Re: Overspeed Training and Muscle Heating?

[Guest guest]

Dr Siff wrote:

" .... On the contrary, " aerobic " training has been shown to

diminish strength and power capabilities.... "

--------

Dejan Vidic writes:

* There exist many discrepancies in scientific literature around this

phenomenon. Recently, Docherty and Sporer (1) have proposed a new model

which may explain why this to training protocols are not mutually exclusive!

References:

1. Docherty, D., & Sporer, B. (2000). A proposed model for examining the

interference phenomenon between concurrent aerobic and strength training.

Sports Med., 30(6): 385-394.

Regars,

Dejan Vidic

University of Ljubljana

Slovenia, Europe

Overspeed Training and Muscle Heating?

> rajinder_johal@h... wrote:

>

> > What do the various conditioning specialists on this group think of

> > overspeed training. In the book " Sports Speed " the authors are very

> > keen on it quoting research backing up its effect on the

> > neuromuscular system, yet Charlie Francis has a very different

> > opinion as expressed in this excerpt below from t-mag.com. Is there

> > any kind of consensus on overspeed training?

> >

> > <http://www.testosterone.net/html/body_128high.html>

> >

> > Overspeed Training

> >

> > Charlie Francis:

> >

> > Q: What do you think of overspeed training?

> >

> > A: Downhill running alters hip position and towing is useless and

> > dangerous. Everyone can move their legs fast enough through the air,

> > it's only ground contact that slows you down. In simplest terms, the

> > shorter the ground contact the faster the runner. Towing causes the

> > foot to land too far ahead of the center of gravity causing the

> > sprinter to spend more time on the ground. The only overspeed

> > training we ever used was running with the wind.

>

> Mel Siff commented:

>

> > [Note that the effects of all methods of " overloading " or " overspeed "

may not

> > be the same, since this depends on how much the training intervention

changes

> > the biomechanics and patterns of force development. Thus, uphill or

downhill

> > sprinting on a gradient of about 3 degrees is not the same as doing the

same on a

> > gradient of much greater inclination. Similarly with methods of running

with

> > added loads or with attached assisted or retarding ropes. Therefore,

before we can

> > evaluate any opinions on such a topic, it is important to quantify what

is being

> > discussed. Did the T-mag article or Charlie Francis qualify their

comments?

> > Running with the wind might seem more appropriate because, unlike an

attached

> > pulley system, it would not locally alter the mechanics of the running

action

> > to the same degree.]

>

> Rajinder Johal:

>

> No, Francis did not qualify his remarks. I just found it confusing

> for myself, in so much as whether or not to include an overspeed

> element in my sprint training. He also seems to go against the grain

> in advocating a high proportion of aerobic work in the training of a

> sprinter, as he makes clear in this excerpt from t-mag.

>

> Regarding his comments below about aerobic runs raising

> temperature thus allowing more muscle fiber to act as fast twitch, is

> there any rationale behind why only aerobic runs would do this? Would the

> same concept, if true, also apply to weightlifting, for example,

> performing numerous sub-maximal lifts after high intensity work,

> which appears to emulate his sprint training methods in the gym setting?

>

> <http://www.testosterone.net/html/134high.html>

>

> Sprinting, Rapid Improvements, and Those Wacky East Germans

>

> Q: I'm a 26 year old 100m sprinter who's been sprinting on and off

> since my junior year in high school. In the college program I

> attended my times were worse than in high school and I attribute it

> to the buffoon type of aerobic training my coach insisted I do. Well,

> years have passed and since having read your material I sprinted my

> PR of 10.72 (electronic- previous best was 11.00) with very poor

> strength levels. My goal is to get down to 10.4 this upcoming track

> season. Is this level of rapid improvement possible in one year?

> 10.72 felt like I was floating; it was the easiest race I've run.

> Have you ever seen anyone drop their 100m time by 4/10's of seconds?

>

> A: That's a lot of time to drop all at once, especially as you've

> already dropped 3/10's in the last year! I'd suggest that you put

> some of the time planning on hold and concentrate on getting the best

> training program in place that you can. Relax and let the results come to

you.

>

> Your comment about your 10.72 race illustrates what I mean. The best

> races always feel easy! Don't put pressure on yourself. I'm not sure

> what sort of aerobic training you did before, but I've always had a

> significant aerobic component in my running programs (about 35%

> anaerobic, 65% aerobic). These runs act as an " active recovery, "

> enhancing blood flow and increasing capillary density (the enhanced

> microscopic network slows down the flow of blood past the cells,

> allowing more time for complete nutrient transfer).

>

> The other poorly understood, but even more important benefit, is the

> increased ability of the body to generate more heat around the muscle

> motor neurons. Increased heat around the neurons lowers electrical

> resistance, allowing more current to pass. This permits more muscle

> fiber to act as fast twitch fiber!

>

> [it would be interesting to see a reference to support this statement.

> Moreover, Charlie seems to be confusing velocity of neuroelectrical

> transmission with the velocity of muscle contraction and they are not

> at all the same thing. Mel Siff]

>

> The East Germans understood the role of additional heat when an

> extensive review of world record performances revealed how often the

> record setter was at the early stages of a cold and running a fever

> when the record was set. (Later into the cold, the adverse effects

> outweigh the benefits, of course.) This led the East Germans to

> experiment with denatured viruses to generate a slight fever

> immediately prior to a world record attempt!

>

> [Mel Siff: Since Charlie is referring to sprint events, then his theory

must also apply to

> other explosive athletes like high jumpers and Olympic weightlifters. As

far as I

> know there are no studies that have shown that jumpers and lifters who

" heat " their

> muscles by means of " aerobic " training perform better than their

counterparts who

> do no aerobic conditioning. On the contrary, " aerobic " training has been

shown to

> diminish strength and power capabilities.

>

> Charlie also has not pointed out that increased and sustained muscle

temperature above a certain

> value can degrade muscle tissue (cause 'necrosis'). In addition,

non-fever induced increases

> in body temperature are only very slight in the deeper layers of the body,

so that the effect on

> larger deeper muscles would be minimal or nil. Once again, some

supporting references would

> be helpful, rather than claims that " the East Germans did this " - since

the latter tried almost

> anything, we could quite safely say that they did this. Anecdotally, I

have found that sprint swimming

> times over about 25m decrease significantly after a hot jacuzzi (about

40-41C), but that this effect

> does not last very long. Who knows, there may be some change due to whole

body heating, but it

> might have more to do with mechanical decreases in fluid viscosity in the

muscle complex than any presumed

> electrical changes in all of the propulsive muscles. Can anyone add some

genuine references to all of these

> speculations?]

>

>

> The warning here is that these " tempo " runs must not interfere in any

> way with the quality of the high-speed runs. This means that aerobic

> interval runs must not exceed 75% of your best possible speed. If

> your best time for the 200 meters is 21 seconds, then your interval

> 200 meter runs must be slower than 28 seconds! Additionally, your

> last interval must be as fast as your first. If you have any problem

> doing that, you're going too fast!

>

>

> Rajinder Johal

> London,UK

>

>

>

>

> Modify or cancel your subscription here:

>

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>

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Dr Siff wrote:

> " .... On the contrary, " aerobic " training has been shown to

> diminish strength and power capabilities.... "

--------

Dejan Vidic writes:

> * There exist many discrepancies in scientific literature around this

> phenomenon. Recently, Docherty and Sporer (1) have proposed a new model

> which may explain why this to training protocols are not mutually exclusive!

>

> References:

>

> 1. Docherty, D., & Sporer, B. (2000). A proposed model for examining the

> interference phenomenon between concurrent aerobic and strength training.

> Sports Med., 30(6): 385-394.

>

> Regars,

> Dejan Vidic

---------------

Is there any chance of anyone posting that article?

Rajinder Johal

London,UK

----- Original Message -----

> From: <rajinder_johal@h...>

> > > What do the various conditioning specialists on this group think of

> > > overspeed training. In the book " Sports Speed " the authors are very

> > > keen on it quoting research backing up its effect on the

> > > neuromuscular system, yet Charlie Francis has a very different

> > > opinion as expressed in this excerpt below from t-mag.com. Is there

> > > any kind of consensus on overspeed training?

> > >

> > > <http://www.testosterone.net/html/body_128high.html>

> > >

> > > Overspeed Training..............