Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

[Guest guest]

The “laugh track” on many comedy shows indicates that a large portion of the public would rather be told when to laugh than to think.

Similarly, your article points out that instead of addressing the nightmare that this program has already become, the laugh track producers keep reiterating the line, “300,000 more people are insured, can that be a bad thing?”

Now, laugh.

Zane Pilzer writes in the “New Insurance Solution” that subsidized healthcare is history and the market can handle the challenge, if allowed to do so.

It made computers, cell phones, cable, satellites, cars, internet, etc. faster, cheaper, and better.

It can do so with health care.

Read it and hope!

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: JPedersen DC <chirodoc1@...>

Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 06:27:47 -0800

or < >

Subject: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

.....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this

program....

.....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society' can not

agree on a solution to a growing problem....

.....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty

quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?Page=/Nation/archive/200802/NAT20080205c.html

J. Pedersen DC

[Guest guest]

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?

Page=/Nation/archive/200802/NAT20080205c.html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

[Guest guest]

I personally love that Mass did this program. It is just the kind of thing needed to figure out how to get healthcare for all. They had the guts to lead, make mistakes and pay for them. God bless them. 300,000 more people insured. I would love to see the numbers on how many personal bankruptcies were avoided by hard working families due to a seriouse illness (currently a leading cause of bankruptcy). Surely the benefit to society to have continuity of care outweigh the upfront costs. And don't forget, a family that was making 103k needed to have 8 children. Eight children?! Give them a break. I gotta go crack some people so I can afford to subsidize my

employee's healthcare bennefit.

Jay

Concordia Chiropractic Center

5425 NE 33rd Ave

Portland OR 97211

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

[Guest guest]

I love that Jack traded the family cow for some magic beans.

Didn’t make it right, but ya gotta love him for trying.

Hey! Maybe nationalized health care will magically be NOT LIKE MEDICARE!

Which is working so well.

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 09:10:20 -0800 (PST)

< >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

I personally love that Mass did this program. It is just the kind of thing needed to figure out how to get healthcare for all. They had the guts to lead, make mistakes and pay for them. God bless them. 300,000 more people insured. I would love to see the numbers on how many personal bankruptcies were avoided by hard working families due to a seriouse illness (currently a leading cause of bankruptcy). Surely the benefit to society to have continuity of care outweigh the upfront costs. And don't forget, a family that was making 103k needed to have 8 children. Eight children?! Give them a break. I gotta go crack some people so I can afford to subsidize my employee's healthcare bennefit.

Jay

Concordia Chiropractic Center

5425 NE 33rd Ave

Portland OR 97211

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

[Guest guest]

Sounds like the current system of health care delivery, ie "expensive, rigid, and ineffective". I think we will just have to disagree on this one. At least we both dig chiropractic and have a forum such as this to air our views. Pretty cool.

be well,

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof> this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while

the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________________________________________________________________________________> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

Sounds like the current system of health care delivery, ie "expensive, rigid, and ineffective". I think we will just have to disagree on this one. At least we both dig chiropractic and have a forum such as this to air our views. Pretty cool.

be well,

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof> this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while

the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________________________________________________________________________________> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

It would be just a whimsical daydream if there weren't concrete examples of how it can work in other countries. After the second world war, Brittan decided that it was god for all of them if some basic health care was given to all. Less of a drag on the economy as a whole. Do they have problems? Yep. Is everyone covered? Yep. Would I be willing to bet that they are much happier with their system than ours? Yep.

You are correct in worrying about nationalized health care looking just like medicare. This would be catastrophic for chiropractic. There are other ways though.

Cheers,

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision

comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the

Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

It would be just a whimsical daydream if there weren't concrete examples of how it can work in other countries. After the second world war, Brittan decided that it was god for all of them if some basic health care was given to all. Less of a drag on the economy as a whole. Do they have problems? Yep. Is everyone covered? Yep. Would I be willing to bet that they are much happier with their system than ours? Yep.

You are correct in worrying about nationalized health care looking just like medicare. This would be catastrophic for chiropractic. There are other ways though.

Cheers,

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision

comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the

Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

Name one federal bureaucracy that is as efficient as the private sector mirror image.

Dr B

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

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[Guest guest]

Are there any federal bureaucracies that have private sector mirror image industries? I am not aware of any. I could site smaller agencies and industries such as private security forces in Iraq costing 3X more than their equivelant US troops. But I think this misses the point. We decide as a society that there are certain things "common goods" we would rather have government do, like roads, schools, fire dept, army etc. I happen to think that healthcare is one of these "common goods" that should not be left to the markets.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level

involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the

anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd. / evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

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[Guest guest]

Are there any federal bureaucracies that have private sector mirror image industries? I am not aware of any. I could site smaller agencies and industries such as private security forces in Iraq costing 3X more than their equivelant US troops. But I think this misses the point. We decide as a society that there are certain things "common goods" we would rather have government do, like roads, schools, fire dept, army etc. I happen to think that healthcare is one of these "common goods" that should not be left to the markets.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to $103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any level.I for one, do not want the gov't on any level

involved. The whole lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to the detrement of the common person.When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results. , DC, DABCO>> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of this > program....> > ....the realist in me laments the

anointed 'best of our society' can not > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some witty > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> > J. Pedersen DC>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd. / evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

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[Guest guest]

The treasury.

Oh, wait. Visa makes more money than the Treasury.

I’ll have to get back to you.

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: " D Beebe, D.C. " <daniel.beebe@...>

Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:52:30 -0800

Abrahamson <drscott@...>, Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>, < >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Name one federal bureaucracy that is as efficient as the private sector mirror image.

Dr B

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

[Guest guest]

The treasury.

Oh, wait. Visa makes more money than the Treasury.

I’ll have to get back to you.

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: " D Beebe, D.C. " <daniel.beebe@...>

Date: Thu, 07 Feb 2008 14:52:30 -0800

Abrahamson <drscott@...>, Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>, < >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Name one federal bureaucracy that is as efficient as the private sector mirror image.

Dr B

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

[Guest guest]

It’s very un-American to wish to give up freedom; especially deferring to the government to do it better.

We haven’t even begun to see the abuse of power from government employee unions (teachers and others).

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 15:15:58 -0800 (PST)

" D Beebe, D.C. " <daniel.beebe@...>, Abrahamson <drscott@...>, < >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Are there any federal bureaucracies that have private sector mirror image industries? I am not aware of any. I could site smaller agencies and industries such as private security forces in Iraq costing 3X more than their equivelant US troops. But I think this misses the point. We decide as a society that there are certain things " common goods " we would rather have government do, like roads, schools, fire dept, army etc. I happen to think that healthcare is one of these " common goods " that should not be left to the markets.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

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[Guest guest]

It’s very un-American to wish to give up freedom; especially deferring to the government to do it better.

We haven’t even begun to see the abuse of power from government employee unions (teachers and others).

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 15:15:58 -0800 (PST)

" D Beebe, D.C. " <daniel.beebe@...>, Abrahamson <drscott@...>, < >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Are there any federal bureaucracies that have private sector mirror image industries? I am not aware of any. I could site smaller agencies and industries such as private security forces in Iraq costing 3X more than their equivelant US troops. But I think this misses the point. We decide as a society that there are certain things " common goods " we would rather have government do, like roads, schools, fire dept, army etc. I happen to think that healthcare is one of these " common goods " that should not be left to the markets.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd. / evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs> <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

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[Guest guest]

You want to see abuses of power? De-regulate something. Un-American?! Lindekugel, DC Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd. / evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs> <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

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Never miss a thing. Make your homepage.

[Guest guest]

OK. I’ll take “Utilities” for $100, .

What is deregulation of phone companies?

Ding! Ding! Ding! That’s Kee-rect!

When I was a kid we only had one phone company and you couldn’t own a phone, had to rent it. When they deregulated the phone companies all sorts of dirtbag companies appeared and some disappeared with various people’s money. No government to protect them.

On the other hand, now we have really cheap phone service, free long distance and serious competition for our dollars giving us more features for less.

Buyers still have to beware. We got hosed by verizon on a verbal contract for a promise of 3 cell phone rebates if we bought a family plan. We only got one rebate and they didn’t know who we talked to, etc. Now we insist that all verbal contracts are faxed to my clinic before they are binding. It really irritates them but if they want the sale, they gumpily comply.

Of course if Uncle Sam had control of the phone companies they would run even better, faster and cheaper.

Like...Medicare.

( E. Abrahamson, D.C.)

Chiropractic physician

Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic

315 Second Street

Lake Oswego, OR 97034

503-635-6246

Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com

From: Lindekugel <pdxchiroguy@...>

Date: Thu, 7 Feb 2008 16:45:44 -0800 (PST)

Abrahamson <drscott@...>, Beebe <daniel.beebe@...>, < >

Subject: Re: Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

You want to see abuses of power? De-regulate something. Un-American?!

Lindekugel, DC

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'

Seems to me that MA has no idea what it got itself into. More people

than expected joined and they are even unable (or unwilling) to give

stats on the type of folks enrolled (i.e. families making up to

$103K). To boot, it sounds like the program was passed with

additional add ons that those in gov't just can't help to make on any

level.

I for one, do not want the gov't on any level involved. The whole

lot has shown me over and over that they are incapable of making

rational decisions. Every decision comes as a pay-off or a favor to

the detrement of the common person.

When a water tank has a leak you don't continually add water to

maintain a specific level. The prudent thing to do is to find and

fix the leak. The gov't doesn't have water tanks they have sieves

and all they do is put more water (money) in with no results.

, DC, DABCO

>

> ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing of

this

> program....

>

> ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

can not

> agree on a solution to a growing problem....

>

> ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find some

witty

> quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....

>

> http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation. asp? <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> <http://www.cnsnews.%20com/ViewNation.%20asp?> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

>

> J. Pedersen DC

>

Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd. / evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs> <http://us.rd.%20/%20evt=51438/%20*http://www.%20/%20r/hs> <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

No virus found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date: 2/7/2008 11:17 AM

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search. <http://us.rd./evt=51734/*http://tools.search./newsearch/category.php?category=shopping>

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[Guest guest]

I'm definitely not defending the current system either but if I have

to choose between the two, I'll take the current one. Then again, I

plan on staying outside of the box.

RT

> > >

> > > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing

> of

> > this

> > > program....

> > >

> > > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

> > can not

> > > agree on a solution to a growing problem....

> > >

> > > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find

> some

> > witty

> > > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic

terms....

> > >

> > > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?

> > Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

> > >

> > > J. Pedersen DC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

______________________________________________________________________

> ______________

> > Never miss a thing. Make your home page.

> > http://www./r/hs

> >

>

>

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.

> http://www./r/hs

>

[Guest guest]

I'm definitely not defending the current system either but if I have

to choose between the two, I'll take the current one. Then again, I

plan on staying outside of the box.

RT

> > >

> > > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failing

> of

> > this

> > > program....

> > >

> > > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'

> > can not

> > > agree on a solution to a growing problem....

> > >

> > > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find

> some

> > witty

> > > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic

terms....

> > >

> > > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?

> > Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

> > >

> > > J. Pedersen DC

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

>

______________________________________________________________________

> ______________

> > Never miss a thing. Make your home page.

> > http://www./r/hs

> >

>

>

>

______________________________________________________________________

______________

> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.

> http://www./r/hs

>

[Guest guest]

The machine it takes to run any qov't program is what scares me.

Once that ball gets rolling, it never stops.

> >> >

> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the

failing of

> > this

> >> > program....

> >> >

> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our

society'

> > can not

> >> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....

> >> >

> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find

some

> > witty

> >> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic

terms....

> >> >

> >> > http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation.

asp?

> >> <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?>

> >> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

> > Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

> >> >

> >> > J. Pedersen DC

> >> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd.

/

> > evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs>

> > <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > No virus found in this incoming message.

> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date:

2/7/2008

> > 11:17 AM

>

>

>

>

> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with

Search.

>

<http://us.rd./evt=51734/*http://tools.search./newse

arch/c

> ategory.php?category=shopping>

>

[Guest guest]

The machine it takes to run any qov't program is what scares me.

Once that ball gets rolling, it never stops.

> >> >

> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the

failing of

> > this

> >> > program....

> >> >

> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our

society'

> > can not

> >> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....

> >> >

> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to find

some

> > witty

> >> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic

terms....

> >> >

> >> > http://www.cnsnews. <http://www.cnsnews./> com/ViewNation.

asp?

> >> <http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?>

> >> <http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewNation.asp?>

> > Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html

> >> >

> >> > J. Pedersen DC

> >> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Never miss a thing. Make your homepage. <http://us.rd.

/

> > evt=51438/ *http://www. / r/hs>

> > <http://us.rd./evt=51438/*http://www./r/hs>

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > No virus found in this incoming message.

> > Checked by AVG Free Edition.

> > Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.21/1265 - Release Date:

2/7/2008

> > 11:17 AM

>

>

>

>

> Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with

Search.

>

<http://us.rd./evt=51734/*http://tools.search./newse

arch/c

> ategory.php?category=shopping>

>

[Guest guest]

Ok...I'll bite if you wish to have a glimpse of what a mandated national governmental healthcare (HillaryCare) system would look like as well as how our profession would be treated within that system we need to simply look at the current wonderful Medicare delivery system. Then look at Canada, England, Germany, etc. wherein chiropractic services are not included or in some cases like that of British Columbia after a few years of inclusion completely eliminated from the provincial/national gov. system to save the government money! In Mass Mitt Romney fought hard against including chiropractic services within their universal healthcare system and apparently attempted to limit chiropractic care in auto PIP to 10 visits or something similar.

Vern Saboe

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof> this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________________________________________________________________________________> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

Ok...I'll bite if you wish to have a glimpse of what a mandated national governmental healthcare (HillaryCare) system would look like as well as how our profession would be treated within that system we need to simply look at the current wonderful Medicare delivery system. Then look at Canada, England, Germany, etc. wherein chiropractic services are not included or in some cases like that of British Columbia after a few years of inclusion completely eliminated from the provincial/national gov. system to save the government money! In Mass Mitt Romney fought hard against including chiropractic services within their universal healthcare system and apparently attempted to limit chiropractic care in auto PIP to 10 visits or something similar.

Vern Saboe

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof> this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________________________________________________________________________________> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www./r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

[Guest guest]

I would not be in favor of expanding medicare as the model of a nationalised system. Chiropractic has had a much longer go here in the states and is likely to be included with better compensation than in any other country. And thanks to the efforts of leaders like you, have managed to expand our work in the areas like WC to near acceptable levels. I think something like what has been done in France, or even Mass would be a gook idea to try state by state.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone

else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof>

this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ ________________ __> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www.. com/r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now.

[Guest guest]

I would not be in favor of expanding medicare as the model of a nationalised system. Chiropractic has had a much longer go here in the states and is likely to be included with better compensation than in any other country. And thanks to the efforts of leaders like you, have managed to expand our work in the areas like WC to near acceptable levels. I think something like what has been done in France, or even Mass would be a gook idea to try state by state.

Jay

Re: Mass. health care plan 'mixed bag'Sorry, I have to disagree. Any thing gov't touches will beexpensive, rigid, and ineffective (DHS, HUD, and FEMA all come tomind).I plan on going on my own and cutting Big Brother out of theequation. The only people I count on are "me and my me and my me andmy friends".As for having eight childern, that sounds like a personal choice andan individual with no kids shouldn't have to subsidize someone

else'spersonal choice. Just my opinion.Take care, , DC, DABCO> >> > ....It's hard for the cynic in me to not comment on the failingof>

this> > program....> >> > ....the realist in me laments the anointed 'best of our society'> can not> > agree on a solution to a growing problem....> >> > ....while the Dr. Abrahamson voice in my head strives to findsome> witty> > quip to encapsulate the issue in humorous yet enigmatic terms....> >> > http://www.cnsnews. com/ViewNation. asp?> Page=/Nation/ archive/200802/ NAT20080205c. html> >> > J. Pedersen DC> >>>>>>>____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ ________________ __> Never miss a thing. Make your home page.> http://www.. com/r/hs>

Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Search.

Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Mobile. Try it now.