Guest guest Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 Several of us have gone through periods of worsened symptoms. I was immediately better, then had a worsening of symptoms a few weeks after starting LDN. JT [low dose naltrexone] Worse before Better? On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 19:55:51 -0000, you wrote:Hidh has been on LDN now for 4 days... is it usual to get worse first... dh's walking has deteriorated .. isit because of not having betaferon??remove the sand to reply to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 29, 2004 Report Share Posted November 29, 2004 > > Hi > > dh has been on LDN now for 4 days... > > is it usual to get worse first... dh's walking has deteriorated .. is > it because of not having betaferon?? > > > > > > remove the sand to reply to me. ============== Dr. Bob Lawrence from the UK who has MS himself & uses LDN explains why the temporary increase in MS symptoms on LDN. When starting this LDN(Low Dose Naltrexone) therapy in the treatment of MS, there may also be some initial transient, though temporary, increase in MS symptoms. Experience in using this method has demonstrated most commonly, such as disturbed sleep, occasionally with vivid, bizarre and disturbing dreams, tiredness, fatigue, spasm and pain. These increased symptoms would not normally be expected to last more than seven to ten days. Rarely, other transient symptoms have included more severe pain and spasm, headache, diarrhea or vomiting. These additional symptoms would appear to be associated with the previous frequent use of strong analgesics, which effectively create an addiction and dependency, thus increasing the body's sensitivity to pain. This temporary increase in symptoms may also perhaps be explained when we consider the manner in which this drug is expected to work. Initially, MS occurs due to a reduction in the activity of the controlling influence of the suppressor T-cells within the immune system. During an acute relapse, the overall number of T-cells is reduced, the normal balance of helper T-cells and suppressor T-cells is disrupted and the damaging helper (CD-4) T-cells tend to predominate. This is the situation most pronounced during an acute relapse but occurs similarly, but to a lesser extent, in chronic progressive MS. Under the influence of LDN there will be an expected increase in the overall numbers of T-cells but, because the CD-4, helper T-cells tend to predominate at this time, an increase in their numbers will expectedly tend to increase MS symptoms. It is only when the numbers of suppressor T-cells effectively " catch up " that the normal balance is restored and symptoms once again diminish and improve. In addition, because LDN stimulates the immune system and many of the drugs routinely used by the NHS in the treatment of MS further suppress the immune system, LDN cannot be used in company with steroids, beta interferon, methotrexate, azathioprine or mitozantrone or any other immune suppressant drug. If there is any doubt, please submit a full list of the drugs you are presently taking so that their compatibility may be assessed. In addition, because LDN will also block the analgesic effects of any opiate drugs (includes codeine, dihydrocodeine, morphine, pethidine or diamorphine) presently being taken, the use of LDN will initially greatly increase the level of pain experienced. It is therefore advisable that any opiate-like drugs be discontinued at least two weeks before this treatment is initiated. When starting the treatment it is essential that any untoward or adverse side-effects are reported immediately so that the treatment process can be further assessed and, if necessary, modified. Dr. M R Lawrence Posted by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 Excellent info, thanks ! JT [low dose naltrexone] Re: Worse before Better? ==============Dr. Bob Lawrence from the UK who has MS himself & uses LDN explains why the temporary increase in MS symptoms on LDN. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 > Hello Everyone, > > I am taking 2.5mg...I been been that dose for some time now..but now I am starting to fell miserable my walking is not as good as it was...and I'm feeling a little fatigue...I wonder is it time for me to increase my dose a little or should I just stick with 2.5mg a little longer ...thanks in advance... > > > ============= Increase your dose, your dose is too low to halt your MS progression if you've started feeling bad on your 2.5mg. You need to be up to at least 3.0mg. Try to eventually make it to 4.5mg if your body will tolerate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 , If it were me, I would increase it to 3.5 mg. If that makes you feel worse, you can always go back down. I started at 4.5 mg, and I feel better than I have in years. Good luck and Peace! VCL > Hello Everyone, > > I am taking 2.5mg...I been been that dose for some time now..but now I am starting to fell miserable my walking is not as good as it was...and I'm feeling a little fatigue...I wonder is it time for me to increase my dose a little or should I just stick with 2.5mg a little longer ...thanks in advance... > > > ============= Increase your dose, your dose is too low to halt your MS progression if you've started feeling bad on your 2.5mg. You need to be up to at least 3.0mg. Try to eventually make it to 4.5mg if your body will tolerate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 Here is the info posted yesterday... [low dose naltrexone] Re: Worse before Better? ==============Dr. Bob Lawrence from the UK who has MS himself & uses LDN explains why the temporary increase in MS symptoms on LDN.When starting this LDN(Low Dose Naltrexone) therapy in the treatment of MS, there may also be some initial transient, though temporary, increase in MS symptoms. Experience in using this method has demonstrated most commonly, such as disturbed sleep, occasionally with vivid, bizarre and disturbing dreams, tiredness, fatigue, spasm and pain. These increased symptoms would not normally be expected to last more than seven to ten days.Rarely, other transient symptoms have included more severe pain and spasm, headache, diarrhea or vomiting. These additional symptoms would appear to be associated with the previous frequent use of strong analgesics, which effectively create an addiction and dependency, thus increasing the body's sensitivity to pain. This temporary increase in symptoms may also perhaps be explained when we consider the manner in which this drug is expected to work.Initially, MS occurs due to a reduction in the activity of the controlling influence of the suppressor T-cells within the immune system. During an acute relapse, the overall number of T-cells is reduced, the normal balance of helper T-cells and suppressor T-cells is disrupted and the damaging helper (CD-4) T-cells tend to predominate. This is the situation most pronounced during an acute relapse but occurs similarly, but to a lesser extent, in chronic progressive MS. Under the influence of LDN there will be an expected increase in the overall numbers of T-cells but, because the CD-4, helper T-cells tend to predominate at this time, an increase in their numbers will expectedly tend to increase MS symptoms. It is only when the numbers of suppressor T-cells effectively "catch up" that the normal balance is restored and symptoms once again diminish and improve. In addition, because LDN stimulates the immune system and many of the drugs routinely used by the NHS in the treatment of MS further suppress the immune system, LDN cannot be used in company with steroids, beta interferon, methotrexate, azathioprine or mitozantrone or any other immune suppressant drug. If there is any doubt, please submit a full list of the drugs you are presently taking so that their compatibility may be assessed. In addition, because LDN will also block the analgesic effects of any opiate drugs (includes codeine, dihydrocodeine, morphine, pethidine or diamorphine) presently being taken, the use of LDN will initially greatly increase the level of pain experienced. It is therefore advisable that any opiate-like drugs be discontinued at least two weeks before this treatment is initiated. When starting the treatment it is essential that any untoward or adverse side-effects are reported immediately so that the treatment process can be further assessed and, if necessary, modified. Dr. M R LawrencePosted by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 > or , > > Where would I find the explanation from Dr. Bob > Lawrence? > > Thanks very much. > > Rainey > rainey_rapp@y... > ============= He gives this paper to his UK patients and some of his patients have put this info. on some of the message boards in years past and I happened to have saved that portion for my files to help other people to understand some of the little quirks LDN can present in the early going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 So sorry I left my caps lock on accidental like! Reg. -- Re: [low dose naltrexone] Re: Worse before Better? Hello Everyone, I am taking 2.5mg...I been been that dose for some time now..but now I am starting to fell miserable my walking is not as Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 21:40:08 -0000, you wrote: >Posted by thank you very much . I had thought it would take a couple of weeks for the betaferon to leave his system, and ldn would not be as quick to help, as it is for others... however, i do see some improvements... remove the sand to reply to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 30, 2004 Report Share Posted November 30, 2004 I've been reading these posts with some interest. I've been on LDN since 10/23. 4.5 mg, no problems. Starting to take steps with my walker (5-10 feet), couldn't do that 3 months ago. I have also been taking liquid vitamins & minerals from ENIVA. The VIBE product really helps. Started that 2 weeks before I started LDN. I feel with the combination it's really helping. Check out there web site. www.eniva.com You can call a toll free number at 1-888-363-9480 for a 15 minute presentation. Well worth it. If anyone is interested, private e-mail me and I can give you some contact info. ADJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2004 Report Share Posted December 1, 2004 , Dr. Bihari doesn't believe that a dosage under 3 mg does anything to prevent MS from progressing or to relieve symptoms. He begins most of his patients on 4.5 mg. It sounds logical to up your dosage to that or to 3, but I don't know which makes more sense. I'm sure other people in the group will have a better take on this. ________________________________________________________________ Juno Platinum $9.95. Juno SpeedBand $14.95. Sign up for Juno Today at http://www.juno.com! Look for special offers at Best Buy stores. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 1, 2004 Report Share Posted December 1, 2004 , that could work, but if the capsules are crimped it could be difficult to do. I don't think you should wait, however. Why don't you ask the doctor for a new prescription and find out if the pharmacy will take back the 2.5 capsules? When I started LDN, I took 4.5 mg. After three days I was barely walking. Dr. Bihari called in 3 mg and Irmat Pharmacy took back the 4.5's. And if that doesn't work, it may be worth paying for a new prescription just for this month. ________________________________________________________________ Juno Gift Certificates Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season. http://www.juno.com/give Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 2, 2004 Report Share Posted December 2, 2004 That's so good that you found that out, . Good luck getting the prescription and with the new dosage. ________________________________________________________________ Juno Gift Certificates Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season. http://www.juno.com/give Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 3, 2004 Report Share Posted December 3, 2004 I wish you tons of luck, ! Let us know how it goes. ________________________________________________________________ Juno Gift Certificates Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season. http://www.juno.com/give Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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