decided on a personal level and accountability resides in

>the decision maker/action taker and only those who are directly affected.

>Medical ethics is much more of a gray area, and has its own natural

>conflicts where the business of medicine intersects with the practice of

>patient care. Unlike our own individual morality and ethical standards,

>medical ethics can and should be reviewed and evaluated by the general

>public. Fortunately for us, we have all been well-trained and self-trained

>for this ever since we were given our second chances at life.

>

>Best.

>

>Bill

> Re: Ethics Question

>

> > Folks,

> > My husband, , is a hosp administrator at

> > Morehead Memorial Hosp here in Eden, NC. He

> > serves on the Ethics Committee which meets once a

> > month. Last Tuesday, a question came up involving

> > an ICD. A person in a hospice situation, dying

> > from an ailment not related to the heart, but

> > with an ICD, was having, what was termed a good

> > death, until the ICD kicked in. Things then got

> > kind of dicey. I do not know what happened

> > afterwards, as Geo did not go into much detail,

> > but we did talk some about what happened to me in

> > Feb, and the fact that I have a living will. I

> > thought I would throw this situation to the

> > group, if for nothing else, some thought. Geo

> > would be happy to talk to any of you who might

> > want to ask him more about the meeting. He lurks

> > here with me. Becca

> > --- zapduff <duffey@...> wrote:

> > > Awesome greeting kiddo! Thanks.

> > >

> > > (My opinion) The BEST book for you, your dad,

> > > and all of us with

> > > faulty tickers is " The No-Salt, Lowest-Sodium

> > > Cookbook " by A.

> > > Gazzaniga (who also has an ICD implant!!)

> > >

> > > You can get it via this link:

> > >

> > http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0312291647/worldvu/

> > >

> >

> > __________________________________________________

> >

July 6, 2002

As always Bill you are a true gentleman and a schlar and hit the nail right

on the head.

Miss your humor

Sharon

July 6, 2002

Sharon wrote:

> As always Bill you are a true gentleman

%%% There's no such thing. If man were telling the truth to a woman

about what was on his mind, he wouldn't be a genleman, would he?

> and a schlar

%%% Also not true. I quit drinking years ago and no longer schlar my

words. I do, however, still blither and am fluent in gibberish.

> and hit the nail right on the head.

%%% Wrong again! I only hit the nail on the thumb. Definitely makes me

one of the first digital handymen.

> Miss your humor

That makes you the lucky one. Others have to listen to it.

Best.

Bill

July 6, 2002

----- Original Message -----

From: "

> You spoke like the champion i know you are.

%%% Yes I won a spulling be onct.

> I think in the world there are very few people

> that can word this issue with the wisdom and

> serenity the way you do

%%% I believe that WMHO (the World Mental Health Orgnanization) is

responsible for that success.

> and and most of that few is probably in this group.

%%% And you thought people were leaving us before? Wait'll they see what

you just wrote about them. You'll be Turkish taffy if they ever get ahold

of you.

> I salute you like a real Turk which is ;

> Touch my stomach then touch my chest

> then touch my chin and touch my forhead

%%% You have four heads? I only have two, and I keep getting in trouble

for using one and not using the other.

> . . . as far as what it means

> it's another couple of pages.

%%% I do appreciate that those are the only parts of your body that you

touch.

Best.

Bill

July 6, 2002

I salute you like a real Turk which is ;Touch my stomach then touch my chest then touch my chin and touch my forhead then give it to you, as far as what it means it's another couple of pages. Thanks and with Love my Friend. TURKTurk,

I hope you are not like my Turkish nannie was. Cause the "then give it to you" could mean a different thing all together.

Miss you on .

Gail_________________________________________________________________

July 6, 2002

Love you too Bill;

Thanks bud, Missed your humor. Love TURK

>From: " bill mahan " <billandmarthamahan@...>

>Reply-

>< >

>Subject: Re: Ethics Question

>Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 07:56:32 -0700

>

>----- Original Message -----

>From: "

>

> > You spoke like the champion i know you are.

>

>%%% Yes I won a spulling be onct.

>

> > I think in the world there are very few people

> > that can word this issue with the wisdom and

> > serenity the way you do

>

>%%% I believe that WMHO (the World Mental Health Orgnanization) is

>responsible for that success.

>

> > and and most of that few is probably in this group.

>

>%%% And you thought people were leaving us before? Wait'll they see what

>you just wrote about them. You'll be Turkish taffy if they ever get ahold

>of you.

>

> > I salute you like a real Turk which is ;

> > Touch my stomach then touch my chest

> > then touch my chin and touch my forhead

>

>%%% You have four heads? I only have two, and I keep getting in trouble

>for using one and not using the other.

>

> > . . . as far as what it means

> > it's another couple of pages.

>

>%%% I do appreciate that those are the only parts of your body that you

>touch.

>

>Best.

>

>Bill

>

_________________________________________________________________

Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com

July 6, 2002

when it is saluting you give in the old Turkish and Ottoman culture it means

a big honor other than that you gotta whatch who's giving you what because

not too many people are old fashion in someways like me . Love TURK

PS; I have just loaded the windows xp i was having a hard time now its ok

but ill tell everyone you gotta get this version its the best yet.

>From: " Dave & Gail Forbes " <charade799@...>

>Reply-

>< >

>Subject: Re: Ethics Question

>Date: Sat, 6 Jul 2002 12:57:30 -0400

>

> I salute you like a real Turk which is ;

> Touch my stomach then touch my chest then touch my chin and touch my

>forhead

> then give it to you, as far as what it means it's another couple of

>pages.

> Thanks and with Love my Friend. TURK

>

> Turk,

>

> I hope you are not like my Turkish nannie was. Cause the " then give it

>to you " could mean a different thing all together.

>

> Miss you on .

>

> Gail

>

> _________________________________________________________________

>

_________________________________________________________________

Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail.

http://www.hotmail.com

November 2, 2005

,

My thoughts are that it is the patient's choice to see whom they choose.

If they are happy with Dr. D's treatment, this is beneficial for their

healing process. It also speaks for the benefit of naturopathic medicine.

Don't change horses in the middle of the stream as the saying goes. By

reshuffling the patients and their cases around again for the sake of ethics

may lose the patients altogether. Perhaps you will be in a similar

circumstance with the roles reversed someday, and if your patient(s) is very

happy with your treatment, you'll understand that it is to your benefit and

the patient's to carry on.

My $.02 worth.

Cerasaro, ND

Great Falls, MT

gen fam prac

Ethics question

>

> Hi Unda group,

> It was suggested to me to put this question out to a

> group of healthcare practitioners. Please let me know

> what you think of this situation:

>

> Dr. A is going on vacation for a week and refers 2

> patients (needing ongoing treatment)to Dr. B. The

> patients show up at Dr. C's office, nearby Dr. B's

> office. The person the patients talk to happens to

> know Dr. B. Practitioner does not recognize the name

> of Dr. A and asks the patient if they have the correct

> office or are they supposed to be at Dr. B's office.

> The patient replies that they were referred to Dr.

> C.'s office. There are two doctors in Dr. C's office.

> Dr. C is out of town so the appointments for the week

> are made with Dr. D.

> Dr. D examines and treats the patients. The patients

> improve quickly with the first treatment. At the end

> of the week Dr. A is back in town and calls the

> patients. The patients tell Dr. A that they are

> staying with Dr. D because they are improving quickly

> and that they were not happy with Dr. A's treatment.

> Dr D suggests that they go back to Dr. A since he is

> back in town. The patients tell Dr. D that they would

> like to stay with Dr. D.

>

> The question is, is it unethical and/or unprofessional

> for Dr. D to continue treating the patients?

>

> Thanks for your help.

> Sawhill, N.D.

> Beaverton, OR

>

> __________________________________

> - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

> http://mail.

>

November 2, 2005

My question/answer/ thought on this subject is:

If we are healers then what does it matter with whom the patient is

receiving healing at that time? We can never and should never think of

owning a person (ie. " this is my patient " type attitude). Dr. D did the

correct protocol, suggested patient go back to referring Dr A and has been

very clear in communication with both patient and Dr. A about the situation.

Then it is only up to the patient as to whom they feel most comfortable and

ready to begging healing. So if patient feels best at this time with Dr D

and does not want to see Dr A then Dr. D should continue to see the patient.

The same situationn will probably happen in reverse at some point in time.

No hard feelings Dr A, move on to the next patient and know that at this

time the patient is receiving the best care for them at this time.

Caruso ND

ston Mi.

If you don't realize the source you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

When you realize where you come from you naturally become tolerant,

disinterested, amused, kind hearted as a grandmother, dignified as a king.

Immersed in the wonder of the Tao, you can deal with whatever life brings

you. and when death comes you are ready.

Lao Tzu.

<BLOCKQUOTE style='PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #A0C6E5

2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px'><font

style='FONT-SIZE:11px;FONT-FAMILY:tahoma,sans-serif'><hr color=#A0C6E5

size=1>

From: & quot; Sawhill, N.D. & quot;

& lt;docsawhill@... & gt; Reply-To:

To:

Subject: Ethics

question Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2005 15:51:46 -0800 (PST)

<tt>

Hi Unda group,

It was suggested to me to put this question out to a

group of healthcare practitioners. Please let me know

what you think of this situation:

Dr. A is going on vacation for a week and refers 2

patients (needing ongoing treatment)to Dr. B. The

patients show up at Dr. C's office, nearby Dr. B's

office. The person the patients talk to happens to

know Dr. B. Practitioner does not recognize the name

of Dr. A and asks the patient if they have the correct

office or are they supposed to be at Dr. B's office.

The patient replies that they were referred to Dr.

C.'s office. There are two doctors in Dr. C's office.

Dr. C is out of town so the appointments for the week

are made with Dr. D.

Dr. D examines and treats the patients. The patients

improve quickly with the first treatment. At the end

of the week Dr. A is back in town and calls the

patients. The patients tell Dr. A that they are

staying with Dr. D because they are improving quickly

and that they were not happy with Dr. A's treatment.

Dr D suggests that they go back to Dr. A since he is

back in town. The patients tell Dr. D that they would

like to stay with Dr. D.

The question is, is it unethical and/or unprofessional

for Dr. D to continue treating the patients?

Thanks for your help.

Sawhill, N.D.

Beaverton, OR

__________________________________

- PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

</tt>

<tt>

November 2, 2005

I agree with what's already been said. Dr. D told pt to go back to Dr. A.

Patient prefers to stay with Dr. D. That's the patient's choice. --kms

Kathy Sweeney, N.D.

Juneau, AK

Family Practice

>From: " nancy caruso " <NDrose@...>

>Reply-

>

>Subject: RE: Ethics question

>Date: Wed, 02 Nov 2005 12:35:40 -0800

>

>My question/answer/ thought on this subject is:

>

>If we are healers then what does it matter with whom the patient is

>

>receiving healing at that time? We can never and should never think of

>

>owning a person (ie. " this is my patient " type attitude). Dr. D did the

>

>correct protocol, suggested patient go back to referring Dr A and has been

>

>very clear in communication with both patient and Dr. A about the

>situation.

>

>Then it is only up to the patient as to whom they feel most comfortable and

>

>ready to begging healing. So if patient feels best at this time with Dr D

>

>and does not want to see Dr A then Dr. D should continue to see the

>patient.

>

>The same situationn will probably happen in reverse at some point in time.

>

>No hard feelings Dr A, move on to the next patient and know that at this

>

>time the patient is receiving the best care for them at this time.

>

> Caruso ND

>

>ston Mi.

>

>If you don't realize the source you stumble in confusion and sorrow.

>

>When you realize where you come from you naturally become tolerant,

>

>disinterested, amused, kind hearted as a grandmother, dignified as a king.

>

>Immersed in the wonder of the Tao, you can deal with whatever life brings

>

>you. and when death comes you are ready.

>

>Lao Tzu.

>

><BLOCKQUOTE style='PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT:

>#A0C6E5

>

>2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px'><font

>

>style='FONT-SIZE:11px;FONT-FAMILY:tahoma,sans-serif'><hr color=#A0C6E5

>

>size=1>

>

>From: & quot; Sawhill, N.D. & quot;

>

> & lt;docsawhill@... & gt; Reply-To:

>

> To:

>

> Subject: Ethics

>

>question Date: Tue, 1 Nov 2005 15:51:46 -0800 (PST)

>

> <html><body>

>

><tt>

>

>

>

>Hi Unda group,

>

>It was suggested to me to put this question out to a

>

>group of healthcare practitioners. Please let me know

>

>what you think of this situation:

>

>

>

>Dr. A is going on vacation for a week and refers 2

>

>patients (needing ongoing treatment)to Dr. B. The

>

>patients show up at Dr. C's office, nearby Dr. B's

>

>office. The person the patients talk to happens to

>

>know Dr. B. Practitioner does not recognize the name

>

>of Dr. A and asks the patient if they have the correct

>

>office or are they supposed to be at Dr. B's office.

>

>The patient replies that they were referred to Dr.

>

>C.'s office. There are two doctors in Dr. C's office.

>

>Dr. C is out of town so the appointments for the week

>

>are made with Dr. D.

>

>Dr. D examines and treats the patients. The patients

>

>improve quickly with the first treatment. At the end

>

>of the week Dr. A is back in town and calls the

>

>patients. The patients tell Dr. A that they are

>

>staying with Dr. D because they are improving quickly

>

>and that they were not happy with Dr. A's treatment.

>

>Dr D suggests that they go back to Dr. A since he is

>

>back in town. The patients tell Dr. D that they would

>

>like to stay with Dr. D.

>

>

>

>The question is, is it unethical and/or unprofessional

>

>for Dr. D to continue treating the patients?

>

>

>

>Thanks for your help.

>

> Sawhill, N.D.

>

>Beaverton, OR

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>__________________________________

>

> - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

>

><a href= " http://mail. " >http://mail.</a>

>

></tt>

>

>

>

> <div

>style= " width:500px;text-align:right;margin-bottom:1px;color:#909090 " >

>

> <tt>

November 3, 2005

Thank you to everyone who replied! You have helped

take a huge load off my shoulders! Attorneys have a

'self-governing ethics committee " and I am glad to

know that we do too.

Sawhill, ND

Beaverton,OR

__________________________________

- PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.

November 3, 2005

Thank you to everyone who replied! You have helped

take a huge load off my shoulders! Attorneys have a

'self-governing ethics committee " and I am glad to

know that we do too.

Sawhill, ND

Beaverton,OR

__________________________________

- PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005

http://mail.

July 1, 2011

Rob Not being an attorney I would think you would be liable for malpractice if you don't inform the patient of your findings. That is my personal opinion. Eliott Mantell DCSent via BlackBerry by AT&TFrom: <rajeffrey@...>Sender: Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2011 11:40:50 -0500 < >Subject: ethics question I have a patient who recently gave me permission to look at a cervical mri that was ordered by a different physician 2 weeks ago. I went online and downloaded the views and report which shows 2 masses, one on the thyroid and the other close to Medulla, probably a menigioma. I am concerned for this patient due to a recent history of bizarre symptoms and worry that the ordering physican has not contacted him to go over the results. I want to talk about the report with the patient but am worried about overstepping an ethical boundary. Do I have cause for concern?Rob , DC

July 1, 2011

Rob,

To both satisfy the patient needs, your duty and foster inter-professional communication; I'd treat the other professional as I would want to be treated. If one of my patients asked another doc to do this, I'd hope that they'd call me first. If you call the other doctor, they may have it in their mind to call the patient or perhaps they have a time scheduled already to do a report of findings. They will respect you if you call them and say this to the staff,

"I am co-treating one of the doctor's patients. She asked me to review a recent study done by your doctor. The patient would like a report of findings from me and I wanted to give your doctor a heads up on this situation. I'm available to speak with the doctor if they would like to call my office. "

This kind of approach could foster respect which translates to potential referrals, but more than that, it's treating others as you'd want to be treated.

Minga Guerrero DC

ethics question

I have a patient who recently gave me permission to look at a cervical mri that was ordered by a different physician 2 weeks ago. I went online and downloaded the views and report which shows 2 masses, one on the thyroid and the other close to Medulla, probably a menigioma. I am concerned for this patient due to a recent history of bizarre symptoms and worry that the ordering physican has not contacted him to go over the results. I want to talk about the report with the patient but am worried about overstepping an ethical boundary. Do I have cause for concern?

Rob , DC

July 1, 2011

MInga, I love your common sense, attention to detail and ethical perspective.Well said indeed! Schneider DC'PDXOn Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:05 AM, <AboWoman@...> wrote:

Rob,

To both satisfy the patient needs, your duty and foster inter-professional communication; I'd treat the other professional as I would want to be treated. If one of my patients asked another doc to do this, I'd hope that they'd call me first. If you call the other doctor, they may have it in their mind to call the patient or perhaps they have a time scheduled already to do a report of findings. They will respect you if you call them and say this to the staff,

" I am co-treating one of the doctor's patients. She asked me to review a recent study done by your doctor. The patient would like a report of findings from me and I wanted to give your doctor a heads up on this situation. I'm available to speak with the doctor if they would like to call my office. "

This kind of approach could foster respect which translates to potential referrals, but more than that, it's treating others as you'd want to be treated.

Minga Guerrero DC

ethics question

I have a patient who recently gave me permission to look at a cervical mri that was ordered by a different physician 2 weeks ago. I went online and downloaded the views and report which shows 2 masses, one on the thyroid and the other close to Medulla, probably a menigioma. I am concerned for this patient due to a recent history of bizarre symptoms and worry that the ordering physican has not contacted him to go over the results. I want to talk about the report with the patient but am worried about overstepping an ethical boundary. Do I have cause for concern?

Rob , DC

-- Schneider DC PDX

July 1, 2011

Wait! I was going to say that!

Dang. Snooze and lose.

E. Abrahamson, D.C.

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: Schneider <portlandchiro1@...>

Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2011 11:59:11 -0700

<AboWoman@...>

Cc: <rajeffrey@...>, < >

Subject: Re: ethics question

MInga, I love your common sense, attention to detail and ethical perspective.Well said indeed!

Schneider DC'

PDX

On Fri, Jul 1, 2011 at 11:05 AM, <AboWoman@...> wrote:

Rob,

To both satisfy the patient needs, your duty and foster inter-professional communication; I'd treat the other professional as I would want to be treated. If one of my patients asked another doc to do this, I'd hope that they'd call me first. If you call the other doctor, they may have it in their mind to call the patient or perhaps they have a time scheduled already to do a report of findings. They will respect you if you call them and say this to the staff,

" I am co-treating one of the doctor's patients. She asked me to review a recent study done by your doctor. The patient would like a report of findings from me and I wanted to give your doctor a heads up on this situation. I'm available to speak with the doctor if they would like to call my office. "

This kind of approach could foster respect which translates to potential referrals, but more than that, it's treating others as you'd want to be treated.

Minga Guerrero DC

ethics question

I have a patient who recently gave me permission to look at a cervical mri that was ordered by a different physician 2 weeks ago. I went online and downloaded the views and report which shows 2 masses, one on the thyroid and the other close to Medulla, probably a menigioma. I am concerned for this patient due to a recent history of bizarre symptoms and worry that the ordering physican has not contacted him to go over the results. I want to talk about the report with the patient but am worried about overstepping an ethical boundary. Do I have cause for concern?

Rob , DC

--

Schneider DC

PDX

March 7, 2012

If patient is HIV positive..and does not want this information to be disclosed to anyone..is it the moral duty of the dentist to inform his/her spouse ?

March 8, 2012

WHAT IS PATENCY OR POTENCY PREPARATION? THANK YOU. From: manochitra d <manochithradurairaju@...> To:

Sent: Wednesday, 7 March 2012, 17:16 Subject: Re: Ethics question

Hi,i think you should not disclose..this is from GMC regulationInforming sexual contacts of patients with a serious communicable disease

10 You may disclose information to a known sexual contact of a patient with a sexually transmitted serious communicable disease if you have reason to think that they are at risk of infection and that the patient has not

informed them and cannot be persuaded to do so.in such circumstances, you should tell the patient before you make the disclosure, if it is practicable and safe to do so. You must be prepared to justify a decision to

disclose personal information without consent.11 When you are tracing contacts and notifying partners, you should not disclose the identity of the patient, if practicable. but there is a clause there which is,

The NHS (Venereal Diseases) Regulations 1974, The NHS Trusts (Venereal Diseases) Directions 1991 and The NHS Trusts and Primary Care Trusts (Sexually Transmitted Diseases)Directions 2000 state that various NHS bodies in England

and Wales must â€˜take all necessary steps to secure that any information capable of identifying an individualâ€¦ with respect to persons examined or treated for any sexually transmitted disease shall not be disclosed except â€“ (a) for

the purpose of communicating that information to a medical practitioner, or to a person employed under the direction of a medical practitioner in connection with the treatment of persons suffering from such disease or the

prevention of the spread thereof, and ( for the purpose of such treatment and preventionâ€™. There are different interpretations of the Regulations and Directions, and concerns about their compatibility with the European

Convention on Human Rights. In particular, there have been concerns that a strict interpretation would prevent the disclosure of relevant information, except to other doctors or those working under their supervision, even with the

patientâ€™s consent or to known sexual contacts in the public interest. Our view is that the Regulations and Directions do not preclude disclosure if it would otherwise be lawful at common law, for example with the patientâ€™s consent or in

the public interest without consent On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 3:23 PM, Shipra Bapna <bapnashipra@...> wrote:

If patient is HIV positive..and does not want this information to be disclosed to anyone..is it the moral duty of the dentist to inform his/her spouse ?

March 8, 2012

patency preparation in endo is cleaning the whole length of the canal so as not to produce an apical blockage...done using a small file....so apical foramen is not widened... From: ARTHUR TADEVOSYAN <arthur_tadevosyan@...> " " < > Sent: Thursday, 8 March 2012 1:13 PM Subject: Re: Ethics question