Re: Weight loss and Vitamix

[Guest guest]

This is an issue I post about often, so my answer will be lengthy to state my

position on it-I do NOT want anyone to think I am trashing their choice to take

a supplement, as there are various reasons why some may chose to do so-this just

states MY take on supplements.

I think as a society, we are taught from a very early age to " take a pill " for

every ailment. Pop an asprin for a headache, take a laxative if the plumbing is

backed up, take an antacid if the tummy hurts, and generally MASK the symptoms

of whatever is going on in the first place, rather than address and correct the

cause. Because of this, we have learned to rely on pills as a quick fix for

just about everything, and rarely do we EVER question what is actually in the

pills we take-quite often, they contain the very ingredients giving us trouble

in the first place. Due to my extreme food allergies, and several near death

episodes caused by them, I have had to learn to look differently at what goes

into my body, so I have done extensive research, testing, and information

gathering, none of which forms any scientific basis other than my own personal

discovery. I am also a nutritionist, so I try to view from that angle as well,

but I am often confronted with people who say " I take Vitamin XXX, etc. and when

I ask what the SOURCE of that vitamin is, usually no one has a clue. For

example, I know MANY people on a " gluten free " diet, who unknowingly pop vitamin

E pills, which are largely derived from wheat. We tend to take for granted that

a pill is a pill, and that supplements and powders MUST be good for us if they

are sold in a health food store-that couldn't be farther from the truth.

Because of my OWN issues, I learned to find more natural sources for the

nutrients my body needs, rather than take something questionable that usually

contains ingredients I can't even pronounce,, let alone identify. Keep in mind

that MOST supplements/vitamins/powders are by products of the food industry-just

a way to sell even more products from " waste " that would otherswise be

discarded. " Protein powders " are a great example of this-the milk and meat

industry would otherwise be throwing away things like whey, which are a by

product of cheesemaking, if they hadn't come up with a clever way to market them

to consumers-many whey powders come from commercially farmed milk, which means

they contain the steroids, growth hormones, antibiotics, medications and

unnatural feeds given to the animals being farmed-all this ends up in any of the

by products. The protein powders are then processed with fillers, anti caking

agents, flavorings, preservatives, etc., which really just serve to bulk up the

amount being sold in a can. To my way of thinking, I am better off getting a

protein boost from a scoop of organic quinoa added to whatever I would add the

protein powder to. No additives, and quinoa is an outstanding protein in its

own right. You can also add cooked mild beans, such as great northers, for an

even healthier boost of protein. Vitamin C is another example of " waste "

being disguised and sold as a healthy supplement-Vitamin C is usually sources

from the VERY heavily pesticide sprayed skins of oranges and citrus used in the

juice industy, which means that most supplements of vitamin C are just a

concentrated source of pesticided-perhaps a bit of good C in there, but far

outweighed by the concentrations of stuff you don't want. I would rather toss a

whole organic orange in the Vitamix for a more than adequate dose of pure

vitamin C! Now, that being said....I know there are " organic " alternatives to

protein powders, supplements, etc., that may not reflect what I said about them,

but I would still rather get my nutrients from a whole food source, than to take

a pill hoping to address my needs. Another thing to consider is how SERIOUSLY

flawed the whole RDA system for " required " nutrients is. Developed during war

times, the RDA was established to ensure that soldiers and those with food

shortages were getting " adequate " nutrition during times when food was scarce or

preparation of healthy food wasn't always possible, so the food industry started

" enriching " foods with synthetic vitamins (think " enriched pasta, enriched

flour, rice " , etc) to make sure that basic nutrition needs were being met at

that time. The RDA never took (or takes today) into account that everyone's

nutritional needs are different-a soldier at war is llikely to need MUCH more

protein than a housewife in rural Nebraska, but the same " RDA " was set for

both-a seriously flawed system at best. What the RDA ended up doing, was to

convince people that they needed certain amounts of each nutrient daily, and

" levels " of accepted vitamins were established for testing, making the whole

system even more flawed. Our needs change DAILY. If I go for a two mile hike

this morning, I will need more carbs and protein than yesterday, when I may have

vegged out on the couch eating bon bons. There is no " daily " requirement to any

of it. I find that listening to YOUR body is the best way to address YOUR

needs...not going by some chart developed by a group of old farts back in the

40's. In a nutshell, to address the question, YES, you can get everything you

need from whole foods-no need for supplements, pills, potions and powders. That

doesn't mean you " shouldn't " use them, just that they are totally unnecessary,

often overpriced, and often lead to a false sense of " adequate " nutrition-all

things best obtained from real food.

Again, just my opinion, I am not trying to trash anyone who does use

supplements, just to offer a different perspective. Usually when I post about

MY distaste of supplements as a source of nutrition, I inevitably and

unintentionally upset those who do chose to take them-that is not my intent in

the least!!

>

> Great question....had the same ones myself.

> Looking forward to the VM community answers.

>

> tom

>

>

>

> From:

[mailto: ] On Behalf Of Wes

> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2012 11:58 AM

>

> Subject: Weight loss and Vitamix

>

>

>

> So I have been reading up about this stuff, and have some questions and

concerns.... If you are using the vitamix for smoothies, soups and other healthy

things, why do so many web sites want you to buy supplements and or other things

for the vitamix style diets? I see lots of people adding potions and powders to

their smoothies and promoting various products. If you are using whole foods and

replacing some unhealthy behaviours with good and nutritious ones why should you

need supplements?

>

> I haven't sworn off regular food, and because I love to cook I will still get

all my meats and proteins needed by my body (just in smaller quantities). but in

researching I find myself very confused... dont raw fruits and veggies supply

most of what is required? I would think processed supplements are not as healthy

as natural ones...

>

> wes

>

[Guest guest]

thanks for that, kind of what I was thinking, and I am not alone obviously...  I am in no way looking for a quick fix to the excess weight I have to lose, and I dont think I need a supplement for anything.  Not to be gross, but back in college my room-mate was a body builder, popped all kinds of pills powders ect... sometimes he would joke that some of the pills came out whole in the toilet (like I said I dont want to be gross), but if this is happening I would imagine its not material the body needed at the time... I would think that many of the drugs, supplements ect that Americans use end up in our sewer system and probably dont do much for the people taking them, just a trip through our bodies internal plumbing which probably isnt good for our filtering organs such as the liver.... 

I would think real food is all the body actually needs, heck our ancestors made it through life without all these chemicals, didn't they?

[Guest guest]

SO true! You can find a ton of info online about city water systems having huge

problems with clogs caused by undigested pills-and even more info on how many

pharmaceuticals end up polluting the water supply, since they pass undigested

from the consumer and into the public water systems, meaning the intended

recipient may not have gotten HIS dose of a medication, but a two year old

having a sip of water from the bathroom fawcet did get it! Scary stuff. I

think it was in NYC where they had a huge problem with undigested vitamins

clogging up the works. I did some experiments years ago on several vitamins and

supplements, none of which disolved even when left in water for weeks, or with

the same type of enzymes one would find in the stomach added to the water. I

personally think a liquified form of a whole food is a better choice-thank

goodness our Vitamixes can give us that!!

>

> thanks for that, kind of what I was thinking, and I am not alone

> obviously... I am in no way looking for a quick fix to the excess weight I

> have to lose, and I dont think I need a supplement for anything.

>

> Not to be gross, but back in college my room-mate was a body builder,

> popped all kinds of pills powders ect... sometimes he would joke that some

> of the pills came out whole in the toilet (like I said I dont want to be

> gross), but if this is happening I would imagine its not material the body

> needed at the time... I would think that many of the drugs, supplements ect

> that Americans use end up in our sewer system and probably dont do much for

> the people taking them, just a trip through our bodies internal plumbing

> which probably isnt good for our filtering organs such as the liver....

>

> I would think real food is all the body actually needs, heck our ancestors

> made it through life without all these chemicals, didn't they?

>

[Guest guest]

Wes, if you are trying to lose weight, you might keep in mind that you are

likely to see weight drop off completely without effort once you start giving

your body whole foods and eliminating processed stuff. Excess weight is most

often just the body hanging on to things it has no idea how to eliminate, such

as synthetic, processed things not meant to be consumed-the body quite literally

stores unknown substances since it has no clue where or what to do with them.

You will likely find that as you give your body more wholesome things, it will

shed the weight without a whole lot of effort, and quite quickly at that.

>

> thanks for that, kind of what I was thinking, and I am not alone

> obviously... I am in no way looking for a quick fix to the excess weight I

> have to lose, and I dont think I need a supplement for anything.

>

> Not to be gross, but back in college my room-mate was a body builder,

> popped all kinds of pills powders ect... sometimes he would joke that some

> of the pills came out whole in the toilet (like I said I dont want to be

> gross), but if this is happening I would imagine its not material the body

> needed at the time... I would think that many of the drugs, supplements ect

> that Americans use end up in our sewer system and probably dont do much for

> the people taking them, just a trip through our bodies internal plumbing

> which probably isnt good for our filtering organs such as the liver....

>

> I would think real food is all the body actually needs, heck our ancestors

> made it through life without all these chemicals, didn't they?

>

[Guest guest]

Wes,

I agree with most (but not all aspects) of what and SJ said about

nutritional supplements. My main point is that EVERYONE is in a different

situation--their current metabolic condition (obesity, type 2 diabetes,

autoimmune and degenerative syndromes, age, and so on), their past health

history, and their access (or lack thereof) to organic vegetables and fruits,

eggs, meats, and poultry. Therefore, whether an adult (or child) needs

nutritional supplementation should be considered on an individual basis. The

following is my long-winded (sorry) thoughts on the subject.

I know from what and SJ have said in their posts that they are well

advanced in the ways of growing their own food and seeking out sources of

organic food for what they cannot produce themselves. However, I would bet that

most of us on this forum are not that far advanced (but would like to be, huh?).

:-))

Bear in mind that if you are buying produce (veggies and fruit) from a

supermarket, most of what the supermarket has for sale is probably not " USDA

organic " (or, for forum members outside the U.S., however your country labels

organically produced food). Commercially grown produce is almost always nutrient

deficient when compared to commercially grown produce from 50 or more years ago,

due to soil depletion and massive use of commercial (incomplete) fertilizers and

pesticides/herbicides. Even the USDA admits to this. If you have access to

organic produce, then it is likely that this produce will have a better native

nutrient content, but that is not guaranteed. And, of course, the contaminant

aspect of organic produce is/should be much less, but is not " zero, " because

most of Planet Earth (at least where food is grown) is now, and has been,

contaminated with toxic manmade chemicals.

I think the best bet for getting the best quality produce is to buy it from

farmers' markets or grow your food yourself if possible. Many, if not most, of

the urban, suburban, and small-town areas of the U.S. now have farmers markets,

because those farmers who are savvy (especially small-operation, family-run

farms) know that U.S. consumers' demand for fresh, local produce is growing

rapidly. And, I have been reading, there are growing numbers of young people out

there who eschew working lives " in the cubicles " of big corporations, opting

instead for a life where they can contribute directly to society (and

themselves) by growing organic food for local citizens. Personally, I believe

that the high employment rate in the U.S. is a potent driver of this new trend,

which is a truly heartening one. A farmer's life isn't for everyone who might

try it, but I think that the new generation of young farmers is getting started,

and this movement will continue on for years to come.

That said, because it is now Winter with 2/3 of the nation in the deep freeze,

it is hard (if not impossible) to find farmers' markets that are open. I live in

central land, and most (but not all) farmers' markets are closed for Winter.

Also, I live in an area that is called euphemistically " high-density housing "

(my home is a small townhouse). Of course, millions of us live in apartments or

townhouses with no, or very small, yards. One interesting new development is

there are new products available for container gardening, which is very

efficient spacewise. This means that those people who want to grow their own

produce in a small space can do so with a modest investment up-front in

containers and supporting supplies. I will try this myself in the coming Spring

season. (I think that Lea Ann has already tried her hand at this, and may have

reported on her experience before I joined this forum.)

I am 65, had major surgery 6 years ago to remove a pancreas tumor (also don't

have my gallbladder or spleen anymore), so my digestive system is far from ideal

(also partly due to age). My appetite is not that good anymore either. So, I DO

rely on nutritional supplements. However, I have gone to a lot of effort to find

the best sources (more than one) of the supplements that I take on a daily

basis. And NONE of these supplements come from a supermarket or drug store. You

may know that the nutritional supplement industry in the U.S. is not directly

regulated by the USFDA--and it SHOULD NEVER be, as far as I'm concerned, given

that the FDA is almost completely controlled by Big Pharma. There are,

unfortunately, many " poor quality " supplements out there. Thus, this situation

puts the burden of sorting out the poor quality supplements from the well-made

ones squarely on the consumer him/herself.

Finally, don't depend on your mainstream medicine doctor to be of any help. Most

doctors in the U.S. know little to nothing about food, diets, and

supplementation, because they were trained in medical school to put very little

stock in foods/diet/supplementation--they were trained almost excusively in

pharmaceutical and surgical approaches. Also, they get most of their " current

medical education " from the Big Pharma sales reps who frequently visit their

offices and urge them to prescribe the " latest and greatest " in pharmaceutical

" miracle " drugs (my take--u-u-u-gh!). Pharma drugs, for the most part, are quite

dangerously ineffective " symptom-suppressors, " and in the long run will not

improve your health. IMO, pharma drugs are best used for emergency situations,

for example, traumatic accidental injuries and sudden cardiovascular events

(stroke, heart attack). Again IMO, long-term use of pharma drugs are not helpful

(and can be very harmful or deadly) for long-term degenerative conditions, for

example, type 2 diabetes, high blood pressure, heart conditions (such as

arrythmia and enlarged heart syndrome aka congestive heart failure),

osteo-arthritis, and autoimmune conditions (such as asthma and allergies, lupus,

rheumatoid arthritis, multiple sclerosis, irritable bowel syndrome, and so on).

Any person who is determined to overcome degenerative conditions can do so with

a persistent, consistent approach to eliminating GMO-laden, non-organic

processed/packaged foods from their diet, and to evolving their diet to the

healing foods, that is, organic produce and other plant foods, and

locally-sourced organic animal protein foods. In many cases, carefully selected

supplementation (either for a finite period of time or an indefinite period of

time) can help in the effort to overcome long-term health problems.

So, my advice to you, Wes, and everyone on this forum, is to evaluate HONESTLY

your own personal health status, your access/availability to organic produce

(and this also includes local pastured, antibiotic and hormone-free, free-range,

grassfed beef, pork, and poultry), and your current diet before you either (a)

reject out-of-hand nutritional supplementation, or ( go to the other extreme

direction of taking every supplement you can get your hands on. Many of you have

decided, or will decide, that you need some amount of nutritional

supplementation to achieve your best health.

Wes, best wishes in dropping your excess weight, and especially, improving your

diet for the rest of your life. One small step at a time eventually yields

fabulous results.

Am now awaiting the delivery of my long-desired Vitamix, with a step forward to

improving my diet with raw veggie-and-fruit smoothies and homemade soups.

Lynn G

>

> So I have been reading up about this stuff, and have some questions and

concerns.... If you are using the vitamix for smoothies, soups and other healthy

things, why do so many web sites want you to buy supplements and or other things

for the vitamix style diets? I see lots of people adding potions and powders to

their smoothies and promoting various products. If you are using whole foods

and replacing some unhealthy behaviours with good and nutritious ones why should

you need supplements?

>

> I haven't sworn off regular food, and because I love to cook I will still get

all my meats and proteins needed by my body (just in smaller quantities). but in

researching I find myself very confused... dont raw fruits and veggies supply

most of what is required? I would think processed supplements are not as

healthy as natural ones...

>

> wes

>

[Guest guest]

Excellent post, Lynn! Well said. I would like to point out though, that many

vendors at farmers markets carry commercially grown produce, or produce that has

been sprayed-it isn't all organic at farmers markets. Often, you can see the

boxes stacked in a vendor's stall that is the same GMO stuff that you find in

the grocery store. On the upside, there are often vendors who do grow organic

produce to be found at farmers markets, and it is nice that you can get to know

certain ones, talk to them about their growing practices, and become regular

customers. They can often learn from you as well. I met a man at a farmers

market that was growing what he THOUGHT was organic, only to be told by me that

his seeds were GMO seeds-he had no idea! It is nice to be able to learn and

share with others, so eventually everyone can learn what the true source of

their food is!

> >

> > So I have been reading up about this stuff, and have some questions and

concerns.... If you are using the vitamix for smoothies, soups and other healthy

things, why do so many web sites want you to buy supplements and or other things

for the vitamix style diets? I see lots of people adding potions and powders to

their smoothies and promoting various products. If you are using whole foods

and replacing some unhealthy behaviours with good and nutritious ones why should

you need supplements?

> >

> > I haven't sworn off regular food, and because I love to cook I will still

get all my meats and proteins needed by my body (just in smaller quantities).

but in researching I find myself very confused... dont raw fruits and veggies

supply most of what is required? I would think processed supplements are not as

healthy as natural ones...

> >

> > wes

> >

>

[Guest guest]

,

Thank you for the compliment. I should have pointed out what you said about

using caution at a farmers' market, but my post was already re-e-e-ally long. If

I go to a new farmers' market or I see a new vendor at a market, I always ask

the hard questions about how they produce their food. A conscientious farmer

will always be forthcoming and gracious about answering your questions. However,

a vendor who is just there as a fly-by-night, will probably evade your

questions, or worse, lie about the production or source of the food. I think

that one has to use one's gut instinct (or sixth sense or whatever it is called)

when evaluating how a vendor or farmer responds to one's questions.

VERY important point!

Lynn G

>

>

> Excellent post, Lynn! Well said. I would like to point out though, that many

vendors at farmers markets carry commercially grown produce, or produce that has

been sprayed-it isn't all organic at farmers markets. Often, you can see the

boxes stacked in a vendor's stall that is the same GMO stuff that you find in

the grocery store. On the upside, there are often vendors who do grow organic

produce to be found at farmers markets, and it is nice that you can get to know

certain ones, talk to them about their growing practices, and become regular

customers. They can often learn from you as well. I met a man at a farmers

market that was growing what he THOUGHT was organic, only to be told by me that

his seeds were GMO seeds-he had no idea! It is nice to be able to learn and

share with others, so eventually everyone can learn what the true source of

their food is!

>

>

[Guest guest]

Indeed,, Lynn...once YOU know the answers to the questions you are asking the

vendor, it is quickly evident if they do. I usually start by asking " what do

you spray your produce with " , rather than ask them if they are organic. By

doing this, they are not sure if I WANT sprayed stuff (fear of bugs or vermin,

or whatever), so they may answer that they use roundup, etc., at which point I

thank them and simply walk away-they have already told me all I need to know.

If I ask a vendor that and they tell me they use no sprays (or name something

organic, such as neem oil), then I know that THEY know their stuff, and I will

engage in further discussions. I have found that if I ask " is your stuff

organic " , it gives them too much opportunity to lie about it, but again, you can

quickly assess if they know what they are talking about. Just a few tricks I

learned over the years, after ending up in the ER from too many deceptions! lol

> > >

> > >

> > > Excellent post, Lynn! Well said. I would like to point out though, that

many vendors at farmers markets carry commercially grown produce, or produce

that has been sprayed-it isn't all organic at farmers markets. Often, you can

see the boxes stacked in a vendor's stall that is the same GMO stuff that you

find in the grocery store. On the upside, there are often vendors who do grow

organic produce to be found at farmers markets, and it is nice that you can get

to know certain ones, talk to them about their growing practices, and become

regular customers. They can often learn from you as well. I met a man at a

farmers market that was growing what he THOUGHT was organic, only to be told by

me that his seeds were GMO seeds-he had no idea! It is nice to be able to learn

and share with others, so eventually everyone can learn what the true source of

their food is!

> > >

> > >

> >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

pills that are tablets, compressed and hard, are often not broken down in the gut and absorbed, but passed through the body. These do end up in the sewer or septic tank. I know several in the septic business say that undigested tablets are a big problem in septic tanks.

I buy my vitamins from Lessman (off HSN or his site: procaplabs.com) as they are all powder in a capsule and easily digested, not passed through hole. compressed tablets are cheap to make, cheaper than putting a powder in a capsule yet so many big producers cut costs with the compressed tabs.

[Guest guest]

Loved your post, ! I do something similar; I always say, " Are your

products conventionally farmed? " And then follow up with what they use for post

control.

> > >

> > > So I have been reading up about this stuff, and have some questions and

concerns.... If you are using the vitamix for smoothies, soups and other healthy

things, why do so many web sites want you to buy supplements and or other things

for the vitamix style diets? I see lots of people adding potions and powders to

their smoothies and promoting various products. If you are using whole foods

and replacing some unhealthy behaviours with good and nutritious ones why should

you need supplements?

> > >

> > > I haven't sworn off regular food, and because I love to cook I will still

get all my meats and proteins needed by my body (just in smaller quantities).

but in researching I find myself very confused... dont raw fruits and veggies

supply most of what is required? I would think processed supplements are not as

healthy as natural ones...

> > >

> > > wes

> > >

> >

>