Re: ????????Drink Eight Glasses of Water a Day?????????

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

This appears to be the source of the 'excessive water drinking causes

kidney problems' publicity (from the University of Western Ontario).

But this particular item is a year old.

http://communications.uwo.ca/western_news/story.html?listing_id=16631

Rodney.

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

>

> Hi folks:

>

> Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about the

> benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read the

> following. It is a news report on a study done after about a dozen

> people died when the drinking water system became contaminated with

e-

> coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

>

> The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

caused

> serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

>

> It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

water

> (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water

is

> too much.

>

> I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and

have

> no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

>

> http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

>

> Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

This appears to be the source of the 'excessive water drinking causes

kidney problems' publicity (from the University of Western Ontario).

But this particular item is a year old.

http://communications.uwo.ca/western_news/story.html?listing_id=16631

Rodney.

--- In , " Rodney " <perspect1111@y...>

wrote:

>

> Hi folks:

>

> Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about the

> benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read the

> following. It is a news report on a study done after about a dozen

> people died when the drinking water system became contaminated with

e-

> coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

>

> The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

caused

> serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

>

> It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

water

> (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water

is

> too much.

>

> I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and

have

> no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

>

> http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

>

> Rodney.

>

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

More on water here:

http://preventdisease.com/home/tips58.shtml

Does anyone have a view about the credentials of the

preventdisease.com website? I just added my name to their mailing

list and their newsletter does seem to contain a lot of information.

So I am wondering if it is worth reading.

I.E. is most of its information reliable? Or are they featured on

Quackwatch? LOL. TY

Rodney.

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about

the

> > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read

the

> > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a

dozen

> > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated

with

> e-

> > coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

> >

> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

> caused

> > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

> >

> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

> water

> > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water

> is

> > too much.

> >

> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and

> have

> > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

> >

> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi folks:

More on water here:

http://preventdisease.com/home/tips58.shtml

Does anyone have a view about the credentials of the

preventdisease.com website? I just added my name to their mailing

list and their newsletter does seem to contain a lot of information.

So I am wondering if it is worth reading.

I.E. is most of its information reliable? Or are they featured on

Quackwatch? LOL. TY

Rodney.

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about

the

> > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read

the

> > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a

dozen

> > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated

with

> e-

> > coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

> >

> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

> caused

> > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

> >

> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

> water

> > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water

> is

> > too much.

> >

> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and

> have

> > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

> >

> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

What's large?

I drink >120 oz, coffee, and/or tea, or water.

I suspect the idea must be taken in context, like how much would you need carrying a pack in hot weather, marching 30 miles? The corps says a liter per hour. That may be overstated also, but the point is we lose a lot of water out the lungs, thru sweat, as well as urine.

"In the first two years of the study, 107 participants {of 4,238} were noted to have high urine volumes and proteinuria. This was originally thought to be suggestive of possible new onset tubular damage to the kidneys. Further investigation has found this not to be the case. It appears that this group may be spilling protein into their urine due to hyper-filtration brought on by drinking excessively large volumes of water. "

{I think they might search further. How many of the 4238 drank large volumes of water and DIDN'T have proteinuria? I wonder how many have hypertension?}

J Biol Chem. 2002 Aug 23;277(34):31154-62. Epub 2002 May 30.

Determinants of vascular permeability in the kidney glomerulus.Hamano Y, Grunkemeyer JA, Sudhakar A, Zeisberg M, Cosgrove D, Morello R, Lee B, Sugimoto H, Kalluri R.Program in Matrix Biology, Divisions of Gastroenterology and Nephrology, Department of Medicine, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA 02215, USA.The human kidneys filter 70 liters of blood plasma every day. The hallmark of almost all kidney diseases, whether acquired or genetic, is the leakage of plasma proteins into the urine because of alterations in the glomerular filtration unit of the kidney. In this regard, the human mutations in nephrin, podocin, alpha-actinin-4, COL4A3, and COL4A5 genes expressed in the glomeruli have been implicated to cause alterations in glomerular filtration apparatus. Nevertheless, the expression of these proteins in relation to each other in mouse models for glomerular vascular leak is unknown. Additionally, within the glomerulus, the central question of whether the primary filtration barrier is the basement membrane or the epithelial slit diaphragm remains ambiguous. Therefore, in this study, we examined the localization and expression of glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm and glomerular basement membrane proteins implicated in glomerular vascular leak using mice deficient in either the alpha3 chain of type IV collagen, the major constituent of glomerular basement membrane, or LMX1B transcription factor, which regulates the expression of key glomerular type IV collagen genes COL4A3 and COL4A4 or nephrin, a glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm-associated protein. This study demonstrates that decreased expression of slit diaphragm protein, nephrin, correlates with a loss of glomerular filter integrity. Additionally, we demonstrate that defects induced by proteins of glomerular basement membrane lead to an insidious plasma protein leak, whereas the defects induced by proteins in the glomerular epithelial slit diaphragms lead to a precipitous plasma protein leak. PMID: 12039968

Just my take.

Regards.

[ ] Re: ????????Drink Eight Glasses of Water a Day?????????

Hi folks:This appears to be the source of the 'excessive water drinking causes kidney problems' publicity (from the University of Western Ontario). But this particular item is a year old.http://communications.uwo.ca/western_news/story.html?listing_id=16631Rodney.--- In , "Rodney" <perspect1111@y...> wrote:>> Hi folks:> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about the > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read the > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a dozen > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated with e-> coli in a town in Ontario Canada.> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that caused > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much water > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water is > too much.> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and have > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp> > Rodney.>

[Guest guest]

What's large?

I drink >120 oz, coffee, and/or tea, or water.

I suspect the idea must be taken in context, like how much would you need carrying a pack in hot weather, marching 30 miles? The corps says a liter per hour. That may be overstated also, but the point is we lose a lot of water out the lungs, thru sweat, as well as urine.

"In the first two years of the study, 107 participants {of 4,238} were noted to have high urine volumes and proteinuria. This was originally thought to be suggestive of possible new onset tubular damage to the kidneys. Further investigation has found this not to be the case. It appears that this group may be spilling protein into their urine due to hyper-filtration brought on by drinking excessively large volumes of water. "

{I think they might search further. How many of the 4238 drank large volumes of water and DIDN'T have proteinuria? I wonder how many have hypertension?}

J Biol Chem. 2002 Aug 23;277(34):31154-62. Epub 2002 May 30.

Determinants of vascular permeability in the kidney glomerulus.Hamano Y, Grunkemeyer JA, Sudhakar A, Zeisberg M, Cosgrove D, Morello R, Lee B, Sugimoto H, Kalluri R.Program in Matrix Biology, Divisions of Gastroenterology and Nephrology, Department of Medicine, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA 02215, USA.The human kidneys filter 70 liters of blood plasma every day. The hallmark of almost all kidney diseases, whether acquired or genetic, is the leakage of plasma proteins into the urine because of alterations in the glomerular filtration unit of the kidney. In this regard, the human mutations in nephrin, podocin, alpha-actinin-4, COL4A3, and COL4A5 genes expressed in the glomeruli have been implicated to cause alterations in glomerular filtration apparatus. Nevertheless, the expression of these proteins in relation to each other in mouse models for glomerular vascular leak is unknown. Additionally, within the glomerulus, the central question of whether the primary filtration barrier is the basement membrane or the epithelial slit diaphragm remains ambiguous. Therefore, in this study, we examined the localization and expression of glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm and glomerular basement membrane proteins implicated in glomerular vascular leak using mice deficient in either the alpha3 chain of type IV collagen, the major constituent of glomerular basement membrane, or LMX1B transcription factor, which regulates the expression of key glomerular type IV collagen genes COL4A3 and COL4A4 or nephrin, a glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm-associated protein. This study demonstrates that decreased expression of slit diaphragm protein, nephrin, correlates with a loss of glomerular filter integrity. Additionally, we demonstrate that defects induced by proteins of glomerular basement membrane lead to an insidious plasma protein leak, whereas the defects induced by proteins in the glomerular epithelial slit diaphragms lead to a precipitous plasma protein leak. PMID: 12039968

Just my take.

Regards.

[ ] Re: ????????Drink Eight Glasses of Water a Day?????????

Hi folks:This appears to be the source of the 'excessive water drinking causes kidney problems' publicity (from the University of Western Ontario). But this particular item is a year old.http://communications.uwo.ca/western_news/story.html?listing_id=16631Rodney.--- In , "Rodney" <perspect1111@y...> wrote:>> Hi folks:> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about the > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read the > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a dozen > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated with e-> coli in a town in Ontario Canada.> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that caused > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much water > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much water is > too much.> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject and have > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp> > Rodney.>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

All good questions. I have emailed the principal investigator of the

ton study. Hopefully I may get a reply. If I do I will post

his answers.

Rodney.

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about

the

> > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read

the

> > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a

dozen

> > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated

with

> e-

> > coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

> >

> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

> caused

> > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

> >

> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

> water

> > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much

water

> is

> > too much.

> >

> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject

and

> have

> > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

> >

> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Hi JW:

All good questions. I have emailed the principal investigator of the

ton study. Hopefully I may get a reply. If I do I will post

his answers.

Rodney.

> >

> > Hi folks:

> >

> > Those who are persuaded by the endless propaganda we hear about

the

> > benefits of drinking large amounts of water daily need to read

the

> > following. It is a news report on a study done after about a

dozen

> > people died when the drinking water system became contaminated

with

> e-

> > coli in a town in Ontario Canada.

> >

> > The study claims it was drinking too much untainted water that

> caused

> > serious kidney problems in 5% of the population of the town.

> >

> > It doesn't say what proportion of the population drank too much

> water

> > (it might possibly have been 5%). Nor does it say how much

water

> is

> > too much.

> >

> > I am providing this jfi. I have no expertise in the subject

and

> have

> > no way of knowing whether the information is accurate.

> >

> > http://www.pulse24.com/News/Top_Story/20051117-003/page.asp

> >

> > Rodney.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Found this:

http://www4.nas.edu/news.nsf/6a3520dc2dbfc2ad85256ca8005c1381/25778ef9e449bc8385256e37005168c4?OpenDocument

"The vast majority of healthy people adequately meet their daily hydration needs by letting thirst be their guide, says the newest report on nutrient recommendations from the Institute of Medicine of the National Academies. The report set general recommendations for water intake based on detailed national data, which showed that women who appear to be adequately hydrated consume an average of approximately 2.7 liters (91 ounces) of total water -- from all beverages and foods -- each day, and men average approximately 3.7 liters (125 ounces) daily."

And I thought I was above average!!!

Regards.

[ ] Re: ????????Drink Eight Glasses of Water a Day?????????

Hi JW:All good questions. I have emailed the principal investigator of the ton study. Hopefully I may get a reply. If I do I will post his answers.Rodney.>> What's large? > I drink >120 oz, coffee, and/or tea, or water. > I suspect the idea must be taken in context, like how much would you need carrying a pack in hot weather, marching 30 miles? The corps says a liter per hour. That may be overstated also, but the point is we lose a lot of water out the lungs, thru sweat, as well as urine. > > "In the first two years of the study, 107 participants {of 4,238} were noted to have high urine volumes and proteinuria. This was originally thought to be suggestive of possible new onset tubular damage to the kidneys. Further investigation has found this not to be the case. It appears that this group may be spilling protein into their urine due to hyper-filtration brought on by drinking excessively large volumes of water. "> > {I think they might search further. How many of the 4238 drank large volumes of water and DIDN'T have proteinuria? I wonder how many have hypertension?}> > J Biol Chem. 2002 Aug 23;277(34):31154-62. Epub 2002 May 30. > > > Determinants of vascular permeability in the kidney glomerulus.> > Hamano Y, Grunkemeyer JA, Sudhakar A, Zeisberg M, Cosgrove D, Morello R, Lee B, Sugimoto H, Kalluri R.> > Program in Matrix Biology, Divisions of Gastroenterology and Nephrology, Department of Medicine, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA 02215, USA.> > The human kidneys filter 70 liters of blood plasma every day. The hallmark of almost all kidney diseases, whether acquired or genetic, is the leakage of plasma proteins into the urine because of alterations in the glomerular filtration unit of the kidney. In this regard, the human mutations in nephrin, podocin, alpha-actinin-4, COL4A3, and COL4A5 genes expressed in the glomeruli have been implicated to cause alterations in glomerular filtration apparatus. Nevertheless, the expression of these proteins in relation to each other in mouse models for glomerular vascular leak is unknown. Additionally, within the glomerulus, the central question of whether the primary filtration barrier is the basement membrane or the epithelial slit diaphragm remains ambiguous. Therefore, in this study, we examined the localization and expression of glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm and glomerular basement membrane proteins implicated in glomerular vascular leak using mice deficient in either the alpha3 chain of type IV collagen, the major constituent of glomerular basement membrane, or LMX1B transcription factor, which regulates the expression of key glomerular type IV collagen genes COL4A3 and COL4A4 or nephrin, a glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm-associated protein. This study demonstrates that decreased expression of slit diaphragm protein, nephrin, correlates with a loss of glomerular filter integrity. Additionally, we demonstrate that defects induced by proteins of glomerular basement membrane lead to an insidious plasma protein leak, whereas the defects induced by proteins in the glomerular epithelial slit diaphragms lead to a precipitous plasma protein leak. PMID: 12039968 > Just my take. > > Regards.

[Guest guest]

Found this:

http://www4.nas.edu/news.nsf/6a3520dc2dbfc2ad85256ca8005c1381/25778ef9e449bc8385256e37005168c4?OpenDocument

"The vast majority of healthy people adequately meet their daily hydration needs by letting thirst be their guide, says the newest report on nutrient recommendations from the Institute of Medicine of the National Academies. The report set general recommendations for water intake based on detailed national data, which showed that women who appear to be adequately hydrated consume an average of approximately 2.7 liters (91 ounces) of total water -- from all beverages and foods -- each day, and men average approximately 3.7 liters (125 ounces) daily."

And I thought I was above average!!!

Regards.

[ ] Re: ????????Drink Eight Glasses of Water a Day?????????

Hi JW:All good questions. I have emailed the principal investigator of the ton study. Hopefully I may get a reply. If I do I will post his answers.Rodney.>> What's large? > I drink >120 oz, coffee, and/or tea, or water. > I suspect the idea must be taken in context, like how much would you need carrying a pack in hot weather, marching 30 miles? The corps says a liter per hour. That may be overstated also, but the point is we lose a lot of water out the lungs, thru sweat, as well as urine. > > "In the first two years of the study, 107 participants {of 4,238} were noted to have high urine volumes and proteinuria. This was originally thought to be suggestive of possible new onset tubular damage to the kidneys. Further investigation has found this not to be the case. It appears that this group may be spilling protein into their urine due to hyper-filtration brought on by drinking excessively large volumes of water. "> > {I think they might search further. How many of the 4238 drank large volumes of water and DIDN'T have proteinuria? I wonder how many have hypertension?}> > J Biol Chem. 2002 Aug 23;277(34):31154-62. Epub 2002 May 30. > > > Determinants of vascular permeability in the kidney glomerulus.> > Hamano Y, Grunkemeyer JA, Sudhakar A, Zeisberg M, Cosgrove D, Morello R, Lee B, Sugimoto H, Kalluri R.> > Program in Matrix Biology, Divisions of Gastroenterology and Nephrology, Department of Medicine, Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center and Harvard Medical School, Boston, MA 02215, USA.> > The human kidneys filter 70 liters of blood plasma every day. The hallmark of almost all kidney diseases, whether acquired or genetic, is the leakage of plasma proteins into the urine because of alterations in the glomerular filtration unit of the kidney. In this regard, the human mutations in nephrin, podocin, alpha-actinin-4, COL4A3, and COL4A5 genes expressed in the glomeruli have been implicated to cause alterations in glomerular filtration apparatus. Nevertheless, the expression of these proteins in relation to each other in mouse models for glomerular vascular leak is unknown. Additionally, within the glomerulus, the central question of whether the primary filtration barrier is the basement membrane or the epithelial slit diaphragm remains ambiguous. Therefore, in this study, we examined the localization and expression of glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm and glomerular basement membrane proteins implicated in glomerular vascular leak using mice deficient in either the alpha3 chain of type IV collagen, the major constituent of glomerular basement membrane, or LMX1B transcription factor, which regulates the expression of key glomerular type IV collagen genes COL4A3 and COL4A4 or nephrin, a glomerular epithelial slit diaphragm-associated protein. This study demonstrates that decreased expression of slit diaphragm protein, nephrin, correlates with a loss of glomerular filter integrity. Additionally, we demonstrate that defects induced by proteins of glomerular basement membrane lead to an insidious plasma protein leak, whereas the defects induced by proteins in the glomerular epithelial slit diaphragms lead to a precipitous plasma protein leak. PMID: 12039968 > Just my take. > > Regards.