Re: possible hypoglycemia condition

June 17, 2008

CRON is not a “one size fits all” kind of thing. Everyone’s different. (I’m looking at your statement that you went down to 1600 cal since you say “others” your size did this – not here you didn’t see that advice – perhaps you saw that on some other board – in fact funny you should bring this up since so recently we discussed extreme restriction).

If you’ve read Walford, he says to custom fit this which does not sound like what you did. Also if you’re not feeling well Walford says to up your calories, up your protein etc. One should start CRON by trying to eat only 100 cal less a day and then reducing calories further very slowly, losing weight VERY slowly etc. Is that what you did?

Just how much weight have you lost in the last year and 1/2?

THERE IS A VERY GOOD REASON WHY WE REQUIRE EVERYONE HERE TO READ “BEYOND THE 120 YEAR DIET”. YOU CAN RUIN YOUR HEALTH IF THIS IS DONE WRONG.

Why are you eating sugar? Eat as much as you want til you feel better but eat the ON part of CRON (lean protein, veggies, fruit etc). Sugar is not a normal food for humans. It’s not found as such in nature.

Good luck on those medical tests.

From: bdorn77 <bdorn77@...>

Reply-< >

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 01:33:05 -0000

< >

Subject: [ ] possible hypoglycemia condition

have been on CR for 1.5 years, 1600 or so, 5'8 130-135. last few weeks

have had brain fog, consistently dizzy, pins and needles feeling in

feet, thick saliva, masseuse said i had some yellowish tinge on hands

and feed, some racing heart issues while lying down, and have just

been feeling kind of dumb and uncoordinated (matching MS type

symptoms). i had been eating lots of vegetables during the day and

dinner, lean meat with dinner, and a bunch of fruit after. last few

days have been eating clams to get a " shot " of B12 in the morning.

went in for a battery of tests also, and my fasting glucose came back

today. it was 17, which they say is typically associated with a coma,

so they assumed it was a mistake.

but i felt like i was about to faint after the blood test, and just

way out of it for a few hours, a first for a blood test for me. ran

out to get a glucose meter as i was again feeling lightheaded while

talking and it was 38, which along with the numbness feeling after the

fasting glucose test, kind of confirms the initial test. i drank 180

cals of OJ, 2 packs of sugar, apple, blueberries, strawberries,

pineapple sauce (on top of pork salad), cantaloupe, honey dew, and a

corona. have gotten the blood sugar up to 62 by eating the above this

afternoon and evening.

so will increase fruit intake over veggies, make sure i wake up in the

middle of the night to eat, and up calories to 2000-2200 or so. spoke

to a doctor online at kasamba, and he said to get tested for elevated

insulin and c peptide to make sure it's not a tumour that leads to

insulin secretion.

pretty sure it's the restriction after reading what happened to Ben

Best. hopefully no permanent brain damage has been done or it's

nothing else.

i guess it's a relief that it's likely the diet and blood sugar, as

i'd been worried about things like MS and cancer and thinking of

getting a brain and/or whole body MRI. i think moving towards more

veggies during the day and less fruit was the major issue, and i

should probably be around 1700-1800. had been going off what other

people my size had been restricting too. guess i learned that it takes

a while for deficiencies to resolve, and will likely take some time to

fix this condition through upped calories and more sugar (quite the

irony).

Doctors probably aren't used to hypoglycemia from excessive healthy

diets, so am turning to the board. any input, how long it will take me

to return to 'normal' or any other advice on how to proceed,

additional tests to get, etc? should i go on a hard core binge of 2500

with simple carbs like pasta? would really appreciate it.

ben's best story.

'The very worst hazards I experienced in practicing CRAN, however,

were toward the end of my 6-month period on fewer than 1600 calories

per day. nMy weight had dropped below 115 pounds and I was

experiencing lightheaded, physical weakness, periodic cardiac

acceleration and gastrointestinal pains. (My lightheaded was so

extreme at one point that I fainted -- not while I was driving,

luckily.) I experienced my first flu in over 2 years, and had

difficulty shaking it off. I was down to 112 pounds when it was time

for my annual physical examination.

My 15-hour fast in preparation for my examination caused me great

discomfort, possibly including symptoms of hypoglycemia (low blood

sugar). When my physician put me on an EKG he found bigeminal rhythm

-- extrasystoles (heartbeat irregularities). He didn't rush me to the

hospital, but he did warn me that I should gain some weight.

Extrasystoles are not usually life-threatening, but they can be. I

immediately went on an eating binge. It took me a while to regain my

stability and pursue a more " moderately stringent " version of CRAN.

Currently, my target weight is 120 pounds, and I rarely go above 123. "

June 17, 2008

Hi Bdorn:

Not even qualified physicians are able to diagnose over the internet. So you need to get medical supervision, face to face, and not pay too much attention to the advice you get here from anyone, especially me : ^ )))

The above said, he is my view (I have NO medical qualifications). Your BMI of around 20 is not at a low extreme. But I wonder how quickly you got down to it. Too fast is not appropriate, and if you lost a lot of weight quickly that might explain your situation.

Second, 1600 calories does seem quite low. Understand that, very roughly speaking, each 100 calories per day that you drop your intake will eventually reduce your weight by about fifteen more pounds - quite a lot. But you are not likely to need more than 2000 calories, imo, unless you have recently lost weight rapidly.

Third, have you checked your diet for adequate intakes of all the micronutrients? If not then that MUST be done to find out what deficiencies you have. (IMO CRON-o-Meter is excellent for this purpose). Almost everyone who checks this finds they have deficiencies of some nutrients. I have four that I fix by supplementing just up to the RDAs for those nutrients.

Fourth, it is easy for people on CRON, watching their BMIs drop to levels they previously had hardly imagined possible, to attribute anything that happens to them to be a result of CRON. Sometimes it is, especially in cases of extreme CRON which does not seem to apply in your case. But other times peculiar symptoms have nothing at all to do with CRON.

The simple fact is that people sometimes get sick with one of the thousands of illnesses that from time to time afflict us humans. You may have just come down with one of those illnesses.

Certainly blood glucose is expected to decline as people transition, hopefully gradually, to a CRON diet. But I have never heard of anyone go onto CRON and see their glucose drop to 17. This *suggests* to me that your symptoms have little to do with CRON. But only a face-to-face visit with a medical doctor can stand a chance of figuring the cause.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

Rodney.

>> have been on CR for 1.5 years, 1600 or so, 5'8 130-135. last few weeks> have had brain fog, consistently dizzy, pins and needles feeling in> feet, thick saliva, masseuse said i had some yellowish tinge on hands> and feed, some racing heart issues while lying down, and have just> been feeling kind of dumb and uncoordinated (matching MS type> symptoms). i had been eating lots of vegetables during the day and> dinner, lean meat with dinner, and a bunch of fruit after. last few> days have been eating clams to get a "shot" of B12 in the morning.> went in for a battery of tests also, and my fasting glucose came back> today. it was 17, which they say is typically associated with a coma,> so they assumed it was a mistake. > > but i felt like i was about to faint after the blood test, and just> way out of it for a few hours, a first for a blood test for me. ran> out to get a glucose meter as i was again feeling lightheaded while> talking and it was 38, which along with the numbness feeling after the> fasting glucose test, kind of confirms the initial test. i drank 180> cals of OJ, 2 packs of sugar, apple, blueberries, strawberries,> pineapple sauce (on top of pork salad), cantaloupe, honey dew, and a> corona. have gotten the blood sugar up to 62 by eating the above this> afternoon and evening. > > so will increase fruit intake over veggies, make sure i wake up in the> middle of the night to eat, and up calories to 2000-2200 or so. spoke> to a doctor online at kasamba, and he said to get tested for elevated> insulin and c peptide to make sure it's not a tumour that leads to> insulin secretion.> > pretty sure it's the restriction after reading what happened to Ben> Best. hopefully no permanent brain damage has been done or it's> nothing else. > > i guess it's a relief that it's likely the diet and blood sugar, as> i'd been worried about things like MS and cancer and thinking of> getting a brain and/or whole body MRI. i think moving towards more> veggies during the day and less fruit was the major issue, and i> should probably be around 1700-1800. had been going off what other> people my size had been restricting too. guess i learned that it takes> a while for deficiencies to resolve, and will likely take some time to> fix this condition through upped calories and more sugar (quite the> irony). > > Doctors probably aren't used to hypoglycemia from excessive healthy> diets, so am turning to the board. any input, how long it will take me> to return to 'normal' or any other advice on how to proceed,> additional tests to get, etc? should i go on a hard core binge of 2500> with simple carbs like pasta? would really appreciate it. > > ben's best story.> > 'The very worst hazards I experienced in practicing CRAN, however,> were toward the end of my 6-month period on fewer than 1600 calories> per day. nMy weight had dropped below 115 pounds and I was> experiencing lightheaded, physical weakness, periodic cardiac> acceleration and gastrointestinal pains. (My lightheaded was so> extreme at one point that I fainted -- not while I was driving,> luckily.) I experienced my first flu in over 2 years, and had> difficulty shaking it off. I was down to 112 pounds when it was time> for my annual physical examination.> > My 15-hour fast in preparation for my examination caused me great> discomfort, possibly including symptoms of hypoglycemia (low blood> sugar). When my physician put me on an EKG he found bigeminal rhythm> -- extrasystoles (heartbeat irregularities). He didn't rush me to the> hospital, but he did warn me that I should gain some weight.> Extrasystoles are not usually life-threatening, but they can be. I> immediately went on an eating binge. It took me a while to regain my> stability and pursue a more "moderately stringent" version of CRAN.> Currently, my target weight is 120 pounds, and I rarely go above 123. ">

June 17, 2008

yes, i read wofford's book, a couple of times. he was the same size as

myself and consumed 1600, and is one of several on this board, and

elsewhere who consumed that amount for an extended period of time.

that, combined with a BMI of 20 that rodney said, a cr calculator

saying i was restricting around 35%, a weight of 130 all seemed about

spot on with what others my size were doing successfully (wofford not

being the best example perhaps). one has to pick a number somehow, and

i was feeling great for a long time. people several inches taller are

in the 1800 range, so the number i worked too seemed appropriate. it's

not a one size fits all, but looking at others my size, it seemed like

a logical number. it was fairly gradual, but i've been at that number

for a quite a while, though with different protein/carb/fat intakes at

times, and since i never felt badly before recently, i wasn't thinking

it was the diet that was the problem. additionally, i had a glucose

meter and it was consistently in the 80s for several months, so gave

up with it and stopped monitoring it. this is also why it's possible

that it's not CR that's the issue, and that i should look to rule out

other more serious things, like cancer, hence the request for other

tests to ask for like c peptid and insulin that the doctor online

today recomeneded. i have a real doctor too, but just got the results

today. i have additional tests, and an appointment set up. obviously,

i over did it, and 1600 for other people my size might be right for

them, but is wrong for me. but hindsight is 20/20 eh, only now can one

tell it was extreme.

thx rodney for your response. i was 160 before, so lost about 30-35 in

some 80 weeks, well within the range of 1 lb per week. i've been in

contact with doctors already, two today, but felt posting on the board

would be a good thing in case anyone who experiences similar symptoms,

to get their blood sugar checked as a start. appreciate

your response both of you.

to answer a question, i'm eating a small amount of sugar to get my

blood glucose up from dangerously low levels, along with natural

sugars, like that from fruit. my body doesn't respond well to the

simple sugars in things like pasta due to the gluten content. thx again.

>

> CRON is not a ³one size fits all² kind of thing. Everyone¹s different.

> (I¹m looking at your statement that you went down to 1600 cal since

you say

> ³others² your size did this not here you didn¹t see that advice

perhaps

> you saw that on some other board in fact funny you should bring

this up

> since so recently we discussed extreme restriction).

>

> If you¹ve read Walford, he says to custom fit this which does not

sound like

> what you did. Also if you¹re not feeling well Walford says to up your

> calories, up your protein etc. One should start CRON by trying to

eat only

> 100 cal less a day and then reducing calories further very slowly,

losing

> weight VERY slowly etc. Is that what you did?

>

> Just how much weight have you lost in the last year and 1/2?

>

> THERE IS A VERY GOOD REASON WHY WE REQUIRE EVERYONE HERE TO READ

³BEYOND THE

> 120 YEAR DIET². YOU CAN RUIN YOUR HEALTH IF THIS IS DONE WRONG.

>

> Why are you eating sugar? Eat as much as you want til you feel

better but

> eat the ON part of CRON (lean protein, veggies, fruit etc). Sugar

is not a

> normal food for humans. It¹s not found as such in nature.

>

> Good luck on those medical tests.

>

> From: bdorn77 <bdorn77@...>

> Reply-< >

> Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 01:33:05 -0000

> < >

> Subject: [ ] possible hypoglycemia condition

>

> have been on CR for 1.5 years, 1600 or so, 5'8 130-135. last few weeks

> have had brain fog, consistently dizzy, pins and needles feeling in

> feet, thick saliva, masseuse said i had some yellowish tinge on hands

> and feed, some racing heart issues while lying down, and have just

> been feeling kind of dumb and uncoordinated (matching MS type

> symptoms). i had been eating lots of vegetables during the day and

> dinner, lean meat with dinner, and a bunch of fruit after. last few

> days have been eating clams to get a " shot " of B12 in the morning.

> went in for a battery of tests also, and my fasting glucose came back

> today. it was 17, which they say is typically associated with a coma,

> so they assumed it was a mistake.

>

> but i felt like i was about to faint after the blood test, and just

> way out of it for a few hours, a first for a blood test for me. ran

> out to get a glucose meter as i was again feeling lightheaded while

> talking and it was 38, which along with the numbness feeling after the

> fasting glucose test, kind of confirms the initial test. i drank 180

> cals of OJ, 2 packs of sugar, apple, blueberries, strawberries,

> pineapple sauce (on top of pork salad), cantaloupe, honey dew, and a

> corona. have gotten the blood sugar up to 62 by eating the above this

> afternoon and evening.

>

> so will increase fruit intake over veggies, make sure i wake up in the

> middle of the night to eat, and up calories to 2000-2200 or so. spoke

> to a doctor online at kasamba, and he said to get tested for elevated

> insulin and c peptide to make sure it's not a tumour that leads to

> insulin secretion.

>

> pretty sure it's the restriction after reading what happened to Ben

> Best. hopefully no permanent brain damage has been done or it's

> nothing else.

>

> i guess it's a relief that it's likely the diet and blood sugar, as

> i'd been worried about things like MS and cancer and thinking of

> getting a brain and/or whole body MRI. i think moving towards more

> veggies during the day and less fruit was the major issue, and i

> should probably be around 1700-1800. had been going off what other

> people my size had been restricting too. guess i learned that it takes

> a while for deficiencies to resolve, and will likely take some time to

> fix this condition through upped calories and more sugar (quite the

> irony).

>

> Doctors probably aren't used to hypoglycemia from excessive healthy

> diets, so am turning to the board. any input, how long it will take me

> to return to 'normal' or any other advice on how to proceed,

> additional tests to get, etc? should i go on a hard core binge of 2500

> with simple carbs like pasta? would really appreciate it.

>

> ben's best story.

>

> 'The very worst hazards I experienced in practicing CRAN, however,

> were toward the end of my 6-month period on fewer than 1600 calories

> per day. nMy weight had dropped below 115 pounds and I was

> experiencing lightheaded, physical weakness, periodic cardiac

> acceleration and gastrointestinal pains. (My lightheaded was so

> extreme at one point that I fainted -- not while I was driving,

> luckily.) I experienced my first flu in over 2 years, and had

> difficulty shaking it off. I was down to 112 pounds when it was time

> for my annual physical examination.

>

> My 15-hour fast in preparation for my examination caused me great

> discomfort, possibly including symptoms of hypoglycemia (low blood

> sugar). When my physician put me on an EKG he found bigeminal rhythm

> -- extrasystoles (heartbeat irregularities). He didn't rush me to the

> hospital, but he did warn me that I should gain some weight.

> Extrasystoles are not usually life-threatening, but they can be. I

> immediately went on an eating binge. It took me a while to regain my

> stability and pursue a more " moderately stringent " version of CRAN.

> Currently, my target weight is 120 pounds, and I rarely go above 123. "

>

June 17, 2008

Glad to hear that (it sounds like) you did it right. And I apologize if I sounded like I was lecturing. But you can’t imagine how many people try to post here that don’t have the faintest idea what we’re about and have never read Walford or our files (which are jam packed with information and have the “best” of our posts).

Good luck and hopefully it’s not serious.

Some might remember my posts a few months back about a relative who was doing everything right and yet became very sick. The upshot of a long and arduous medical work-up was that he had been bitten by a tic sometime in the past, contracted Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever (without realizing it) and while his body fought it off, he developed an auto-immune response. He is now well, but the process of finding out what his problem was took months and months.

From: bdorn77 <bdorn77@...>

Reply-< >

Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 09:12:30 -0000

< >

Subject: [ ] Re: possible hypoglycemia condition