Guest guest Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 My mother, Pat, had not 1, not 2, but, YES, FOLKS, 3 vertebroplasties.And, darn it all, they ALL got rid of ALL of her back pain--as in IMMEDIATELYSo she didn't have months or years of back pain for each of her compression fractures.And even as she shrank from 5 ft tall to 4 ft 7", she still stood straight as a pin. Worked for her, so I'm with the experts. Don't need no steenking research. Ask Pat. She'll vouch for it.A'course, she's no longer with us, so we'll just have to take her daughter's word for it.But she's one of those damned Chiropractor and we all know that they are quacks and are dangerous.Oops... Argument got away from me...Ann DCFrom: " Abrahamson" <drscott@...>" Seitz" <dcdocbrian@...>, Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 3:34:54 PMSubject: Re: Kyphoplasty Each year Medicare pays for roughly 40,000 vertebroplasty procedures at a cost of $3,000 or more, says Dartmouth-Hitchcock Medical Center orthopedic surgeon Weinstein. 40,000 x $3,000= $120,000,000! Ok, wait! I know this one. At $50 per treatment, that is 2,400,000 chiropractic adjustments. And the pre-op, post-op, para-op, bop-bop-she-bop care is probably 100 Beelion Dollars! "Everyone picked up on it and stared doing it.... But the new studies testing vertebroplasty's efficacy took years to perform because doctors were reluctant to enroll patients. They were convinced that vertebroplasty worked. They said, “STUDIES? WE DON’T NEED NO STEEKING STUDIES!†The Mayo Clinic/University of Washington trial had to expand to locations worldwide [and give free beer] to attract enough patients. Some doctors even said the trials were unethical. One 2005 editorial in the Journal of Neuroradiology predicted that a randomized trial of vertebroplasty "would almost assuredly merely confirm the data that we already have" and thus "does not seem necessary or ethically justifiable." -- E. Abrahamson, D.C. Chiropractic physician Lake Oswego Chiropractic Clinic 315 Second Street Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-635-6246 Website: http://www.lakeoswegochiro.com From: Seitz <dcdocbrian@...> Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 14:00:09 -0800 < > Subject: RE: Kyphoplasty Take a look at this (does kyphoplasty work?) http://www.forbes.com/2009/08/05/vertebroplasty-healthcare-reform-business-healthcare-backpain.html Seitz, DC Tuality Physicians 730-D SE Oak St Hillsboro, OR 97123 (503)640-3724 From: drjallan@... Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2012 13:41:09 -0800 Subject: Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 I am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry.My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel?Rod , DCTillamookhttp://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 I might add to this on vertebroplasty these thoughts. I personally experienced a compression fracture of T6 last year while playing B-Ball at Central Catholic. It was diagnosed by our own Sellers -radiologists per excellence. Tim recommended that I just take it easy for about 3 to 4 months and all would be well. I did just that and after 4 months my back pain was gone and I was lifting weights and generally raising cane just fine. I have vowed to give up full court Basketball though. At 62 it may be time to hang up my old Central B-Ball jersey. So for me -in spite of my advancing age-my compression fracture healed just fine without any fancy dancy vertebroplasty. Schneider DCPDXOn Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 7:39 AM, Rod DC <rjacksondc@...> wrote: I am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry. My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel? Rod , DCTillamook http://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 -- Schneider DC PDX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 Okay. Here is one of those wonderful 'teaching moments'.So we both have a unique perspective. My mother's spine was not crumbling because of corticosteroid treatment for what must have been a serious underlying health condition. None of her compression fractures were 'spontaneous'. They were all caused by severe falls, they were in 3 separate areas, and the procedure never resulted adjacent fractures requiring additional procedures.Clearly, your mother's basic spinal integrity had already been iatrogenically compromised, so she was not only a poor candidate for vertebroplasty, she NEVER should have been offered the procedure. A very sad story, Rod, and I am so sorry to hear about her suffering and your distress over it. Shoulda never happened. It is no wonder that you feel the need to rant. I'm totally with you.All I am saying is that vertebroplasty, when it is 'appropriate', can be a game changer for the better. I know people who have lived with that deep, gnawing, awful pain from compression fractures for months or even years. My mother's pain would have been horrible to live with, yet the vertebroplasty stopped it on the spot. Within a week of the procedure, she was pain free, which means no prolonged use of pain meds and NSAIDS.What may be one person's miracle and salvation is another's invitation for destruction and death. We all know of other things like this in our world. Neither of our stories negates the other. What our stories suggest is that every individual person's situation or condition is unique and requires a different response.Ann DCFrom: "Rod DC" <rjacksondc@...>bluepearl2001@..., Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2012 7:39:08 AMSubject: Re: Steenkin' KyphoplastyI am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry.My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel?Rod , DCTillamookhttp://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 So again, another story about a completely different individual and different circumstances.My mother was in her 80's and not very active. She was also in enough pain that she could not sleep or sit or cook, etc. You were an active, healthy chiropractor, right?And, of course, I'm glad all worked out well for you. Doesn't change my original comments. Just reinforces them. Every case is unique and requires it's own solution. LOL Ann DCFrom: " Schneider" <portlandchiro1@...>"Rod DC" <rjacksondc@...>Cc: bluepearl2001@..., Sent: Thursday, January 12, 2012 9:10:37 AMSubject: Re: Steenkin' Kyphoplasty I might add to this on vertebroplasty these thoughts. I personally experienced a compression fracture of T6 last year while playing B-Ball at Central Catholic. It was diagnosed by our own Sellers -radiologists per excellence. Tim recommended that I just take it easy for about 3 to 4 months and all would be well. I did just that and after 4 months my back pain was gone and I was lifting weights and generally raising cane just fine. I have vowed to give up full court Basketball though. At 62 it may be time to hang up my old Central B-Ball jersey. So for me -in spite of my advancing age-my compression fracture healed just fine without any fancy dancy vertebroplasty. Schneider DCPDXOn Thu, Jan 12, 2012 at 7:39 AM, Rod DC <rjacksondc@...> wrote: I am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry. My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel? Rod , DCTillamook http://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 -- Schneider DC PDX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 This is far more often the picture seen than what Ann's mother (thankfully) experienced. SunnySunny Kierstyn, RN DC Fibromyalgia Care Center of Oregon 2677 Willakenzie Road, 7CEugene, Oregon, 97401541- 654-0850; Fx; 541- 654-0834www.drsunnykierstyn.com bluepearl2001@...; From: rjacksondc@...Date: Thu, 12 Jan 2012 07:39:08 -0800Subject: Re: Steenkin' Kyphoplasty I am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry.My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel?Rod , DCTillamookhttp://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PC Oregon Natural Health Clinic (Inside Trainer's Club) 333 S State Street, V401 Lake Oswego, OR 97034 503-636-6600 OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012 Rod, I am sorry to hear of your mom's plight. THerein lies the rub with -plasty. It has been documented and theorized that the harndess of the "glue" causes a certain stiffness that causes surrounding tissues to have to absorb the weight and shock of motion, and has been known to cause other areas to have problems......kind of like the areas above and below a fusion having to take up the lack of motion and having consequent damage. Unfortunately, as in all medicine and chiropractic, one cannot tell how an individual is going to respond. So...it could be a God-send like Ann's report, or like your mom's. Don WHIte, RN, DC In a message dated 1/12/2012 7:39:13 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, rjacksondc@... writes: I am truly happy for Ann's Mom having such a great response to kyphoplasty, but I feel the need for ranting all over the other side of the coin. Sorry. My mother endured multiple compression fractures of her thoracic spine during corticosteroid treatment for Crohn's. The doctors convinced her that vertebroplasty would help her after the first fracture. She underwent the first vertebroplasty then the next vertebra fractured and the next and the next and the next, each time another vertebroplasty was performed..... her back pain got worse and worse after each procedure. They had her taking pain meds to counter the increasingly severe back pain, which in turn complicated the ulcers from the corticosteroids prescribed for the Crohn's and she ended up dying from internal bleeding. She trusted the doctors right up to her last day even though her life consisted of hobbling from her bed to the bathroom and back (a trip of several minutes even though it was 15 feet away) with the ongoing Crohn's symptoms of abdominal pain and bloody diarrhea, complicated by the extreme back pain induced by the vertebroplasties. Wanna know how I really feel? Rod , DC Tillamook http://www.arthritistoday.org/news/vertebroplasty-no-benefit.php Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PCOregon Natural Health Clinic(Inside Trainer's Club)333 S State Street, V401Lake Oswego, OR 97034503-636-6600OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 12, 2012 Report Share Posted January 12, 2012  I got detoured out of my first chosen profession by a compression fracture of T4. I was hit by two motorcycles after I crashed while leading a race when I was 17. Didn't know I had broken my back until x-rays at WSCC my freshman year. Big difference from what our Mom's went through, obviously. I would not have elected to do anything at the time, and probably not even now, but I am pleased that these procedures exist and that (hopefully) patients are being screened adequately. I probably shouldn't say this, but I am afraid my Mom was screened using the ka-ching evaluation process. Rod Kyphoplasty questions: Is there a window of time after a compression fracture that kyphoplasty is most successful? Judith E. Allan, DC, PCOregon Natural Health Clinic(Inside Trainer's Club)333 S State Street, V401Lake Oswego, OR 97034503-636-6600OregonNaturalHealthClinic.com Rodney G. , DC Tillamook Natural Health Center 309 Laurel Ave. Tillamook, OR 97141 503-842-6532 -- Schneider DC PDX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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