hello

[Guest guest]

edited for brevity and topposting...

Welcome to the group, Melinda -- if you have a website, link it in your

signature. Enjoy your membership, and get to know folks..it's a friendly place.

Anya

thanks, Enya. I'll add my website when i find someone to make it. i'm not in

a hurry becuase I still don't know what i want, hopefully in the next 6 months

i';ll have one to show.

lol. i feel so stupid. I'm still learning how to use the database here.

what form do you prefer, resin or absolute for perfume oil? i'm looking for

labdanum, bezoine, and peru balsm (this one has essentia oil form too). TIA

Melinda

\

[Guest guest]

--- Anya <mccoynewsguy (DOT) <mailto:mccoy%40newsguy.com> com> wrote:

Ach! -- one of my oldest buds from the internet - I knew her before

kidlets~

She finally managed to stumble her way over here to open our eyes all to the

beautifully twisted world of dirtyroses and vintage sassy cards and her

apothecarian perfumes, although, strangely (her favorite world) she is shy

about sharing them. Now I have exposed all her secrets, she will blossom

forth, a rose by any other name....or a Jeanne Rose prole, as the need

be....

Anya

Anya~

Why am I not surprised that you'd tell my secrets ? How could I resist with

the faboo description of DR that you gave? haa!

As soon as my packaging comes in I'll be sampling you as well as others who

would want to try some of my products. Not just perfume either

There will be more than perfumes on the site - it's just bouncing back and

forth between being the mad alchemist, webmistress and making magazine

deadlines for artwork in addition to feeding/chasing/entertaining/reading to

the kidlets....leaves me little time to focus on one thing for more than 30

mins at a time. Throw in the fact that I have ADD and I'm always amazed

that anything gets done!

" Before kidlets " - that was such a long luxurious vacation compared to now!

The Terror Tots do keep me on my toes and sometimes in tears when they find

my secret stash of special oils and pour them out on the kitchen floor.

Didn't I know, that they're " making fumes and smelly things. " lol

[Guest guest]

Thank you for today`s comments. I really needed to read this. I have just spent the afternoon organising a swimming trip for muslim women and children. Funding throught the `healthy living criteria` of a local council rather than a PCT. The women came last week full of enthusiasm and excitement. We all had a fantastic time, and they were looking forward to today`s outing. However, this week, someone told them (a religious male), it was against their muslim religion to go swimming, despite having a secluded pool, female life guards and appropriate dress. Most of them believed it, except three women - one of whom said she was allowed for `medical reasons`. The others were too frightened to come in case they were seen as unreligious or disrespectful. They all wanted to come but felt the full force of their community and a male perspective which restricted what was an enjoyable experience for them. How sad and angry I felt for these women. Someone had

decided choices for their bodies and their children and held them at home. It made me think how women always struggle to claim their bodies, opportunities for their children and men judging women; except for those who came anyway and will no doubt experience disapproval. I haven`t given up on this project, but the fight for women always continues even in 2006. Jeanetteholtz <holtz62@...> wrote: JudyQuite an interesting read for a senate letter. How intrigued I was that your letter did not generate much response.Interesting you ask about 'where is the back pay for bank staff HV's'?I wonder how you would get an answer to this? try your UNSON

rep, these are the people who fight a daily struggle for the rights of all workers and they have a very big 'Women in Unison' department that influences government changes around the rights of working families and equality in the workplace! As a result we now have european employment law adopted to offer value to the family unit (greater maternity, paternity and carers leave in NHS).I was quite sad at your reflection on how Kurdish and Turkish women would embrace or reject their human rights to be equal in EVERY way with men.So I think you would value the excellent articles written for International Women's Day (08/03/06)in the Independant newspaper. This reminded us all of our global reponsibility to acknowledge the atrocities that happen to Women all over the world. Women who survive the struggle of living in a male dominated community or regime, where women are tortured, raped and murdered daily. Every women on this planet has a

responsibility to celebrate the achievements of her predecessor who fought the feminist struggle!We are never to think ourselves lucky, nor undermine women who live in a society that does not support them in upholding family values, and we in UK are guilty of judging women who are unable to do this, we watch from our own back yard, tut, and do nothing.as for Kurdish and Turkish women and their human rights, you mention girls and education, their rights to it!This is why Turkey has not been allowed into the EU, the human rights of the child and especially the female child were never met. If a society prevents Women being educated, its a full proof male power plan that prevents or slows female analysis of their plight and acceptance of inequality. May I relate to the works of Wollstonecraft? 'A Vindication of the Rights of Women' (1792), she argues that the intellect will always govern. Wollstoncraft sought to persuade women

to aquire strength of mind body through education. her works challenges love, passion, sex, property, marriage and the ambiguities of women who might believe that to be free they must be like men. So the struugle even in 1792 challenged the place of women in society, debating the strictures of dress in Islamic fundamentalist countries to the rights of equal pay. I am by no means admonishing the behaviour of our own male society, I still work in a very large organisation called the NHS, where board rooms are still drenched in inequality, where the glass ceiling still exists. Gender issues in our NHS are still contributing to a male dominated drain of finance that has recently contributed to the demise of the role of the Health Visitor. In its favour of the financial empire of power of the medical profession (acknowledged by the 'Independant' 21/08/06, GP's now get a mean wage of £81, 844). This in itself has contributed to the removal of and

undervaluing of the family support so long provided by the health visitor. We now have lots of lovely thriving little businesses around the country and in the same corner pct's in huge debts and hospitals closing.As I say, we as health visitors more than anyone else, be we male or female, have a huge responsibility to advocate on behalf of all women and all children.Social injustce is a poverty that we must acknowledge for and on behalf of all Women.Judy it was an eye opener to read your message, if only to remind us of how to value women! Many ThanksMargaret Holtz

Try the all-new . "The New Version is radically easier to use" – The Wall Street Journal

[Guest guest]

Dear Margaret, Thank you for your kind reply. I have yet to tackle the issue re:back pay for bank staff. I'm hearing mutterings that bank staff are paid more than contract staff because their holiday pay is given to them over and above their salary. I need to sit and work out the sums but then contract staff get paid for being off sick which bank staff do not etc etc! I still think it is an unfair situation. I will be contacting the local representative acting for the bank staff on the Agenda for Change. Further to thoughts from Turkey.My husband is amazed at the way European women treat their partners/husbands. We have a restaurant and I will say when you watch the tourists, the women are much more physically aggressive toward their men than vica versa! They always seem to be hitting them on the back or punching them on the arm. The women are also

much more likely to be drunk than the men and are very aggressive and billigerent as a rule! Binge drinking seems to be the norm on holiday for women and age does not seem to be a bar! 60 year old ladettes is not a particularly attractive sight! So I do wonder sometimes whether we have taken our emancipation too far? I wouldn't want to loose what we have gained because it was and still is, a long hard battle for women to be equal in all areas with men but maybe we need to learn to "grow-up" and start to respect what we have and show men and other cultures that we can handle equality of the sexes? I think for those who live in countries such as Turkey ( and remember Turkey is a very liberal Muslim country compared to many) and don't ever visit abroad, the view they have of womens equality is somewhat tarnished because of the behaviour they witness from European women when their on holiday. Why, should

they be remotely interested in letting their own women have equality because they probably fear that they will behave in the same way? Women on holiday in Turkey seem to take it as their right to sleep with whom ever they want, regardless as to whether they are married ( I am aware that alot of the Turkish men are not exactly open about their marital status).Safe sex although possibly practised at home, goes out the window when they're away (we have constant ads in the winter about safe sex on the TV and the pharmacy always prominently display condoms in the windows)! It is against the teachings of the Khoran for people to have sex outside of wedlock and again what they see from equality is women and men having sexual relations and they are not married. If you think about it in the UK this was unacceptable until the sixties and as a single teenage parent myself in the late 70's, I know that the stigma was

still around even then. My father thought the village and his work colleagues would ostracise him for having a daughter with a baby and he took along time to forgive me, although he never showed this to my daughter, only the unconditional love of a grand parent. This was only 29yrs ago, not so long if you look at the big picture. I don't know but I would guess that the incidence of a teenage pregnancy is much less likely in the Muslim community than in a non-muslim community, particularly in the UK. Perhaps that was partly the reason why they have arranged marriages and often why the couple are so young, this would obviously allow sexual experimentation without repercussion of a baby outside of wedlock? I have often wondered about homosexual and lesbians born into a society where arranged marriages still occur like Turkey and many other Muslim countries. These marriages often occur when the couple are only in their mid-late

teens and often this age group have not come to grips with their sexuality at this age. So I have often imagined that there must be many tied together by marriage where they are sexually incompatable! This must be soul destroying for them. I don't know if there is increase in suicides in these cultures where this type of marriage still exsists? In Turkey there has been a shift and often arranged marriages will now occur when the couple are in their 20's and some parents are even being persuaded to not make arrangements for their children by their children and the parents are listening to them. However, there is the other side, many of the children want an arranged marriage, they feel that their parent knows best and they will say it must be very difficult and confusing for us to find the right partner because we are able to choose anyone we want! Certainly in Turkey, the divorce rate is not anywhere near as high as the UK. I am so sorry that the women were persuaded by an elder or male not to attend the swimming classes. Perhaps, there is an element of fear in the male camp? May be asking the Iman (Mosque Leader) to come and view the pool and facilities and explain what and why you are offering this opportunity to the women you will find that those that didn't come the second time start to come back.I know it will probably go against the grain but it maybe worth asking him in future for his blessing on any other activities you might like to set up for Muslim women. They are the leaders of the community and if you can get him to see what you are trying to do and that you are not trying to teach them wicked non-muslim ways and he sanctions it, then the other males will follow and will allow the women to participate.Then, once you have the women attending with their husbands blessings, you can probably do alot more work with them and they will respond more

because you have removed some of the fear they may have, especially if they see themselves as defying their husband. Also the younger husbands may not actually mind their wives attending but his/her father might and if you're living in your fathers house and you also work for him he could make life very uncomfortable for you and your family, so they tow the line and stop the women attending. Please be assured I am not saying this is always the case and I am aware there are many "bullies" out there. Please note that Turkey has, as of this year bought in laws that punish perpetrators of Domestic Violence and it is now a prisonable offence but I will say I'm not sure how committed the police will be to enforcing this law initially but again, like the UK, it took quite a few years for the law to be changed here and we still have an unacceptable level of Domestic Violence. I know this only to well from the families that I visit on my caseload and I often hear

from the victims that he got away with it and he's now living with someone else and she will probably suffer the same fate! Funnily enough women in Turkey had the right to vote at national and local level long before Mrs Pankhurst won it for us! Sorry another long sermon from me. Judy Kara holtz <holtz62@...> wrote: JudyQuite an interesting read for a senate letter. How intrigued I was that your letter did not generate much response.Interesting you ask about 'where is the back pay for bank staff HV's'?I wonder how you would get an answer to this? try your UNSON rep, these are the people who fight a daily struggle for the rights of all workers and they have a very big 'Women in Unison' department that influences government changes around the rights of working families and equality in the workplace! As a result we now have european employment law adopted to offer value to the family unit (greater maternity, paternity and carers leave in NHS).I was quite sad at your reflection on how Kurdish and Turkish women would embrace or reject their human rights to be equal in EVERY way

with men.So I think you would value the excellent articles written for International Women's Day (08/03/06)in the Independant newspaper. This reminded us all of our global reponsibility to acknowledge the atrocities that happen to Women all over the world. Women who survive the struggle of living in a male dominated community or regime, where women are tortured, raped and murdered daily. Every women on this planet has a responsibility to celebrate the achievements of her predecessor who fought the feminist struggle!We are never to think ourselves lucky, nor undermine women who live in a society that does not support them in upholding family values, and we in UK are guilty of judging women who are unable to do this, we watch from our own back yard, tut, and do nothing.as for Kurdish and Turkish women and their human rights, you mention girls and education, their rights to it!This is why Turkey has not been allowed into the EU, the

human rights of the child and especially the female child were never met. If a society prevents Women being educated, its a full proof male power plan that prevents or slows female analysis of their plight and acceptance of inequality. May I relate to the works of Wollstonecraft? 'A Vindication of the Rights of Women' (1792), she argues that the intellect will always govern. Wollstoncraft sought to persuade women to aquire strength of mind body through education. her works challenges love, passion, sex, property, marriage and the ambiguities of women who might believe that to be free they must be like men. So the struugle even in 1792 challenged the place of women in society, debating the strictures of dress in Islamic fundamentalist countries to the rights of equal pay. I am by no means admonishing the behaviour of our own male society, I still work in a very large organisation called the NHS, where board rooms are still drenched in

inequality, where the glass ceiling still exists. Gender issues in our NHS are still contributing to a male dominated drain of finance that has recently contributed to the demise of the role of the Health Visitor. In its favour of the financial empire of power of the medical profession (acknowledged by the 'Independant' 21/08/06, GP's now get a mean wage of £81, 844). This in itself has contributed to the removal of and undervaluing of the family support so long provided by the health visitor. We now have lots of lovely thriving little businesses around the country and in the same corner pct's in huge debts and hospitals closing.As I say, we as health visitors more than anyone else, be we male or female, have a huge responsibility to advocate on behalf of all women and all children.Social injustce is a poverty that we must acknowledge for and on behalf of all Women.Judy it was an eye opener to read your message, if only to

remind us of how to value women! Many ThanksMargaret Holtz Greeting from Hayri & Judy Kara, Lush Restaurant, Kusadasi, Turkey. Judy has missed everyone but most of all her gorgeous husband.She is working in the UK to get money to expand Lush.She

will b back next year.Hope you had a good holiday.See you again.

All new "The new Interface is stunning in its simplicity and ease of use." - PC Magazine

[Guest guest]

Judy a wonderful enlightenment of your experience and culture, thanks for the knowledge! Margaret Holtz

[Guest guest]

Interesting points, Hayri. I think we're all tempted to stereotype

cultural groups, but in practical day to day moral decisions about

our behaviour, we're all individuals responding to cultural norms in

our own way.

Those aging ladettes may possibly be behaving similarly to the way

they would at home on a Friday night, but it's possible they're

escaping from a mundane and restricted life at home and using the

opportunity of a foreign holiday for bad behaviour where their

families and neighbours can't see. They don't have to take some of

the consequences of social disapproval and shame in their own

neighbourhoods. At home, they're possibly quite ordinary mothers,

grandmothers, housewives and workers whose day to day behaviour may

be more sedate. There's something about being in an alien place and

dropping one's normal social inhibitions which I've also seen

affecting overseas tourists here in the UK, doing things they

wouldn't ever get away with at home.

Violent and aggressive behaviour, reckless sex with strangers and

public drunkenness is really no more acceptable in either society

whether it's men or women. It's just bad behaviour, plain and

simple. Look at the legal systems in both countries and spend a day

in a local court watching such sordid cases pass before magistrates.

You won't see it being condoned. But we should punish the individual

for what they as individuals choose to do, not their whole social

group.

I don't think this sort of behaviour has anything to do with

emancipation or women or any other group in society. There's a world

of difference between liberation and licentiousness. Liberation is

about recognising the common humanity of men and women and not

oppressing or restricting the lives and opportunities of girls or

women simply because they are born female. It's about our shared

human dignity. Licentiousness is personal or group bad behaviour

which very often hurts or offends others. Human dignity has nothing

to do with this! Human beings at their worst, rather.

I agree that such bad behaviour is likely to be offensive to people

working and living in holiday resorts. Loud aggressive drunks are

never good company at close quarters. I live in a popular holiday

area myself, next door to a pub. Drunks are pretty ghastly, aren't

they? But so are religous bigots. It's a mistake to say that bad

behaviour by a few individuals ever justifies social oppression and

fewer human rights for the majority.

Sermons are catching on!

.

On 30 Aug 2006 at 18:52, Hayri Kara wrote:

>

> Dear Margaret,

>

> Thank you for your kind reply.

>

> I have yet to tackle the issue re:back pay for bank staff. I'm

> hearing mutterings thatbank staff are paid more than contract staff

> becausetheir holiday pay is given to them over and above their salary.

> I need to sit and work out the sums but then contract staff get paid

> for being off sick which bank staff do not etc etc! I still think it

> is an unfair situation. I will be contacting the local representative

> acting for the bank staff on the Agenda for Change.

>

>

> Further to thoughts from Turkey.My husband is amazed at the way

> European women treat their partners/husbands. We have a restaurant and

> I will say when you watch the tourists, the women are much more

> physically aggressive toward their men than vica versa! They always

> seem to be hitting them on the back or punching them on the arm. The

> women are also much more likely to be drunk than the men and are very

> aggressive and billigerent as a rule! Binge drinking seems to be the

> norm on holiday for women and age does not seem to be a bar! 60 year

> old ladettes is not a particularly attractive sight!

>

> So I do wonder sometimes whether we have taken our emancipation too

> far? I wouldn't want to loose what we have gained because it was and

> still is, a long hard battle for women to be equal in all areas with

> men but maybe we need to learn to " grow-up " and start to respect what

> we have and show men and other cultures that we can handle equality of

> the sexes?

>

> I think for those who live in countries such as Turkey ( and remember

> Turkey is a very liberal Muslim country compared to many) and don't

> ever visit abroad,the view they have of womens equality is somewhat

> tarnished because of the behaviour they witness from European women

> when their on holiday. Why, should they be remotely interested in

> letting their own women have equality because they probably fear that

> they will behave in the same way?

>

> Women on holiday in Turkey seem to take it as their right to sleep

> with whom ever they want, regardless as to whether they are married (

> I am aware that alot of the Turkish men are not exactly open about

> their marital status).Safe sex although possibly practised at home,

> goes out the window when they're away (we have constant ads in the

> winter about safe sex on the TV and the pharmacy always prominently

> display condoms in the windows)! It is against the teachings of the

> Khoran for people to have sex outside of wedlock and again what they

> see from equality is women and men having sexual relations and they

> are not married.

>

> If you think about it in the UK this was unacceptable until the

> sixties and as a single teenage parent myself in the late 70's, I know

> that the stigmawas still around even then. My father thought the

> village and his work colleagues would ostracise him for having a

> daughter with a baby and he took along time to forgive me, although he

> never showed this to my daughter, only the unconditional love of a

> grand parent. This was only 29yrs ago, not so long if you look at the

> big picture. I don't know but I would guess that the incidence of a

> teenage pregnancy is much less likely in the Muslim community than in

> a non-muslim community, particularly in the UK. Perhaps that was

> partly the reason why they have arranged marriages and often why the

> couple are so young, this would obviously allow sexual experimentation

> without repercussion of a baby outside of wedlock?

>

> I have often wondered about homosexual andlesbians born into a

> society where arranged marriages still occur like Turkey and many

> other Muslim countries. These marriagesoften occur when the couple are

> only in their mid-late teens and often this age group have not come to

> grips with their sexuality at this age. So I have often imagined that

> there must be many tied together by marriage where they are sexually

> incompatable! This must be soul destroying for them. I don't know if

> there is increase in suicides in these cultures where this type of

> marriage still exsists?

>

> In Turkey there has been a shift and oftenarranged marriages will now

> occur when the couple are in their 20's and some parents are even

> being persuaded to not make arrangements for their children by their

> children and the parents are listening to them. However, there is the

> other side, many of the children want an arranged marriage, they feel

> that their parent knows best and they will say it must be very

> difficult and confusing for us to find the right partner because we

> are able to choose anyone we want! Certainly in Turkey, the divorce

> rate is not anywhere near as high as the UK.

>

>

> I am so sorry that the women were persuaded by an elder or male not to

> attend the swimming classes. Perhaps, there is an element of fear in

> the male camp? May be asking the Iman (Mosque Leader) to come and view

> the pool and facilities andexplain what and why you are offering this

> opportunity to the women you will find that those that didn't come the

> second time start to come back.I know it will probably go against the

> grain but it maybe worth asking him in future for his blessing on any

> other activities you might like to set up for Muslim women. They are

> the leaders of the community and if you can get him to see what you

> are trying to do and that you are not trying to teach them wicked

> non-muslim ways and he sanctions it, then the other males will follow

> and will allow the women to participate.Then, once you have the women

> attending with their husbands blessings, you can probably do alot more

> work with them and they will respond more because you have removed

> some of the fear they may have, especially if they see themselves as

> defying their husband. Also the younger husbands maynot actually mind

> their wives attending but his/her father might and if you're living in

> your fathers house and you also work for him he could make life very

> uncomfortable for you and your family, so they tow the line and stop

> the women attending. Please be assured I am not saying this is always

> the case and I am aware there are many " bullies " out there. Please

> note that Turkey has, as of this year bought in laws that punish

> perpetrators of Domestic Violence and it is now a prisonable offence

> but I will say I'm not sure how committed the police will be to

> enforcing this law initially but again, like the UK, it took quite a

> few years for the law to be changed here and we still have an

> unacceptable level of Domestic Violence. I know this only to well from

> the families that I visit on my caseload and I often hear from the

> victims that he got away with it and he's now living with someone else

> and she will probably suffer the same fate!

>

> Funnily enough women in Turkey had the right to vote atnational and

> local level long before Mrs Pankhurstwon it for us!

>

> Sorry another long sermon from me.

>

> Judy Kara

>

>

>

>

> holtz <holtz62@...> wrote:

> Judy

>

> Quite an interesting read for a senate letter. How intrigued I was

> that your letter did not generate much response.

>

> I with men.

>

> So I think you would value the excellent articles written for

> International Women's Day (08/03/06)in the Independant newspaper.

> This reminded us all of our global reponsibility to acknowledge

> the atrocities that happen to Women all over the world.

>

> Women who survive the struggle of living in a male dominated

> community or regime, where women are tortured, raped and murdered

> daily. Every women on this planet has a responsibility to

> celebrate the achievements of her predecessor who fought the

> feminist struggle!

>

> We are never to think ourselves lucky, nor undermine women who

> live in a society that does not support them in upholding family

> values, and we in UK are guilty of judging women who are unable to

> do this, we watch from our own back yard, tut, and do nothing.

>

> as for Kurdish and Turkish women and their human rights, you

> mention girls and education, their rights to it!

>

> This is why Turkey has not been allowed into the EU, the human

> rights of the child and especially the female child were never

> met. If a society prevents Women being educated, its a full proof

> male power plan that prevents or slows female analysis of their

> plight and acceptance of inequality.

>

> May I relate to the works of Wollstonecraft? 'A Vindication

> of the Rights of Women' (1792), she argues that the intellect will

> always govern. Wollstoncraft sought to persuade women to aquire

> strength of mind body through education. her works challenges

> love, passion, sex, property, marriage and the ambiguities of

> women who might believe that to be free they must be like men. So

> the struugle even in 1792 challenged the place of women in

> society, debating the strictures of dress in Islamic

> fundamentalist countries to the rights of equal pay.

>

> I am by no means admonishing the behaviour of our own male

> society, I still work in a very large organisation called the NHS,

> where board rooms are still drenched in inequality, where the

> glass ceiling still exists.

>

> Gender issues in our NHS are still contributing to a male

> dominated drain of finance that has recently contributed to the

> demise of the role of the Health Visitor. In its favour of the

> financial empire of power of the medical profession (acknowledged

> by the 'Independant' 21/08/06, GP's now get a mean wage of £81,

> 844). This in itself has contributed to the removal of and

> undervaluing of the family support so long provided by the health

> visitor. We now have lots of lovely thriving little businesses

> around the country and in the same corner pct's in huge debts and

> hospitals closing.

>

> As I say, we as health visitors more than anyone else, be we male

> or female, have a huge responsibility to advocate on behalf of all

> women and all children.

>

> Social injustce is a poverty that we must acknowledge for and on

> behalf of all Women.

>

> Judy it was an eye opener to read your message, if only to remind

> us of how to value women! Many Thanks

>

> Margaret Holtz

>

>

>

>

>

> Greeting from Hayri & Judy Kara, Lush Restaurant, Kusadasi,

> Turkey.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

it is great to have you in our group april. it is wonderful for you to have found this group. there are so many great people here to talk to and that can offer an ear and lend advice. hope to hear from you soon. evelynrr.com> wrote: My name is April. I want to thank you for accepting me into your group. I have Lupus. I found this out in March of this year. It has been a tough road but with the support of my family

and several Christian groups and my Lupus groups, I am doing a little bit better. Altough at times I still need an extra boost. My family is struggling right along with me and sometimes they don't really understand what to do or how to help. I know that this group is all about those who are sick. I am truly sorry that each and everyone of you in this group are. I understand that we all need some one to talk with and lean on from time to time. I know I do. It is hard to communicate with those who don't completely understand what it is your going through. I am truly grateful that you have welcomed me to this group. I hope to make many friends. And I hope that I too, can be of some help and support for you. Thank you.

Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small Business.

[Guest guest]

it is great to have you in our group april. it is wonderful for you to have found this group. there are so many great people here to talk to and that can offer an ear and lend advice. hope to hear from you soon. evelynrr.com> wrote: My name is April. I want to thank you for accepting me into your group. I have Lupus. I found this out in March of this year. It has been a tough road but with the support of my family

and several Christian groups and my Lupus groups, I am doing a little bit better. Altough at times I still need an extra boost. My family is struggling right along with me and sometimes they don't really understand what to do or how to help. I know that this group is all about those who are sick. I am truly sorry that each and everyone of you in this group are. I understand that we all need some one to talk with and lean on from time to time. I know I do. It is hard to communicate with those who don't completely understand what it is your going through. I am truly grateful that you have welcomed me to this group. I hope to make many friends. And I hope that I too, can be of some help and support for you. Thank you.

Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small Business.

[Guest guest]

Welcome April! I'm glad you're here. Yes, unfortunately our loved ones don't always understand illness, and it is very frustrating at times. I'm very fortunate that both my husband and I have experienced illness and being a caregiver, so we can openly discuss issues. We are in a phase now that he is resentful of me for my illness currently, and has guilt over it. It is very normal for resentment to happen, and it doesn't have to be a negative thing, as long as you discuss it without any anger, it can dissipate easily. One thing that helped is him watching this group for a period of time. He saw how others struggled to understand, and it brought us closer together. It can sometimes help to see a counselor with the entire family, or it can help to have educational nights where you all sit and watch a program about your illness, or discuss informational websites.

Hugs,

-----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of AprilSent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 3:09 AM Subject: Hello

My name is April. I want to thank you for accepting me into your group. I have Lupus. I found this out in March of this year. It has been a tough road but with the support of my family and several Christian groups and my Lupus groups, I am doing a little bit better. Altough at times I still need an extra boost. My family is struggling right along with me and sometimes they don't really understand what to do or how to help. I know that this group is all about those who are sick. I am truly sorry that each and everyone of you in this group are. I understand that we all need some one to talk with and lean on from time to time. I know I do. It is hard to communicate with those who don't completely understand what it is your going through. I am truly grateful that you have welcomed me to this group. I hope to make many friends. And I hope that I too, can be of some help and support for you. Thank you.

[Guest guest]

Welcome April! I'm glad you're here. Yes, unfortunately our loved ones don't always understand illness, and it is very frustrating at times. I'm very fortunate that both my husband and I have experienced illness and being a caregiver, so we can openly discuss issues. We are in a phase now that he is resentful of me for my illness currently, and has guilt over it. It is very normal for resentment to happen, and it doesn't have to be a negative thing, as long as you discuss it without any anger, it can dissipate easily. One thing that helped is him watching this group for a period of time. He saw how others struggled to understand, and it brought us closer together. It can sometimes help to see a counselor with the entire family, or it can help to have educational nights where you all sit and watch a program about your illness, or discuss informational websites.

Hugs,

-----Original Message-----From: [mailto: ] On Behalf Of AprilSent: Tuesday, September 05, 2006 3:09 AM Subject: Hello

My name is April. I want to thank you for accepting me into your group. I have Lupus. I found this out in March of this year. It has been a tough road but with the support of my family and several Christian groups and my Lupus groups, I am doing a little bit better. Altough at times I still need an extra boost. My family is struggling right along with me and sometimes they don't really understand what to do or how to help. I know that this group is all about those who are sick. I am truly sorry that each and everyone of you in this group are. I understand that we all need some one to talk with and lean on from time to time. I know I do. It is hard to communicate with those who don't completely understand what it is your going through. I am truly grateful that you have welcomed me to this group. I hope to make many friends. And I hope that I too, can be of some help and support for you. Thank you.

[Guest guest]

Hello April, may your time here be a kindhearted and

comforting feeling. My name is Adam I have

Depression,Diabetes,Asperger Syndrome- which tends to make my social

& communication not that good however, i'll do my best to learn

about Lupus to better understand you as a person overall.

Adam

[Guest guest]

Thank you so much for the welcome. I appreciate very much you

taking the time to learn more about my disease. I am still learning of it

myself so any help I can receive or new information I would be grateful in

learning. I have not heard of Aspersers Syndrome. I will certainly read up on

that as well. Thank you again for the warm welcome.

-----Original

Message-----

From:

[mailto: ]On Behalf

Of Adam Wilder

Sent: Thursday, September 07, 2006

10:54 AM

Subject: Re: Hello

Hello April,

may your time here be a kindhearted and

comforting feeling. My name is Adam I have

Depression,Diabetes,Asperger Syndrome- which tends to make my social

& communication not that good however, i'll do my best to learn

about Lupus to better understand you as a person overall.

Adam

[Guest guest]

>hi helen .. it as tacken me 15 years to fined out i have conns

snydrome . were u from am from huddersfeild uk

>

> It is so nice to be able to talk to other very special people. I am just

> part way through the maze and at each twist and turn I often feel like

> giving up then look at my children and darling husband and know I can't

> leave them.

>

> My symptoms go back right to 1988 when my youngest child was born

(we have 3

> of our own and then acquired another teenager last year). There was

nothing

> you could go to your primary physician (GP here in the UK) with -

general

> tiredness, gaining weight, back pain, running to the toilet a lot,

thirst. I

> did go to a number of doctors in various places (at that time my

husband's

> job meant we were moved every couple of years) and did have some very

> general tests done for sugar diabetes (borderline negative) and iron

levels

> (higher than normal) and over the years have been told it is because

I had 3

> children under 5 and anyone would be tired, I had a hectic

lifestyle, it was

> my age, and the back pain was caused by osteoarthritis and of course

I had

> depression. My potassium levels were low and I was given potassium

salts and

> the second test showed they were better but still low. My Doc said

that was

> okay and to stop the salts but a third test would be a waste of

money. How I

> wish I had insisted! He also told me a lot of my problems were

because I was

> fat and gave me a diet to follow. I followed the diet and my rate of

weight

> gain increased. Prior to giving birth to my third child I was always

> slightly underweight for my height.

>

> My previous GP was a horror. If he couldn't fix it then he wasn't

interested

> and refused to refer anyone on to a specialist but at least he did

agree to

> check out my blood pressure which was 190/105 at that point. I knew

it was

> too high as I'd taken part in some research at work as part of a control

> group and had to be dropped from the programme because of persistently

> dangerously high blood pressure. My GP " monitored " my " raised " BP

every week

> for nearly a year but did nothing. Told me it was due to being obese and

> also my age was to blame and everyone got high blood pressure as

they got

> old (I am 43).

>

> Then I had a medical at work and they sent me straight from work to

my GP

> with a note asking him to instigate treatment and inform them of the

outcome

> but in the meantime I was too much of a risk at work and would not

be able

> to continue my employment. At that point I was given a beta-blocker

to which

> I was allergic (I woke up in the local hospital emergency room and

was told

> my BP was off the scale and to see my GP asap). I was then given

Istin (a

> calcium channel blocker) and I went into toxic shock. My own GP was on

> holiday when this happened and his locum saw me. The locum managed

to keep

> me alive and refereed me to an allergist at the big city hospital.

That was

> last Christmas (2001).

>

> When my own GP found out about the referral he was not pleased and

tried to

> cancel it. He also gave me a diuretic (not a potassium sparing type)

which I

> did not collect having checked it out with my best friend who is a

> pharmacist. I had a stand up fight with my GP and I don't know if he

did try

> to cancel the appointment but it was already in the system and I was

seen

> the following week.

>

> The allergist is wonderful. She is a very beautiful South African

Lady and

> very thorough. I think they took a whole arm full of blood and I had

a real

> good medical top to toe. My blood pressure was still very high and the

> potassium levels were down through the floor. They also found I had

severe

> allergy to most starches and can only eat rice, millet and tapioca

starch

> with confidence and maize starch if we are sure it is not

contaminated with

> gluten or potato. This does make life interesting when I need to eat!

>

> The allergist sent me to another part of the hospital for in-patient

> investigation of the blood pressure and lack of potassium (at that

stage the

> K level was 1.8 and normal is 4.5 to 5.5 I think) and my BP was so

high it

> could not be measured on a normal meter. They had to add numbers to the

> charts to record it. I have been in hospital for 3 of the last 4

weeks and

> have been wired for sound several times. I now hove no secrets! The

> endocrinologist is fabulous and talks to you not down to you or over

your

> head. At one point he said to me " You are a highly intelligent woman and

> this must have been very distressing for you. The mess of your body

> chemistry will have caused some brain damage and you will feel like your

> memory is Swiss cheese......... " I was SO relieved. At one point I

really

> thought I had lost my marbles. He also wrote key points down and let

me look

> stuff up in his own reference library.

>

>

> They have eliminated Cushings Disease and Rhea but all along Simon (the

> Endo) said he thought it could well be Conn's Disease. The samples

have to

> go to a lab in Leeds where they will be evaluated and it takes 4 to

5 weeks

> to get results from the ELISA tests. As I have worked in the

biochemistry

> evaluation field I know more about the mechanics of these tests than the

> doctors and did a mini-workshop for anyone interested in the

hospital about

> how they worked and the pitfalls of both ELISA and rapid tests. I

was told

> this had been valuable to everyone and not just the medical students and

> have been asked to repeat it next time I am in. I'll take a kit in

with me

> then so they can see what I am talking about rather than have to

look at my

> poor drawings.

>

> It was found I do well on spironolactone but have to stick to one

particular

> brand as I do not have allergic reaction to it. My BP is down to

just above

> normal and my K levels are keeping up reasonably well. I have to eat

bananas

> and chocolate to keep them up there which is really difficult!

>

> Now we wait for the test results which are due in a couple of weeks.

I had a

> CT scan last week and hope that will show the trouble as well. Do I have

> tumours on one side or both? Is it operable? Will the tumours regrow

or grow

> on the other adrenal gland? Who knows.

>

> Sorry this is so long - it helps just to talk.

>

> Helen

>

[Guest guest]

In a message dated 10/9/2006 7:06:13 AM Central Daylight Time, d_k45050@... writes:

I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days ago,and sorry to say

I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person. It seems that

everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to themselves. Am I NOTin

the cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love,

Hi, ,

I have been only an observer, and have not commented at all (I don't think). but I do believe that most individuals on this list suffers, and sometimes are so miserable that they can't even concentrate on others. Hope you learn a lot from being on here, and Welcome!

Dar

[Guest guest]

Hi Dave YES, you are NOW in our family here,, Im sorry it has been kind of slow lately and I have been tied up with my daughter and not here as much as I'd like to be ... so let me say WELCOME,,,, I am Jackie or Jax,, I treated my hep and have been clear now almost 4 years,, I am/was geno 1a and had a LOT of damage but a low viral load.. I try to get to the forum everyday but sometimes I miss a day or two,, so please dont be discouraged,, If you have any questions, please feel free to ask them,, thats what we are here for! jaxDave <d_k45050@...> wrote: I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days ago,and sorry to say I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person. It seems that everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to themselves. Am I NOTin the cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love, Jackie

[Guest guest]

Dave today was the first time I have seen your email I am so sorry it took so long to get back at you. I have been in bed sick this last week . I know the members here would never ignore anyone or not welcome you . Please stick around

Hello

I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days ago,and sorry to say I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person. It seems that everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to themselves. Am I NOTin the cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love,

[Guest guest]

,

I apologize too...this is a great group and they are

very resourceful. Please don't feel alone...we are

all in this together!!!

Kathy

--- elizabethnv1 <elizabethnv1@...> wrote:

> Dave today was the first time I have seen your email

> I am so sorry it took so long to get back at you. I

> have been in bed sick this last week . I know the

> members here would never ignore anyone or not

> welcome you . Please stick around

> Hello

>

>

> I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days

> ago,and sorry to say

> I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person.

> It seems that

> everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to

> themselves. Am I NOTin

> the cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love,

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

,

I apologize too...this is a great group and they are

very resourceful. Please don't feel alone...we are

all in this together!!!

Kathy

--- elizabethnv1 <elizabethnv1@...> wrote:

> Dave today was the first time I have seen your email

> I am so sorry it took so long to get back at you. I

> have been in bed sick this last week . I know the

> members here would never ignore anyone or not

> welcome you . Please stick around

> Hello

>

>

> I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days

> ago,and sorry to say

> I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person.

> It seems that

> everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to

> themselves. Am I NOTin

> the cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love,

>

>

>

>

__________________________________________________

[Guest guest]

Dave, I'm sorry too. It doesn't feel good to be left out. Sometimes doesn't deliver all the mail. DOn't know why, but it sure does happen. Anyway, hello and where in this world are you? I am Sharon age 63 and live in Washington state. I have HCV since 1976, known about it since 1999. I'm geno 2a and have little damage to my liver. Hello! Sharonelizabethnv1 <elizabethnv1@...> wrote: Dave today was the first time I have seen your email I am so sorry it took so long to get back at you. I have been in bed sick this last week . I know the members here would never ignore anyone or not welcome you . Please stick around

Hello I'd sent out an Introduction letter a couple days ago,and sorry to say I haven't seen it or had a reply from one person. It seems that everyone knows everyone here and just speaks to themselves. Am I NOTin the

cliche ? Take care All Peace and Love,

Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Small Business.

[Guest guest]

Hi Tristan,

welcome to the group.

" I also with the help of local autism workers here, established a

social group for young adults with Aspergers and High Functioning

Autism at the end of the last year, which has been a success so far

with now 5 members, including 3 women. "

Sounds good :-) Please let us know how this is going if you want to -

like what kind of things does the group do?

>

> Hi,

>

> Environmental1st2003 invited me here and I decided to join, a

little

> about myself, I'm a 23 year old guy with High Functioning Autism,

> who lives in Bendigo, Australia. I am currently an Accounting

> Student at a local university campus. My main interests and hobbies

> include, History, Economics, Biology (particularly ecology),

Kubuntu

> Linux Operating system installed on my computer, listening to

music,

> cycling.

>

> I also with the help of local autism workers here, established a

> social group for young adults with Aspergers and High Functioning

> Autism at the end of the last year, which has been a success so far

> with now 5 members, including 3 women.

>

[Guest guest]

>

> Hi,

>

> Environmental1st2003 invited me here and I decided to join, a

little

> about myself, I'm a 23 year old guy with High Functioning Autism,

> who lives in Bendigo, Australia. I am currently an Accounting

> Student at a local university campus. My main interests and hobbies

> include, History, Economics, Biology (particularly ecology),

Kubuntu

> Linux Operating system installed on my computer, listening to

music,

> cycling.

>

> I also with the help of local autism workers here, established a

> social group for young adults with Aspergers and High Functioning

> Autism at the end of the last year, which has been a success so far

> with now 5 members, including 3 women.

>

Wonderful. There is such a lot of ground to cover, physically, in

Australia, so many places folks might be out of reach, and it's

important too that one of us is in at the creation of any group, not

just workers doing it for us.

In Britain, it's bad for local groups to get founded by the National

Autistic Society, they end up run on a we-know-best basis and the

more intelligent members voicing their anger online. Local workers

with local agendas you know you like, and a group being independent

not part of a national outfit, that's the right model. I was in the

starting core of 5 who set up a group in Kirkcaldy, Scotland, with a

worker serving just as an outside contact at our invitation. I would

actally like him more involved than he is, to keep us in touch with

the science etc.

Welcome here to the effort for more personal niceness in our global

community. That is equally important.

[Guest guest]

Welcome, Tristan! I'm Raven, an AS mom raising an 11-year-old Aspling

with multiple co-morbidities. Thanks for sharing some info on

yourself and I hope you enjoy the group.

Raven

>

> Hi,

>

> Environmental1st2003 invited me here and I decided to join, a little

> about myself, I'm a 23 year old guy with High Functioning Autism,

> who lives in Bendigo, Australia. I am currently an Accounting

> Student at a local university campus. My main interests and hobbies

> include, History, Economics, Biology (particularly ecology), Kubuntu

> Linux Operating system installed on my computer, listening to music,

> cycling.

>

> I also with the help of local autism workers here, established a

> social group for young adults with Aspergers and High Functioning

> Autism at the end of the last year, which has been a success so far

> with now 5 members, including 3 women.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi Tristan,

We are happy to have you here. Our group is a bit more serious and

focused than many others on the net. But that seems to be what its

members want. There is also more to this society than meets the eye

and perhaps you will discover what I am talking about in time.

In the meantime, settle in, try to make yourself comfortable, and

enjoy the group.

I am 38, AS, am an artist, and run nine groups for Aspies.

Tom

Administrator

Hello

Hi,

Environmental1st2003 invited me here and I decided to join, a little

about myself, I'm a 23 year old guy with High Functioning Autism,

who lives in Bendigo, Australia. I am currently an Accounting

Student at a local university campus. My main interests and hobbies

include, History, Economics, Biology (particularly ecology), Kubuntu

Linux Operating system installed on my computer, listening to music,

cycling.

I also with the help of local autism workers here, established a

social group for young adults with Aspergers and High Functioning

Autism at the end of the last year, which has been a success so far

with now 5 members, including 3 women.

[Guest guest]

Hi MAzz,

will be thinking of you today at this sad time.

Hopefully it is nothing serious with Doug's ear but if it is a burst ear

drum which isn't uncommon (it has happened to me twice) it should be ok in

a couple of weeks time, I presume he is going to the Dr as soon as he can.

Take CAre,

Elaine

>-- Original Message --

>Central Coast Bandsters <centralcoastbandsters >,

>

>From: Mazz <starbug@...>

>Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2006 07:19:00 -0700

>Subject: hello

>Reply-

>

>

>To everyone who has been burning candles for my family I thank you very

>much. Today is going to be the tough day. Don's funeral is at 10.15

>this morning at Rookwood. So please think of Betty his wife, Narelle

>his daughter, Adam and his twin sons and also all his

>grandchildren and extended family at this time.

>

>Then would you believe of all days I have a team dinner with work that I

>

>have been planning for a couple of months now and I can not get out of

>it but I think it will be the medicine that I need after this week.

>

>I have Doug home from work today as he has a serious problem with his

>good ear. As most of you know Doug is deaf in one ear and blind in one

>eye because of his mum having had rubella when she was having him. Last

>

>night when having a shower dont ask me how or why he his ear got itchy

>and he put his finger in there to scratch it and he felt something crack

>

>and since then he has hardly been able to hear a thing. I am very

>worried about him and I home it is something structual done to the ear

>and not the eardrum or anything that will effect his hearing long term.

>

>Well talk to you all over the weekend. Have a great day.

>

>Cheers

>Mazz

[Guest guest]

Hi MAzz,

will be thinking of you today at this sad time.

Hopefully it is nothing serious with Doug's ear but if it is a burst ear

drum which isn't uncommon (it has happened to me twice) it should be ok in

a couple of weeks time, I presume he is going to the Dr as soon as he can.

Take CAre,

Elaine

>-- Original Message --

>Central Coast Bandsters <centralcoastbandsters >,

>

>From: Mazz <starbug@...>

>Date: Fri, 27 Oct 2006 07:19:00 -0700

>Subject: hello

>Reply-

>

>

>To everyone who has been burning candles for my family I thank you very

>much. Today is going to be the tough day. Don's funeral is at 10.15

>this morning at Rookwood. So please think of Betty his wife, Narelle

>his daughter, Adam and his twin sons and also all his

>grandchildren and extended family at this time.

>

>Then would you believe of all days I have a team dinner with work that I

>

>have been planning for a couple of months now and I can not get out of

>it but I think it will be the medicine that I need after this week.

>

>I have Doug home from work today as he has a serious problem with his

>good ear. As most of you know Doug is deaf in one ear and blind in one

>eye because of his mum having had rubella when she was having him. Last

>

>night when having a shower dont ask me how or why he his ear got itchy

>and he put his finger in there to scratch it and he felt something crack

>

>and since then he has hardly been able to hear a thing. I am very

>worried about him and I home it is something structual done to the ear

>and not the eardrum or anything that will effect his hearing long term.

>

>Well talk to you all over the weekend. Have a great day.

>

>Cheers

>Mazz