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Re: Height >>> Lifespan ...... WAS: Re: insulin and IGF-I, health,

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Posted
Posted

--This is particularly interesting with regard to the widely observed,

especially in Europe (particularly in Holland) very large increases in average

height over the last four decades or so.

Maco

[ ] Height >>> Lifespan ...... WAS: Re: insulin and

IGF-I, health,

<html><body>

<tt>

Hi JW:<BR>

<BR>

Here is one paper that seems to review the relationship between <BR>

lifespan and logevity:<BR>

<BR>

" Is height related to longevity?<BR>

<BR>

Samaras TT, Elrick H, Storms LH.<BR>

<BR>

Reventropy Associates, 11487 Madera Way, San Diego, CA 92124-<BR>

2877, USA. SamarasTT@...<BR>

<BR>

Over the last 100 years, studies have provided mixed results on the <BR>

mortality and health of tall and short people. However, during the <BR>

last 30 years, several researchers have found a negative correlation <BR>

between greater height and longevity based on relatively homogeneous <BR>

deceased population samples. Findings based on millions of deaths <BR>

suggest that shorter, smaller bodies have lower death rates and fewer <BR>

diet-related chronic diseases, especially past middle age. Shorter <BR>

people also appear to have longer average lifespans. The authors <BR>

suggest that the differences in longevity between the sexes is due to <BR>

their height differences because men average about 8.0% taller than <BR>

women and have a 7.9% lower life expectancy at birth. Animal <BR>

experiments also show that smaller animals within the same species <BR>

generally live longer. The relation between height and health has <BR>

become more important in recent years because rapid developments in <BR>

genetic engineering will offer parents the opportunity to increase <BR>

the heights of their children in the near future. The authors contend <BR>

that we should not be swept along into a new world of increasingly <BR>

taller generations without careful consideration of the impact of a <BR>

worldwide population of taller and heavier people.<BR>

<BR>

PMID: 12586217 " <BR>

<BR>

Rodney.<BR>

<BR>

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...> <BR>

wrote:<BR>

> That's been my observation, too, but I once lost a discussion about <BR>

that. <BR>

> And I can't make myself shorter, gracefully.<BR>

> <BR>

> Of course we could make our children shorter with less food and a <BR>

lot of legal fees. Walford suggested " we don't want to raise a <BR>

generation of short people " (paraphrased).<BR>

> <BR>

> Still, I don't have or recall articles relating lifespan to <BR>

pygmies, as we have Eskimos and lifespan, eg.<BR>

> <BR>

> I also have heard dwarves are short lived, as are giants, but again <BR>

no articles.<BR>

> Perhaps the diff, in dwarves as opposed to pygmies, is there is a <BR>

gene that makes the Pygmies short whereas the dwarves suffer a gene <BR>

problem, not necessarily transmitted. (just guessing).<BR>

> <BR>

> In any case, I feel more sure each day that IGF-1 is not the factor <BR>

that causes cancer any more than any other factor of which a cancer <BR>

takes advantage. <BR>

> EG, If I measure my IGF-1and find it higher than average, would I <BR>

be happy as I would if I measured my bone density and found it above <BR>

average? Secondly, if I really wanted to lower the system level how <BR>

would I do that? I could eat less and starve my weight and bone down, <BR>

but will that make me live longer? <BR>

> Notice I make a distinction between a " system " level as in changing <BR>

the thermostat. A lowering by food lowering would not be lowering the <BR>

system's set value, merely changing the short term IGF-1. <BR>

> If I went back to eating more food the IGF-1 would come back up to <BR>

it's system level, unless I triggered an anorexic point. <BR>

> If we are keeping IGF-1 low by CR, we may be able to live longer, <BR>

but not if we impact osteo, IMO. Like weight, I want it to be on the <BR>

low side perhaps, but I think the IGF-1 level will go down with <BR>

weight loss anyway, because the system is set that way. After all, it <BR>

is a hormone with a feedback control system, actually two if you <BR>

include the CNS.<BR>

> <BR>

> Regards.<BR>

> <BR>

> [ ] Re: insulin and IGF-I, health,<BR>

> <BR>

> <BR>

> Hi JW:<BR>

> <BR>

> Oooops, sorry. Correction, shorter people live longer than tall <BR>

> people ........... I believe.<BR>

> <BR>

> Rodney.<BR>

> <BR>

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

</tt>

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<div style= " width:500px; text-align:right; margin-bottom:1px; color:#909090; " >

<tt>

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Posted
Posted

--This is particularly interesting with regard to the widely observed,

especially in Europe (particularly in Holland) very large increases in average

height over the last four decades or so.

Maco

[ ] Height >>> Lifespan ...... WAS: Re: insulin and

IGF-I, health,

<html><body>

<tt>

Hi JW:<BR>

<BR>

Here is one paper that seems to review the relationship between <BR>

lifespan and logevity:<BR>

<BR>

" Is height related to longevity?<BR>

<BR>

Samaras TT, Elrick H, Storms LH.<BR>

<BR>

Reventropy Associates, 11487 Madera Way, San Diego, CA 92124-<BR>

2877, USA. SamarasTT@...<BR>

<BR>

Over the last 100 years, studies have provided mixed results on the <BR>

mortality and health of tall and short people. However, during the <BR>

last 30 years, several researchers have found a negative correlation <BR>

between greater height and longevity based on relatively homogeneous <BR>

deceased population samples. Findings based on millions of deaths <BR>

suggest that shorter, smaller bodies have lower death rates and fewer <BR>

diet-related chronic diseases, especially past middle age. Shorter <BR>

people also appear to have longer average lifespans. The authors <BR>

suggest that the differences in longevity between the sexes is due to <BR>

their height differences because men average about 8.0% taller than <BR>

women and have a 7.9% lower life expectancy at birth. Animal <BR>

experiments also show that smaller animals within the same species <BR>

generally live longer. The relation between height and health has <BR>

become more important in recent years because rapid developments in <BR>

genetic engineering will offer parents the opportunity to increase <BR>

the heights of their children in the near future. The authors contend <BR>

that we should not be swept along into a new world of increasingly <BR>

taller generations without careful consideration of the impact of a <BR>

worldwide population of taller and heavier people.<BR>

<BR>

PMID: 12586217 " <BR>

<BR>

Rodney.<BR>

<BR>

--- In , " jwwright " <jwwright@e...> <BR>

wrote:<BR>

> That's been my observation, too, but I once lost a discussion about <BR>

that. <BR>

> And I can't make myself shorter, gracefully.<BR>

> <BR>

> Of course we could make our children shorter with less food and a <BR>

lot of legal fees. Walford suggested " we don't want to raise a <BR>

generation of short people " (paraphrased).<BR>

> <BR>

> Still, I don't have or recall articles relating lifespan to <BR>

pygmies, as we have Eskimos and lifespan, eg.<BR>

> <BR>

> I also have heard dwarves are short lived, as are giants, but again <BR>

no articles.<BR>

> Perhaps the diff, in dwarves as opposed to pygmies, is there is a <BR>

gene that makes the Pygmies short whereas the dwarves suffer a gene <BR>

problem, not necessarily transmitted. (just guessing).<BR>

> <BR>

> In any case, I feel more sure each day that IGF-1 is not the factor <BR>

that causes cancer any more than any other factor of which a cancer <BR>

takes advantage. <BR>

> EG, If I measure my IGF-1and find it higher than average, would I <BR>

be happy as I would if I measured my bone density and found it above <BR>

average? Secondly, if I really wanted to lower the system level how <BR>

would I do that? I could eat less and starve my weight and bone down, <BR>

but will that make me live longer? <BR>

> Notice I make a distinction between a " system " level as in changing <BR>

the thermostat. A lowering by food lowering would not be lowering the <BR>

system's set value, merely changing the short term IGF-1. <BR>

> If I went back to eating more food the IGF-1 would come back up to <BR>

it's system level, unless I triggered an anorexic point. <BR>

> If we are keeping IGF-1 low by CR, we may be able to live longer, <BR>

but not if we impact osteo, IMO. Like weight, I want it to be on the <BR>

low side perhaps, but I think the IGF-1 level will go down with <BR>

weight loss anyway, because the system is set that way. After all, it <BR>

is a hormone with a feedback control system, actually two if you <BR>

include the CNS.<BR>

> <BR>

> Regards.<BR>

> <BR>

> [ ] Re: insulin and IGF-I, health,<BR>

> <BR>

> <BR>

> Hi JW:<BR>

> <BR>

> Oooops, sorry. Correction, shorter people live longer than tall <BR>

> people ........... I believe.<BR>

> <BR>

> Rodney.<BR>

> <BR>

<BR>

<BR>

<BR>

</tt>

<!-- |**|begin egp html banner|**| -->

<br><br>

<div style= " width:500px; text-align:right; margin-bottom:1px; color:#909090; " >

<tt>

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Guest guest

Guest guest

Posted
Posted

Sounds reasonable. However, I wonder about dwarves and pygmies who have demonstrated lower IGF-1.

Of course, women live longer and generally weight less.

Of the Pubmed search for insulin and IGF, these are the ones that mention lifespan:

Thus, in females, genetic variation causing reduced insulin/IGF-1 signalling (IIS) activation is beneficial for old age survival. This effect was stronger for the GH1 SNP than for variation in the conserved IIS genes that were found to affect longevity in model organisms. PMID: 15771611 (does lower height or lower IGF-1 increase age?)

CONCLUSIONS: These data indicate that IGF-I has the characteristics to be a marker for the insulin resistance syndrome. This suggests that low IGF-I levels may be a useful marker for identifying subjects at risk for cardiovascular disease. PMID: 15616244

Present knowledge on the effects of growth hormone (GH) and insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) deficiency on aging and lifespan are controversial. Studying untreated patients with either isolated GH deficiency due to GH gene deletion, patients with multiple pituitary hormone deficiency due to PROP-1 gene mutation and patients with isolated IGF-I deficiency due to deletions or mutations of the GH receptor gene (Laron syndrome); it was found, that these patients despite signs of early aging (wrinkled skin, obesity, insulin resistance and osteopenia)have a long life span reaching ages of 80-90 years. ...On the contrary, mice transgenic for GH and acromegalic patients secreting high amounts of GH have premature death. PMID: 15621211 (but these are not 100yo.)

Ageing may{might} be controlled by a genetic-hormonal system that may have originated from a very early common ancestor. One of the pathways that has been implicated in ageing is the insulin/insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1) signaling, which is involved in many functions that are necessary for metabolism, growth, and fertility in animal models like flies, nematodes, and mammalians. While disruption of the insulin/IGF-1 receptor in nematodes and flies increases lifespan significantly, mammals with genetic or acquired defects in insulin signaling pathway are at risk for age-related diseases and increased mortality.

This contradiction can be explained by the acquisition of more complicated metabolic pathways in mammalians over evolution. Mammals have insulin/IGF-1 receptors in many organs, but their functions are opposite if they are located in the central nervous system or in the periphery; whereas lower species have insulin/IGF-1 receptors signaling mainly through the nervous system. Furthermore, mammalians have different and very specific receptors for insulin and IGF-1, with distinct pathways and diverse functions. Striking evidence suggests that decreased IGF-1 levels and signaling during early development, but not the insulin signaling may modulate longevity in many species. Thus, paradoxical outcomes follow the decrease of insulin and/or IGF-1 signal pathway in invertebrates and in mammals, prolonging life in the former and shortening it in the latter. In this review we focus on the downstream cascade of events in the insulin and IGF-1 signaling to identify specific pathways that are relevant to human longevity. PMID: 15272501

A number of recent studies of aging in Drosophila, mice and dogs have shown an association between reduced body size and increased lifespan. It is unclear (a)whether such an association is a general feature of animal species; and (b)whether the association reflects an effect of body size on aging, or leiotropic effects of common determinants of growth and aging. To address these issues, we have studied the relationship between size and lifespan in the nematode Caenorhabditis elegans, and surveyed related findings in Drosophila. In C. elegans, we compared 12 wild isolates with varying body size and lifespan, but saw no correspondence between these traits. We also examined aging in giant and dwarf mutants, but observed only reduced lifespan in all cases. In a comparison of 15 long-lived daf-2 insulin/IGF receptor mutants, we saw a positive correlation between body length and lifespan, and up to a 28% increase in daf-2 mutant body volume. Thus, in C. elegans, insulin/IGF signaling may limit growth rather than promote it. Studies of Drosophila show no consistent correlation between body size and lifespan. These results indicate that the negative correlation between body size and lifespan seen in some mammals is not typical of invertebrates, but support the view that co-variation of size and longevity may occur via effects on insulin/IGF signaling. PMID: 12543270

Real-time PCR analyses confirm that insulin receptor isoform A expression predominates over isoform B expression in the ovarian carcinoma cell lines. This report suggests that the insulin receptor may play a role in the regulation of ovarian cancer cell growth. PMID: 12193537 {modified by the cancer?)

[ ] Re: insulin and IGF-I, health,> > > Hi JW:> > Oooops, sorry. Correction, shorter people live longer than tall > people ........... I believe.> > Rodney.>

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Guest guest

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Posted
Posted

Sounds reasonable. However, I wonder about dwarves and pygmies who have demonstrated lower IGF-1.

Of course, women live longer and generally weight less.

Of the Pubmed search for insulin and IGF, these are the ones that mention lifespan:

Thus, in females, genetic variation causing reduced insulin/IGF-1 signalling (IIS) activation is beneficial for old age survival. This effect was stronger for the GH1 SNP than for variation in the conserved IIS genes that were found to affect longevity in model organisms. PMID: 15771611 (does lower height or lower IGF-1 increase age?)

CONCLUSIONS: These data indicate that IGF-I has the characteristics to be a marker for the insulin resistance syndrome. This suggests that low IGF-I levels may be a useful marker for identifying subjects at risk for cardiovascular disease. PMID: 15616244

Present knowledge on the effects of growth hormone (GH) and insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) deficiency on aging and lifespan are controversial. Studying untreated patients with either isolated GH deficiency due to GH gene deletion, patients with multiple pituitary hormone deficiency due to PROP-1 gene mutation and patients with isolated IGF-I deficiency due to deletions or mutations of the GH receptor gene (Laron syndrome); it was found, that these patients despite signs of early aging (wrinkled skin, obesity, insulin resistance and osteopenia)have a long life span reaching ages of 80-90 years. ...On the contrary, mice transgenic for GH and acromegalic patients secreting high amounts of GH have premature death. PMID: 15621211 (but these are not 100yo.)

Ageing may{might} be controlled by a genetic-hormonal system that may have originated from a very early common ancestor. One of the pathways that has been implicated in ageing is the insulin/insulin-like growth factor (IGF-1) signaling, which is involved in many functions that are necessary for metabolism, growth, and fertility in animal models like flies, nematodes, and mammalians. While disruption of the insulin/IGF-1 receptor in nematodes and flies increases lifespan significantly, mammals with genetic or acquired defects in insulin signaling pathway are at risk for age-related diseases and increased mortality.

This contradiction can be explained by the acquisition of more complicated metabolic pathways in mammalians over evolution. Mammals have insulin/IGF-1 receptors in many organs, but their functions are opposite if they are located in the central nervous system or in the periphery; whereas lower species have insulin/IGF-1 receptors signaling mainly through the nervous system. Furthermore, mammalians have different and very specific receptors for insulin and IGF-1, with distinct pathways and diverse functions. Striking evidence suggests that decreased IGF-1 levels and signaling during early development, but not the insulin signaling may modulate longevity in many species. Thus, paradoxical outcomes follow the decrease of insulin and/or IGF-1 signal pathway in invertebrates and in mammals, prolonging life in the former and shortening it in the latter. In this review we focus on the downstream cascade of events in the insulin and IGF-1 signaling to identify specific pathways that are relevant to human longevity. PMID: 15272501

A number of recent studies of aging in Drosophila, mice and dogs have shown an association between reduced body size and increased lifespan. It is unclear (a)whether such an association is a general feature of animal species; and (b)whether the association reflects an effect of body size on aging, or leiotropic effects of common determinants of growth and aging. To address these issues, we have studied the relationship between size and lifespan in the nematode Caenorhabditis elegans, and surveyed related findings in Drosophila. In C. elegans, we compared 12 wild isolates with varying body size and lifespan, but saw no correspondence between these traits. We also examined aging in giant and dwarf mutants, but observed only reduced lifespan in all cases. In a comparison of 15 long-lived daf-2 insulin/IGF receptor mutants, we saw a positive correlation between body length and lifespan, and up to a 28% increase in daf-2 mutant body volume. Thus, in C. elegans, insulin/IGF signaling may limit growth rather than promote it. Studies of Drosophila show no consistent correlation between body size and lifespan. These results indicate that the negative correlation between body size and lifespan seen in some mammals is not typical of invertebrates, but support the view that co-variation of size and longevity may occur via effects on insulin/IGF signaling. PMID: 12543270

Real-time PCR analyses confirm that insulin receptor isoform A expression predominates over isoform B expression in the ovarian carcinoma cell lines. This report suggests that the insulin receptor may play a role in the regulation of ovarian cancer cell growth. PMID: 12193537 {modified by the cancer?)

[ ] Re: insulin and IGF-I, health,> > > Hi JW:> > Oooops, sorry. Correction, shorter people live longer than tall > people ........... I believe.> > Rodney.>

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